Is it time for US voter ID cards? Even Mexico has voter ID cards.

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  1. Readmikenow profile image97
    Readmikenowposted 2 years ago

    https://usercontent2.hubstatic.com/14447091.jpg
    A very complete research document concerning voter fraud was done by the Heritage Foundation.  It show how widespread voter fraud is in the United States.  The report doesn't have it broken down by party, just incidents of voter fraud violations.

    Could voter ID cards be the answer? 

    They are common in countries in South America, Africa as well as eastern Europe and others.  I'm sure the United States is just as capable as these other countries in having a voter ID System.

    Here is a link to the Heritage Foundation research concerning voter fraud.

    https://www.heritage.org/voterfraud

    Here is a link to National Review about it.  The article has some interesting links in it.

    https://www.nationalreview.com/2015/07/ … s-require/

    1. jordancollins profile image44
      jordancollinsposted 2 years agoin reply to this

      I think it will improve voting system to a great extend. Great idea!

    2. Credence2 profile image80
      Credence2posted 2 years agoin reply to this

      Fine, as long as it is free and effort is made to keep the impediments of any American citizen obtaining one to a minimum

    3. profile image0
      promisemposted 2 years agoin reply to this

      I already have to show a government-issued photo ID card in Virginia before I can vote.

      I don't see the need for a second one if the first one serves the same purpose.

      1. Live to Learn profile image78
        Live to Learnposted 2 years agoin reply to this

        Well, if DMVs continue issuing driver's licenses to illegal immigrants that presents a whole litany of possibilities for problems.

        1. profile image0
          promisemposted 2 years agoin reply to this

          I'm not aware of any credible evidence of many illegal immigrants using Virginia photo ID cards to vote.

          Even the database Mike links has only 17 convictions in 12 years, which is just 1.5 per year.

          I don't know why we have to create a lot more cost and bureaucracy just to stop 1.5 cases per year.

          1. Readmikenow profile image97
            Readmikenowposted 2 years agoin reply to this

            So, your approach would be to wait until it is a problem?   Could be too late by then.

            1. profile image0
              promisemposted 2 years agoin reply to this

              We don't have a problem in Virginia or a lot of other states. Even Trump's own commission couldn't find any proof.

              If Texas has a problem, it should solve it. I don't think the entire country should pay a price for incompetence in Texas.

              BTW, that article said their "U.S. citizenship could not be confirmed". That doesn't mean they were fraudulent votes.

              1. Readmikenow profile image97
                Readmikenowposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                Simply because you don't know of any voting problems in Virginia does not mean there aren't any...it just means you don't know about them. 

                https://www.heritage.org/voterfraud/search?state=VA

                There are problems with illegal voting in EACH of the 50 states.

                1. JAKE Earthshine profile image76
                  JAKE Earthshineposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                  Prove it: The ONLY credible voting fraud case I can find is fraud by republicans in North Carolina and if you're truly concerned about election manipulation you should be advocating for BOUNCING Bozo and his Controlling Russian Operatives our of our oval office:

                2. Credence2 profile image80
                  Credence2posted 2 years agoin reply to this

                  " because you don't know of any voting problems in Virginia does not mean there aren't any...it just means you don't know about them"

                  But it can easily be said that just because one does not know of any voting problems in Virginia, does not mean there aresome.Who has yet to prove that there are in fact problems?

                  1. wilderness profile image95
                    wildernessposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                    Although I did not expect Jake to look at data showing what he didn't want to see, I'm surprised that you didn't bother either.  Mike has posted it twice now, plainly showing voter fraud in Virginia spread over the last 11 years.  16 criminal convictions and one "judicial finding" (whatever that means).

                3. profile image0
                  promisemposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                  I'm going by the link you provided by the Heritage Foundation. The problems are minimal based on that link.

                  I also don't see how conservatives want to violate states rights by demanding a federal solution with a lot of cost and bureaucracy to fix small problems.

                  1. Readmikenow profile image97
                    Readmikenowposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                    Violate state rights? "a lot of cost and bureaucracy"...I would love to see the proposals you are referring to in this situation.

                4. Valeant profile image87
                  Valeantposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                  45 cases in the 2018 elections across the whole country is a problem?  That's what the Heritage link says.  But I like how they left out the North Carolina fraud that the GOP committed.  Selective?

                  As for that Texas link, they've already amended it to note that 20% of the people who were included on those lists had already proved their citizenship and shouldn't have been there in the first place.  So the validity of any conclusions taken from that data is suspect at best.

                  1. Readmikenow profile image97
                    Readmikenowposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                    Very simple why NC has not been included, it is still being determined by the NC election board.  At this point it is considered "Alleged."

                    The Heritage link is based on public records. 

                    Again, many elections are decided by a few hundred votes, the votes cast by non-citizens could determine election outcomes. 

                    That is why it is a problem.

                  2. wilderness profile image95
                    wildernessposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                    "That's what the Heritage link says."

                    No, that is NOT what the Heritage link says.  It says there were 45 known cases, that went to trial and got a conviction.  It makes no attempt to estimate a total number of cases or even the total of cases that are known but never prosecuted and convicted.

                    It does not say there were only 45 instances of voter fraud across the country.

            2. Credence2 profile image80
              Credence2posted 2 years agoin reply to this

              But why is the risk of disenfranchisement of so many not weighed against the magnitude of the illegal voting problem as presented by Promisem?

              I seem to picking up a vibe that Republicans simply prefer that not everyone vote, as their agenda is appealing ever fewer potential voters. So, you create as many bureaucratic and legalistic obstacles that you can toward that end.

    4. RJ Schwartz profile image89
      RJ Schwartzposted 2 years agoin reply to this

      Absolutely - our election system should be without doubt in any way shape or form.  The zealots will immediately cite that no real credible voter-fraud cases have been established, but that's just not true.  The mainstream media fails to report them.  Here is a link that documents over 1,000 cases
      https://www.heritage.org/election-integ … oven-cases

    5. crankalicious profile image94
      crankaliciousposted 2 years agoin reply to this

      I have no opposition to voter ID cards. But how will we avoid counterfeits? I imagine they'll still have to be verified against voting rolls, leaving us pretty much where we are now.

      Generally though, voter ID laws are usually used to suppress marginalized voters - the poor. Still, voting is a privilege and it's not asking very much for people to get an ID card. If we make it relatively easy for a citizen to accomplish, I see no problem.

      1. Readmikenow profile image97
        Readmikenowposted 2 years agoin reply to this

        You make an excellent point.  Should we not move forward because of counterfeits?  In the state where I live, if you don't drive, you can still get a FREE ID card if you are low income from the DMV.  I believe a voter ID card should be provided at no direct cost to citizens.  They will pay for it with tax dollars.

        1. crankalicious profile image94
          crankaliciousposted 2 years agoin reply to this

          My point is, does a voter ID card actually make it easier for illegals to vote?

          Given we have little problem with illegal voters now, are we actually creating a problem?

  2. emge profile image79
    emgeposted 2 years ago

    It's a good idea to have voter ID cards. They were introduced in India but have met with partial success. A little more streamlining will iron out the glitches

  3. JAKE Earthshine profile image76
    JAKE Earthshineposted 2 years ago

    Ironic that the ONLY Credible evidence of voter fraud on a wide scale was perpetrated by REPUBLICANS in North Carolina: And by the way, nowhere to my knowledge is there a requirement  for "voter id" in the constitution, the only reason WHY alt-right wing republicans are trying to suppress voter turnout with all these tricks is because they understand the fact that the more Americans who turn out to vote, the better the chances are of DEMOCRATS WINNING Elections and that's a fact:

    "Republicans were upset about election fraud — before it threatened their candidate"

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics … e1d642def2

    1. StevenHall4646 profile image72
      StevenHall4646posted 2 years agoin reply to this

      Are you kidding me? Democrats also have a history of voter fraud. Democratic volunteers went door to door to gather ballots and threw out votes that were Republican in Californa. Isn't that just as corrupt?

      https://www.sacbee.com/news/state/calif … 82125.html

  4. Readmikenow profile image97
    Readmikenowposted 2 years ago

    I think there is a serious voting problem that will only get worse.  Non-citizens voting in elections.  Democrats are for it, which is insane.  Republicans are against non-citizens voting in U.S. elections.  Should the Democrat party value American citizens more than non-citizens, this wouldn't be an issue.  It is a shame Democrats have become the party of illegal alien support. 

    In Texas, 58,000 non-citizens voted in at least one election.  Sometimes elections come down to a few hundred votes.  This could mean non-citizens are determining the outcome of elections.  This is wrong. 

    https://www.star-telegram.com/news/stat … 94315.html

    American citizen overwhelmingly feel non-citizens should not be permitted to vote in elections.

    https://thehill.com/hilltv/what-america … -rights-to

    https://hubstatic.com/14447378.jpg

    1. JAKE Earthshine profile image76
      JAKE Earthshineposted 2 years agoin reply to this

      SOMEDAY maybe Sean Hammity and the rest of the boneheaded alt-right wingers will actually prove non-citizens vote in our elections:

  5. Readmikenow profile image97
    Readmikenowposted 2 years ago

    https://hubstatic.com/14451624.jpg

    1. Valeant profile image87
      Valeantposted 2 years agoin reply to this

      Hmmm, I wonder why would the GOP want to target these groups?

      https://hubstatic.com/14451674.jpg

      1. Readmikenow profile image97
        Readmikenowposted 2 years agoin reply to this

        And the source?  The DNC of course. 

        And to this I say...so what?

        Are you telling me people in this group are less intelligent and capable than citizens in Mexico or India where they must have government IDs to vote?

        I wonder about this number since having a government ID is required to do so many things.  This includes everything from applying for food stamps to applying for welfare, buying alcohol and more.  Here is a list of 24 things people must have a government issued ID to get.

        https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/24-t … a-photo-id

        1. Valeant profile image87
          Valeantposted 2 years agoin reply to this

          And their source was a recent study by New York University's Brennan Center for Justice.  And it turns out that more than three million Americans actually don't own a government-issued picture ID.

          The most common form of government-issued ID are driver's licenses and so the people who are most unlikely to drive, as it is, is elderly, the poor, people who live in big cities, like African-Americans, especially young people, too, especially if they attend college. They may not have need for a car at the moment.

          And then people who are in rural areas. The other challenge for them is they are not near the Department of Motor Vehicles offices, etc., etc. where you would get these IDs.

          A study found that in California, New Mexico, and Washington, whites were more likely to have driver’s licenses than nonwhites. In Orange County, Calif., about 92 percent of white voters had driver’s licenses, compared with only 84 percent of Latino voters and 81 percent of “other” voters. Another study in Wisconsin similarly found that while about 80 percent of white residents had licenses, only about half of African-American and Hispanic residents had licenses.

          Those figures alone can back the case that ID laws would be discriminatory.

          'Are you telling me people in this group are less intelligent and capable than citizens in Mexico or India where they must have government IDs to vote?'  Some serious inferred racism.  Not shocked by it considering your stance on the topic.

          1. Live to Learn profile image78
            Live to Learnposted 2 years agoin reply to this

            There is no inferred racism in the comment you claim had it.

            There is inferred racism in saying minorities would have a difficult time procuring an id.

            1. Valeant profile image87
              Valeantposted 2 years agoin reply to this

              Considering three of the five groups listed were minorities, to come out and question their intelligence is a clear case of inferred racism. 

              Providing actual stats that list the number of people who do not have government id, stats from studies that display there are clear differences based upon race, is far from racist.

              1. Live to Learn profile image78
                Live to Learnposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                Voting is a privilege, not a right. The comment made to you wasn't racist. Your argument was, because it implied a handicap of some sort prohibiting someone from going through the simple motion of procuring id.

                If the system is set up to allow all to obtain id and nothing unduly prohibits any individual from obtaining one; the fact that any percentage of any subset does not go through the motions to procure one does not imply racism.

                1. Valeant profile image87
                  Valeantposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                  What exactly does asking if 'people in those groups are less intelligent' have to do with their needing or not needing a government issued id in their daily lives?    Clearly inappropriate.

                  1. Live to Learn profile image78
                    Live to Learnposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                    What reason would you propose? That was possibly the reason it was asked.

                    We know no one qualified is being prohibited from getting id. We know it isn't cost prohibitive. We know everyone qualified to vote has proven the capability to navigate the system to procure that, but somehow you advocate that some cannot do the same for id.

                    The question presented is why do you think that problem exists? Why do you think some can do some things and not others? I suppose a reasonable argument could be made that the elderly or disabled might need some concessions but why any other group?

                    You presented what you considered to be evidence, but no explanation. We know there are no obstacles which keep people you identified from going through the motions to comply. Other adults have proven it possible to comply. I come from an extremely poor county where everyone who wanted to vote made it to the polls and had id, so there is no evidence poverty prohibits compliance.

                    It's a simple question asked of you. Why do you think concessions should be made when there is no evidence the system is discriminatory? Why would you appear to advocate against id when everyone can access, and many states already have a system in place for it and it seems to function effectively?

                    There has to be some reasoning you could present. Don't fall back on the standard 'I can't back my opinion so I'll just accuse someone of racism'. Because, quite honestly, I consider it disgustingly condescending to imply some subsets can't do simple things.

 
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