Why Hate Folks who had their Health Coverage Restored under Obamacare?

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   Dr Billy Kiddposted 12 years ago

   I read stories of small business people who could not buy health insurance. They had quit their day jobs where they had it. But they did not realize that insurance companies rarely sell to individuals and small companies. Some actually diied without insunace. With others, Obamacare allowed them to buy insurance. When i read the comments under these stories, there are always people who wish the person that got the insuracne woulld just die.
   
   This confuses me. I know the U.S. is divided into those who think about resovlving problems in a fair manner and those who feel that all answers should come from their convictions. This latter group says things like the constitution didn't set up a nanny state and peo[le without insurce should just die.
   
   Why is this hatred so common? Is is because the person had the opportunity to build a business and the other one didn't? Is is because Hatred is a Family Value? Or are we puppets to a manical media that programs us to hate peope who are helped by the government?

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      HowardBThinameposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      I don't want anyone to go without healthcare, but I'm not convinced Obamacare is the answer. There is a four-tier system, and the lowest tier, Bronze, which is what the poorest will receive, only pays 60% of health care bills, excepts some wellness-checks. I don't see that as an answer. For others - the government is saying, okay, now you're going to have coverage - go buy it. If they can't afford the premiums, they will have a fine tacked onto their taxes. Again, I don't think that is an answer.
      
      I think millions will still be without coverage and multi-millions will have such sparse coverage that they still can't afford to go to the doctor. I think we ought to be able to do better in this nation. But, that's just me.

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         Josakposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         You do realize that for those with low income the insurance is free right?

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            HowardBThinameposted 12 years agoin reply to this

            Actually, it's not for anyone except those with the very lowest incomes. Those who already qualify for Medicaid. The option to expand Medicaid services is now a state issue and some states are voting not to expand. Those who will be really crunched are those who make above poverty level, but do not make enough to either pay the premiums - yet they must. There is some tax credit that should help, but it's only after the fact. One must file the previous years taxes in order to qualify for it - and it's not complete reimbursement. The hard part will be for those folks to pay the premium, which on the low end for a single person will be around $400 and for a family will be higher, when they're having a tough time putting food on the table as it is.
            
            For the wealthy - Obamacare is great. They (most of the wealthy) already have good health coverage - so - no skin off their teeth. It's the just those who can't afford it already - who are being told they must pay.
            
            I don't think that's a good plan at all. Even if some low/moderate income families scrape up enough to pay the premiums, they still have high deductibles and high co-pays. The low deductibles are reserved for those who can purchase the Platinum and Gold level plans.
            
            I'm not sure where the average uninsured person is expected to come up with the extra money in this economy. And those who live in small and rural communities, where most employers do not hire more than 50 workers, have to buy their own insurance. So far, the "competitive" exchanges don't appear to be offering great rates.
            
            If they can't pay (and I'm guessing millions won't be able to) they have to pay the IRS tax. So, that takes away a bit more of their money and they still get no healthcare.
            
            I think many have not taken the time to read the plan. I know it's long, but it's worth at least scanning.

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               Dr Billy Kiddposted 12 years agoin reply to this

               Right. 10% of the population will not be able to afford the preiums for health insurance under the Affordable Care Act, according to one source. http://www.commonwealthfund.org/~/media … ief_v2.pdf

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                  HowardBThinameposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                  I have a feeling it will be a lot more than 10%. But, I hope it's that low. I would have preferred a bill that encouraged the wealthy to shoulder part of the plan, instead of dumping the cost on lower-middle income folks.
                  
                  It's what it is, I suppose, but I don't think it will survive. Too many people will be out in the cold. I took the time and read 3/4 of this plan. I think some are in for a big (and sad) surprise.

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   Uninvited Writerposted 12 years ago

   There is a sad lack of empathy in the United States these days it seems (actually in the world). So many are not able to put themselves in someone else's shoes. They think of course whatever happens to people is their own fault. Many of them change their tune when it is they who come down with a serious illness.
   
   And...it is the Internet and some idiots think it's fun to be as nasty as possible in their comments.

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      Dr Billy Kiddposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      That's kind of like the psycological theory. If you did it wroing, it's because of your character. If I did it wrong, it's because of the external circumstances. That does come down to a lack of emphathy.

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   innersmiffposted 12 years ago

   Idiot conservatives do half the work of the Obamacare-fascists by playing cartoonishly selfish like this. Anybody who's actually serious about free-market healthcare doesn't believe people should (or would) die in the streets through lack of insurance.

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      Josakposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      But the absolute incontrovertible fact is that they do.

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         innersmiffposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         Where on the planet is there free-market healthcare?

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            Josakposted 12 years agoin reply to this

            It doesn't exist anywhere anymore because people around the world have figured out how terrible it was but during the industrial revolution for example throughout Europe, Latin America up until the 30s and 40s etc etc. healthcare was simply provided by private institutions and doctors, the consequence of which is most people never saw a doctor in their life and the lower classes in countries like England lived more than a third less than the upper class.
            
            Both my step parents were born at home with no doctor or nurse present because none could be afforded and my grandfather was blind in one eye for most of his life because he could not afford the simple surgery to get it fixed. You have no idea how privileged you are to live with the protections you don't appreciate at all
            
            This fanatical belief that the free market can fix everything is disproved simply by glancing back at our history.

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               Dr Billy Kiddposted 12 years agoin reply to this

               Josak, I've lived in ghetto-like situations and so many people there limp. As a healthcare provider I've had to watch people die because of lack of treatment. There's only so much pro bono work a person like me can do.
               
               "Cartoonishly selfish" surely describes those who hate people who got their health insurance restored through Obamacare.

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                  Josakposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                  Agreed completely.

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            Dr Billy Kiddposted 12 years agoin reply to this

            Innersmiff. I worked at a medical university. The U.S. government pays $100,000 per physician resident-in-training (post graduation) per year for every medicial student in the U.S. Hospitals say they do not have the resources to train newly graduated resident physicians. For this, and other reasons, the U.S. government was paying half the costs of healthcare before Obamacare came along.

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   JaxsonRaineposted 12 years ago

   To me, it's not about providing healthcare insurance to those who can't get it. I don't have a problem with that, just like I don't have a problem with general welfare programs*.
   
   To me, the issue is the government forcing me to do something, taking away a right of mine, increasing its power, and instituting a landmark type of new tax. This has opened the way to tax people for:
   
   Not exercising enough
   Not eating enough vegetables
   Not getting enough sunlight
   Not voting
   Not doing X
   
   
   
   *All welfare programs must be 'hand-up', with stipulation/training/job search/placement.

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   Mighty Momposted 12 years ago

   So-called Obamacare doesn't only address health insurance for the uninsured.
   It addresses improving care provision -- capacity building for providers, increasing access to both primary and speciality care, as well.
   It's not just about getting more people care, it's about improving the EFFICIENCY and the EFFICACY of health care.
   
   But I suppose that's evil, as well.
   

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      TIMETRAVELER2posted 12 years agoin reply to this

      I have spent a lot of time researching the AHCA.  It is not perfect and will have to be tweaked as time goes on, but it will provide health care for 30 million people who no longer have it.  Furthermore, everybody who is so against it or who rales about being "forced" to pay for it forgets that for years hospitals have been forced to treat anybody...whether or not they have insurance...and THIS is one of the main reasons those of us who have coverage have to pay so much for it.  WE are paying for THEM...and if they are too poor to pay for coverage, they STILL can use the ER facilities nationwide.
      
      Furthermore, the fact that in 2014 the pre existing condition exemption will kick in is a miracle for millions who could previously could never get coverage.
      
      The argument that this "forced" payment opens the door for other forced payment issues is absurd.  You cannot compare health care coverage to anything else because sooner or later, every single living human being will need it....and some will need it a lot!
      
      Unfortunately, I think the great majority of Americans have been dumbed down to the point that they simply listen and respond to rhetoric instead of thinking things through.  Why would you be so against something that was meant to help people?  To me, this doesn't even make sense.
      
      Anybody who is angry because someone was able to get insurance is mentally deficient.
      
      And Mighty Mom is absolutely correct...the efficiencies that are to come will improve care, save money and save lives.

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         Dr Billy Kiddposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         TimeTraveler2, you have a lot of good points. One thing I've learned is that  the problem is not so much that many Americans are dumbed down. The deal is very few ever get the real facts. Think of how much time it took you to figure out the Affordable Care Act would lower the cost of healthcare and the deficit. Now, if that information could have simply come across the evening news. But wait--
         
         Instead we got a 2nd amendment debate about whether it was OK to take assault rifles to meetings where Obamacare would be disussed. Perhaps this is what you meant by dumbed down. Myself, I believe those 2nd amendment people truely felt a threat at times, just listening to the nonsense on the TV. could drive almost any person to extremes.

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