jump to last post 1-6 of 6 discussions (39 posts)

Parking Meter Activists Save Drivers $80,000 in Fines

  1. wrenchBiscuit profile image91
    wrenchBiscuitposted 2 years ago

    http://s2.hubimg.com/u/12068681_f520.jpg
    These activists are being hounded by big brother for  putting their own money in parking meters so their fellow citizens won't get fined. The city of Keene New Hampshire  filed lawsuits against the activists but both lawsuits were thrown out by a lower court. However the city has appealed, and now the case is headed to the New Hampshire Supreme Court. Read more at http://thefreethoughtproject.com/activi … dpvAyZv.99

    These miscreant city officials have no shame: Filing a lawsuit against citizens for helping their fellow man! If Jesus came down from heaven today, I am sure these same city officials would try to have him crucified for healing the sick, since the local hospitals would be losing money as a result.  In Cleveland Ohio, or Ferguson Missouri, they would just cut to the chase and have a cop shoot Jesus, claiming the son of God threatened the cop with eternal damnation.

    This is the type of activism that is needed all across the United States. Here we see the forward thinking people of New Hampshire standing united against corrupt city and state officials who steal millions of dollars  from U.S. taxpayers every year. Hat's off to the "Robin Hooders!"

    1. Credence2 profile image86
      Credence2posted 2 years ago in reply to this

      Geez, WB, haven't law enforcement got better things to do with their time?Since when is it against the law for someone to put money in a parking meter on someone else's behalf. What sort of right wing plot is afoot?

    2. wilderness profile image96
      wildernessposted 2 years ago in reply to this

      Agreed - we should all celebrate those that encourage a select few to monopolize limited public resources, leaving the rest of the community to do without while picking up the cost of that encouragement.

      1. PhoenixV profile image81
        PhoenixVposted 2 years ago in reply to this

        Make ya wanna go into a McD's with a bullhorn and call the teenager behind the counter nasty names because of the amount of sugar or sodium that might be in their products?

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3FUtauy1j74

        1. wilderness profile image96
          wildernessposted 2 years ago in reply to this

          A far better solution might be to tax city dwellers enough to tear down their grocery stores and build free  parking garages instead so that suburbia can drive into the city and park for free, don't you think?

          1. PhoenixV profile image81
            PhoenixVposted 2 years ago in reply to this

            Well, I personally like the bullhorn idea. We have to stop the tyranny of teenagers "peddling and pushing" sugar and salt to us all, to an early coronary.  Or we could just not eat fast food and ride a bike or walk to work and avoid parking meters and fast food altogether. That way, some elderly lady trying to make an appointment wont have to drive around the city block for an hour waiting for the robin hooders to run out of nickels. If we level the downtown area for free parking, sure, we would have plenty of space, but no one would have a reason to park there.

          2. wrenchBiscuit profile image91
            wrenchBiscuitposted 2 years ago in reply to this

            A better idea would be for you to come with some good ideas of your own. You are quick in your attempts to tear down ideas and perspectives of others, but you seldom share anything but sarcastic , and vitriolic remarks. An interesting idea would be nice once and a while. Put it in your Day Planner.

            1. wilderness profile image96
              wildernessposted 2 years ago in reply to this

              Personally, I like parking meters.  It is a reasonable method of limiting the time in a parking space meant to be shared by everyone - there is but a token fee until one decides they need not share and can keep the space indefinitely.  Even then there is only a small fine for being an inconsiderate a$$-h.

              1. wrenchBiscuit profile image91
                wrenchBiscuitposted 2 years ago in reply to this

                If someone doesn't want to share a parking meter they also can continue to put money in it. Does that make them an a$$ as well in your book of parking etiquette? This this not about who likes parking meters. It's about citizens being harassed for actually obeying the law. According to you, if someone's son. daughter, or significant other keeps feeding the meter for them then they are also cheaters. If I or anyone else chooses to put money in someone's parking meter it is morally and legally correct to do so. You have no argument.

        2. oceansnsunsets profile image88
          oceansnsunsetsposted 2 years ago in reply to this

          Wow..... I couldn't believe that guy with the camera.  His accusation that lady was stealing by force, was sickening.  Over and over and over, he said she was stealing.  They wouldn't stop following her,

  2. oceansnsunsets profile image88
    oceansnsunsetsposted 2 years ago

    Just from a totally different angle.....  what about the citizens that would want to happily pay to park in these much wanted spaces,  but can't because of others that sit in spots that don't want to pay like everyone has to?

    It sounds like its a lot of people not paying, if this has become such an issue for both sides here.   Funny, the two sides "duking it out" aren't even the ones that caused the problem in the first place.  The ones that caused the whole problem are those that want something for nothing.  "I want to park here, and am in full knowledge I have to pay to, but I don't really want to."  Proven by actions, over and over...

    Just keeping all the ideas involved, on the table for discussion here.  Now, if there were a little old lady that tripped on the way back to her vehicle, and couldn't pay, then this should not be held against her, nor any other of sad, non ordinary scenarios.  Very often, people just don't want to pay, and don't intend on paying when they get the fine. 

    Do we never penalize those that go against the rules, that in some cases make life harder for those that don't want to break the rules, and just get to work or wherever they are going?  See how there are more details?  And no, I am not defending a lawless tax collecting greedy politicians or anything....  Just asking to look at all sides.

    1. wilderness profile image96
      wildernessposted 2 years ago in reply to this

      Funny how that gets left out, isn't it?  The purpose of a parking meter is two-fold, after all - to limit the time spent in a specific spot and to raise funds.  Of the two, the first is more important but is being circumvented by these "heroes" out to save a space hog a few dollars.

    2. wrenchBiscuit profile image91
      wrenchBiscuitposted 2 years ago in reply to this

      http://s1.hubimg.com/u/12068918.jpg
      If you want to argue that the so-called "law breakers" are keeping the "honest" citizens from getting a parking place, you are dead wrong, and have nowhere to go with such a predictable argument. How so? Read it and weep: There is no ordinance or "law" in any city that I have ever lived in that suggests there is a "time limit" on parking spaces. What does this mean? It means that as long as money keeps going into that meter, I am not breaking the law. If I want to park my car all day long at one particular parking meter, then I have the legal right to do so as long as I pay the required cost of admission. Consequently, if I do so I am cheating no one. I challenge any of you brilliant scholars to prove me wrong! How can someone be considered a "space hog" when they are following the rules by paying the meter? Furthermore, having someone else put the money in the meter is not cheating either, since the law only requires that money be placed in the meter. Period.

      Your logic implies that if I go to a restaurant to buy someone else a hamburger and a coke, the person I am buying it for is cheating because they should be the one standing in the line, and not me! I also suggest that all of you take back any Christmas presents you purchased for your husband or wife, since they are also cheating by not going to the store and making the purchase for themselves. The city has asked for a price of admission. This activist group has paid the price of admission. What is the problem? The city got their money.Where is the theft of services?

      The problem is that city governments are in the business of stealing money from citizens by any means necessary. They wanted their blood money and didn't get it. The court even ruled against them because the required parking meter fees were paid. It fascinates me that so many people are so in love with authority, or so used to getting pushed around, that they would actually defend their own oppressors. This is why I often compare mainstream America to a goat herd. Some of the good people of New Hampshire are obviously not a part of said goat herd! The beauty and intelligence of their brilliant action is that this is not even a case of civil disobedience. This is a case of obeying the letter of man's law while observing the teachings of Jesus: "Do unto others...". Because of their generosity, I have decided that I will respond in kind, and provide their organization with a wonderful Christmas gift. I hope many others will do the same. Osiyo!

      1. PhoenixV profile image81
        PhoenixVposted 2 years ago in reply to this

        Here is the Court Document on PDF that goes into a little more detail on what them little fellers were up to.

        http://www.nhmunicipal.org/Resources/ViewDocument/197

        1. wrenchBiscuit profile image91
          wrenchBiscuitposted 2 years ago in reply to this

          This is old news. So what? Where you there when Bill Clinton said: " I did not have sex with that woman!" or "How do you define sex?". Police officers kill innocent people and say, " I feared for my life", or " I was standing my ground". Presidents, politicians, police,and public officials are some of the biggest liars in the world simply because they've got the "law on their side". Do you remember Eliot Spitzer? Of course they have to come up with a lame excuse to shut these heroic individuals down, because these young people made them look like the fools they really are. Do you honestly think the city officials of Keene New Hampshire would never tell a lie, or at least stretch the truth to keep some extra money in their pockets?

          1. PhoenixV profile image81
            PhoenixVposted 2 years ago in reply to this

            Well I like to think of myself as being fair minded.  I know I don't like parking tickets and I know I don't like not being able to find a parking space. But when weighing two things like, say for instance, sworn affidavits or people on a video screaming thief, with a bullhorn, at what appears to be a nice parking meter lady, I think I will have to go with my own eyes. But that's me.

      2. oceansnsunsets profile image88
        oceansnsunsetsposted 2 years ago in reply to this

        In actuality, what I said was absolutely true.  This is not debatable.  If someone wants to not pay but park there, it does keep those that do want to pay and park, from parking there. (Just addressing that actual, pointed issue there.)   I have been in this situation and lived and been in such places.  As for what you say next, if you DO indeed keep your meter filled, why are you acting like I would have any problem with that?  You keep money in, you get to park there. If you use the money earned by others to park there, then you are using their hard earned money to do so, and not being clever at all.  I didn't say there is a time limit, and of course the idea is that as long as you want to pay, you can stay!  You are not taking any stand against my points.

        You agree with me when you say, "If I want to park my car all day long at one particular parking meter, then I have the legal right to do so as long as I pay the required cost of admission. Consequently, if I do so I am cheating no one. I challenge any of you brilliant scholars to prove me wrong! How can someone be considered a "space hog" when they are following the rules by paying the meter? Furthermore, having someone else put the money in the meter is not cheating either, since the law only requires that money be placed in the meter. Period."

        Yeah.... that is the point.

        The hamburger example, that point, would be better made if you had a person stealing a hamburger, then having someone run up and pay for it first, before they got caught, etc.  We are talking about people getting the "product or service" and not paying, and having people coming in and trying to save them the penalty of breaking a rule.  Its not against any rule, the scenario you give there in the restaurant.  The gifts we buy for families, also broke no rules.  That point falls too....  My understanding is they put money in meters that are not paid for at that current moment.  All my points rest on that fact, and move from there.

        If these robin hooders want to be suckers and enablers for those that want something without having to pay, that is fine with me I guess.  I don't know how it is productive.  That you want to encourage others to enable those that don't pay fines for a benefit like parking where you prefer, is fine I suppose.

        1. wrenchBiscuit profile image91
          wrenchBiscuitposted 2 years ago in reply to this

          You just don't get it do you? If the meter is being paid then no one is breaking any rules. That is clearly the point that all of the upstanding citizens here have missed. This isn't about enabling anybody, cheating,or breaking the rules. This is about citizens who are "not" breaking the law, but who are now being harassed by a corrupt city government. This is the kind of power  that city governments should not have. This is the kind of abusive power that also leads to police brutality and killer cops.

          1. oceansnsunsets profile image88
            oceansnsunsetsposted 2 years ago in reply to this

            I was bringing up the obvious points left out of the narrative was all.  If you don't want to see how people aren't paying their meters, and that this is what is driving the whole thing even being a topic in the first place, then what can I do?   I have to assume this is true, otherwise there would be no reason to put money into unpaid  meters. 

            I shouldn't have to say this, but I don't like paying parking meters either.  I wish I didn't.  I don't wish others to have to pay them either.  I don't like people giving others a hard time that are trying to do their jobs, like we saw in the video with the nice lady that couldn't walk away from them to get away from the constant barrage of untruths accused onto her.  I don't like big government.  I want less government.

            I also appreciate that if and when I do have to go downtown, or to a beach or something, that I can hopefully find an open spot to park in, and pay the meter through the time I will be there.  I pay attention to the time, and you will find me walking back or even running if I am cutting it close.  I want to avoid the fees.  These are my points.  So if you are disputing me you are disputing these points somehow, and I don't see how that is.

            To each his own.  Peace.

          2. wilderness profile image96
            wildernessposted 2 years ago in reply to this

            You are mistaken - it is indeed against the law to feed the meter for someone else in some cities.  And I really have a problem in seeing that such a law, discouraging the "space hogs", leads to police brutality (don't think I've ever heard of a meter maid pistol whipping anyone).

  3. Kathryn L Hill profile image87
    Kathryn L Hillposted 2 years ago

    Okay, wB here is my perspective:  In the first place, don't these people have anything better to do with their time? Honestly?
    Why are they doing what they are doing? It is unrealistic and it is silly. Bottom line it is just silly. They are literally stalking people's cars! I would make sure to be back on time just to avoid someone else taking jurisdiction over MY responsibility!  It is actually better for citizens to take care of their own personal matters.
    I mean, REALLY!

    1. wrenchBiscuit profile image91
      wrenchBiscuitposted 2 years ago in reply to this

      http://s2.hubimg.com/u/12069049_f1024.jpg
      You think it's silly saving the citizens of Keene $80,000! I'm sending these guys a Christmas present. They deserve a medal for what they have done. You say they are stalking cars? It is the city that has been stalking, and I will tell you why. I know that I am smarter than most people, but I think this is fairly straight-forward:

      City and state governments pass laws that they know a certain percentage of citizens will fail to obey for various reasons. These reasons are all based on human nature. A rich person will not have a problem paying a parking meter fine, and so for them, a parking ticket will not be such an issue. But for the average working person, a parking ticket can be a burden, and so the average working class person will usually try to avoid getting a ticket. The ones that do, certainly don't do it on purpose, as they don't have such disposable income. But because of human nature, many people will miscalculate the time it will take to do their business, or they may be unexpectedly detained, or they may get distracted and simply forget. This is what the city is counting on. They are counting on the fact that human nature will prevail, and that they will earn a projected revenue as a result.  What this amounts to is exploiting human nature by criminalizing human nature for profit. Such intentions can only be construed as evil, as it is setting the citizen up to fail. But this is just one of many examples of laws that are designed primarily for profit.

      Furthermore, we are witnessing an ever expanding police state. Anything that moves the citizen into a more confrontational stance, as opposed to a submissive posture, can only help to slow the progression from a police state to a totalitarian slave state. Although we are currently living in what I refer to as "The Slave State of the Second Order", things can still get a lot worse real fast. Such citizen action's as these at least give us hope that we may yet rise above our present state of servitude. There is nothing silly about freedom Kathryn... nothing silly at all.

      1. Kathryn L Hill profile image87
        Kathryn L Hillposted 2 years ago in reply to this

        You have a good point.
        I was parked on a residential street in Pasadena with two hour limit signs clearly posted. I dutifully pulled forward before two hours were up, but I got a ticket. ($45.00! yikes!) Apparently, I have to park on another street because I'll still get a ticket after moving my car to the other side of the street! (I was told by a resident.)  This I consider to be revenue collecting and it is wrong.  I agree, the citizens should not be taken advantage of.
        My last parking ticket was due to signs that were not clearly posted in the least.

        Who's the guy? ^

        1. wrenchBiscuit profile image91
          wrenchBiscuitposted 2 years ago in reply to this

          That guy is W.E.B. Du Bois  (1868-1963), writer and social/civil rights activist who was the first African American to earn a doctorate from Harvard. Also co-founder of NAACP in 1909 among other accomplishments.

      2. wilderness profile image96
        wildernessposted 2 years ago in reply to this

        For being so much smarter than other people, you sure don't seem to understand the reality around you.

        Those people didn't "save" the citizens of the city anything at all; all they did was shift the burden from lawbreakers to honest citizens.  That money will be spent, one way or another, and the people will pay for it whether through  additional taxes or from fines for breaking the law.

        1. wrenchBiscuit profile image91
          wrenchBiscuitposted 2 years ago in reply to this

          Did you read the original post? The lower court did not rule in favor of the city. If it were an obvious case of breaking the law then it would,t be going to the State Supreme Court. Read and learn. There were no lawbreakers. Furthermore, if everyone stayed home for a year then the city would still lose $80,000 in expected parking fine revenue. Would the citizens still owe this money to the city regardless, and why? Your responses having nothing to do with the real world. Stay on the Sufferbus if you like  and keep listening to Lee Greenwood..

          1. wilderness profile image96
            wildernessposted 2 years ago in reply to this

            Are you for real?  Do you really think the politicians are going to fire the 911 dispatchers, fire fighters or even the yard crew in the park simply because they came up $80,000 short of projected income from fines?  All it means is that taxes will increase next year.

            Yes, I saw that.  Whether there is a law on the books or not wasn't noted, but that the city has appealed the decision is.  The city attorney seems to feel the court was in error...  Plus, of course, the defendants were NOT found innocent as the case was thrown out instead of being judged.

            1. wrenchBiscuit profile image91
              wrenchBiscuitposted 2 years ago in reply to this

              Are you for real? How far do you think $80,000 will go? The fire chief in the city I live in makes $100,000 a year. You are making all of these wild claims that have no basis in reality. The loss of this projected revenue "will not" affect the salaries of city employees. There would be no good reason to raise taxes over this issue other than pure greed and stupidity. But since I am sure city officials have many other methods of stealing money from the citizens of Keene, I highly doubt that they would make such a transparent move for such a relatively small amount of money; a move that could only cause them more headaches, and focus more unwanted attention on their shady dealings.

              Maybe you have never made a lot of money in your lifetime, but I was born into a well to do family. I have never wanted for money except when I have purposely chosen to live in poverty, in order to better  understand the condition of the poor and the common man. I assure you my friend, $80,000.00 may be a big overall savings for the citizens of Keene New Hampshire, and I applaud the young people who have walked like Jesus, but in the big picture, the dollar amount is not as impressive as you seem to think.

              1. wilderness profile image96
                wildernessposted 2 years ago in reply to this

                And if not affecting salaries, where else will the shortfall come from?

                Oh yes, "stealing" from the citizens.  Which is just what I said, isn't it?  If they don't get it from fines from lawbreakers they will get it somewhere else; from those that don't break the law.  Maybe bump the property tax a bit.  Or the water bill. 

                With 23,000 people in the town, and assuming 4 people per family, that's the grand sum of about $16 per family per year...so that inconsiderate people can hog parking spaces for themselves rather than share the limited resource with others.  If that's "walking with Jesus" it's no wonder that so many disdain the myth.

                1. wrenchBiscuit profile image91
                  wrenchBiscuitposted 2 years ago in reply to this

                  How revealing! According to you, anyone who gets a parking ticket is an inconsiderate, law breaking, space hog! Nationwide, that would amount to tens of millions of people. Kathryn Hill commented that she too was fined $45.00 once!  But your "wisdom" doesn't stop there. You continue by suggesting that it is better that corrupt  city  officials  steal from these so-called law breakers than the good law-abiding citizen. Quite remarkable!

                  As far as your comment about the "myth of Jesus",  your impending death will reveal many myths, including the myth of America, and the myth of the supremacy of mankind.

                  1. Kathryn L Hill profile image87
                    Kathryn L Hillposted 2 years ago in reply to this

                    Yep, thats me: an inconsiderate, law breaking, space hog!  sad

                    One resident who lives in an apt. on that street told me he has racked up to $800.00 dollars in unpaid parking fines.
                    There's a really fat space hog for you.

  4. Sed-me profile image82
    Sed-meposted 2 years ago
    1. oceansnsunsets profile image88
      oceansnsunsetsposted 2 years ago in reply to this

      Seems like that man is doing a good thing, good for him.  We need more like him in our world, making such a difference.

      1. Sed-me profile image82
        Sed-meposted 2 years ago in reply to this

        He is doing a good thing. When a 90 year old man is arrested for feeding the homeless, something has gone incredibly wrong in the world.

        1. oceansnsunsets profile image88
          oceansnsunsetsposted 2 years ago in reply to this

          No argument from me on that.

  5. oceansnsunsets profile image88
    oceansnsunsetsposted 2 years ago

    Have the same do gooders considered sticking it to the IRS by offering to help people pay their taxes on time to avoid extra fees and penalties, that either can't or don't prefer to spend their money that way, or their time to meet deadlines? (For whatever the reason?)

    I guess it is a nice thing to do.  I hope they are having their desired effect, after choosing this to be the best way to help out in their society.  Everyone has options of how to give and spend their time. 

    The group on the one video harassing the meter maid to the degree they did, could have still done their good and "cheated" the government without the extra trouble they gave her, and the other police.

    1. wilderness profile image96
      wildernessposted 2 years ago in reply to this

      Now I like that idea - a little help in paying my taxes for me would be greatly appreciated and won't simply put the burden on anyone else either! 

      If I asked nicely do you think they would do that? big_smile

      1. oceansnsunsets profile image88
        oceansnsunsetsposted 2 years ago in reply to this

        Haha! Perhaps, I mean we need to see how dedicated these people are in showing the government that we aren't slaves to them while they laugh all the way to the bank!

  6. pstraubie48 profile image90
    pstraubie48posted 2 years ago

    I am dumbfounded. All I can do is shake my head and ask: are they kidding ?
    The activists should be receiving a commendation.
    They are using precious judicial time on this???
    I will never cease to be amazed.

 
working