Quran burning

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   goldenpathposted 14 years ago

   Hypocrisy runs rampant in society.  Many take their own freedom of religion as a means to crush someone elses.  We all have personal choices.  It's not the religion's fault for someone's actions - it's the individual.  Let them have the Quran and let all other scriptures exist.  It's when individual actions cross the line into illegality and murder that justice must intercede.

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      dutchman1951posted 14 years agoin reply to this

      From NewsChannel5.com in Nashville.
      
      well One nut decided to do it! We are dead set on tearing each other appart? This is Nuts people, makes no sense at all to do this.
      
      article below
      
      SPRINGFIELD, Tenn.- A Springfield pastor says he did go through with a Koran burning Saturday.
      
      Pastor Bob Old runs his ministry from his home, and threatened to burn the Islamic holy book in his backyard, and put the video online. Saturday the pastor says he's decided against posting the video to YouTube.
      
      A small group of protesters did show up at his house, but there were no confrontations.
      
      This happend in Clarksville, Tenn. and the Protestors were Army Wives, whose Husbands are in the 101st and dispatched oversease from Ft. Campbell. This is a sad day for this Preacher and his hate mongering crap.

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      earnestshubposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      It is the religion's fault.
      
      It tells it's believers to kill non-believers. In both the quoran and bible.
      
      Do I need to post a few dozen of each?

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         dutchman1951posted 14 years agoin reply to this

         Please do Earnest, post and let it be seen. There is nothing to justify this nonsence, nothing at all. this is nuts. Words on a page written 50-500 years after the fact, and no evidence of True exhistance, except primitive beings. 
         
         Un-identified Bones =Words=Facts.....I think not.

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         goldenpathposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         I'm sure you and others have researched and diligently sought out wisdom in compiling evidence against any and all faiths.  However, any faith can defend the words of it's holy writ.  You cannot possibly explain the Qu'ran from a Muslim point of view.  It's not possible.
         
         We all still have free choice.  No religion can strip you of that therefore it's not a religion's choice.  A religion may be false to the bone but it still cannot escape that one fact.

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            earnestshubposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            Would you deny that religion tells people to kill?
            
            What do you do with the threats of the OT? Ignore them?
            Disconnect jesus from them? Deny they are written? Deny their very clear meaning?
            Rip the OT out? Substitute your own book? Say that every one of these scriptures is quoted "out of context?"
            
            Pretend that I make them up myself perhaps?

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               goldenpathposted 14 years agoin reply to this

               People view other people's faith according to their own understanding and "outside" perceptions.  These are more often than not skewed perceptions.  You know I'm an authority on this truth.  I will not defend nor condemn the faith in question because I am not in it.  I do, however, condemn selected individuals that have radicalized it to a point of murder.  Often in scripture what we deem as violent murder and bloodshed means something totally different in it's original tongue.  Scripture is not written as we think today.  Scripture was written in a time and tongue that expresses symbolic images to represent ideas.  This is the problem of people posting verses on the forums because they are looking at the literal word as perceived in today's language and not the original intended language.

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                  earnestshubposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                  So only the select few who are much smarter and more loved by god are the people who understand what "kill un-believers" REALLY means?
                  
                  I may be no less bible literate than you are by the way.
                  
                  I can read what is written.
                  What is written is insane by any reasonable standards.
                  
                  Omnipotent entities who are jealous, possessive murderers by their own words are not very likely to get a good hearing.

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                     goldenpathposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                     I never said the select few are more enlightened or choice.  I said they have radicalized their faith which is dangerous and wrong.  I condemn any system of belief that advocates open murder upon another fellow being but I am not about to condemn a faith that many in such faith can defend their holy writ with a different meaning.

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                        earnestshubposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                        Are you saying that "kill un-believers" has another meaning??

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                           goldenpathposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                           I don't know!  I submit and admit that.  I don't know how they explain that term.  Perhaps they use it to mean putting down unbelief as a whole.  I don't know!  Perhaps it means kill the darkness of unbelief and the lack of hope it invites.  I don't know!  Who knows - perhaps it does literally mean to kill people.  Again, as long as someone is out there that can explain it in non-violent terms as they see it I will not condemn it because I am judging a system according to the acts of a few.  I am head strong in my faith buy many misconstrue our beliefs into something totally untrue and uneducated.  The same can be said for all faith systems.  Once we judge on the whole because of the few we become blind to the good hearts of the many.

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                              earnestshubposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                              These beliefs are constantly being held up as "truth" and "proof" that those who through study have decided it is a fairytale will all rot in hell along with their family and loved ones.
                              
                              I don't know how you guys think it is OK to misread anything even from your own "word" when it suits you in discussions.

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                                 goldenpathposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                                 When you read a book or article your literal interpretation of the wording suits you.  What's the difference?  It's all part of personal interpretation.  It's when an individual's actions cross over into murder and open deceit that I question and condemn.  Until that happens on the "whole" of that faith's membership we should not judge against it.

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                                 goldenpathposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                                 Everyone claims to have studied what they believe.  It's those outside a given faith that claims it as fairy tale.  You could believe in a rock and bow to it and I wouldn't care or try to alter your firm belief as long as you have love and charity in your heart, a love for mankind and a willingness to work for your needs.
                                 
                                 Variety is good and what makes us interesting. 
                                 
                                 Now, I will say this and take it as you will even with meaning between the lines.  I do and will condemn any radical even a religion's leader that openly and publicly exhorts it's membership to engage in mass murder and tyranny.  We all know this has been done heavily over the past couple decades.

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            dutchman1951posted 14 years agoin reply to this

            Agree,
            
            but....history proves Religion kills. It's human Passion is fever, and fever is blind. (Religion in any Belief form does this none are excluded from feeling it is the only way)
            
            It leads to conflict with authority, and thus punishment which is death.  By being in place as the foremost thought- (the Only way) It guarantees conflict will happen, because by natural thought processes not all will believe, so then all those are made to believe or die.
            
            Historically it has happened with repeatable predictability.

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   logic,commonsenseposted 14 years ago

   If you own a piece of property, do whatever you want with it!  Burn it, eat it or shove it where the sun don't shine!  Who cares?!  What's the big deal, it's yours!  Just leave other people's stuff alone!

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      dutchman1951posted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Yes Logic, but do it in silence, it is not necessary to incite people, advertise it on the net,  just because you can. Are they destroying their own property because they can or because they wish to put on a show. Is it Ego, or a mear innocent act.....think with Logic
      
      We have obligated ourselves to live in a  society, anything goes just because its yours is bull-crap, and down deep you know this. but you condition your mind to accept less. We are more than this....think

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         goldenpathposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         I completely agree.  Over the past hundred years this society has become apathetic, complacent and we have learned to "compromise" all those virtues and ethics our ancestors cherished and built families on.  Respect, tolerance and understanding have gone out the window and will be the foundation of our undoing.

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            dutchman1951posted 14 years agoin reply to this

            agree

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   earnestshubposted 14 years ago

   First from the bible.
   This is just a brief list, there are many many more I can think of.
   
   
   Whoever sacrifices to any god, except the Lord alone, shall be doomed.  (Exodus 22:19 NAB)
   
       They entered into a covenant to seek the Lord, the God of their fathers, with all their heart and soul; and everyone who would not seek the Lord, the God of Israel, was to be put to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman.  (2 Chronicles 15:12-13 NAB)
   
   
   If a man still prophesies, his parents, father and mother, shall say to him, "You shall not live, because you have spoken a lie in the name of the Lord."  When he prophesies, his parents, father and mother, shall thrust him through.  (Zechariah 13:3 NAB)
   
   
   Now the quoran.
   
   
   Qur’an 2:191 “...kill the disbelievers wherever we find them”
   
   Qur’an 9.33 He it is Who sent His Apostle with guidance and the religion of truth, that He might cause it to prevail over all religions.
   
   Qur’an 2:193 “And fight with them until there is no persecution, and religion should be only for Allah”
   
   Qur’an 8:71 And if they intend to act unfaithfully towards you, so indeed they acted unfaithfully towards Allah before, but He GAVE YOU MASTERY OVER THEM
   
   Qur’an 8:55 Surely the vilest of animals in Allah’s sight are those who disbelieve.
   
   

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   Jeramiposted 14 years ago

   earnestshub  wrote ....
   If a man still prophesies, his parents, father and mother, shall say to him, "You shall not live, because you have spoken a lie in the name of the Lord."  When he prophesies, his parents, father and mother, shall thrust him through.  (Zechariah 13:3 NAB)
   =====================================================
   
      Right before this   ..  is it not written that God said that he was not going to send any prophets for a period of time and that anyone that says that they are a prophet ...
   they are a false prophet???
   
      This is one way to reveal who his true messengers are.

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5. 71

   earnestshubposted 14 years ago

   From the quoran:
   
   Qur’an 8:7 “Allah wished to confirm the truth by His words: ‘Wipe the infidels (non-Muslims) out to the last.’”
   
   Any ambivalence here?
   
   From the bible:
   
   Whoever sacrifices to any god, except the Lord alone, shall be doomed.  (Exodus 22:19 NAB)
   
   They entered into a covenant to seek the Lord, the God of their fathers, with all their heart and soul; and everyone who would not seek the Lord, the God of Israel, was to be put to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman.  (2 Chronicles 15:12-13 NAB)
   
   If a man still prophesies, his parents, father and mother, shall say to him, "You shall not live, because you have spoken a lie in the name of the Lord."  When he prophesies, his parents, father and mother, shall thrust him through.  (Zechariah 13:3 NAB)
   
   
   Any ambivalent statements here?
   
   These books need no interpretation, they speak for themselves and cause war and hate.

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      goldenpathposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      So does intolerance and lack of understanding.  Without maintaining love in the heart for all good people of all faiths it's easy to dwell on the negative and see only what we want to see or look for. 
      
      I admit, on the surface I am disturbed by much of what that writing has in it, but again that is only my interpretation.  When I see the masses casting their boats toward the free nations or them arming their missiles then I'll know something went very wrong.  I the end at least I'll know that I didn't judge where it wasn't necessary.  I won't condemn a people just the actions of a people.  If their holy writ has driven them masses to extermination of others then it should be put down.

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         paarsurreyposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         Radicals on both sides; they don't see the peaceful teachings.

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         J.R. Smithposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         The NAB is well-known as not being inspired and should in no way be used to quote from.

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   raisingmeposted 14 years ago

   We might want to get consider getting our collective act together before some big kahuna burns the whole damn lot of us.  Tis time, methinks, to corral our turds!

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   christiansisterposted 13 years ago

   Jesus says to live your life in Peace and Love Forgiving all who trespass and realize it is not the person. It is Satan. Anytime we take a violent action it is us handing our will to Satan and then if we retaliate to a violent action with violence we are letting the Satan in someone else invite Satan into our actions. With this type of behaviour only Satan wins. We are called to be strong in the face of Satan and do as Jesus instructed. Forgive, be Longsuffering, Compassionate and Loving. For by these actions you will prove yourself to be a follower of Christ.

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