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Regarding deaths of 4 servicemen, WHAT ARE WE DOING IN NIGER ANYWAY?

  1. Credence2 profile image82
    Credence2posted 4 weeks ago

    Just wondering, why is the Trump Administration so tight lipped on the question?

    1. promisem profile image91
      promisemposted 4 weeks agoin reply to this

      Is the situation the same as Benghazi? Does that mean Rex Tillerson is guilty of "murder" like Hillary Clinton and should face multiple Congressional investigations?

      1. Ken Burgess profile image82
        Ken Burgessposted 4 weeks agoin reply to this

        All it takes is a minute to do a search and find out, but no... lets not let facts get in the way of spouting off more ignorant tripe.

        http://www.military.com/daily-news/2017 … mbush.html

        http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/us-troop … d=50559788

        1. promisem profile image91
          promisemposted 4 weeks agoin reply to this

          I love the fact that people like you would rather launch an insult than address the point. Typical of Fox News extremists.

          Not surprisingly, your links have absolutely nothing to do with my point.

          1. Ken Burgess profile image82
            Ken Burgessposted 4 weeks agoin reply to this

            You have no point.  I gave reference to where answers could be found on the subject, you ranted about something totally not related.

            I could go into how these are vastly different situations and why, but I won't waste the time, any facts brought to the discussion would be ignored, and you would continue with your fact-less ranting.

            1. promisem profile image91
              promisemposted 4 weeks agoin reply to this

              LOL. The point of my QUESTION is obvious. (I capitalized question in case you didn't see the question mark in my post.)

              Americans died in both hostile situations because they lacked proper support. Please read my entire post before flying off the handle.

              The fact that anyone claims expertise on both situations from a pair of vague news articles is silly. Just armchair soldiering.

              1. Ken Burgess profile image82
                Ken Burgessposted 4 weeks agoin reply to this

                I do read your posts, they are often nonsensical, or unrelated to the topic of discussion, they are either rants or attacks on other posters.

                As for this topic, you have no military background, you have no SF insights, so you have no basis to criticize the matter at hand, or how one event compares to the other.

                1. promisem profile image91
                  promisemposted 4 weeks agoin reply to this

                  Seriously? Attacks on posters? Look at this whole thread. I simply asked a question. You attacked me. Total hypocrisy.

                  Why don't you calmly answer the question without losing your temper?

                  The question doesn't require any military background. Americans without proper support died in both situations. The question asks why.

          2. Kathleen Cochran profile image83
            Kathleen Cochranposted 3 weeks agoin reply to this

            Would love to hear "Fair and Balanced" Fox news fans justify all the complaints of sexual harassment towards this network.

            Reagan got 240 Marines killed in Beirut is the 80s and he's beloved.  Trump supporters will find excuses for these deaths.  They were unavoidable - just like Benghazi.  And what were we doing there?  Things that are secret for a good reason.  Just like Benghazi.

            1. promisem profile image91
              promisemposted 3 weeks agoin reply to this

              Just like Benghazi. And Niger.

              You are right. If we are going to complain about Hollywood sexual assaults, we should complain about Fox News assaults at the same time. Reasonable people should condemn all of it and not just some of it.

              And if we are going to have Congressional investigations into Benghazi, then we also should them for Niger.

            2. GA Anderson profile image84
              GA Andersonposted 3 weeks agoin reply to this

              "Reagan got 240 Marines killed in Beirut..."

              While it is true that 240 Marines died in that barracks bombing during Reagan's presidency Kathleen, your phrasing that "Reagan got them killed" certainly says volumes about the credibility of your statements.

              GA

              1. promisem profile image91
                promisemposted 3 weeks agoin reply to this

                You seriously misunderstand her point. She goes on to say the Beirut deaths were unavoidable like Benghazi.

                Reagan didn't "murder" those Marines any more than Clinton "murdered" the four people in Benghazi.

                Her credibility is just fine. And so is her point about double standards by the Fox News faction.

                1. GA Anderson profile image84
                  GA Andersonposted 3 weeks agoin reply to this

                  I did get her point about the Benghazi comparison promisem, but, but... sputter, mutter, and mumble...

                  Well damn! you made me go back and look at her post. And double damn! My comment can only be described as an emotional knee-jerk reaction to the "...Reagan killed..." lead-off.

                  I screwed that one up. It is my credibility that should be questioned on this one. Mia Culpa. I will go back an apologize to her.

                  GA

                  1. promisem profile image91
                    promisemposted 3 weeks agoin reply to this

                    Your own credibility just took a big jump higher. I don't know if you care what I think about your credibility, but I'm taking a chance and saying it anyway.

                    I also made one slight mistake two years ago. smile

              2. GA Anderson profile image84
                GA Andersonposted 3 weeks agoin reply to this

                Kathleen, after taking a second look at your post, (prompted by a promisem comment) - that I responded to - I was really off-base. I jumped the gun and shot right past your point. A knee-jerk emotional reaction that reflects more on my credibility than yours.  I hope you will accept my apology.

                GA

              3. Ken Burgess profile image82
                Ken Burgessposted 3 weeks agoin reply to this

                Indeed, well said.

                When one considers these attacks and efforts of... I'm not sure what?  Revenge for the election results?  Blanket efforts to stifle all opposing view with insults? ... come from accomplished intelligent, otherwise rational adults, one has to wonder where we go from here.

                Countless times I have been called a Trumpster, Conservative, Republinazi, or labeled with whatever the term is for someone who watches Fox news (I haven't watched any MSM news shows for months).  Yet, soon as I, or anyone voice an opinion certain people on here do not like the 'you are one of THEM' statements and attacks come out.

                What I do know, is that during the Obama Administration, and prior, the discussions were more civil, at least on my articles and questions, and those I interacted with.  It has been unusual that the level of animosity has increased and compounded since this election, when usually it dies down for a couple of years before things start to get wound up for the new election (4 years).

        2. Misfit Chick profile image73
          Misfit Chickposted 4 weeks agoin reply to this

          Here is a splash from one of Ken's links: "The Special Forces soldiers are in Africa to bolster the defense capabilities of partner nations, while combating terrorist groups such as Boko Haram and al-Qaida in the Islamic Maghreb."

          It was a good question but easily answered. Every once in a while terrorism strikes somewhere else besides the places we are familiar with hearing about it.

          Frankly, you and Ken are attacking each other without listening, promisem. It is the sad way of things these days: Lefties & Moderates are becoming as beligerent as Righties & T-fans.

          Trump's parroting supporters start out pushing buttons with rude accusations or insults like this; and we've learned to fight like them - and this is what happens as a result: we regress to their 3rd grade level of attack as a response; and nothing gets accomplished but insults. Not falling for their diverting provocations is the trick. They've obviously learned their extremely-divisive Trump-lessons very well, LoL!

          1. promisem profile image91
            promisemposted 4 weeks agoin reply to this

            Misfit, I simply asked a question. Ken attacked me on a personal level for asking it: "ranting", "nonsensical", "ignorant tripe".

            I've learned that bending down to bullies only encourages them. For that reason, I don't put up with bullies. Nor should anyone else.

            1. Misfit Chick profile image73
              Misfit Chickposted 4 weeks agoin reply to this

              I totally get that... But allowing a bully to provoke you into this kind of discourse isn't quite right, either. I'm sorry, it just seems a little beneath you, ha! What would you say to Ken in response if you had a (pretend) 5 yo nephew standing next to you? Maybe you would still respond the same way. I'm just saying, the insults only make situations bigger instead of accomplishing anything - and T-fans like Ken are very good at provoking hard feelings, ugliness & violence just like their beloved 'leader'.

              1. promisem profile image91
                promisemposted 4 weeks agoin reply to this

                Your point is well taken. I've lived long enough to know that I take the high road in life 90% of the time and the low road the other 10%. I have love and respect from people who know me and matter to me.

                I know some people on HP don't feel the same about me.  smile

                Taking the low road is not something I enjoy doing. But I do it when I think it's necessary. I have learned it's necessary with most bullies. I've seen them hurt too many people too many times, including my own children.

                To your question, I would not write some of the above comments in front of a young child. Or if I did, I would explain why.

                1. Credence2 profile image82
                  Credence2posted 4 weeks agoin reply to this

                  I have always admired your stand as a forum participant, it is just that the conservative movement today is defined by intimidation and bullying, look at the head of the serpent? What can we expect?

                  1. promisem profile image91
                    promisemposted 3 weeks agoin reply to this

                    Thanks, Credence. It means a lot coming from you.
                    Oddly, I think the "head of the serpent" is doing the country a favor by forcing responsible citizens to consider their votes, who they support and why. The more divisive Trump becomes, the more thinking people step up to the plate.

            2. Ken Burgess profile image82
              Ken Burgessposted 3 weeks agoin reply to this

              This is incorrect, you have continued this tirade.  Not very professional for someone who claims to be long experienced in the media/journalist arena. Then again what am I saying, you reflect the MSM so well!

              As for not putting up with bullies, I do agree, and while I will not waste my time further responding to you, I want you to know it is not because I have been cowed or reprimanded by your antics here on Hubpages, going back for months now, directed towards others more than anything I have posted.... I simply realize it is beneath me to continue encouraging your pettiness.

              I called you out for it, and now I am done.

              1. colorfulone profile image86
                colorfuloneposted 3 weeks agoin reply to this

                Could it go back to McCarthyism, "Have you no decency?"  lol

                1. promisem profile image91
                  promisemposted 3 weeks agoin reply to this

                  Are you referring to his accusations of "ranting", "nonsensical" and "ignorant tripe" in response to a simple question?

                  Are personal attacks OK as long as they come from conservatives? Yes or no.

          2. GA Anderson profile image84
            GA Andersonposted 3 weeks agoin reply to this

            Hi Misfit Chick, Mark Twain offered advice concerning the situation of your last paragraph. I try to always keep his quote in mind as I participate in these forums.

            Of course I am not saying it applies to the objects of your comment, but it is good advice: Mark Twain's discussion advice

            GA

            1. promisem profile image91
              promisemposted 3 weeks agoin reply to this

              GA, I'm curious how you would react if my response to your 2nd Amendment question a week or so again was something like the following.

              "This is nothing but more factless ranting and ignorant tripe from a right-wing gun nut."

              You may claim you wouldn't be upset and respond emotionally. But based on our history together, I strongly suspect you would be upset and show it in your response.

              So now I ask. If you have an open, fair and balanced intellect, what prevents you from finding such behavior objectionable?

              1. GA Anderson profile image84
                GA Andersonposted 3 weeks agoin reply to this

                ah geez promisem. You know I have to offer you a "challenge" to point to one of my responses that you deemed to be from an upset and emotional perspective. Even that 2nd Amendment one you alluded to turned out to be your misperception after an explanation was offered.

                I do think I can truthfully reply that any answering responses I would make would not be of an upset and emotional nature. Contrarily I would say such responses would be even more rationally considered so as to convey a message that 'you can go to hell', yet have you thank me for the sentiment. ;-)

                It appears you may have taken offense at my Mark Twain quote reference, yet clearly missed my statement that it was not intended to apply directly to you or Ken, but to the type of conversations Misfit Chick was speaking of.

                I wasn't calling you an idiot promisem, that would be an emotional response. But... some synonyms for the concept, like; bullheaded, obstinate, etc. may make my Mark Twain thought more applicable.

                GA

                1. promisem profile image91
                  promisemposted 3 weeks agoin reply to this

                  GA, it sounds like you are evading my point and imagining things about my thought processes.

                  I would be glad to show you responses you have made that were personal attacks based on being upset with someone. For example:

                  "That's just baloney Randy. How about addressing the point of the OP instead of just restating silly questions and statements."

                  Regardless, you misperceive my comment. My point is about double standards on personal attacks and not specific attacks by you.

                  With that in mind, you didn't answer my question. You run the risk of being accused of having a double standard on civil behavior -- one for your fellow conservatives on here and another for everyone else. So one more time:

                  If you have an open, fair and balanced intellect, what prevents you from finding such behavior objectionable?

                  1. GA Anderson profile image84
                    GA Andersonposted 3 weeks agoin reply to this

                    promisem, it sure seems to me that you are making this a lot more complicated than intended. Maybe I did "misperceive" [sic] your comment. It sounded like you were defensive about the Mark Twain quote.

                    It also seems we have a different perspective of emotional personal attacks;

                    "That's just baloney Randy. How about addressing the point of the OP instead of just restating silly questions and statements."

                    That wasn't intended as a personal attack, and I still don't perceive it as one. My intention, and my perception of the phrase, was to challenge, (okay, maybe you could also say admonish), Randy to address the issue being discussed. I didn't hear from Randy about an "emotional attack," but I did hear from another poster that reconsidered her agreement with your opinion of the comment after reviewing the thread, and my explanation to you.

                    But, my perception could just as easily be as wrong as I think it is right. After all, apparently my explanation of it to you didn't change your mind - even if it did change other's. In which case, I hope you will let me plead that it was an unintentional emotional response. (but I must be obstinate and refuse to think of it as a personal attack)

                    Maybe Randy will chime in and let us know if he perceived my comment to be an emotional personal attack.

                    On the other hand, an accusation of holding a double standard based on allied perspectives would be an affront, one which I would take seriously. I am not certain you actually made such a claim, (benefit of the doubt, and all that), but if you did, I believe I could find sufficient past forum conversations to disprove your thought that I don't hold Conservatives to the same standards you think you are being held to.

                    As to your last question... I do try to keep an open mind on topics, and I do try to be fair in my considerations, but those are only well intentioned efforts, that aren't always successful - but I do not make those claims for myself.

                    Concerning personal attacks, I don't consider calling someone's input - in a political discussion, crap or tripe to be a personal attack. I see it as an attack on the input. Crap and tripe may be a more blunt and impolitic approach than I would take, but if the input is crap or tripe - there is nothing personal about it.  I see a difference, maybe you don't. Perhaps you are a little too invested in some of your opinions.

                    ps.I hope I haven't left you feeling I "evaded" your questions, I tried to cover the ones I perceived to be questions. Get back to me if I missed another one.

                    GA

                2. promisem profile image91
                  promisemposted 3 weeks agoin reply to this

                  By the way, "obstinate" people stand by their beliefs. They don't change their minds just because someone else insists that they do.

                  1. GA Anderson profile image84
                    GA Andersonposted 3 weeks agoin reply to this

                    You are almost right about "obstinate" promisem, but I think the more correct operative word would be persuade, rather than insist. And one aspect of that effort to persuade could be the presence of more accurate facts or a more factual consideration of circumstances.

                    Would being obstinate about a belief that the earth is flat be a good thing?

                    GA

      2. Credence2 profile image82
        Credence2posted 4 weeks agoin reply to this

        This "Command" may well be legitimate. It is just dismaying that we have to have our fingers in so many pies. Is it any wonder that that themilitaty budget has to bankrupt the treasury? How can I continue to pay for this involvement on the most remote parts of the planet?

        1. GA Anderson profile image84
          GA Andersonposted 4 weeks agoin reply to this

          We have to be concerned about the effects of terrorism everywhere Cred, not just the terrorism directed at our shores. I think our fingers in the pie serve our best interests.

          GA

          1. Credence2 profile image82
            Credence2posted 4 weeks agoin reply to this

            So, how far are we to take this, GA?

            Nine-Eleven was 16 years ago. And, we still use the threat of endless war to justify guns over butter. Watching the Vietnam documentary byPBS reminds me how we continue to chase after the futility of a fool's errand. It appears that nothing has been learned, or perhaps we do not want to learn, the military industrial complex is a massive machine that since WWII, will not be denied.

            Who says that globocop has to be the way, must it always be so? History tells us that Abe Lincoln worked to keep foreign powers out of our civil war. Why can't we accept the fact that civil war and human conflict on the globe at this period of time is unavoidable and inevitable as an unfortunate by product of the human condition?

            This constant threat of total war and endless war is food for the rightwinger as an excuse to deny needed resources on the domestic front.

            So, your assessment for the need of endless militarism, I disagree with. Let defense be proscribed to be just that "defense". So, I don't subscribe to the Bush Doctrine.

            1. GA Anderson profile image84
              GA Andersonposted 3 weeks agoin reply to this

              Ohh gawddd Cred. You got all of that from my comment?

              How about this perspective... Ossama and his Al Qaeda fighters have found a safe base in Afghanistan. He has proclaimed he will attack us again, and his group is growing larger and stronger daily. Afghanistan doesn't have the force or will to fight him. Pakistan has both, but doesn't know how to proceed. Would you be okay with sending advisers to train Pakistan's anti-terrorist forces?

              But wait, that is a loaded question... instead of Ossama and Al Qaeda, and, Afghanistan, plug in that group from Niger - with the same stated goal of attacking Western nations, and the same circumstances that the country they are based in, and surrounding ones, have the will but not the training to combat them. Would you support U.S. advisers to train them?

              I wasn't talking about the "Military-Industrial Complex" cabal of secret power brokers, and I wasn't talking about covert military actions - for political purposes, posed in the guise of fighting terrorism.

              Ossama attacked us from Afghanistan. When would you think it is okay for us to turn off our 'other nations' terrorism radar? Is your 16 years long enough?

              GA

              1. Credence2 profile image82
                Credence2posted 3 weeks agoin reply to this

                Don't mean to be a wise guy, but Khrushchev once said that "he would bury us". I don't let verbal threats put us in a position to turn our economy upside down based on raw fear. I worry more about the danger from domestic(home grown) terror and abusers of firearms run amuck. So, why should I allow myself to be distracted? And, again when it comes to 'advisers', isn't that what we were told during the earliest days of American involvement in Vietnam?

                I have read more than one account of billions of wasted American tax dollars for graft, abuse associated with building the instrastructure of Afghanistan. Again, the same sort of pacification used to enlist the former South Vietnam in the so called war against international Communism.

                If training means just training that is one thing, but if the past is any guide.......
                As I said before, these programs, our level of involvement and expense need closer oversight.

                Some of this "preemptive" war concept can and does go too far at times?

                1. GA Anderson profile image84
                  GA Andersonposted 3 weeks agoin reply to this

                  You make valid points Cred, it's just that I wasn't going in that direction. I was commenting on the appropriateness I see in our efforts to help other nations combat terrorism that could easily grow to be a threat to us.

                  That those efforts could lead to the points you make is not something I would ignore. (except maybe the Vietnam allusion)

                  GA

  2. colorfulone profile image86
    colorfuloneposted 4 weeks ago

    AFRICOM United States Africa Command

    https://twitter.com/USAfricaCommand?ref … r%5Eauthor

    1. Credence2 profile image82
      Credence2posted 4 weeks agoin reply to this

      Thanks for this reminder, Colorfulone

      1. colorfulone profile image86
        colorfuloneposted 4 weeks agoin reply to this

        Your post sparked my memory.

  3. colorfulone profile image86
    colorfuloneposted 3 weeks ago

    I don't have TV service. I follow Hannity, Tucker and Dobbs (a few others on Fox) on social media as time permits.  Especially, Hannity, who seems to have a hotline to the President more than once a week. 

    Added:  I expect Fox to come under greater attacks.

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