Razing Arizona? Are the GOP nuts?

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   Credence2posted 4 years ago

   https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/202 … ucey-trump
   
   
   What bugs me most is the very idea that the Arizona Republican Party censures Gov. Ducey of the great state Arizona solely because he would not agree to question his own state's electoral results.
   
   Is Ducey being censured because he adher d to and follows the rules customary in electoral contests and he did not just out and out throw that away and declare Trump the winner?
   
   So, the Arizona Republican Party is not concerned with the process, only that their man is to win. We have seen this attitude play out in Georgia as well.
   
   I would think that Republican governors were certainly not going to give the Democrat ticket for President and Vice President any advantage that they could have avoided.
   
   Arizona, like Georgia is a loss to the GOP because of changing demographics in those states that have been on going but are now making themselves felt.
   
   There was not any election fraud in either Arizona or Georgia, as the Governors of these states will attest to,  those supporting Democrats were simply more numerous than those that supported Republicans, nothing sinister about that. And, darn it, we drove our supporters to the polls.
   
   Ask the GOP, do we give fealty to the Democratic process or loyalty to a single man?
   
   So, this is the kind of party and politics that now wants a "truce"?  The attitudes that persist among their numbers only encourages me to distrust them all the more.
   
   This controversy will split the party in half and I say "don't let the door hit you where the good Lord split you".

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      GA Andersonposted 4 years agoin reply to this

      This is an easy response. Today's Republican party is in its ouroboros phase.  The current Republican party can't survive. It is burning and can only hope for a rebirth. That might look like a Phoenix reference, but the way the party is eating itself alive I think the ouroboros is more appropriate.
      
      Also, relative to what should emerge, this article quote says it best:
      
      "“These resolutions are of no consequence whatsoever and the people behind them have lost whatever little moral authority they may have once had,” said Sara Mueller, Ducey’s political director."
      
      GA

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         Valeantposted 4 years agoin reply to this

         Trumpism is eating the current GOP away completely.  Enough spineless elected reps exist to keep Trump as the head of the party, as evidenced by the 55-45 vote today in the Senate.  They put their own individual interests ahead of what they know to be best for the country.  We saw that evidenced by them going along with the entire anti-science policies in regards to the Covid-19 crisis.
         
         As with Credence and people like Steve Schmidt of the Lincoln Party, it's going to be easy to be a one-issue voter going forward.  You're either for democracy or against it.

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            GA Andersonposted 4 years agoin reply to this

            But, but . . . the issue is a constitutional issue that is very much subject to debate. I have done some looking into it and I would side with Paul's position. I understand there is one historical example  that 'could' thumb the scales against Paul, but I also understand that there are many reputable Constitutional scholars that agree with him.
            
            It appears this will be an SC decision, and I certainly won't match my opinion against theirs. You don't seem to have that problem.
            
            Since this is an open scholarly debate, how do you know they put their own interests first? What if their positions are Constitutionally upheld, would you still feel the same?
            
            Are you staking your claim on your partisan political view without regard to the implications of a SCOTUS decision? I am not that confident. With what little Google University has taught me, I would have also sided with Paul's argument.
            
            GA

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               Valeantposted 4 years agoin reply to this

               We have many examples of the current crop of GOP elected officials kowtowing to Trumpism.  I used a second example, that of willfully ignoring CDC guidelines on Covid just because Trump did.  Then there are the numerous reps who admit that what Trump did in his Ukraine call was wrong, but refused to convict him.  You really want to try and sell that these reps aren't afraid of a mean tweet from Trump that could potentially end their careers, or worse if you're Mike Pence, maybe even your life.
               
               Yes, I base my view on precedent after hearing Schumer lay out the case.   
               And since no case has been appealed to SCOTUS as of now, existing precedent seems to be applicable to a conclusion.
               
               And then when Schumer added the words Paul left out when Paul only quoted the friendly parts of the Constitution, while leaving out the part about disqualification.  You may want to check out that rebuttal that Schumer gave right after Paul's statement.
               
               And this article articulates a lot of how myself and likely many in our party feel about the right currently:  https://www.yahoo.com/news/imposter-beh … 44994.html

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                  GA Andersonposted 4 years agoin reply to this

                  I think your use of Ukraine as an example of your point is also a good example of why there can only be degrees of agreement between many on the Left and the Right.
                  
                  Many folks don't feel as you do about that call. Many might feel it was more inappropriate than wrong, (and many won't think there was anything wrong with it)—but not inappropriate on an impeachment level. Many others may agree with you that it was wrong—but still not on an impeachment level.
                  
                  And then there are the many people that watched Biden brag about using a billion club to get a Ukrainian government to do what was demanded by another president, and then want to impeach their president for doing something they see as very similar.
                  
                  So maybe the best use of Ukraine as an example is to show why there are different views of what is "bad," and why folks will fall on one side or the other of the Constitutionality of the Democrat's impeachment trial move.
                  
                  GA

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         Credence2posted 4 years agoin reply to this

         GA, the Republicans need to start making the hard choices, they must detox. Trump has got to go, in ALL facets of Republican politics before it can return to normalcy and be seen as a responsible political party.
         
         If I were them I would treat Trump as a toxic mistake and move him from the public eye as soon as possible. He is already trying to throw his weight around, post-Presidency. McConnell, while diabolical, is a pragmatist who would say that Trump has outlived any political usefulness to the party and today is more a liability than otherwise.
         
         Trump really is not worth hanging on to as he possesses virtually nothing to redeem him.
         
         As I always say, our 'system' does not and cannot work unless everybody agrees to play by the same rules. But if Republicans make their commitments to a single man over standard Democratic principles.......

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   PrettyPantherposted 4 years ago

   The Oregon GOP is just as out of touch with reality, issuing a statement that the Jan. 6 insurrection at the Capitol was a false flag operation.
   
   I am surrounded  by fools.

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      Credence2posted 4 years agoin reply to this

      This trend seems to be everywhere. Everybody criticizes me for comparing this sort of thinking to the very worst behavior identified from fascist regimes in the past and we are seeing this now in America.
      
      How many of these folks ditched civics class in junior high?

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   Valeantposted 4 years ago

   This was telling today:  https://www.yahoo.com/news/gop-answer-p … 38374.html

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      Credence2posted 4 years agoin reply to this

      Seems like no one has learned a thing regarding events from the last 3 months.
      
      Would someone like to take a stab at why supporting this man is so compelling for so many?
      
      This master of leading from behind.

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