The belief in his own singular, separate existence, and the accompanying delusion that he is important, and his opinions matter.
That's sweet of you Zarm.
I actually only used "he" to be consistent with Mohit's question, and my separate existence is just as illusory as anyone else's.
It is part of the fascinating multi-layered complexity of life that I, and my opinions, can be both important, and not important - at the same time.
I'm with Mark on the "grain of sand" principle, really.
What I see, think, and say is not my own creation, but the gift of Universe filtered through the unique filter that is the apparently separate me.
Any value in what I say arises from the recognition you have when you hear it, and how that recognition makes you feel. It is the Universe filtering through your uniqueness that you recognise, not any personal brilliance of mine - and it is the Universe to which all credit is due, really.
Your welcome Jenny.
To a certain extent that rings true for me, as we are part and parcel of this universe, the way you express your understanding of the universe is like poetry.
I like your writing
Yes, it really is wonderful that all the world's spiritual and philosophical paths and religions (most anyway) are trying to express that concept, that there is a human me and a divine me, or a real me and an unreal me, or a lower me and a higher me, a little me and a big me, a secular citizen and a chela, a subconscious me and a conscious me, etc......or as some say a sinner and a disciple.
I guess the folly is that some don't see the similarities.
My answer to this is:
Anything else I could say would be negative.
For me Pride is thus:
Available falsifiable evidence given that contradicts assumptions and preconceived ideas and which is freely accessible and testably repeatable by anyone and everyone and then the subsequent denial of the evidence as true and demanding attention. I would include religious dogma and doctrine within that category as well, (things that are assumptive or preconceived).
"If we believe absurdities, we shall commit atrocities"
I would say the populist definition of pride is merely thinking you know better than those in perceived positions of established authority. Whether you actually know better or not is irrelavent to this populist notion.
So in other words "Let me one-up your mind because I say so". Or, "Let me one-up your mind because important people say so". Or, "Let me one-up your mind because everyone says so". Or- if they are really stupid- "Let me one-up your mind because God says so".
These are all approaches taken in populist notions of pride.
In defense of the populist notion I will say it is quite natural due to social expectations that we all have.
Natural or not, it is still logically incorrect.
Nothing wrong with a little pride. When it leads to hubris, then problems start to arise.
Funny, I see pride as:
a high or inordinate opinion of one's own dignity, importance, merit, or superiority, whether as cherished in the mind or as displayed in bearing, conduct, etc.
that is how I would define pride.
examples of pride Zarm, I don't want to take food when offered even though I am hungry because doing so makes me look needy or helpless.
That makes a starving person a fool, that he would rather starve then admitt he needs help.
I agree with gamergirl.
By this definition then I am quite proud as I have high regard for my own dignity. I would not say inordinate, but definitely a high regard for my own self worth/integrity/dignity.
Importance? Meh, I am no more important than the next person in the grand scheme of things.
Merit? That's a tricky one and not easy to answer.
Superiority? That is almost like a trick question. I have yet to meet anyone that is innately superior to anyone else, including myself.
Pride is good, as pride allows survival. Too much pride and one cannot learn, but just the right amount and one cannot be made to submit easily...
One of the most annoying as hell things on this planet is when a person verbally refuses to be pidgeon-holed into some neatly boxed up societal/cultural or religious category...
I guess I must be one of those annoying as hell people, who will fight to the death for the right of other people to be annoying as hell as well, whilst in the pursuit of their own life, liberty, and happiness.
The biggest folly men live with in my opinion is the need to kill other men when issues cannot be resolved peacefully.
Same goes for the biggest folly women live with.
The human race just isn't very good at merely "walking" away and coming back to talk later.
We suck when it comes to doing an about face and leaving the area after a failed act of diplomacy.
You will go to Heaven or Hell when you die. Out of fear of death while in God's disfavor, many think they will burn in Hell-fire-for eternity.
Out of the same misguided notion, many speak of how they know their loved-ones, are looking down, on them, form heaven or watching over them after the've died.
The life and times of Jesus Christ were are the perfect example of what we can expect and hope for after death. Other than loving one-another and being kind to each other the most important thing that Jesus shared with us was his death opening the door for mankind gift of the, Resurrection.
Bottom line, mankind can look forward to the Resurrection after death. Only 144,000, to include the 12 deciples minus Judas, the [betrayer] will go to heaven.
Those of us who are meek will inherit the earth, the very place God made for us in the first place.
Mankind going to [Heaven] or [Hell] is the biggest folly man lives with.
That's funny because I believe Tom or Mark quoted some other guy I foget his name, he said something to the effect that the biggest 'folly' of man was believing in an afterlife.
So, while they are different quotes, really they are one in the same. Maybe it really is all about being successful here first, the rest will be a suprise. If nothing happens, how you gonna know anyways?
Your "God" is the 3rd biggest folly mankind lives with.
Thats right, the 3rd biggest, not the 1st.
Read your Bible, after death you'll have to wait to be judged. It could take a while too depending on how long it takes for the earth to end and all, you know, the reading of the book of life and all that.
Why is it that so many Christians refuse to study their Bible?! Back when I was one I was studying that thing all the time. Maybe they're afraid that like me and so many others, if they read too much into it, they'll realize how silly and wrong it all is.
The best part is the 144,100, that claim cracked me up.
If they read the whole Bible and meditated on each part they probably would either A. Fry their brains like a fried egg or B. Leave x-tianity.
"Exodus 22: 29-30
Do not hold back offerings from your granaries or your vats.
"You must give me the firstborn of your sons. 30 Do the same with your cattle and your sheep. Let them stay with their mothers for seven days, but give them to me on the eighth day."
There is depth in these words you are missing out on.It means for God you must give up everything ,then you get God.I earlier said with the universe or God it goes as you conquer this universe the universe conquers you.
When do I get to see,meet God?
Whenever you really decide to,
When you want nothing.
Fair enough but I'm not getting into the philosophy of it, I'm merely arguing a technicality within the scripture and commenting on the fact that so few so-called Christians actually read and study it. If someone is going to tell me that the Bible is the authoritative word of god, they should at least know what the thing says!
An interesting story comes from the Mahabharata one of the Masterpieces of poetry composed by the sage Vyasa and written by Ganesha.
Ganeshas condition to Vyasa in order thet he write Vyasa must not falter or halt while reciting.
Vyasa condition to Ganehsa-contemplate and understand what I am saying then write thus giving him time.
Deals with Krishna and The Pandava brothers Yudhistara,Arjuna,Bhima.Nakula and Sahadeva who have been exiled from their kingdom.
In exile a brother goes to fetch water from the nearby lake and doesnt return even after some time has past. Worried another of the five brothers goes to look and even he doesnt return.
Eventually four brothers go and do not return forcing the eldest brother Yudishtara to go in search of his younger brothers.
On reaching the lake he is confronted by the lake spirit who says he has captured his youger brothers as they were unable to answer his question and he will also take him in bondage if he doesnt answer the question correctly.
The question is -What is the biggest folly man lives ?.
Yudhistara answers correctly-Mans biggest folly is that he lives life like he will never die.
Because of this his priorites in life are all warped. He postpones important things which he should be doing now.
'Mankind going to [Heaven] or [Hell] is the biggest folly man lives with.' 'Mans biggest folly is that he lives life like he will never die.'
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