1 in 4 HS Graduates can't pass the military entrance exam.

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  1. Stump Parrish profile image60
    Stump Parrishposted 12 years ago

    http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/art … 76f6c1d4c9

    Nearly one-fourth of the students who try to join the U.S. Army fail its entrance exam, painting a grim picture of an education system that produces graduates who can't answer basic math, science and reading questions, according to a new study released Tuesday.

    The report by The Education Trust bolsters a growing worry among military and education leaders that the pool of young people qualified for military service will grow too small.

    "Too many of our high school students are not graduating ready to begin college or a career — and many are not eligible to serve in our armed forces," U.S. Education Secretary Arne Duncan told the AP. "I am deeply troubled by the national security burden created by America's underperforming education system."

    Why does the Conservative Texas School Board believe the best way to improve this situation is to teach the kids more lies, and hide more facts, from them? Myth and Superstitions have replaced cold hard facts for these people and they refuse to allow a child to think for themselves.

    1. profile image56
      C.J. Wrightposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      The idea that a school system WANTS to teach creationism along with evolution translates to poor test scores is a stretch at best. More like simply a lie. A lie to support a particular belief system.
      Casgil makes a good point. Children should be tought how to think for themselves. NOT what to think. Teaching alternate theories and allowing them to decide for themselves is best.
      People who are "programed" vice educated are easily led. No doubt. However children that programed with hard cold facts are not necessarily educated.

      1. I am DB Cooper profile image65
        I am DB Cooperposted 12 years agoin reply to this

        I agree to an extent, as long as creationism is taught as part of a history/religious studies course. There is no denying that creationist thought has shaped history, and I think we can better prepare children for both military service and world travel (which tend to go hand-in-hand) by teaching them about the world's varied religions. I do not support teaching one specific line of creationism (for instance, the evangelical Christian view) as a counter-point to evolutionary biology. One can be demonstrated using biology, chemistry, and archeology, while the other is supported books that are in no way based on scientific study.

        1. profile image56
          C.J. Wrightposted 12 years agoin reply to this

          I think it's a better approach than is being put forth today. In other words, either or, then one and not the other.  One man's religion is another mans fairy tell. It's a matter of perspective, not inteligence.

      2. Stump Parrish profile image60
        Stump Parrishposted 12 years agoin reply to this

        If critical thinking skills were taught to all students, and the facts and opinions of all interested parties were presented to them, they would be able to reach an intelligent, well thought out answer, to any question on any subject. The answer would be arrived at by simple or complex reasoning.

        Why do so many fear teaching their children how to think. Are they helping their children or protecting their own insecurities? I always hoped my children would be smarter than I am, not dumber.

        1. profile image56
          C.J. Wrightposted 12 years agoin reply to this

          Don't know the answer to that question. Jealousy would be my guess. However, it's not a phenomenon specific to the "South".

          I grew up in a home where I was the only person to graduate high school. I was enrolled in advanced courses most of my years in school. I grew up in a very strict evangelical household. I am neither a devout creationist as it's understood today nor am I a devout evolutionist. I'm decidely Christian in my approach to life, however I'm by no means "evangelical". Of course stereo typing is easy. It makes the problem someone else's issue to deal with. You know, "those southerners" and their dumb parents.

          1. Stump Parrish profile image60
            Stump Parrishposted 12 years agoin reply to this

            I will admit that I ain't the brightest bulb in the turnip patch by any stench of the imagination.

            Sry, I'm just in a great mood today and I intend on taking it out on someone, lol.

            There are exceptions to the rule everywhere. Most down here tend to be decidely christian in describing themselves and as far as they can get from that in leading their lives. I suppose I am as guilty as the next of coloring my words and actions with whatever shade I am exposed to on a regular basis. However, there is no justifiable reason to substitute fiction for facts when teaching anyone anything.

            Our current system produces easily manipulated test scores rather than thinking, functioning, citizens. These test scores are used to determine the pay increases of the teachers. The needs of the students have no bearing on our present school system's decisions.

            1. profile image56
              C.J. Wrightposted 12 years agoin reply to this

              "Our current system produces easily manipulated test scores rather than thinking, functioning, citizens. These test scores are used to determine the pay increases of the teachers. The needs of the students have no bearing on our present school system's decisions."

              Agreed! I believe this is exactly what's going on.
              A few years ago I was helping my daughter with some algebra. She didn't understand the lesson, so we started from scratch. I helped her with the equations. In the end she was fully capable of ariving at the correct answer. In the end she recieved an F on the quiz. Why? Because she didn't do it the way it was presented in class. There were no problems with the math or the resulting solution. She showed her work and could step the teacher through the steps, explaining each. Talk about a bad day. The parent teacher conference was heated to say the least!

    2. Misha profile image62
      Mishaposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Surely mega rich and repubs are the ones responsible big_smile

      1. Stump Parrish profile image60
        Stump Parrishposted 12 years agoin reply to this

        You might be onto something there Misha. Let me think about it....Hmmm, sometimes I forget how lucky I am to have at least started my public education in the north. Even as late as the 60's they were still teaching students how to do that up there. Moving to the south I got an early look at the future of education in America. It all came down to this...repeat after me, repeat after me, repeat after me. OK, next word. Repeat after me,...

        Ok I was even able to think about your statement while typing the last one. I know, autographs will be available soon.

        I don't think the mega rich are responsible unless you are reffering to those who got mega rich, running a mega church. Them folks is guilty as hell.

        I am feeling quite circular today so I will try some logic for the last part of my response. The repubs are responsible because most repubs are christian conservatives and the christian church has always fought knowlegde. Haha, Thats quite round if I do say so myself.

    3. fatfist profile image68
      fatfistposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      But WHY would US military personnel need an education in math, science, and reading in order to pull the trigger and kill a Muslim??

      1. Stump Parrish profile image60
        Stump Parrishposted 12 years agoin reply to this

        Congradulations, you just passed the military entrance exam. Please stop by your local recruiter and pick up your weapon.

    4. Me, Steve Walters profile image82
      Me, Steve Waltersposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      big_smile They don't have that problem in the U.S. Marines...they all pass everything...OOHRAH!


      (I didn't read your link...but find it curious that you went off on a tangent in your last paragraph on "the Conservative Texas Education Board" giving way to lies...and myths. How does this apply to your previous paragraphs?)

  2. Cagsil profile image80
    Cagsilposted 12 years ago

    A child who doesn't think for themselves is the perfect individual who can be controlled by others. Why not?

    Plenty of people continue to turn a blind eye to the atrocities that continue, so why shouldn't education be any different.

    The ignorant, gullible and foolish are the only source of people who can be manipulated. The Educated ones are harder to do that with.

    1. Stump Parrish profile image60
      Stump Parrishposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      I have to wonder if a lot of jobs aren't being sent out of this country in search of qualified workers capable of independent thought.
      The ignorant and gullible are about to elect the next president and I am actually starting to believe that I may be alive to see the total collapse of this country. The new census indicates that people are flocking to the areas that don't require a functioning brain to succeed. Oh well, there is always Canada. They still use the brains they were born with up there.

  3. Cagsil profile image80
    Cagsilposted 12 years ago

    Hey Stump,

    Here is a hub I wrote about America and the direction it is headed. If people in this country are not careful, then they will be the cause for the complete collapse of America.

    http://hubpages.com/hub/America-A-Natio … us-Trouble

    I also wrote a different hub on America's Money and called it "Degeneration of Value". It might be worth a look too, because it shows people what government has been doing with the Economy, for which, has lead to the problems in the above hub.

  4. Shadesbreath profile image81
    Shadesbreathposted 12 years ago

    Allowing this conversation to become a "Creationism versus Evolution" debate is EXACTLY how the education system in the U.S. has crapped itself.

    Everyone is so busy trying to push their views that nobody is willing to accept the fact that there's lots of views, and because of that we shouldn't teach ANY views, and should just go back to teaching the little bastards how to read, write and do arithmetic.

    But NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOo, we can't even do that because what book will we give little Johnny to read? We can't give him Little Red Riding Hood because that book paints females as weak and intrusive.  We can't teach Huckleberry Finn because that's racist.  We can't teach math because the word problems are always written in ways that favor one social group or another. We can't teach U.S. history because that is the white man opressing the Native Americans. We can't teach economics because all the banks are crooks and Henry Ford was an exploitive monster, and the whole economy was set in motion by slavery and everything we have in America is the result of the wars where we took everything by force which was created and grown out of the evil of the rancid British colonial empire run by MEN who were women-opressing slavers and Satan's children, puked forth from the underworld by evil ... etc.

    That's why we're in this pickle right now.

    1. Stump Parrish profile image60
      Stump Parrishposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Hey Shade, You bring up a good point with your mini rant that by the way, I gotta chuckle out of, How much historical fact has been swept under the rug in order to please one group or another's tender sensiblilities? We have reached the point in this practice that a large percentage of our population has no clue about the country they were born in. They pick a group and sign up for it's tax free, handy Dandy, version of the world. One quick downlaod and they are certifiable geniuses. (Pun intended)

      In closing I must state that being born in Pittsburgh, the home of Hienz Foods, I applaud your use of the word "pickle" in a semi political statement. You don't see this kind of daring much anymore. Thank You Sir.

    2. profile image56
      C.J. Wrightposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      tada!!!! very good point.

  5. Misha profile image62
    Mishaposted 12 years ago

    ROFLMAO John, you cracked me up big_smile

    1. Shadesbreath profile image81
      Shadesbreathposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      I try.  big_smile

  6. psycheskinner profile image83
    psycheskinnerposted 12 years ago

    Maybe the exam is just kinda hard?  These are people you are gong to hand lethal weapons to, after all.

    1. profile image56
      C.J. Wrightposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      No, it's not a hard test. I'ts not a knowlege test at  all. It's an apptitude test. This is what's scary about the scores.
      What it's telling me, and what's being discussed is that this is the results of standardized testing. In other words, children are being instructed on how to score well on standardized testing within the public school system. The ASVAB is an apptitude test that's only designed to evaluate your ability to apply logic to a given area. Basically it turns out that we are teaching children WHAT to think, vice how to think in the school system today. Being overweight is generally not that big of a problem. The services have delayed entry. If the recruit wants to serve and is willing to do the work. The services will work with them.

      There are two ways of evaluating the scores. The DOD has a general set of rules. Each branch has the scores broken down by section where they are weighted.

      Generally whats called the score is the "AFQT" its a number ranging from 0 - 99. Most services require a waiver for scores less than 50. Apparently the Army says 35? The Marine Corps has typically had the highest requirements, 55. The Navy used to be 50 as well as the Air Force. Now, these are the bare minimums to "get in". These scores are composites of different sections of the test. These section scores are used to determine what "Job" you will get. In the Navy it's called a Rating. The other services call them Military Occupation Specialty(MOS).

  7. melpor profile image93
    melporposted 12 years ago

    A lot of high school graduates also fail the U.S. Army entrance exam because many of them are overweight and out of the weight requirement range. It is not just education why they are failing, it is physical as well. Guys were a lot slimmer and fit when I was in high school and college.

    1. Stump Parrish profile image60
      Stump Parrishposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Good point mel However, their academic ranking and scores when compared to students around the world are pitiful. Our school system is turning out fat stupid graduates incapable of survival. That they manage to do this while spending more per student than any other country is a testament to The almost as stupid parents of the stupid graduates in question. They are working to make the next batch of graduates even dumber.

  8. mikelong profile image61
    mikelongposted 12 years ago

    Having served in the military, and having worked to aid those who were entering the recruit process, I can speak to the lack of academic abilities in our youth...

    I scored a 93, 95 somewhere in there, on the ASVAB.....though I was enlisting infantry, my scores opened doors for jobs that the recruiters didn't even know existed..

    Out of all the other recruits...I was the only one to, already through bootcamp, select what type of job I wanted..... 

    When my recruiter introduced me to the other recruits at our station, I was the "genius".....but therin lies the problem....

    I was no genius. 

    Working in the intel field, I and the other Marines at our schools were very high scorers in terms of the ASVAB....(the Marines won't take a recruit who fails the test..though the Army will)..but I discovered that most in the intel field, especially among the other branches, don't score very highly....

    I was shocked when I would hear soldiers, sailors, and airmen almost bragging about the good times they have after scoring a 60 on the ASVAB....

    I believe that, leaving high school, the ASVAB standard, and the SAT, should be the standard for gaining that diploma...

    Yet, I believe that there is a focused effort by a few to undermine public education....especially in poor, immigrant communities...which are also the source of a predominant percentage of the enlisted recruiting demographic...

  9. Evan G Rogers profile image60
    Evan G Rogersposted 12 years ago

    So, government sucks at educating our children...

    ... yet we demand more funding for it...

    ... and we refuse to pay teachers more?

    Am I getting this right?

    1. Stump Parrish profile image60
      Stump Parrishposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      The government according to the republicans sucks at doing everything. Remeber that health care attack that actually asked...do you really want us messing with your healthcare as bad as we do at everything. That these people were re-elected is the problem. Until those who control the system are forced out of the system, they will continue to manipulate the system for their benefit and those they answer to...Fox News before long. Remember fox is now supplying all the republican canidates for office. Here in Spartanburg SC we have a debate going on. There are 7 different school districts in this country with seven administrations and seven superintendents and so on. The good ole boy republican systen down here thinks this needs to stay the same and that teachers should accept less pay and work longer hours. Everyone of those $175,000 positions includes country club memberships, ect. The schools down here are run to give family members of weath polititions high paying useless jobs at the publics expense.

    2. profile image56
      C.J. Wrightposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      yea, you got it. What's wrong with that? I don't get it? LOL

    3. profile image62
      logic,commonsenseposted 12 years agoin reply to this


      Let's throw more money down the rathole instead of getting rid of the rats.

  10. livewithrichard profile image75
    livewithrichardposted 12 years ago

    Anyone consider that the report linked in the OP is bogus reporting made to favor H.R. 5741:Universal National Service Act which was introduced by [D]Rep. Rangel of NY?

    If the public is made to believe that "most" HS grads can't pass the ASVAB then surely they will back a mandatory service Act for 18 - 42 y/o's.

    The ASVAB measures the aptitude an individual has in order to qualify they for a certain job set.  The majority of those that join the military are going to go infantry which requires the lowest score and even then a waiver can be obtained. 

    I don't care how high tech the military is getting, they still want the dumbest of the dumb in the infantry, the ones that have NO other choices, the ones they can mind-meld to do the bidding of their superiors. 

    There are only a certain amount of jobs in the military that require a high aptitude which is why most recruiters push new recruits towards the infantry.

    It's real easy to believe the above bogus reporting especially if you don't have HS aged children. If you do have HS aged children and they can't pass tests, don't blame the schools, blame yourself.

    1. Stump Parrish profile image60
      Stump Parrishposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Richard, that is a definite possibility. However this report simply states that which has been proven many times before. American graduates lack the basic skills needed to think independently. Spend sometime in the deep south and you will see countless examples of our wonderful educational system at work. In the 70's down here they still taught word memorization rather than phonetics. Juniors at my high school had an optional reading class available. This class was a last ditch effort to teach next years graduating class how to read. They learned important reading skills like ...How to Balance a check book, ect. Granted this was 35 years ago. In those 35 years, SC has managed to remain firmly planted in the bottom 5 of the best educated states in this country. Students have gotten dumber and the school administrations have grown wealthy and all work in brand new multi-million dollar building complexes. As I stated previously, we have 7 of these complexes in our county.

      Aother study you might not like is the one that shows, the more religious an area is the less educated the majority of people living in this area are. The reverse holds true also, the more educated an area is the less religious those living it are. 8 of the most religious states in America are also in the 10 least educated states.

      People down here are more interested in making sure students believe in their version of god, than they are teaching them the skills to succeed in life. 
      knowledge has always been the enemy of relgion and that battle still rages south of the Mason/Dummy line.

  11. Mikeydoes profile image76
    Mikeydoesposted 12 years ago

    The smart people wouldn't pass it. IMO.

    1. Stump Parrish profile image60
      Stump Parrishposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      The smart people who had no other option for going to college would. The smart ones trying to escape the crap hole they live in would. The smart ones with other options might not pass it, for sure.

  12. Flightkeeper profile image65
    Flightkeeperposted 12 years ago

    It could be the new school learning where they try to bring up your self confidence by teaching stupid stuff instead of the actual hard math and sciences that helps you get anywhere.

    1. Stump Parrish profile image60
      Stump Parrishposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Yep, the old every child is a winner approach to teaching. Sry, some kids are naturally stupid. Not every one of them can or should be president. Spending the first 18 years of your life hearing that you are special and that your IQ of 43 makes you a winner, does nothing but set everyone of these students up for a open handed slap in the face from reality when they enter the work force or the real world.
      Writing our exit exams in highschool to make sure the dumbest in the class graduate does nothing for those who have an average or better level of intelligence.

      1. profile image56
        C.J. Wrightposted 12 years agoin reply to this

        The local school system here has a motto of "Every Child, Every Day, College Bound" It's ridiculous!

  13. profile image0
    Sophia Angeliqueposted 12 years ago

    And according to research conducted to years ago, 95% of 4 year university students can't write a grammatical sentence...

  14. profile image0
    Sophia Angeliqueposted 12 years ago

    They should never have killed the classical education model which started being put to death mid 60s to end 60s. By the early 70s, the new education was in place.

    Since then, there has been a steady decline in education naturally.

    I was speaking to some young teachers the other day. One teacher was moaning because she was expected to teach kids mental arithmetic and she had never been taught it.

    The classical education system allowed people to go to trade school if they didn't wish to go to University. Germany still has only 10% of its students go to university. Ther rest go to trade schools of one type or another.

    This idiotic mindset that everybody is equal only insures that those who are intelligent are wasted because they can't get ahead in a system designed to keep everybody stupid so that everybody can be equal.

    Nobody is equal. Some are born beautiful, talented, gifted, etc. Others are born ill, ugly, poor, whatever. People can only be treated equally before the law. That is something completely different.

    As this is predominantly a Christian country, I'm going to use 'god's word' to back this. The new testatment says that some are born with one talent, others with two talents, and others with seven talents (or something like that). It also says that some are born to burn in hell and some are predestined to be with God. In other words, nobody is born equal. And the state can't make them equal.

    It can't be had both ways. So either there's a god and he says that everybody is not born equal.

    Or there's not a God and maybe man can make everbody equal.

    Or maybe the observations of science can establish that most people have the ability to earn a living and the system can support them by providing them with different paths of education...

  15. profile image0
    WildIrisposted 12 years ago

    My son took the ASVAB exam and scored in the high 90's but never joined the military. He could not understand why the military would take anyone with a low score. The fact that the military did take such low scores did not encourage my son to join up. He wondered, if when a situation got tight, would these other recruits really know enough to make the right decision or would their lack of judgment cost him his life.

    I agree with Sophia Angelique, abandoning the classical education model and Socratic dialogue in favor of the politically correct  is hurting this country and it future. Somehow it is more acceptable to be a slacker than to be smart in school. Go figure.


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