One more thing that will make the biden presidency a stain on the history of the United States
"President Biden is commuting the sentences of nearly all the inmates on federal death row, a move that comes not even two weeks after he went through with the "largest single-day grant of clemency" in American history, the White House announced Monday.
Of the 40 inmates on federal death row, according to DeathPenaltyInfo.org, Biden is commuting 37 men sentenced to death, reclassifying their sentences to life without the possibility of parole.
The convicted murderers who will now escape execution include: Marcivicci Barnette, who killed a man in a carjacking and his ex-girlfriend; co-defendants Brandon Basham and Chadrick Fulks, who kidnapped and killed a woman after escaping prison; Anthony Battle, who killed a prison guard; Jason Brown, who stabbed a postal worker to death; Thomas Hager, who committed a drug-related killing; David Runyon, who participated in the murder-for-hire plot of a Naval officer; Thomas Sanders, who kidnapped and killed a 12-year-old girl; Rejon Taylor, who carjacked, kidnapped and killed a restaurant owner; and Alejandro Umana, who killed two brothers inside a restaurant.
Two men were on death row for the murders of witnesses: police officer Len Davis, who ordered the murder of a witness who was part of an investigation into a misconduct complaint against him, and Ronald Mikos, who killed a federal grand jury witness in a Medicare fraud investigation.
Ex-Marine Jorge Torrez was set to be executed for killing another servicemember.
The list also includes men who committed deadly bank robberies, such as co-defendants Billie Allen and Norris Holder, who killed a bank guard during their crime; Brandon Council, who killed two bank employees; and Daryl Lawrence, who killed a special-duty police officer during an attempted bank robbery.
Julius Robinson killed two people over drugs, and so did co-defendants Ricardo Sanchez, Jr., and Daniel Troya, who killed a family, including two children.
Drug lord Kaboni Savage murdered or directed someone else to murder 12 people during a 16-year period – including an arson that killed six members of a federal informant's family.
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/biden- … presidency
Interesting! That opens doors to the age old debate of the morality of capital punishment, doesn't it?
Not necessarily my personal perspective, next, is what Google University AI generated overview is. For background, I remember way back when about '73 while in high school in a youth group setting at my baptist church the youth pastor introducing us to the topic of capital punishment.
********** From Google University **********
The morality of capital punishment is a complex topic with many different perspectives:
Arguments against
Many people oppose capital punishment because they believe it's:
** Inhumane and violates the right to life
** Irreversible
** Biased against certain races and economic groups
** Not a more effective deterrent than life or long-term imprisonment
** Cruel, degrading, or unnecessary
** The same as murder
** A multiplication of hate
Arguments for
Some people support capital punishment because they believe it:
**Represents just retribution for certain crimes
** Protects society
** Preserves the moral order
** Has a deterrent effect on potentially violent offenders
** Is morally justified in exceptional circumstances
Religious views
There is no agreement among religious faiths on the morality of capital punishment. However, some religious leaders, particularly within Judaism and Roman Catholicism, have campaigned against it.
Deontology
Many deontologists believe that capital punishment is a moral wrong because killing is wrong under most circumstances.
[a] Jesus's statement
Jesus famously stated "let he who is without sin throw the first stone," which some say effectively says that capital punishment should not be carried out.
Of course, I suspect, a couple of blankets can be tossed out boiling it down to right vs left or conservative vs. liberal, yet each individual will wrestle with the implications of the realities of death in different context(s).
Did you take the time to read why these people have been sentenced to death? What do you say to the families who had loved ones killed by these monsters?
"The convicted murderers who will now escape execution include: Marcivicci Barnette, who killed a man in a carjacking and his ex-girlfriend; co-defendants Brandon Basham and Chadrick Fulks, who kidnapped and killed a woman after escaping prison; Anthony Battle, who killed a prison guard; Jason Brown, who stabbed a postal worker to death; Thomas Hager, who committed a drug-related killing; David Runyon, who participated in the murder-for-hire plot of a Naval officer; Thomas Sanders, who kidnapped and killed a 12-year-old girl; Rejon Taylor, who carjacked, kidnapped and killed a restaurant owner; and Alejandro Umana, who killed two brothers inside a restaurant.
Two men were on death row for the murders of witnesses: police officer Len Davis, who ordered the murder of a witness who was part of an investigation into a misconduct complaint against him, and Ronald Mikos, who killed a federal grand jury witness in a Medicare fraud investigation.
Ex-Marine Jorge Torrez was set to be executed for killing another servicemember.
The list also includes men who committed deadly bank robberies, such as co-defendants Billie Allen and Norris Holder, who killed a bank guard during their crime; Brandon Council, who killed two bank employees; and Daryl Lawrence, who killed a special-duty police officer during an attempted bank robbery.
Julius Robinson killed two people over drugs, and so did co-defendants Ricardo Sanchez, Jr., and Daniel Troya, who killed a family, including two children.
Drug lord Kaboni Savage murdered or directed someone else to murder 12 people during a 16-year period – including an arson that killed six members of a federal informant's family."
It boils down to the privilege was Biden's not mine. It is his morals you should be questioning. The rest of your rebuttal is meaningless to me, yet thanks for sharing a perspective to consider. I shant go into my thoughts and feelings of capital punishment at this time.
Problem is that Biden has decided his morals override the laws of the land, the judgements of the courts and the will of the people. For now, he is the King and can do no wrong.
I understand the ambiguity as capital punishment is against the law here too, but I still am not okay with a president appionting himself above everyone else and deciding that what the juries and judges who heard those crimes decided what was appropriate.
What if one of the presidents that comes along decides that it is okay to arrest and convict his political opponents? What if one of the presidents that comes along feels that he should support an assassin to kill his opponent?
The Presidential pardon has long been used in the US. While it can be abused, setting free friends and family (as Biden did for his son) that is unusual. It is normally used when new evidence shows at least possibility of innocence or simply as a gesture of kindness and caring.
But here Biden has declared that he believes the death penalty wrong and has removed it as a solution for those few crimes it is used in. He has the legal right to do so; he does NOT have the ethical right to go against the will of the people because he doesn't like the law as written. Our President is not a god, declared to be the moral guidance for all.
It does sound more like something a king could do. I thought that people realized that the president was not annoited by God.
Especially bad is granting a pardon for treason, tax evasion, and any other potential crimes for the last 15 years.
Yeah, Biden has set aside the purpose of the law, using it to satisfy his own wants and feelings.
Meanwhile people cry and wail that Trump will be a dictator, doing whatever he wants.
I'm certain the left doesn't see the irony of it.
Of course not. Much of the left (most, by a large margin, in my estimation) does not like the death penalty. Biden merely did something they would like done - that he is taking the law unto himself is irrelevant. Because they like what he did; let Trump do something (even legal, like separating criminals from their children) that they do not like and all hell will break loose. Again.
It just makes one wonder who made up the list for Joe.
I have more sympathy for the victim's families than the monsters who killed people. I think what biden did was despicable.
"Family of murdered SC woman rages at Biden for commuting killer's death sentence: 'She was shown no mercy'
Donna Major's daughter said the news left her feeling 'hurt, frustrated and angry'
The family of a South Carolina bank teller gunned down during a 2017 robbery is livid after President Biden commuted her killer's death sentence just days before Christmas.
Now Donna Major's family is left reeling through the holiday season, rattled by the news that the convicted criminal had been shown the mercy he refused to show others.
"I was angry. I'm still angry. I am upset that this is even happening, that one man can make this decision without even talking to the victims, without any regard for what we've been through, what we're going through, and completely hurt, frustrated and angry," Major's daughter Heather Turner said Tuesday on "Fox & Friends."
"She was shown no mercy at all. This man walked into the bank, never said two words to her. Shot her three times in total. He went and shot her coworker, Katie Skeen as well, who was totally defenseless and unaware of anything happening," Major's husband, Danny Jenkins, added during the show.
"I can't even believe that this is actually happening…"
Career criminal Brandon Council was among 37 inmates whose federal death row sentence was commuted to life in prison by President Biden earlier this week.
Surveillance video from the 2017 double murder shows Council walking into CresCom Bank in Conway, South Carolina, approach Major and speak to her briefly before pulling out a gun and shooting her multiple times.
He then leapt over the counter and opened fire on 36-year-old teller Kathryn Skeen, killing her as well.
https://www.foxnews.com/media/family-mu … n-no-mercy
Trump is the epitome of placing himself and his policies above the law. Let's get real, people.
I probably would not have done it the way Biden did. I presume that they all received a death sentence the involved murder. If that is the case you either pardon them all or none of them. I certainly believe that Root and the terrorist related killers need to meet up with old sparky, But, I would like to know what Biden's methodology was on why these three killers were not pardoned. Because the very scale of the pardons would indicate that Mr. Biden is opposed to the death penalty in principle and allows the most heinous of the bunch to be executed because of publicity and notorious nature of their crimes comapared to others?
That, in itself, is not a valid way to make the distinctions.
Get real. The lefts continued excuses for this man that excused a man that killed an eight year old child are inexcusable. Trump never pardoned this type of person, and if he did his supporters would condemn him.
If Biden does not support the death penalty, he could try to pass laws and not just ignore the laws.
Trump talks about pardoning the rabble of January 6 2021 of all of their crimes. Why can Trump use his power as President to pardon but Biden cannot?
Protestors, not rabble. Mostly peaceful, just like CNN commented about those BLM protestors that were torching the shopping centers, right?
If Trump decides to pardon them the leftists have absolutely no right to comment after the Hunter fiasco and Biden pardoning the "cash for kids" judge.
Plus he already did his daughter's corrupt father in law, plus all his traitor MAGA friends.
Perhaps because Trump saw a group of people being used as political pawns and treated differently than other people that rioted just as they did. Biden, on the other hand, has decided that he does not like the law; it offends his personal sense or morality (as if he had one!) and therefore should not be enforced even though the people and the courts have said it should.
MAJOR difference between the two.
MAJOR difference between the two.
No, just YOUR PERCEIVED difference between the two.
Ah. You believe that participating in a riot, or breaking and entering, is basically the same as murdering someone. Any difference is perception only; the morality of one, the evil of it, is the same as the other.
Yes?
Participating in a riots causing grave injuries to law enforcement personnel while bringing desecration and vandalism to new heights should not go completely unpunished as Trump, knowing him, will probably do.
Biden's pardons reduced the death penalty into life sentences. So, no one is getting off scott free, Wilderness. As if you didn't know, there are many states that do not have the death penaltY. I am satisfied tha Biden used his authority appropriately, despite the fact that you don't.
"Participating in a riots causing grave injuries to law enforcement personnel while bringing desecration and vandalism to new heights should not go completely unpunished as Trump, knowing him, will probably do. "
I agree, and will go further that participating in a riot causing even property damage without physical harm to any person should not go completely unpunished. Even a "demonstration" that is illegal and causes harm (physical or otherwise) to other people. "Civil disobedience" is not excused under the law and should be punished as any other illegal activity.
But it very often does go unpunished, even with massive property damage.
No, they did not go scot free. Neither will they serve the sentence a jury, a court and the law all found reasonable. Because, recall, Biden decided that his personal morality set is against the death penalty except in two specific cases as decided by him. Others, including the mass of Americans that made the law, are irrelevant.
I'm sorry, but while this appears quite legal, it is NOT ethical and is NOT within reasonable powers of the President. The ability to offer clemency and grace to certain criminals is not the same as changing the law, however temporarily - it is not the same as deciding that the law is wrong and should therefore not be followed, which is exactly what Biden did. He has decided that, in the matter of capital punishment he is a god and should not permit it to happen.
I do not find such action appropriate for a President any more than I find judges making law to be appropriate. Or cities that decide they are not subject to federal law or American policies.
1st amendment gives people the right to peaceably assemble. I won't give conservatives any space on that.
While Biden's use of the pardon was unprecedented, it is completely legal. The morality and ethics of this is something for you to grapple with, I have no problem with it. Because for every time conservatives say that Biden crosses the line, from our perspective Trump crosses it 10 times.
So, any moral outrage from the Right will likely fall upon deaf ears on our side. The Constitution lays out what is within the the reasonable power of the President, who are you to say otherwise?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal … ly_history
We are going to disagree on this one, but are you surprised?
"1st amendment gives people the right to peaceably assemble. I won't give conservatives any space on that."
Key word being peaceably. Destroying property, even illegally blocking roadways, is not "peaceably" regardless of how you cry out that it is.
If you support Biden's misuse of the program then you have to support misuse of other programs by other people. You don't get to simply choose that what you like and agree with is all right but anything you don't think is a good thing is wrong.
I'm positive that the moral outrage will fall up deaf ears, at least ears such as yours, for anything from the right is evil and bad in your eyes.
Nope, not surprised, for the reason given just above. For you, anything at all from the right is evil regardless of it's results or intent.
“for anything from the right is evil and bad in your eyes.”
From my experiences with your people and advocates over many years, that is probably more true than otherwise. So, yes, I don’t care for rightwingers, whom in this forum is not aware of that?
I consider all right wing perspectives, policies and policy creators as malevolent until i prove it otherwise. So, the rightwinger will never receive the benefit of the doubt, not from me.
I think that is a fair evaluation of the other side, don’t you think?
And there it is again: two wrongs can make a right . . . (and from the same warrior too!)
" I have no problem with it. Because for every time conservatives say that Biden crosses the line, from our perspective Trump crosses it 10 times."
Are you sure that morality and ethics are only for others to worry about is a stand you want to defend?
GA
“Are you sure that morality and ethics are only for others to worry about is a stand you want to defend?”
All of this is relative, my morality and ethics are not those of yours or Wilderness, or that of most of the Right. Yes, I worry about it, but from a completely different point of view.
So this is a place where “whataboutism” can apply?
It looks like "whataboutism" is all that can apply. You couldn't defend the actions without a comparison: Biden did it but Trump did it 10 times more.
You did the same thing with 'morals and ethics:' you needed a comparison to party or ideology.
Relative to Biden's pardons, I don't see a morality issue (Right or Left), but I do see an ethics issue—just as Wilderness described.
This was more than a president pardoning a 'buddy' or a political operative, or even some rich guy with pull—something we agree past presidents have done, it was an arbitrary political ideology action.
GA
I have no problem with it. The President is acting within the confines of the law. The fact that conservatives are raising Cain over it is all the more reason is just more Biden bashing. SO, I still defend it..... so when conservatives speak of "ethic" issues, I have learned to look the other way
As I said there are many states without a death penalty,
What he did is MORE ethical than to just letting someone off because of his being a buddy, or pal
Such being the BiG difference between the view of the left on matters comapar d with your own
The differences, as compared to my own, might not be what you think. I am also against the death penalty. My reason is singular and probably different than yours, but it is not why I agree with the criticisms of Pres. Biden's act.
For clarity, I was not condoning or agreeing with the description of past presidential pardons, it is simply my perception of many of their pardon choices.
My 'perception' is also that you would be strongly critical of these (Biden's) pardons if a Republican president were the one doing it.
GA
"My 'perception' is also that you would be strongly critical of these (Biden's) pardons if a Republican president were the one doing it."
That is the incorrect perception. I don't like Republicans or conservative reasoning in general, but I am not two faced or hypocritical in my points of view. I am true blue to a fault, no excuses and no red added....
I perceive that you always give Republicans a free pass, "two wrongs don't make a right" or otherwise. And they all have the very nerve to talk to me about ethics, electing for Commander and Chief a convicted felon?
Some of the more heinous and brutal crimes deserve the death penalty, so I am not totally against it from a psychological standpoint.. But, legally, it is one or the other and I would support no death penalty because in my view, it is always better to release a guilty man rather than execute an innocent one.
I was wrong. Your reason for being against the death penalty is the same as mine. We aren't perfect and a wrong death penalty can't be fixed.
GA
“These commutations are consistent with the moratorium my Administration has imposed on federal executions, in cases other than terrorism and hate-motivated mass murder,” Biden said in a statement.
“Make no mistake: I condemn these murderers, grieve for the victims of their despicable acts, and ache for all the families who have suffered unimaginable and irreparable loss,” he said.
The three death row inmates who aren’t included in Biden’s list on Monday include two notorious mass shooters, as well as the person who killed multiple people at the Boston Marathon, The New York Times reported.
by Veronica 11 years ago
What are your beliefs on capital punishment?I personally rather see someone rot in jail for their crimes than get the easy way out.
by Cut The Bullshit 12 years ago
Do you believe in the death sentence for murderers? And why?
by Readmikenow 2 weeks ago
Well, I guess there are people who have done some illegal stuff under biden that they could be prosecuted for but not to worry, if anything is discovered, they have blanket immunity from biden. "Biden pardons Mark Milley, Anthony Fauci, J6 committee membersSpeculation whirled that Trump...
by danielleantosz 12 years ago
What are your views on the death penalty?While I do believe that some people should be put to death, the risk of sending an innocent person to death is too great. I think either the requirements for the death penalty should be higher or is should be banned. What do you think?
by Don W 13 years ago
In jurisdictions that maintain capital punishment are the rates of aggravated murder and felony murder lower than in jurisdictions where capital punishment has been banned?
by Prakash RnP 11 years ago
Are you for or against capital punishment for rapists that murder their victims?Answers with supporting reasons are solicited.
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