Well now, she reminds me a little of Wyatt Earp.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b56vwZ_o … r_embedded
she looks ... like a psychopath...
I'm surprised that no one is noticing how this OBVIOUSLY Christian video has a giant American flag in the background.
Religion and Government are one, but America is NOT a Christian nation.
These nutjobs keep thinking that "america = god".
(pssst... the "muslims" think the same way, and thus by burning a Quran in front of a US flag, you're making the same idiotic mistake that "your enemies" are making.)
Anyway, I'm not making the claim that she doesn't have the right to do this, I'm just making the claim that she's an idiot.
PSHAW! Brave is loving your enemies, and praying for those who persecute you!
She is nothing but playing to her own hatred and vanity!
Geeez-just not too long ago, Bill Maher was fired for saying suicide bombers were brave...double standard?
I should say so! Hummmph.
Extremist garbage. She's a female version of the idiot preacher in Florida who burned the Koran. Her stuff is even more inflammatory.
She's an all-American American. She teaches live stock marketing and she is a financial consultant and a stock trader.
This is a complex issue. Radical Muslims don't need any excuses to kill those who disagree with them, they already have a mandate to do it.
But the world is cowed by their insanity. She has decided not to be cowed. A very dangerous decision.
Aren't there any people here who discuss issues?
I'm about to bail on this forum. Boring come backs.
With mad staring eyes and total hypocrisy!
I could only bear to watch the first two of the Koran but the first one was about kicking out invading enemies, just like the US does.
And the second was about raping captives, just like some American soldiers do.
SERIOUSLY you are so against America, that is why you try and spew your socialistic nonsense! Why would you even equate that with the US? your disgusting. Does the US have a book saying these things? Yes I'm sure some crazy soldiers have done some sad things but when caught they get punished! not celebrated like they do! and for you to stick up and justify radicalism is just moronic.
He's not against America. All he is doing is throwing back some fact-filled rthetoric back in your face. How many times have you guys ripped him and others apart for their "anti-American, socialist views?" I mean seriously...
DTR I'm not condoning with this crazy woman did but this guy has never said one thing positive for America. read his posts. how can you equate what some crazy soldiers done which were punished if caught, compared to radical Islam? that woman said 30 other things but he conveniently left them out. I checked many posts and not a single one has a good thing about America. He doesn't mention school girls rioting and breaking windows and setting fires in the streets of London, how we do not have a lot of people of color as millionaires and in top places, he did not answer how many he has in UK especially in politics! only the bad from here. I was taught sometimes you you don't have anything nice to say do not say anything.
Well, you've got me there, I know nothing about schoolgirls rioting and breaking windows and setting fires in the streets of London.
You never asked me how many coloured people we have in the upper echelons in the UK, but I'll assume that you just have and answer, not enough.
If you don't have anything nice to say to me, aren't you being hypocritical by telling me constantly how moronic I am?
No I'm not against America, just hypocrisy.
I am aware though, that a book written 700 years ago will have passages in it that are not relevant in the 21st century, just as the bible does.
Have you actually read the bible? Some pretty violent injunctions in there boy.
John your the one with hypocrisy. show me one post that you like America that you have written. again how do you equate what crazy soldiers have done to radical Islam? THAT IS HYPOCRISY! also I guess you have not heard that the bible has been changed since then a few times! Christians do not practice the old bible they have moved on into the 21st century. Islam has not! they never changed it. show me where in the current bible that they preach beheading and killing the infidels! and how do you equate soldiers with the bible? some in the military are atheist, Jewish, even Muslim look at the guy who shot up soldiers at fort Hill!
I'm sorry that the US is so insecure that it is upset by the thoughts of one English man.
No, equating what some crazy soldiers do with what some crazy Muslims do is not hypocrisy, it's reality. Try it sometime.
You're right. We're so insecure.
When you insult "us" (which is an act of discrimination - you assume all "americans" are "americans"), "we" SHOULD just say "Darn! That rascal!" and not respond.
I'll start immediately.
"Darn! That rascal!"
Well Evan, I don't intend to insult the US, just tell it as I, and many others see it.
I'm sure that you would be much happier if my posts were full of praise for the US, but I just can't find it in myself to praise the likes of Lady Love.
I don't see you agreeing with everybody, why should I? Is freedom of speech an exclusive privilege?
again twisting! nobody is trying to take anything away! your BS spin again. he clearly stated what you wrote meant all US not just one person and I do not see anyone else blasting the persons country for a few individuals like you do and STATED in your post back to Evan!
I never said you didn't have the right to speech.
But you still failed to address my core argument.
"Darn, that rascal!"
another knock on America from your trap! I have not said nothing for about a month, then had enough of your nonsense so I express it to you only! I do not put down the UK, I'm putting you down...big difference. I do not need to try your messed up ideology! the stuff you spew is ruining our country and do not like it! weird how I know more about what happens in your country then You do? enjoy!
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article … harge.html
The Daily Wail! Only nut jobs take that seriously. Still what else would I expect.
By the way, I don't put America down, just some Americans.
also funny how you pick out just two but leave out all the other stuff! typical BS that you twist! pick and choose.
As I said, I could only bear to watch the first two, any more would have had the effect of a full frontal lobotomy on me, something which I suspect she has had.
John, why do you comment on something that is of no interest to you and which you have not even considered? Seems you would leave the room if it held no interest for you.
But Ann, it is of more than interest to me, radical Islam sees no difference between the US and the UK and we are much nearer to them.
That mad woman puts us at risk too.
It is false to say that I have not even considered it, I'd say that I've probably considered it in greater depth than many on here.
So you think radical Islamists, as they are now called, need an excuse to act out against westerners? They have a direct mandate to act out against anyone not of their religion.
AnnCee, quit talking like every muslim in the middle east wants us dead.
You know that's BS.
(psst: we've been over there bombing them for... 70 years now? I'd be pissed if they did that to me!)
Most Muslims in the world are living in terror. I am very sorry for most Muslims in the world. Obviously they are of no help to themselves or to anyone else as far as eradicating the killers among them. They suffer more than anyone from the radicals.
And yet, you call someone who burns their holy book a hero?
... I don't buy it!
Sure, show the video - but you have to acknowledge that what you just wrote ("I am very sorry for most Muslims in the world.") is in direct contradiction with calling that woman a hero.
"I feel sorry for your religion. that's why i think this woman, who pisses on your beliefs, is a hero!".
Evan, if there were a "Like" button, I'd click it.
I did not call her a hero, I said her action was brave because she deliberately provoked killers with a full knowledge of the danger.
I've never seen anyone do anything that brave. I'd be tempted to think it was foolhardy or insane. But she has armed herself and is ready to face the consequences. She gave her name and her physical address for crying out loud.
I honestly don't know what to think about her. Except I know she has the courage of her convictions to a degree I have rarely even seen in fiction let alone real life.
I didn't say I feel sorry for their "religion" either. I said I feel sorry for the Muslim PEOPLE, the ones who are terrorized by the radicals, which is apparently all Muslims who aren't radicals. You keep misunderstanding and misquoting me, Evan.
"I did not call her a hero, I said her action was brave because she deliberately provoked killers with a full knowledge of the danger."
ok, let's see how consistent you are.
I'm going to go on the highway and lie down.
... do you consider that "Brave"?
Are you trying to make a particular driver stop or just lying in random traffic?
doesn't matter - in both situations I'm risking my life for a purpose!
... But if you want to get particular, i'm trying to stop a particular driver!
In fact - i'm trying to stop a driver who is about to run over a baby.
What do you think, am I still brave?
awww... no reply?
Obviously, the answer from AnnCee is "yes of course it would be brave to save someone from an oncoming car".
To which I would respond:
"Oh, then you agree that it IS heroic to try to fight against a bunch of Americans who are trying to overthrow your religion?"
And then AnnCee has to say "dangit".
Yep, using AnnCee's own criteria for bravery, she would call the 9/11 terrorists "courageous."
Nice the way you put words in other people's mouths, evan. Play with yourself much?
I assume I'll get banned shortly for my "unnecessarily combative" words.
I put the words that other people say into different contexts that have the same meaning.
Then they get mad at me because I showed them that they're hypocrites.
The process continues to this day.
The analogy doesn't make sense. On the one hand he's violating someone else's mouth and with the other hand....
Oh... never mind.
Does matter. To me. Your thoughts don't interest me.
Yeah--if you fought back, you'd be a freedom-fighter! Imagine that.
Whether you agree with what this woman did or not it is beyond dispute that she is courageous to do such a thing.
Molly Norris promoted an "everyone draw Mohammed day" and she has lost her life to save her life after a fatwa was declared against her. The FBI advised her to disappear and she has.
This woman, Ann Barnhardt, is armed and on guard. She knows what happens.
You probably didn't see this part at the end of the second half but she gave her name and her address and invited anyone who wanted her to come and get her.
I don't know if she has seen the Daniel Pearl death tape. I find Barnhardt's videos horrifying and frightening. She is definitely tempting death and taking a stand both for her country and her faith. She is free to do so and it was Graham's comments about restraining that freedom that drove her to do this act. I hope he's proud.
You may also not have heard, Graham said that in a time of war people shouldn't be able to say things that would incite the enemy. Barnhardt lists examples of anti-Japanese and anti-Nazi propaganda used routinely and widely during WWII. But now we are so buckled down by cultural Socialism aka political correctness and by Islamic extremists who have taken our measure and used our weaknesses to destroy us.
http://www.academia.org/the-origins-of- … rrectness/
God, what an appalling sentiment and what an appalling woman.
I can't believe she gave out her address. That just cut her life expectancy down a tad.
She's loaded for bear, but still. It was an extremely dangerous thing to do and she is encouraging other people to follow suit.
It is the most provocative action I have ever seen anyone take. She knows these people aren't kidding around. Apparently neither is she. Not often you see someone laying her life on the line like this.
I'll give her that.
Some balls are held for charity
And some for fancy dress..
She's just got the biggest balls of em' all.
Onusonus - watch how this plays out. I just hope the cops are watching. There will be an 'attempt' on her life. Something spectacular for publicity. The reason I hope the cops stake her out. The 'attempt' will turn out to be as phony as she is. She's not taking any chances. Just like Jones in Gainesville, it's calculated for profit - with no personal risk. The only lives at stake were strangers within reach of a mob in Islamic countries.
It takes no guts to play Russian roulette when the gun is at somebody else's head.
I think this writer has some good points. Barnhardt certainly did punch right through the confusing miasma of murky political correctness and battle weariness to address the issue smack in the face.
http://www.familysecuritymatters.org/pu … detail.asp
What an idiot this Ann Barnhardt is... A bigot dressed in the garments of "patriotism".... Lunacy at its finest...
The only "elitism and snobbery" is her own....
What is the purpose of burning a Quran? Because one can? Is this it? Foolishness...
I call what she is doing the "self-fulfilling prophecy"... She, and others like her, want to show that Muslims are angry, violent, everything the "West" isn't....classic Orientalist garbage... But, what she is really doing is showing her own anger and violence... She would look good in an SS uniform...
I don't see Muslims burning Bibles.... In all the relations that I've had with Muslims I have been treated with nothing but decency and respect. In fact, one youth I tutor is a Shiite whose family came to the United States from Iran... To get a quality education he attends private Christian school....
Will this young man's classmates see this ridiculous video? If so, what will it communicate to them, and how will it affect their views towards him?
Too many people lack the microscopic perspective that would otherwise make them realize how stupid they are behaving...
I wonder if Muslims in this nation, if the young man I was talking about decided to take his Bible and burn it....what would the response be?
Would he be viewed as "exercising his freedom of speech rights" as an American, or would he be paraded as an "anti Christian Muslim extremist"? If he burned his Bible on youtube and his classmates and teachers witnessed this act, how would they treat him?
Perhaps he should start doing it....right? Why not be fair and balanced?
Oh, wait, that is the type of action Ann is trying to create....this is what she wants...
My ultimate point is this....
Is this the path we wish our nation to follow at this point? Are we trying to foster a religious war within our own nation? Or are we going to respect the religious and secular views of America's diverse population?
Good to see someone addressing the issue. I don't entirely disagree with you except I don't think the woman is an idiot, a bigot, a lunatic, an elitist or a snob. Maybe a fool.
Not easy to make a strong point amidst all the fog of cultural Socialism but she's done it.
I do feel for the regular Muslims who do no one any harm. It must be difficult to hold their heads up high while the world is dominated with news of the murderous actions of the bad apples among them. Not to mention the dangers they face from these people. The radicals among them want to pull them back into the stone age and it must be difficult and dangerous to oppose the trend. I suppose Muslims in this country are a bit more safe than those in countries where Sharia is the law of the land. There are fewer and fewer havens for peaceful Muslims.
Ann, the overwhelming majority of Muslims are the "regular ones" you are referring to...
If this was not the case, instead of an angry mob of 100 responding to the "Reverand's" ridiculous stunt would have been in the thousands, tens of thousands, if not millions..
When the cops who beat Rodney King within an inch of his life were acquitted, riots broke out around the nation and world....
But only a handful of Muslims become violent when a Quran is burned?
The proof is clear.... And this is why I think that burning the Quran is becoming a bigger and bigger publicity issue...
They didn't get the response they were looking for, so they are pulling an Emeril, and trying to "kick it up a notch" until they get the "fireball" they wish to see..
Too many have their eyes in Revelations and desire to usher in "end times"....
If only it was their "end time"....these extremists need to leave the rest of us alone...
And to stand in front of an American flag while one rants, as this lady does, attempts to paint the picture that she truly represents America...like Fox Schmooz...
It's not just the radicals that want to put Muslims back in the stone age.....this lady and many of her Christian ilk (I remember the anti-Mohammedan perspectives I was pumped with in church while growing up) are trying to put them there too....
I'll leave this with one more point....for all the Muslims I know or have known..none have ever tried to convert me... Not one single Muslim has (aside from when I've asked questions) discussed religion or the role of religion in politics... They are quite happy to be left alone on that count... If one knows something of Islam, they are more than happy to share a discussion, or even debate...but their is no imperialism of the soul..
I can't say the same for the Christian missionaries who venture into Afghanistan, for example... We want their oil...we want their natural gas, we want their trade routes, and we want their souls...
Ann's reaction appears to be a reaction to dhimmitude, a reaction to Wimpsey Graham's statement to the effect that Americans should do without their freedom of speech on this particular issue.
Obviously it is dangerous to poke the religion of Muslim radicals. They'll kill you for a cartoon.
I don't think Ann Barnhardt is looking for a wider explosion of rage. She is making a case for her freedom of speech and she is expressing her opinion about Islam. The opinion Graham and others say she should not express.
We are blessed to live in the United States of America. Christians in other parts of the world are dealing with a different face of Islam.
Ann, I don't know which Muslim country you've visited, but from the North African experiences that I've had, Egypt and Morocco in particular, I do not agree with you...
As for Muslims in the United States....the Florida "pastor" and this Ann (from the video linked in this thread) are showing the type of Christianity that al Qaeda and the Taliban want the Muslim world to see....
As for being a dhimmi....my family was more successful in that status in the Ottoman Empire than African and Mexican Americans have been in the United States... For all the fear of Sharia Law, the same pattern of denying the ability to testify in court, to participate in the political process, to serve in the military so on and so forth have been a lasting legacy of the United States...
While a Muslim of any ethnicity could travel throughout the Islamic world unmolested, the stupidity of racism and religious intolerance (towards Jews and Catholics up until quite recently in our national history) were a staple of Americana...
Like Orientalism, the projection of onto Muslims of intolerance, violence, oppression, and such are false... The pot is calling the kettle black...
The radical Islamists in Egypt have been successfully suppressed by the Mubarak regime for thirty years and before him by Nasser and Sadat. The women are already seeing a difference in their treatment with Mrs. Mubarak gone.
I don't know about Morocco except to say that on my little visit there I found the typical Muslim poverty and suppression of women.
I've been curious about something, speaking of Morocco, why does Muslim culture support belly dancing and the burkha at the same time. Doesn't make any sense to me.
When I speak of Egypt, I am looking back long before Mubarrak... After fleeing the Ottoman Empire, my great grandfather took up residence in Alexandria, where he and his family lived until coming to the United States in the 1920's..
Part of my words reflect the current period, and they also reflect the past....
If one wants to go back further, compare the treatment of Jews and Christians under Muslim rule to the experiences of Jews, Muslims, and Christians (non-Catholics) in Iberia... Start there...
Additionally, while governments using Islam have not always done a very good job, Muslim populations in general have...
During the Armenian Genocide (which affected my family tremendously) Muslims took in their Christian neighbors and hid them from the thugs hired by the crumbling Ottoman Sultanate.. While atrocities occurred on a massive scale, it could have been far, far worse... And for the "Muslims" who did participate in the violence against Armenian Christians...many of those responsible for the ill-affects were prisoners released from jail by the Ottoman government, or marginalized tribesmen like the Kurds....who, though being Muslim, were subsequently destroyed by the same Ottoman government...
It is one thing to parrot what people say...it is another to look at the reality on the ground that only thorough research can bring...
From transcribing interviews of Genocide survivors, to learning about my own familial experiences...a lot of perspectives have changed... Believe me, Ann, I used to think the way you do....and in the past, I probably would have gotten a kick out of the video you posted here.... But with all I know and see now...there is no way to go back into the Socratic "cave of ignorance" (The Allegory of the Cave--"The Republic")..
We have to progess......and we have to be adults about this...
The video that is the basis of this forum does nothing but bring out the foolish, childishness of our society...
I spent some time in Alexandria. Egypt to me is a sad place. The vastness of its history seems to dwarf the reality of today. The poverty is terrible. It's the only place I've visited where I've seen little children sleeping on the streets alone. I guess they have that in some places in South America too. You are fortunate your ancestors were courageous enough to leave their world behind and bring your family to this place.
Today we have dangerous Islamic extremists trying to destroy the west. They have declared war on us. Whether or not the typical Muslim goes along with this, they certainly don't fight it.
Or should I say, very few of them do, and those who do are marginalized by the others. Out of fear I'm sure. Nevertheless that's the reality. They are a truly silent majority.
The Detroit area has, I believe, the largest population of Muslims in the U.S. The individuals I've spoken to and the community and muslim leaders have spoken out repeatedly against Muslim terrorism and in favor of cordial, cooperative interfaith relations. There has been a high degree of cooperation with federal, state and local law enforcement authorities.
I'm not making this up, but I'll see if I can find some from Detroit newspapers. A couple of years ago I attended a documentary movie in Dearborn, Michigan, about the history of Muslims in Spain where for three hundred years Catholics, Jews and Muslims lived in harmony. The purpose of the showing was to promote the idea that people from all religions can live together with mutual respect. My wife and I attended the movie with a Catholic neighbor couple. The period of harmony ended in Spain when the Spanish inquisition began under Queen Isabella as I remember.
http://www.freep.com/article/20091228/N … m-peaceful
Here's what Juan Cole, U of M professor/Middle East expert had to say on the subject:
http://www.juancole.com/2005/07/friedma … n-and.html
Here's one where a "good Christian" nut job drove all the way from Stockham, California, with the intention of attacking a Mosque in Dearborn.
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/03/0 … m-hearings
Beautiful mosque, by the way, on the ride up from Ohio. It stands out. Columbus, Ohio has the second largest population of Somalians (Moslems) in the US. And I have to tell you, the Somalian community has played an extremely significant role in revitalizing business in the North End.
Both bellydancing and the burka predate Islam... Being covered from head to toe is smart when living in the desert...which is the environment that Islam developed within... If one looks at even Byzantine history, such coverings are seen... The myth is to believe that this is just a Muslim way of wearing clothes...
But you bring up a good point....as with any human idea, there are contradictions... Why do many Afghan men participate in parties involving young dancing boys, who often end up being prostitutes?
Another question is, why do American tax dollars go to companies like Dyncorp so that they can perpetuate such "festivities"?
In terms of repression of women, I don't think Christians have anything to argue... Until very recently, women in Spain couldn't own property... They could not exist independently...they had to be married..they could not inherit property.. There is much more to this...
In Islam this is not the case...women can inherit property, though not at the same percentage as males... Muhammad's wife was a wealthy widow....(an entity that could not exist in Christian Europe for over a thousand years)...it was only through her wealth that Muhammad had the time to run off into the mountains to meditate...which was a common practice for wealthy Arab young men at the time...
As for "typical Muslim poverty"......I'd compare that to the poverty in Mexico...which is about the same... But when I travelled through that country (and I don't mean "visiting T.J"...I travelled pretty extensively through the country)..I saw the juxtaposition of extreme poverty to American factories...
The further I got away from the American factories, the more farming and self-sufficiency I found...
Inbalances have far deeper reasons than religion...
Finally, just as with Christianity, all Islam is not alike... From Berbers and Greeks, to Egyptians, Persians, Indonesians and Arabs....Islam is vastly diverse..
Which is why I criticize those who speak of it as if it were some monolithic entity... It simply cannot be all segmented together...
Ann, I am glad to see that you can discuss things civilly, unlike the Lady of Unlove and others of her ilk...
Thanks for not being typical...
Here is a poem you will enjoy by Palestinian American Naomi Shihab Nye.
Before you know what kindness really is
you must lose things,
feel the future dissolve in a moment
like salt in a weakened broth.
What you held in your hand,
what you counted and carefully saved,
all this must go so you know
how desolate the landscape can be
between the regions of kindness.
How you ride and ride
thinking the bus will never stop,
the passengers eating maize and chicken
will stare out the window forever.
Before you learn the tender gravity of kindness,
you must travel where the Indian in a white poncho
lies dead by the side of the road.
You must see how this could be you,
how he too was someone
who journeyed through the night with plans
and the simple breath that kept him alive.
Before you know kindness as the deepest thing inside,
you must know sorrow as the other deepest thing.
You must wake up with sorrow.
You must speak to it till your voice
catches the thread of all sorrows
and you see the size of the cloth.
Then it is only kindness that makes sense anymore,
only kindness that ties your shoes
and sends you out into the day to mail letters and
purchase bread, only kindness that raises its head
from the crowd of the world to say
it is I you have been looking for,
and then goes with you every where
like a shadow or a friend.
I wrote a whole statement, and it deleted itself....
I do enjoy the poem, thank you.
There are extremist elements....in both Muslim and Christian camps...
It is important to single them both out as threats for all of us who lay in between...who are far more likely to get hit in the cross-fire... It is important to watch for the political machines who utilize them...domestically and internationally...
The hugest terrorists in the world dwarfing all others are the US government on behalf of the Military Money Complex.
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