Unending argument on Religion

1. 60

   francisassissiposted 11 years ago

   
   Religions have their own interpretations and understanding, why quarrel? Where is the respect? Where is the love?

   replyreport
2. 0

   Emile Rposted 11 years ago

   You are correct. If we could only communicate through action; those who believe could only live their faith. But, those who make the news because they live by faith are usually pretty scary these days. We had one Mother Theresa, but quite a few suicide bombers. Individuals who live by the standards of love espoused by many as the nature of God are outnumbered by those who live by violence claimed in the name of God. I think we all have different ideas as to why this is true. These ideas drive the argument; since most individuals prefer peace and security.

   replyreport
   1. 92

      habeeposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      I agree. I've never understood the violence associated with religion - and that includes Christianity. Some of the most horrendous violence and torture in history were done in the name of religion. I mean really - can you picture Jesus taking part in the Spanish Inquisition??

      replyreport
      1. 60

         bBereanposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         I can't picture Jesus taking part in Catholicism at all, so no.  Christianity being accused of the atrocities of the inquisitions betrays the lack of knowlege most have regarding the major differences between biblical Christianity and Catholicism.  A great in depth and well documented expose on this subject is "A Woman Rides the Beast" by Hunt: 
         
         http://www.amazon.com/Woman-Rides-Beast … +the+beast

         replyreport
         1. 92

            habeeposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            Good point, but it's still a shoot of Christianity. What about the Salem witch trials? The group responsible claimed to be devout followers of the Bible. I'm not knocking Christianity - I'm a Christian. I just don't get the violence. I would think that Christians would want to follow Christ as a role model.

            replyreport
            1. 60

               bBereanposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               Catholicism really isn't an offshoot of Christianity, but more a hijacking and redefining of terminology.  Unable to completely eliminate Christianity, Constantine tried a different tactic by adapting Christian terms and characters to the pagan church he was already the head of, and remained the leader of to the day he died.  Instead of Isis, Horus and Sept you had Jesus, Mary and Satan.  Throughout it's early history the Catholic church continued to persecute and kill Christians who were not fooled and would not convert to Catholicism.

               replyreport
               1. 0

                  Motown2Chitownposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                  Constantine did not establish the Catholic Church as we know it today.  In fact, he caused the first schism in catholic (universal) Christianity.

                  replyreport
                  1. 60

                     bBereanposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                     Yes, the Catholic church has evolved, but it is following the path and example set by Constantine.  It is his church.

                     replyreport
                     1. 0

                        Motown2Chitownposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                        I'm sorry, but you are very mixed up in this understanding.  Constantine is the founder of the Eastern (Byzantine) Catholic Church.  The Catholic Church that most refer to by that name alone is the Roman Catholic Church - which is what Constantine left to establish himself as the head of Christianity in the east.

                        replyreport
         2. 0

            Motown2Chitownposted 11 years agoin reply to this

             
            
            And Catholicism being accused because of the atrocities of the inquisitions possibly betrays an innate prejudice, IMO.  After all - the Spanish Inquisition was begun by Spanish monarchs, not Church leaders.

            replyreport
            1. 60

               bBereanposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               Islam initiated the conflict, but the Catholic church responded and perpetuated it.  Again, a big subject but well addressed in the book I mentioned.

               replyreport
               1. 0

                  Motown2Chitownposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                  So the Jews of today should in fact be held accountable for killing Christ?

                  replyreport
                  1. 60

                     bBereanposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                     As the most persecuted people in history, they have been held accountable for rejecting Jesus, but it is not man's place to do that.  Jews remain God's chosen people, his promises to Abraham still apply and Christians should pray for and support them.
                     
                     I'm enjoying the conversation but have to catch a few hours sleep before work.

                     replyreport
                     1. 0

                        Motown2Chitownposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                        But Catholics of today should be held responsible for every action of "Catholics" in the past?

                        replyreport
                        1. 60

                           bBereanposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                           Honestly, the Catholic church discourages layity from studying the bible, saying they can't understand it, and they really don't even want them understanding the history and doctrines of the church.  They want them to follow and do as they are told by the church.  Most Catholics consequently have no idea what all their church stands for or details of it's history.  Pretty hard to hold them accountable for the history.  The church itself, (it's leadership), however, knows or should know.

                           replyreport
                           1. 0

                              Motown2Chitownposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                              First, it is wildly untrue that the Church discourages study of Scripture by the laity.  That has NOT been the case since at least the 60's, after the Second Vatican Counsel.  Before boldly making claims about what Catholics do or don't or about what they're encouraged to do or not do by Church leadership, be sure you're speaking with someone who is truly uneducated about the Church.
                              
                              I am not.
                              
                              I'll be happy to set you straight about what is ACTUALLY taught to and practiced by Catholic Laity.

                              replyreport
                              1. 60

                                 bBereanposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                 Yes, with access to bibles in common languages now widely available, there is no avoiding people reading it so why not "encourage" it, but are you telling me you are not told you need the church to interpret and understand it?  If so, your right, it really has changed.

                                 replyreport
                                 1. 0

                                    Motown2Chitownposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                    We are taught that the Church is guided by the same Holy Spirit that guides us individually.  Some who choose laziness simply do what they're told to do by their church leaders.  Others follow the leading of the Holy Spirit in their daily lives, often finding themselves unwittingly faithful to the teachings of the Church.
                                    
                                    Interesting, huh?  That statement is as true about protestant and non-denominational Christians as it is of Catholics.
                                    
                                    Out of curiosity, have you ever been a member of the Roman Catholic Church?

                                    replyreport
                                    1. 60

                                       bBereanposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                       I have not always been a Christian, but I have never been a Roman Catholic.  I have had several friends who used to be Catholics.   
                                       
                                       Would you agree that:
                                       Much of the Catholic doctrine is not found in the bible? 
                                       Catholicism and biblical Christianity have irreconcilable differences?
                                       
                                       I ask because in spite of primarily incompatible doctrines, unbelievers and other religions tend to group Catholics and Christians together.  We have much socially on which we can agree, and even work together on, but considering the two beliefs as the same, or interchangable, is to do a disservice to, and misrepresent both.

                                       report
                                       1. 0

                                          Motown2Chitownposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                                          Some Catholic doctrine, while not directly lifted from the Bible, has Biblical support.  But, yes, Roman Catholicism is a religion of both Scripture and Tradition.
                                          
                                          Interestingly enough however, Catholicism is a denomination of Christianity.  So, we are indeed Christians. 
                                          
                                          Also, those Christians who accuse Catholics of being so anti-scriptural are the same ones living the doctrines of Sola Scriptura or Sola Fide - by scripture alone, by faith alone - neither of which doctrine is found in or upheld by Scripture.
                                          
                                          
                                          
                                          Also be careful that you don't choose to receive your education about Catholicism from those who 'used to be' Catholic.  Many of those folks, while still embracing Christianity, have their own axes to grind with the Church.

                                          report
3. 79

   jlparkposted 11 years ago

   Like I said in the "how do you define God" question....I think that trying to define God or Gods is assuming that your definition of God is the only one.
   
   Defining God, or Gods, is a ridiculous notion as it is trying to define the undefinable.  That is what makes Gods Gods - they cannot be defined.  Humans - we can, thats why we aren't Gods.
   
   I think that is where the Christian religion and all it's off shoots comes unstuck. It assumes that it has the only God, and then tries to define Him.  Then assumes that their definition is the only one.
   
   So, accepting that there may be more than one, and leaving Gods to define themselves....would make this world a whole lot less violent, and a whole lot more peaceful....isn't that what religion is supposed to be about? Peace and love?

   replyreport
   1. 60

      francisassissiposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      News media plays the big part in that violence you just said.

      replyreport