For You Socialists out There - The Coming Economic Collapse Of China

1. 0

   Poppa Bluesposted 14 years ago

   http://news.yahoo.com/s/csm/20100316/cm_csm/287926
   
   The article explains how China has been able to achieve its phenomenal growth and the consequences of their actions and the effect it will have on the rest of the world.
   
   Consequently it proves that capitalism and freedom are the best means for a consistent long term approach for prosperity.

   replyreport
   1. 56

      Sab Ohposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Yeah, a big reckonin' is on the way there. The RMB is overvalued at least 20-45% - can't maintain that forever, the central bank has spent the last decade making loads of really bad loans to the provinces, and China's debt to GDP is at around 98%! Ours is at 11% and we are tearing our hair out over it. Imagine.

      replyreport
   2. 69

      Ralph Deedsposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      I agree with you on capitalism and freedom, with appropriate regulation to make sure it doesn't self-destruct. We obviously disagree on what regulations are necessary and appropriate. Thanks to the period of deregulation that started with Reagan which culminated in the banking, real estate and other excesses, the pendulum is swinging back toward greater regulation.

      replyreport
   3. 84

      Marisa Wrightposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      You're comparing capitalism and communism, not capitalism and socialism.  There's an enormous difference.

      replyreport
2. 90

   Will Apseposted 14 years ago

   You must have noticed that China is a capitalist country now.

   replyreport
3. 69

   MikeNVposted 14 years ago

   Why anyone would Envy China is hard to fathom.  China is a Communist Country and the average citizen has no rights makes next to nothing and lives close to Poverty.  So what if they have Growth if the people who create the growth do not benefit?  The ruling elite are the only benefactors.
   
   Here is what Chinese Workers Make... do you want to be paid like this:
   
   http://www.worldsalaries.org/china.shtml
   
   China pulled tainted milk off the shelves only to have it reappear because the Chinese Government doesn't care about it's people.
   
   China is polluting the world to produce crap products.  China is an Environmental Disaster.
   
   
   
   From the UN 2004:
   
   SHANGHAI (AP) — Environmental damage from China's breakneck economic growth, the spread of AIDS and growing poverty threaten the future of China's drive to better living standards, the United Nations said in a report released Thursday.
   
   China faces daunting shortages of productive farmland and water, said the U.N. Development Program study. Untreated sewage discharge and industrial effluent have left most rivers, lakes and groundwater heavily polluted, it said.
   
   "China is not yet on track in reversing the loss of its environmental resources," said the report, which assesses the country's ability to meet goals set by the Millennium Summit in 2000.
   
   So what exactly is so great about China?

   replyreport
   1. 66

      TheGlassSpiderposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Well, obviously these pay rates look pretty sucky...but do you also have a link to something that would show the cost of living? I presume that if it's a communist country that the gov't provides certain things that they wouldn't in a capitalist one? For instance--do they have health care for all their citizens over there? If they do, that's one expense they don't have that capitalists do.
      
      I'm not trying to argue with you, I'm just trying to put these wages into context.

      replyreport
      1. 69

         Ralph Deedsposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         China provides very few government social benefits. I read somewhere recently that the average wage for manufacturing jobs is $1.20/hour and that clothing factories are moving out of China to Vietnam, Cambodia, and other countries where the average wage is 20 cents an hour.

         replyreport
         1. 66

            TheGlassSpiderposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            Goodness, that DOES sound terrible...but again, I have to ask...What's the cost of living and how does it compare?
            
            My friends in MD think I make a ridiculously low amount of money, but in WV I'm considered well-to-do--all because of the difference in the cost of living.
            
            ETA: Also...I see on freelancing sites all the time, people accepting what I would consider slave wages. Like $1.00 per 500 word article...but there are plenty of Eastern freelancers just lapping these jobs up as though they were being offered gold. I can only assume that for those people $1.00 for their time is acceptable.

            replyreport
            1. 69

               Ralph Deedsposted 14 years agoin reply to this

               Well, it's not only acceptable, it's preferable, to the Chinese farm laborers who are moving from a barely subsistence level to the factories. China is going through the same stage of development experienced here as the U.S. changed from an agrarian, small town society as people migrated from the farms of the midwest and south to the formerly great industrial centers of the midwest.

               replyreport
      2. 56

         Sab Ohposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         To try and put the wage issue into context you also have to account for the vast disparity between the industrialized coastal areas and the interior and west that is still solidly third world.

         replyreport
4. 56

   Sab Ohposted 14 years ago

   To be fair, the political environment is much better than it was, economically they have embraced capitalism, and a whole lot of people are much better off than a decade ago. There are now quite a few very rich private citizens and more all the time. I believe a big correction is on the way for China, but we should look honestly at the good as well as the bad.

   replyreport
   1. 69

      Ralph Deedsposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Agreed. There are fabulously rich Chinese capitalists but the standard of living of the average Chinese worker has also increased spectacularly since Chairman Mao passed from the scene. China is overdue for establishing some social insurance programs such as unemployment compensation, industrial health and safety regulations, retirement programs, medical care and the like along the lines of other countries as they industrialized.

      replyreport