Have you noticed a pattern in my answers?
It is obvious that I get annoyed with individuals who can only offer a biblical answer to my atheism; and where they presume that I need to come round to their way of thinking? That annoyance shows itself in my answers here in the forums.
I am not going to make a judgment on myself; simply recognize what I do and see if it's possible for me to modify my reaction.
And my first response is: Does it matter that another person is fanatically christian to the point of denying my choice of "non-belief?" My answer: Only if they physically or mentally threaten myself or someone who is special to me.
Alan - There is that old Chinese proverb saying : "You can't prevent birds from flying, but you can prevent them from making a nest in your hair". So, ultimately, religious fanaticism (in all its forms, from quasi-intellectual to parrot-like ) doesn't matter one bit. It is THEIR mind's construct, that has nothing to do with your chosen mind style.
To say it mathematically, their and our minds are incomeasurable, or say it in everyday lingo - it's just mixing apples and oranges.
Our criteria of normalcy, logic, rationality is different, so we can't be on the same page no matter how hard we try. Look at scientific "denominations" . A chemist, a physicist, and biologist can easily find a common ground enriching each other's view. On the other hand, put a Christian, a Moslem, or even one of their own factions (Yehova's witnesses for example) together, and there will be a verbal war. Then put some guns on the table, and you may have a totally different kind of discussion between these "love" promoters.
Alan, your life's passion is something concrete - how to make this planet more livable by recycling the waste into something more useful. How can any of us "philosophers" or religionists match your noble quest? You have my admiration as a human being, and I salute you.
On the other hand, all this crap about "hating this or hating that" is totally useless. Every scientist worth his salt will say how "hate" is a hormonal assault on our own body, a completely self-defeating act. If questions like this appeared as a theme of psycho-pathology, it would be understood as appropriate. As an obvious advertisement of biblical puritanism which forbids "hate", it may be a great discussion only among the religionists, as a part of their own inspiring each other - but out of their circles it's worthless.
Well, Alan. my friend, try to see it my way - you can't expect a cat to start barking, so don't expect your point of view to be understood and appreciated in a wrong place. Let everyone do their own thing, and you do yours. In a way it is embarrassing to put ourselves in a situation where someone is trying to drill into your mind their own deliberate phantasies. I am not responding to any of it anymore since I found it embarrassing. (I guess you noticed I even deleted all dozen or so of my own questions having to do with religion)
So this is strictly my message to you my friend. Some of those self-appointed spokesmen may try to provoke me - but well, it's below my simple human dignity to be bothered.
I rarely venture in to the religious section these days. But sometimes, when I'm bored, I look to see if there are anti-atheist rants going on. Then I mess with them for the hell of it.
Thanks Val and L.A.C. I just did my meditation and as an exercise "allowed" a few mosquitos their breakfast upon my body. It was a great lesson on "integration." Intimately so, without destroying them!
Austinstar - That's exactly what I used to do. But I repeat, some of those non-intrusive believers I do respect.
I lost respect for them years ago. They need to earn respect, and i just don't see that happening in all their copying and pasting and failure to answer the actual questions. They get really into name calling and whining too.
Thanks everyone for your input. I will close this Question shortly, so it does not become bogged down like the others have done when left for too long.
Best answer goes to Vlad, thanks Vlad. But everyone has had useful input. Respects to all.
No Alan, your answers are well thought out and original as opposed to the copy/pasted answers coming from free-thought impaired people.
Most commenters here do not even bother to read and comprehend the questions being asked. They just automatically go straight to their set of prepared and memorized and copied references thinking that if they repeat themselves enough, someone, somewhere will eventually accept it as "truth".
The theists here are so often anti-atheists first and foremost. They do not bother to use their own thoughts, perhaps because they don't have anything original to say, do, or think. They just follow the party lines.
I can understand from your perspective, Alan, how it can seem intrusive. While there's nothing that can be said or reached through discussion that will change that certainty in this life, you can alter your own reaction to it. And doing so can be done through understanding.
Think of it in the context of how they're seeing it. I, of course, can't speak for all believers, just simply how I see it. Take this as an example. If you were to see a man with a bag over his head wondering towards a busy street, would you not feel compelled to get involved? Because most often that is the motivation. They see a fellow human in what they perceive to be danger. It's not that they're trying to force their ideals onto you, or gain themselves some heavenly reward, they're trying to "save" you from the danger that they see that you're in that you don't seem to be able to see for yourself.
So, if you're able to see these same interactions in their proper context, if you're able to understand that it's coming from a place of love and concern, and not from a place of superiority or arrogance, then this I would think would impact the reaction you have to it.
Jeremy - Has it ever crossed your mind that "saving" a non-believer is an insult to his intelligence? How would you like if an atheist wanted to "save" you from "religious delusions"? Would you appreciate his "altruistic intentions"? I doubt it.
Of course I appreciate it. Anyone who takes the time to lay out the logic for something they believe I have wrong, I appreciate the effort they put forth to correct me. Is it insulting to save someone from wondering into traffic?
Jeremy - Do you REALLY believe that a normally functioning, relatively happy, relatively successful atheist "needs" something like "saving"? From what? From imaginary. illusory danger?
From a very real danger of missing out on what it's all about. It's not about a handful of decades of managing to be "relatively happy/successful". What a devastating waste of time and effort that would be if mbillions of years culminated into that.
Jeremy - As a teenager I once had a problem convincing a girl that I didn't want her love. Believers' insistence on "saving us all" reminds me of that. In normal world it's called "imposing", "intruding", "being a pest".
I too live in the normal world and to me it's care, love, concern. It comes from a place of pure intention for your benefit. Plenty more to be insulted by than from someone wanting to reach out and help.
Jeremy - From your comments I think that you should really focus on "helping" YOURSELF. - Our chat is over.
Just trying to bring some perspective. Lessen the hate. Clearly I failed.
Jeremy - It's so hard to say good-bye to your lack of understanding. I don't "hate" you, man, where did you get that one? You are "saving" without a danger, you are "lessening the hate" that doesn't exist" - what is your imagined "holy mission"?
Just an understanding that there's more than just what can be seen. Like these differing mindsets. Totally invisible to others, yet undeniably real. The danger a believer sees IS real. Is the traffic real to the man under the bag? He doesn't see it.
Jeremy - "Is the traffic real" to a man who wears a bag of delusions? How do you know it's a non-believer to cross the road? Why is your mindset more competent than a non-believer's - other than "because you say so"? Is your "believing" a proof?
Jeremy - you do not see what it is like to live WITHOUT the threat of "hell" hanging over your head! I can tell you that it is enormously peaceful to realize there is no "hell". It's all in your head.
I totally agree, Austinstar. For me there is no after-life so it and the threat of retribution is absent from my mind. Everything relates back to connection between me and this physical world - and of course with my neighbour.
I dont believe in hell. So I dont have that either. My problem with atheism is that it doesnt stand up logically and fools one into thinking that all life is is this handful of decades we each get.
Your view of atheism is incorrect. We don't believe in gods, but I, for one, believe in the infinity of life, the universe and everything. No beginning, no end. no death at all. We just change structure on the infinity scale. We are the universe!
And thats fine. Thats something more in line with accounting for all that life is. But it does seem a tad convenient if its all as you say, yet totally unintended to be that way.
Austinstar - I know your explanation is much more elaborate (just like mine), but we are on the same page there.
Yes, Jeremy, stick with your extremely inconvenient god theory. That deity makes perfect sense. Weird how a burning bush tells you how to live your life.
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