Disobedient Pet Owners

1. 53

   TruthDebaterposted 13 years ago

   A puppy across the road at a neighbors house got ran over and killed last night. From what I hear, this isn't the first time they have had a dog ran over. Are there any laws or fines to disobedient owners that let their animals get ran over without keeping them leashed or inside?
   
   I understand it is a cruel world and things happen, but why is this legal when things like dog fighting and others are illegal? I think this is animal cruelty the same or worse when an animal gets hit by a car and can suffer days or hours before death while the owner gets off without penalty.

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2. 87

   WryLiltposted 13 years ago

   I agree there should be stricter rules on dog owners. However I'd like to relate our experience...
   
   We have a malamute. That's like a husky. We had him inside a reasonably high fence. He escaped. We fenced off the higher backyard part. He escaped. We put him on a thick chain that weighed more than I'd like to carry and cost a shiny penny - he escaped carrying the chain. Currently we're using a length of high tensile wire and some thick chain. Our dog think he's Houdini...
   
   So yes, sometimes it is the owners fault but take into consideration both sides!

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   1. 53

      TruthDebaterposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Thanks. I used to have outside dogs when I was a child, but now we have inside dogs. I am not sure I agree keeping dogs outside should be legal. I think dogs and cats are on a different level than animals like cows and other livestock animals. Usually with our dogs outside, we had little interaction with them. When inside, we are forced to appreciate them more. So should keeping or making them live outside or chained up be legal? Btw, our dog escaped a chain also when I was little and bit the landlord. She had to be put down.

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      1. 87

         WryLiltposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Poor dog. Landlord probably deserved it...
         
         I don't know how well a big malamute would go inside! Small dogs maybe but not a dog that big!

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         1. 53

            TruthDebaterposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Thanks. You are right, my mom didn't like him, she said he deserved the bite lol. I don't think I have seen a malamute and i'm not sure it should be illegal to keep them outside, but many people keep great danes and other large dogs inside seemingly without too many problems.

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            1. 65

               Ivorwenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               Stop and think about what you are saying!  Dogs are descendants of wolves.  Wolves live outdoors, all year around, in some of the harshest conditions!  Coyotes do likewise, and they are a fairly small animal.  I have seen coyotes out roaming the planes at night in -20F weather (plus wind), and they don't seem to be suffering.
               
               Sure, they seek shelter, all creatures do.  A cave or abandoned badger hole.  A dog house offers at least as much protection.
               
               I grew up on a farm, with a number of dogs over the years.  Most of them wouldn't come into a building unless food was being offered.  The favorite sleeping place of our dogs was in a haystack.

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               1. 53

                  TruthDebaterposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  Thanks. There is a difference from domesticated dogs and dogs raised in the wild. Dogs raised in the wild have a greater chance in surviving the wild than do domesticated dogs. The weather is not always the only issue, like frogdropping wrote, some are left chained and barking the entire day. I can agree to some outside dogs that are away from busy roads, cars, and other houses.

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                  1. 65

                     Ivorwenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                     I can see where you are coming from.  Having dogs in town (or a city) is a challenge.  After trying several options, we invested in a wireless collar system for our two dogs, as they couldn't jump it or chew thew it.  Inside is not an option for these dog's comfort.  They may enjoy curling up for a nap in the house, but they need the ability to run, and much more so than a walk provides.
                     
                     I am actually amazed at how well domestic dogs can do in the wild, especially if they are running in a pack, but that creates a whole other problem.    Of course, I have never owned tiny dogs.

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                     1. 53

                        TruthDebaterposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                        Thanks. Yes, I agree dogs should have some freedom while also using precautions to keep them safe. Do you believe pet owners should get off free without penalty that gets multiple dogs ran over?

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                        1. 65

                           Ivorwenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                           While I am against animal abuse, I am also against excessive laws. 
                           
                           Usually, towns and cities have leash laws.  If those are being broken, then there are already consequences in place for animals roaming at large, whether the animal is injured by the behavior or not.   Really, I think people who are not willing to take the steps to keep their animals safe of should choose not to own animals, however, people obviously have different ideas on what taking care of animal means.  Heck, people can't even agree on what that means for children.  Why should we expect everyone to think the same about animals?   Your neighbor needs to figure out a plan to keep the animals safe, before owning another one or choose not to own, IMO.
                           
                           When we got our first dog, we trained her to stay home, within the boundaries of our yard.  We never had a problem (over a year) until a lady who walked by our house on her way to work decided to 'befriend' our dog, by offering jerky to the dog, when we were gone.  Of course, it was only a matter of time, before our dog was following this woman around town.  When our dog arrived at her place of work, she tied her up and called the dog catcher on us, claiming she didn't want to see the dog get ran over.  When we started talking to others about this, we found out that this woman was responsible for the demise of more than a dozen dogs, due to her 'befriending' of them. 
                           
                           We were fined for our dog running loose, as were other pet owners, while the root of the trouble got a pat on the back for 'looking out for these animals.' 

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                           1. 53

                              TruthDebaterposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                              Thanks. I agree there are different realities of what proper care is. How can you agree with a leash law that keeps dogs from biting other animals or people, but be against a law that protects the animal from the owners repeated failures? A person letting multiple animals get killed is repeated failure as well. Laws and consequences are the only things that raise awareness to higher levels of humanity. Sometimes laws are the only things that wake people up.
                              
                              Again, compare to dog fighting, why is the fighting illegal when the owner lets the dog get ran over with suffering and death?
                              
                              I don't think the woman walking down the street can be blamed unless she actually went in the yard and persuaded the dog. If she would have killed the dog and stated self defense or if the dog would have bit her, would it have been her fault or the owners if she was just walking down the street?

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                              1. 65

                                 Ivorwenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                                 Entering peoples yards and feeding their dogs treats, then walking off, with half of the treat in her hand is not luring a dog out?
                                 
                                 As to the laws, I believe leash laws are for keeping the dog safe as much as they are for keeping people safe.  If the dog is running at large, there are consequences, regardless of if the dog is hurt or not.

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                                 1. 53

                                    TruthDebaterposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                                    Thanks. Yes I disagree with someone entering the yards as I wrote above. I don't think the leash law applies to a dog being run over unless maybe it causes a wreck. I am pretty sure there is no penalty if the dog is ran over and no person is injured.

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                                    1. 65

                                       Ivorwenposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                                       I think it would be difficult to know who and how to charge, without a lengthy and costly court case.  People are not going to take their rights being limited without a fight, especially if they do not think they are guilty of anything. 
                                       
                                       I am sure that the way leash laws are applied varies from place to place, as they are a local law, not a state of federal law.
                                       
                                       For me, it comes down to the point of asking 'Is it worth spending taxpayer's $ on preventing some people from owning animals?'  And, unless you can PROVE negligence or abuse, No.  And if you can prove those things, why not go after the person while the dog is alive?

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                                    2. 53

                                       TruthDebaterposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                                       Thanks. Now I think we are getting to the issue, "is it worth it". I think to say it's not worth it to hold owners responsible for the death is contradictory to holding owners responsible for cruelty or dog fighting. There is no difference. If you enforce one, enforce the other. I am pretty sure the leash law doesn't apply or isn't enforced when an owner has multiple animals ridden over. It wouldn't be hard to prove ownership in many cases, investigators would simply need to question much like dog fighting investigations, the evidence would be the dogs body.  I agree it makes more sense to prevent things while the animals are still living, laws and enforced consequences also prevent things in some cases.

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3. 77

   frogdroppingposted 13 years ago

   I walk our dog a lot. I never fail to feel disappointed at those that walk theirs and leave the mess behind. I see many instances of poor ownership. Just down the road there's a large German Shepherd that spends its life on a chain in a tiny yard. Another I know of that's left to bark - probably out of boredom. I could go on.
   
   I was asked the other day if I mind walking ours, especially first thing on a morning when I'm half asleep. I hadn't thought about it. She gives me and my family so much, taking her out on walks is no big deal. But ... we are a cruel species, to each other, not just to animals.
   
   We couldn't sort outselves out in a thousand years. We're too destructive. Of course not all of us are. But enough to make the good among us saddened from time to time.

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   1. 53

      TruthDebaterposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Thanks. Very well said, I agree with everything. We are fast to take things for granted until we don't have them anymore or see someone elses animals in comparison. I guess all we can hope for is a larger awareness or more evolved humanity that places more value on life.

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4. 86

   rebekahELLEposted 13 years ago

   I think it's sad when owners don't walk their dogs. If they have their walks and social time walking through a park or neighborhood,generally they will be satisfied and won't try to escape. especially a big dog that needs to release energy.
   
   I read somewhere that one reason dogs misbehave or try to escape is something in their brain. when a dog gets exercise, it helps to balance his brain and the dog is calmer. I have found that to be true with my own dog. It helps their overall behavior and feeling of contentment.
   
   as far as penalties for the owners whose dog is run over? there are leash laws when a dog is off the owners property, but I'm not sure it would apply if a dog jumped over a fence or ran out of the house.

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   1. 53

      TruthDebaterposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Thanks. I agree with your information on exercise. I am mainly writing about repeated offenses. If a person doesn't learn from past failures, I think there should be laws or penalties in place.

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