If your God is Perfect than how is the Universe so Imperfect
Nature is a perfect in it's balance.. Humans aren't and we are the ones that alter what God has made.
Allah (God) is perfect and His Universe is perfect as well. If we see any imperfection then it's our lack of knowledge as we are not seeing the angle for which that imperfection is perfect. So nothing is imperfect if we see with the eye of God.
Ever crossed your mind that gods are the creation of imperfect human minds and nature has no use for any gods at all as it obvious when you gain a clearer understanding of objective reality?
Well true that I may not have crossed my mind. But whatever I thought, researched and discovered, I found that whatever comes to our mind, does exist somewhere in the universe. If God is in our mind then it does exist somewhere.
Sure? Then what about mjglgjamgt and square circles? Do they exist too?
Wow, so you think because you think it, it exists. I'm thinking of Santa right now? The tooth fairy? Purple elephants? Just because you want Got to exist doesn't mean he does. More people need to develop there critical thinking skills. Don't believe everything you're told.
Then so does Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny
Baloney. JRR Tolkien would even disagree with you on that one.
While our imaginations are boundless, the laws of physics are not.
the laws of physics are kinda like the path of rays of light.
under the right circumstances; we can bend the heck out of them.
Yes, believers do believe that of which they have no understanding and regardless of facts.
I KNEW Spiderman was real. Thanks for proving that, Jerami.
It is always good to see your bright positive attitude enter the room.
How Ya been?
Acts of God like tsunamis, kill people and we have no control.
Yes I still say that whatever comes to your mind, it does exist. It does exist somewhere in the Universe if you remove the limitations of time and space. Now I will give you just a minor example though there are millions of such examples. In our fairy tales we use to read about some magic ball in which you could see every corner of the world. Now that magic ball is on your desktop in the form of computer. This example may not satisfy you. But you have the ability to give existence to anything you think about, how much ever logicless is that.
So I gave existence to God by thinking of him? Hate to break this to you but by thinking of God all I did was give existence to my concept of God.
The paradox. hmmm. If God is perfect why do we live in a cruel world? If god is perfect then why does he need praise from us? If God can do anything can he make a rock he himself can't move? Would a God create such a cruel world? Why would God create psychopathic people?
When you remove God from the equation the entire universe make sense. Try it. Even for just a moment.
Which part of the universe do you perceive to be imperfect? Try removing energy. Once you've done that, add it back in and call it GOD.
We know very little about the universe, so I'll speak about what we do know about in our universe. Earth, we live in a cruel, sometimes painful world. The lucky ones are born smart and good looking, the unlucky ones don't make it to their first birthday. Spend some time in a children's hospital and you will understand what an imperfect world looks like. Ever watch a predator start to eat it's prey before it's dead? Animals feel pain and fear the same way we do. Ever wonder how many human succumbed to the same fate? Never mind getting preyed on by another animal, humans do it to each other.
Praying doesn't help. The hospitals are full of people praying. Cancer does not discriminate.
In a perfect world there would be no birth defects.
In a perfect world there would be no hunger.
In a perfect world there would be no cancer.
and so on.
Remove all of the imperfections and we have no incentive to learn how to eradicate disease. We have no need to attempt to find a way to stamp out hunger. We have no reason to understand the needs of the rest of life on earth. And our curiosity would be forever stunted.
Remove imperfections from the world we inhabit and we would find ourselves gluttons who selfishly use every resource at our disposal wantonly. We would have no consideration because there would be no need for concern. The world might be perfect....but the goal of caring for others would be so far removed from our collective view that it would never cross our minds
If God were perfect, the idea would be accepted accross the board, no matter it's derivation. There is no perfect God, that resides in the fallible minds of the people.
This looks more like a world nature created and not one a perfect god created. I wouldn't create a world where animals eat other animals and there certainly would not be parasites. Guinea Worms, Candiru and Ascaris infection comes to mind. Only nature could spawn such nasty creates.
That is definitely a strong possibility and one I lean toward accepting due to the obvious facts. But, if I were a god I think I'd still see the up side of setting events in motion on a similar track. If I had faith in my own creation, of course.
That's why I have no desire to go to "heaven"
I hope, if heaven exists, that it has nothing to do with endless golf courses and harp music...but it would be endless learning with purpose. Growing toward another purpose. Eternity is a a difficult concept to fathom. Without the hope of growth and change I can't see the up side.
Removing imperfection from the world would also remove our own imperfections.
Many birth defects are caused by man's own hand. People go hungry and starve because of man's inability to adequately distribute food where it is needed. Much waste, greed, and inefficiency. Cancer is being stopped. The advances that have been made over the last few decades have curtailed the number of deaths from several different kinds. That's why God gave us brains. The world is perfect. And we are perfect also. Just gettin' the bugs worked out. Even Microsoft had to do that.
The universe with or without God, is useless to us, and it is filled with deadly objects, even in our own solar system.
It is a kludge.
Radman dear, the cruelty, disabilities, diseases etc don't mean that the world is imperfect. These are created to make this universe perfect if you think. Suppose there would not be any poor then what would be there???? There would be no rich of course.... If there would be no disease then there would be no health as well. Very simply, if there would not be imperfection then how would you know the meaning of PERFECTION?
samadasiam you have a very interesting perspective on life. A world without disease, poverty and disabilities would be called heaven.
That being said, you don't need decease to have heath, you can just have health. Why would a god that loves us give us Ascaris infection or Guinea Worms (look them up) when he has already created a world without decease? The answer lies in nature and evolution. Cruelty is cruelty no matter where it comes from.
The world is imperfect because some people are resilient in deliberately and effectively spreading extremist ideology. Terrorist groups that subscribe to its ideology spread noxious ideas to gain legitimacy for their cause and make their violent acts seem acceptable.
That is how some countries cannot achieve peace, progress and prosperity (usually because they do not pledge determination to cooperate against threats through joint police and intelligence measures). That is how the world becomes imperfect.
Rad Man wrote
This looks more like a world nature created and not one a perfect god created. I wouldn't create a world where animals eat other animals and there certainly would not be parasites
Are you saying that in a perfect world eagles wouldn't eat rabbits, or owls wouldn't eat mice? or would we simply eliminate these life forms.
Every living thing on this earth is a parasite which preys upon another life form.
And every life form depends upon the parasitic nature of other life forms for its own survival.
So I think we need to think some more about "IF" that which we perceive to be a perfect would in fact suport any form of life at all.
I know I can't think of a way to create a better system.
We just need to operate, within the system we have, More efficiently !
That is exactly what I was thinking Jerami. I thought it would be a fun exercise to open a thread and see what everyone envisioned as 'the perfect world' and see how fast flaws in the design were pointed out. I don't think it gets much better than this, even with the flaws in place.
the universe is not good enough for you? and gods to blame for this? sighs.
i live in the acreage. west palm. middle of a cluster . god isnt involved
Prat Whitney more likely
Problem isn't nature. Problem isn't even religion. More like a lack of it or pure understanding of it. The problem is everybody trying to get what they can as quickly as they can before anyone else has a chance, and proceeding with every new thing before the full implications of their actions can be assesed.
Yes, religion is huge problem that accomplishes little more than create more problems.
But don't turn your back on a lion. They don't see you as special. They see meat.
I don't see myself as special either. I bleed, eat pee, and poop. Wild animals are somewhat unconcerned with me. Lived in a wilderness camp up on the Divide. Crows and I have a complicated relationship, but doves seem to like me fine. Most dogs like me, but cats are too aloof for that to extend to them.
supposed to be a comma between eat and pee.
I have to say you completely lost me. Made me laugh with the eat pee thing... but I have no idea how any of that connects to this thread.
Of Course God is Perfect! The Universe is perfect as well, what is wrong is the perception of a fallen man whose mind is faulty! Once you correct yourself by new birth then you see all is perfect.
Acts of God, as they are ironically called are not under the control of humans, and they exist to destroy and kill, along with disease and pestilence.
God has failed at everything he has done according to the bible.
He failed with the Angels, Adam and Eve....Cain.....etc
This forum is on its own, it has mutated to the point where the issue is no longer relevant.
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