To gain a point of perspective, think about a "billion"...

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   qwarkposted 13 years ago

   A billion:
   
   A billion seconds ago it was 1959!
   A billion minutes ago jesus alledgedly lived!
   A billion hours ago our ancestors were living in the stone age!
   A billion days ago no one walked upon the earth on 2 feet!
   
   Now, consider 1000 times a billion: a trillion... and try to visualize our national debt!
   
   Does that KINDA put things in perspective?
   
   Qwark

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      Texasbetaposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Yeah man, that is a bunch. I can't even fathom really.

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      dutchman1951posted 13 years agoin reply to this

      CBO stated 1 trillion dollars can buy everything there is that exhists to buy in the U.S 3 times!
      
      I can not fathom it either.

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         qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Hi Dutchman:
         ...now multiply that trillion by 14-30 and understand that there is no possibilty that our debt can be paid off.
         We must become a "manufacturing" nation again and produce the best products that can be imagined.
         Can we do it? Beats me!
         Qwark

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            dutchman1951posted 13 years agoin reply to this

            totaly Agree qwark, totaly agree
            
            but....we need to really work to open world markets for all goods, or we will have no one to sell to, and we can not self sustain just ourselves. we have splintered all our factories and sent them off shore for years sense Regan.
            
            now we need them, and they are Gone,  and we are busy shooting at people instead of feeding them and helping them to build a free economy so they can grow and educate their people.

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               qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               Dutchman:
               ...ahhh, but we won't have to worry about that in another hour.
               Here in Arkansas the world will end and jesus will appear.
               I'm going to prepare some milk and cookies.
               How are you going to celebrate?  :
               Qwark

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   superwagsposted 13 years ago

   This was written about ten years ago, but it's still an interesting perspective - it's nicked from Bill Bryson (excellent american travel author):
   
   "Imagine you were locked in a bank vault filled with dollar bills and you can keep each one that you initial.  Say you could initial one dollar bill per second and that you worked without ever taking a break.  How long do you think your non-stop efforts would take before you initialed the millionth bill?  The billionth?  The trillionth?
   
   If you initialed one dollar bill per second, you would make $1,000 every 17 minutes.  After 12 days of nonstop effort you would acquire your first $1 million.
   
   After 31.7 YEARS you would become a billionaire.
   
   But not until after 31,709.8 years would you count your trillionth dollar, and even then you would be less than one-tenth of the way through the pile of money representing America’s national debt."

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      LockAndKeyposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Most of the building owners have latest technologies of security system in their Offices or in their house. So don't think it is possible to face such  a situation.

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      dutchman1951posted 13 years agoin reply to this

      interesting money facts Super, very

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   logic,commonsenseposted 13 years ago

   qwark,
   In order to be able to visualize it, they have to be willing to look.  Too many put their head in the sand and think we should spend more.  The concept of cutting spending is something foreign to them.

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      qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Logic:
      The concept of a trillion is far beyond the abilities of the average human being to consider with understanding.
      The interest payment on trillions of dollars of debt mounts up at a staggering rate!
      I don't think I'll get much play on this thread 'cause most Americans think, "Ok we've been in the "hole" before, we'll dig out way out of this one just like we have the others.
      They have no conception of the "depth" of this hole and the problems this debt will create during this century.
      I've asked this before and get little response. "If the bank owns your mortgage, who's the boss?"
      They are either dumb and blind of as you said, "bury their heads in the sand."
      These are very scary times.
      Qwark

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         logic,commonsenseposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         The most scary thing is those that can not or will not see what is happening.  We are living in a house of cards that is close to tumbling down and yet there are those that refuse to believe we have to make drastic changes to prevent a total meltdown.  Unless government spending is cut back, including Medicare and Social Security, we are not going to survive as an economy.  The other day, someone was saying if we took all the money that corportations made, all the money of the richest people, all the money that we currently take in, we would still not have enough to get to the end of the year.  The question was asked, what would you do for next year?
         The answer to the problem is not more spending.  The government can not be all things to all people.  That is a recipe for failure.  The law of nature is some people do not survive, that is immutable.  Otherwise all will perish.

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            qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            BANKRUPCY!
            The whole damned world will suffer if we do!
            The world has shrunk up to the size of yer bedroom closet and we're all jammed in...TIGHT!
            To make it work, the impossible MUST happen i.e. we think, plan, create and solve together!
            NEVER HAPPEN!!!!!
            Homestead a corner in the closet, get'cher guns and ammo and protect what'cha got!...'cause they're comin' to take it away from ya!~
            Qwark

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               logic,commonsenseposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               Two steps ahead of you!

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                  qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  ...yer a "thinker!"
                  Proud of ya.
                  "Lock and load!"
                  Qwark

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                     logic,commonsenseposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                     Most would get rid of the h and put an s in front of the t!
                     
                     The key to survival is to be ahead of the pack.  Just remember, don't look back the bastards are gaining on ya!

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                        qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                        Ok "Stinker"
                        lol
                        Don't let the bastards wear ya down!
                        Dive! Dive!
                        
                        Qwark  :

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      dingdondingdonposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Let me explain simple economics to you. We have been in debt for a very long time; it is not a recent thing. During what we think of times when the economy was booming we were still in debt.
      
      To enable an economy to grow and improve people have to spend money. People living under the fear of debt, losing their jobs and their benefits every day because of cuts, do not spend money. So the economy gets worse. To prove this, let's compare two countries.
      
      South Korea's plan to boost its economy was to spend more to stimulate it. South Korea is now known as one of the countries who recovered the best from the crash.
      
      Ireland, on the other hand, decided to make lots of cuts to save money. Ireland is now sinking rapidly, known internationally as the Western country struggling the most, and often pointed to by other politicians as the worst possible way to handle debt.
      
      So.

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   Cagsilposted 13 years ago

   The National Debt is $12+ Trillion.
   
   That's actually not taking everything into account. It's sad to say, but it's not.
   
   The nice little green pieces of paper people carry around are actually IOU's, given to the U.S. Government, as a loan, just so it can operate.
   
   The debt based system doesn't work. It never has worked. The government injects "money", which it has to borrow, into the Economy. It's unfortunate, that the government continues to attack the Economy in the same manner, as in the past and learns nothing.
   
   If the government focused on growth, then they wouldn't inject money into the Economy itself, but would invest infrastructure for education and promote small business dependence, then it might actually see a return on it's money. But, continuing to inject money into the most wealthiest of companies is healthy for the Economy to begin with and anyone with half a brain would be able to see that.
   
   I agree Qwark, most people cannot fathom what a trillion dollars looks like, much less understand the amount of debt this country is actually in.
   
   As a closing, I'd like to let not only you, but others, the American debt isn't actually $12+, but closer to $70+ trillion, because of the many programs that are subsidized.

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      qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Cags:
      We are taking a long walk on a short pier! Yep!
      Qwark

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         Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         If things do not change. Yep!

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      canadawest99posted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Actually, the debt problem is much bigger than anyone can realize or comprehend or even begin to tackle.
      
      http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-2cdEnsZ79zo/T … yramid.jpg
      
      We will have to default and repudiate the sovereign debt of the world and start over.  Does that mean your personal debt will be gone - not a chance!

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      logic,commonsenseposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Cags, you are correct, it is closer to 70 billion.  No one wants to see that, they just want to keep getting the handout or bailout from good ol Uncle Sam.  They think the government just pulls it out of thin air.
      Pogo had it right, "we have met the enemy and he is us!"

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   Doug Hughesposted 13 years ago

   I did the calculation a few months ago. If you set a goal of cutting the national debt in half in 30 years, and weight the calculation by income, someone middle-class would pay $46 per month... someone in the bottom 20% by income, would pay $10 per month. Someone in the top 5% would pay near (or over) $300 per month. This would cut the national debt in half in the usual term of a mortgage.
   
   It's a calculation ion principal only, because we pay interest whether we pay down the debt or not. But it probably shows where the resistance will come from - and it's not the guy paying $10 per month.

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      qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Doug:
      China has a firm grip on our "jewels."
      She won't "squeeze" because She needs us.
      This is the first time in Her existence that Her burgeoning population can experience a quality of life they could only dream of 50 yrs ago.
      Billionaires are on the rise. Western capitalism has made Her necessary, productive and rich!
      How many fronts is She fighting wars on and wasting money by the boat load? NONE!
      How near is She to bankrupcy? NOT!
      But She is dependent upon the world for maintaining the lofty position She's gained!
      She is a country slightly larger in sq mileage than the USA.
      She needs to feed her burgeoning masses and She can't do it.
      She is mountainous and has depended upon terraced farming for centuries.
      ALL nations are dependent upon all others to maintain and progress. China understands that!
      Those that don't/won't will eventually fail as human population increases and the world continues to shrink due to technology.
      China is, expertly, playing the game and the game is "balance."
      They know the consequences of "foreclosing" on the US Debt.
      It would be disastrous to all world populations.
      There's no possibility of us paying off this debt! None at all!
      Both the mortgagor and the mortgagee will "compromise" endlessly.
      That's the "art of politics."
      Qwark

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         Doug Hughesposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Quark - the debt to China is unsecured. If we default, they don't own the National Monument... or anything else.
         
         Our global credit would be carp.. and they would be SOL. 
         
         The fact is we could readily get control of the debt... if everyone paid their share.

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            qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Doug:
            
            Who is "Quack?"
            
            Have I demeaned you, insulted you, spoken "down" to you, disrespected you?
            
            Or is "Quack" another "hubber" you've mistaken for me?
            
            I think I offered a respectful opinion and in return, I am referred to as "Quack?"
            
            Or was "Quack" a typo?
            
            Qwark

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               Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               Hey Qwark, he said- Quark. Yes it was a typo.

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                  qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  Ok Cags:
                  I went back and checked.
                  I APOLOGIZE DOUG!
                  I read it fast. My bad!
                  Watching tv and reading forum comments...lol
                  I'll crawl back into my hole and cower in embarrassment...lol
                  Qwark

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                     Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                     

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   lovemychrisposted 13 years ago

   That's the same amount that's not collected in taxes, due to special interest tax loop-holes!
   
   We don't have a debt problem, we have a tax problem.

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      aka-djposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Yeah. The gov't spends, the people pay.
      Sounds about right.

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         lovemychrisposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Not what I meant.
         
         I mean, the poor pay, the rich don't!
         
         Mike Malloy: Billions In Profit, Zero In Taxes http://dlvr.it/NBzYw

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   logic,commonsenseposted 13 years ago

   Qwark,
   Not scared, just prepared!
   Okay, okay, I haven't converted all my currency to gold and silver yet.  Haven't bought any AK 47's yet.  Haven't built a bunker yet.  Haven't stored canned goods yet.  Hmmm, maybe I better be like those two ants on the anthill and 'get on the ball'!

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      qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      "...a man's gotta do whata man's gotta do!"
      I'm gonna try to figger out the "point of detonation" and be there!
      1/60 of a second and I'll become an integral part of mother earth!
      Life after the "blast" ain't gonna be to my liking! :
      I'm not into "Pascals Wager," so I'll just bury my head "tween" my legs and kiss my ass g'bye! :
      
      Qwark

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