I Need Help From The Brits

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   Harvey Stelmanposted 15 years ago

   Lately we are hearing much on the news that is negative on your health-care, it has gone on for a week or so. Are problems coming to the front? Please tell me the story, as seen locally.

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      Harvey Stelmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this

      I wasn't looking to argue, I wanted to know if something was going wrong. Figuring the other side of the pond knew more, I simply asked a question.

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         ryankettposted 15 years agoin reply to this

         Hi Harvey, we were not arguing with you. There are people on here that will not let this particular political issue rest.
         
         As per my first response, what problems have you heard? If you tell me what you have heard, I would be happy to confirm whether or not it is  a) true, or b) propoganda. The likelyhood is that some of it would be true and some of it would be untrue. I say that as a Brit, who lives in the UK, has used the NHS himself just yesterday!, and would be more than willing to discuss your concerns.
         
         The UK government is looking to slash the cost of running the NHS by £20bn (about $30bn). There are concerns about how this can be achieved, but the government are clear that this will not be as a result of job losses. Instead, they will drag up the performance of those hospitals achieving under-average levels of output to match the current average levels of output. This would save money.
         
         If that is what you have heard recently, then yes this is an area of concern with Brits who do not want any cut backs in the NHS budget (contrary to the opinions of many US citizens, who clearly wish for no money to be spent on public health care).
         
         If this is not what you have heard Harvey, then please explain and allow me to discuss.
         
         Regards,
         
         Ryan.

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            Harvey Stelmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this

            I have heard things on different news reports, so i can not post non-written words. There were a few stories in the past week.

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               ryankettposted 15 years agoin reply to this

               Well you are asking me to comment about problems with the NHS. If you are unwilling to say what you heard, then I cant help you.
               
               The only problem the Brits are having with the NHS are concerns about potential budget cuts.
               
               If that is what you have heard, then yes that is a problem. If that is not what you have heard, then this is American propoganda.
               
               Our prime minister, and our shadow prime minister, have already spoken out against America with regards to these half truths and scaremongering.
               
               Apologies if I sound brash, but our whole country is on the defensive against constant lies in the American media in the past two months about our health service.
               
               Thats all that I can say unless you are prepared to explain what exactly it is that you have heard.
               
               I do wonder why you bothered asking the question if you cannot be bothered to explain it in any depth.

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                  Harvey Stelmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this

                  Ryan,
                  
                  They were interviewing Brits that were not able to get surgeries and others that had to wait to see doctor's. I'm sure that didn't help but I didn't have a pen to take down their names.
                  
                  f I was the head of any country, I would not trus our President. You can read my HUB'S, most are against him. He is a COMMUNIST!

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   ryankettposted 15 years ago

   Why dont you start by telling me what problems you have heard? The NHS does have certain problems, but much of what I have heard from Americans and certain American political figures is complete rubbish. The British were so appalled by some comments that a national newspaper launched a campaign on twitter which got hundreds of thousands of supportive responses and crashed twitter twice.
   
   You list everything that you have heard, and I will tell you if its true. Im sure that some of it will be true, some of it wont..... Fire....

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   Mrvoodooposted 15 years ago

   These threads from a few weeks back may be of interest to you:
   
   http://hubpages.com/forum/topic/19375#post304831
   http://hubpages.com/forum/topic/19310
   
   * I personally know of nobody within the UK without love for the NHS, from what I can tell it was all yet another American smear campaign.

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      ryankettposted 15 years agoin reply to this

      In fairness, he may be talking about proposed efficiency measures designed to save £20bn, these have been talked about in the past couple of days. I cant defend this until I see how they intend to save this money.
      
      I am 99% certain that anything else he would have heard would be the standard propoganda that has been debated and defended to death by us Brits on hubpages for the last month or so....

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         Mrvoodooposted 15 years agoin reply to this

         Ah right, sorry, thought it was the same old same, and now Nicomps turned up I'm out of this thread before I lose the little faith I have left in human decency.

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            nicompposted 15 years agoin reply to this

            lol. We'll miss you!

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            ryankettposted 15 years agoin reply to this

            You and me both mate..... Else I will need NHS treatment for manic depression triggered by extreme bordom and frustration.

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               nicompposted 15 years agoin reply to this

               As I always say, don't let the facts get in the way of your 99% surety. Thinking people will read my links and address them. Enjoy your fish and chips.

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                  ryankettposted 15 years agoin reply to this

                  Actually its beef stew and dumplings tonight. Fish and Chips night has passed, and they were very tasty. Enjoy your.... errr.... McDonalds? KFC? Burger King? Subway? Dunkin Donuts?

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                     nicompposted 15 years agoin reply to this

                     McDonald's Angus burger is quite good. Perhaps Chik-Fil-A this afternoon. Do you have that?

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                        Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this

                        I knew you were a junk food man.
                        
                        @ the OP
                        
                        I have lived in both countries and the British system is far superior an the whole. Of course it fails in some instances and there is abuse that goes on.

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                        ryankettposted 15 years agoin reply to this

                        I cant say that I have heard of a Chik-Fil-A, unless that is what we know simple as a Chicken Fillet Burger..... but yes I do like the Angus burger.
                        
                        You can have Burger King back though.... I have a breakfast there today on route to a job interview, had to put it in the bin!

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                           nicompposted 15 years agoin reply to this

                           Chik-Fil-A is a national chain of chicken joints. Their mascot is a cow who says "Eat more Chikin".

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                              ryankettposted 15 years agoin reply to this

                              Nope, it looks like that one hasn't primed itself for an assualt on global markets yet then? In fairness, I think (and hope) that the fast food market has become saturated in the UK - cant see room for any more heart attack foods. And Pizza Hut announced a long term plan of 'consolidation' in the UK, suggesting that the market has reached its full capacity.
                              
                              If that means less fat people taking up two seats on a plane and less litter on the streets, then good!

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                                 nicompposted 15 years agoin reply to this

                                 Hey, if you have a heart problem, just go get a free angioplasty.

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                                    frogdroppingposted 15 years agoin reply to this

                                    Nicomp you have a bee in your bonnet about the UK NHS huh? It's ok you know, if you live in the US - you don't have to worry about using it.

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                                    ryankettposted 15 years agoin reply to this

                                    Nothing is free remember nicomp, its just that some things are half price
                                    
                                    It would be interesting if a Phd student could do a thesis on the cost of an Americanised food industry to the British national health care service. I suspect that we will establish exactly why health care in America costs a lot more (ye fat bastards)

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4. 62

   nicompposted 15 years ago

   The Brits ration health care.
   
   
   "Adjusted for population, the United
   States currently has about four times as
   many (CT) scanners as Britain does"
   http://www.brookings.edu/comm/policybriefs/pb147.pdf
   
   "Waiting Times. Waiting lists are a huge problem in Great Britain. Some examples: 750,000 are on waiting lists for hospital admission; 40% of cancer patients are never able to see an oncologist; there is explicit rationing for services such as kidney dialysis, open heart surgery and care for the terminally ill. Further, minimum waiting times have been instituted to reduce costs. "A top-flight hospital like Suffolk Est PCT was ordered to impose a minimum waiting time of at least 122 days before patients could be treated or the hospital would lose a portion of its funding.""
   
   http://www.cprights.org/2008/04/health- … ritain.php
   
   
   http://catholicexchange.com/2009/01/07/115087/

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      ryankettposted 15 years agoin reply to this

      750,000 are on waiting lists for hospital admission - Do you never have to make an appointment to see a doctor about minor issues? I have been to hospital 4 times in the past 3 weeks, have another appointment for next week, and this all relates to one minor issues. I have been on that waiting list, and come off that waiting list, 4 times in 4 weeks.
      
      Suffolk PCT recieves an average of just 30 complaints per quarter. It serves around 750,000 people. Suffolk neighbours my own county, dont try and tell me that you know more than the 3 relatives I have that work there.
      
      Look I cant even be bothered to talk to a parrot.... change the record.
      
      Original Poster - read those links provided by Mrvoodoo.Our health care system is way above the US in the world rankings, costs 8% of our GDP, as opposed to your 16%, we have a longer life expectancy than the USA, and the vast majority of us Brits have a very strong appreciation for our health care service. Not to mention the fact that everybody in the country gets it (no rationing by the way, my 74 year old grandad has been kept alive by the NHS for the past five years at the cost of tens of thousands of pounds, with no invoice, he even has a carer visit him to get him out of bed every single morning - again, no charge. He has cancer, has had strokes, he wears a catheter - he has been kept alive with no expense spared).
      
      Dont be fooled by propoganda. If you or I were to lie as much as American politicians about the NHS, we would be taken for to the cleaners for libel/slander.
      
      If our healthcare system lacks in anyway, it still far surpasses the American system. And that is respected worldwide.

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      kephriraposted 15 years agoin reply to this

      Part of the problems with American healthcare is massive overprescription of medicine and overuse of expensive equipment because doctors and hospitals make more money from more procedures. There is no rationing of the use of CT scanners in the NHS, we just don't need as many cos we don't over use them.
      As for '40 of cancer patients in Britain never see an oncologist' - where did you get that from? All cancer patients in the UK see an oncologist, regardless of their job or how much money they have for insurance.

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         nicompposted 15 years agoin reply to this

         True, you don't need medicine when you're sent home to live out your life.
         
         A CT scan is a diagnostic device, not treatment.

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            kephriraposted 15 years agoin reply to this

            What's that got to do with it? I was just saying their use isn't rationed, thats just a myth.

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            ryankettposted 15 years agoin reply to this

            1) He didnt say it was a treatment.
            
            2) There are no cancer patients that do not get to see an Oncologist, unless they are in the final days of their life before bothering to phone a doctor.
            
            3) I know dozens of people who have had cancer scares, all people are seen pretty much immediately. My grandad was diagnosed with cancer early enough for him to be alive 17 years later - still with that cancer. Try telling him that the NHS lacks in cancer care, he would not be able to afford to stay alive in the US. America puts a price on life. For me, and most people in the world, thats the one area where Capitalism has no place.

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               nicompposted 15 years agoin reply to this

               I can't dispute your anecdotal evidence and I respect it. We do differ on the price of life: every country puts a price on it, especially those countries with socialized medicine. In America each person sets their own price. In Britain you let the government do it. Does Britain operate on a balanced budget or does the government run a deficit?

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                  ryankettposted 15 years agoin reply to this

                  Right now, our country is borrowing money and building up national debt. But nowhere as much as America has (and is) of course. Our borrowing has risen sharply since the start of the financial crisis - we bailed out our banks, just like you. The economic situation pretty much mirrors that of the US, which is no suprise.
                  
                  The NHS is funded directly by tax revenue. No money is borrowed specifically for the purpose of funding a national health service. And you do not need to be reminded that we spend 8% of our GDP on healthcare, whilst you spend 16% and still have 42million people who are not entitled to it.

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         Amanda Severnposted 15 years agoin reply to this

         A friend of my colleague was diagnosed with terminal cancer last week, and he was in the office visiting yesterday. He's still pretty chirpy despite the diagnosis. This is his third lot of cancer over a twenty year period and consequently he has refused chemotherapy because he knows it will only add weeks rather than years. He is in his late sixties and can't speak highly enough of the NHS and the speed with which he was seen, and the range of treatments offered and received. But of course, if these people would sooner believe the spurious claims of those who clearly have an axe to grind, then so be it.......

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            nicompposted 15 years agoin reply to this

            Anecdotal evidence. I suppose I could trot out an American who loves his health care and a Brit who feels slighted... that's not how we resolve these issues.

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   nicompposted 15 years ago

   Treatment of Coronary Artery Disease: What Does Rationing Do?
   http://www.brookings.edu/comm/policybriefs/pb148.pdf

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   JamesCurtisposted 15 years ago

   This kind of thing makes me so mad! People come on here spouting half truths based on hearsay or a one off personal experience.
   
   Seriously Ryan, how can you want to get rid of Buger King based on one lousy breakfast? Anyone who knows anything will tell you the BK is pretty much the best for burgers, but you NEVER have the breakfast.

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      Mark Knowlesposted 15 years agoin reply to this

      All that stuff is garbage. You want a real barbecue burger - you have to make it yourself.

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         JamesCurtisposted 15 years agoin reply to this

         Impossible! Some of the best scientific minds in the world have dedicated their lives to making the Double Whopper with Cheese. How could one man improve in that using only food and heat?

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      Daniel Carterposted 15 years agoin reply to this

      LOL. And silly me was thinking this response was going to be about the halftruths of healthcare!!
      
      Such a relief that healthcare is not as big an issue as breakfast at a fast food joint.
      
      I personally think that American insurance companies have a lot to do with all the negative press regarding US healthcare reform. An article on CNN pretty much proves it:
      
      http://us.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/08/17/p … index.html
      
      (Hope the link still works)
      
      For me it's not all one or the other. (As far as for or against proposed reform).
      
      There is a lot of fear and animosity being spread by conservatives and liberals alike in the US, and it makes it all the more difficult for the average American to get real facts.
      
      As for BK, you're on your own. I don't eat there and rarely eat at any fast food holes. BLECH.

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         Uninvited Writerposted 15 years agoin reply to this

         It's just that this topic has been beaten to death on the forums.
         
         I don't like BK either and I try to avoid McDonalds.

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      ryankettposted 15 years agoin reply to this

      sorry, but its McDonalds all the way for me. Although I try and avoid them all to be honest, once every two weeks for me I much prefer supporting the local chippy than feeding (excuse the pun) the corporate machine.

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   wrenfrost56posted 15 years ago

   Personally I love the NHS, I am very greatfull. We are very fortunate to have a system of great, free care.

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      nicompposted 15 years agoin reply to this

      it's not free.

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         wrenfrost56posted 15 years agoin reply to this

         O.K. not free, but I think it's well worth paying taxes for! If your ill you get treated, you don't need insurance and those on benafits or lower incomes are intitled to the same treatment as those with better income/wealth.

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         Amanda Severnposted 15 years agoin reply to this

         She didn't say it was. And your point is?

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   Helen Caterposted 15 years ago

   My husband had a heart attack 6 weeks ago. The NHS were faqntastic. He was in hospital 4 days and they have provided weekly rehab. We have private health care but had no need to use it. Waiting lists for very minor ops is probably high, but thats because more serious cases overide them. If you are going to dye from something you will be seen very quickly. I have never had any need to complain about the service. Our NHS is brill.

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      wrenfrost56posted 15 years agoin reply to this

      I am sorry to hear about your feller, I hope he is better and I agree with you I think the NHS is great.

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