White Space

1. 87

   DzyMsLizzyposted 12 years ago

   Ok, I apologize for bringing this up again, but I cannot find the original thread in which I asked, and other threads on the matter say "inactive--do not post."
   
   Sooo... MY problem seems to be the opposite of what other folks are asking about white space--they want to eliminate it.
   
   I WANT white space to be able to be forced in, for visual effect in many of my poems.  I do not want everything slammed against the left margin.
   Some of my older poems, I managed this, but something changed since then.  If I try to edit those, when I re-save the capsule, my formatting is gone, and everything is left-aligned, and I cannot get my original formatting back.
   
   I asked about this once before, and someone instructed that you could surround the formatted text with < pre > and < /pre > (minus the spaces, of course) , using the html editing section. 
   However, that doesn't work, either.  I tried it, and it is not an accepted command; it gives an error message and says the html has to be "cleaned up."
   
   
   Now, I realize full well that HP is mainly an article site, and not a poetry site.  That said, it would be appreciated if we could have the option to add extra spacebar inputs, and have those "respected."
   
   I'm not a programmer, (I learned only a teensy smattering of 'basic' back in the early 1980's), but for those who are, I do not think this would be a difficult matter, to put an "if/then" type command to maintain author-input white space.
   Pretty please?

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   1. 88

      WryLiltposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Just to be clear on what you want to do. Are you looking to do:
      
      Ex 1
      
      (Space) Poem Starts Here
      
      Ex 2
      
      (Space)
      Poem
      (Space)
      Poem
      
      There is a special formatting you can use for poetry, when in text capsule click the drop down box that says 'Format' and goto 'Preformatted' to get a look like this hub.
      
      As for an indent or space in front of the start of the line, this link may help although I don't know how many work with Hubpages.

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      1. 0

         The Writers Dogposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         Thanks, Wrylit. I was also wondering about this

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         1. 88

            WryLiltposted 12 years agoin reply to this

            

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      2. 87

         DzyMsLizzyposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         Thanks, WryLit--
            I'll look into those options when I get home from my volunteer shift at the cat /dog rescue.
         
           Your Ex 1 is close to what I want..  I sometimes do things like this:
         
         Poem starts here
         
         (space, space, space)  remainder of line 1 is here
         
         (space, space, space, space) line 2 starts here...
         
         Spaces.........................................).end of 1st stanza is here.
         
         
         .....And so forth
         
         and I do not wish to use a string of periods as I've done here.....
         
         I've experimented before with the "pre formatted" thingamabob (not on poems..but just to see what it was and what it did...) ..and all it seems to do is stretch everything out into one, long, single line that doesn't even fit within the capsule as it's being edited, so that you have to scroll across back and forth to read the entire bit you've typed in.  That didn't impress me much....

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         1. 0

            calculus-geometryposted 12 years agoin reply to this

            You can force horizontal spaces in the HTML editor by adding the character code "& # 1 6 0 ;" (without the quotes and spaces) repeatedly.  (I added spaces in there just in case this comment form turned the symbol into an actual space.)

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            1. 0

               calculus-geometryposted 12 years agoin reply to this

               Update: I just tested this out of curiousity and the extra spaces did not stick unfortunately.  I hope you do figure it out DzyMsLizzy.

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   2. 85

      Marisa Wrightposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      The HTML section has a list of allowed commands at the top of the box - nothing else is allowed.  So I'd be curious to know whether calculus-geometry's idea works.
      
      What you need is an "indent" button (which is available on Word and OpenOffice, but not on HP. 
      
      The only thing I can think of is to turn your poem into a .pdf and post an image of it.

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      1. 87

         DzyMsLizzyposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         Oh--I had not thought of that approach..  I don't really know how to use PDF.  All I know about it, is that when I find a PDF document, it irritates me, because I can do nothing with it.http://hubpages.com/forum/topic/91551#

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2. 61

   paradigmsearchposted 12 years ago

   Allowed Tags: a, blockquote, br, strong, em, u, h2, h3, h4, li, ol, p, pre, sup, sub, ul

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3. 81

   homesteadboundposted 12 years ago

   If you are just wanting to add white space, I created a couple of blank graphics that I insert for that purpose - essential white blocks of varying sizes. I insert these using the photo capsules between the text capsules or picture capsules. Would something like this work for you?

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   1. 85

      Marisa Wrightposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      I think MsLizzy is looking for a layout where each line of the poem is progressively more indented.
      
      I must confess that as a non-poet, I have trouble understanding why the layout of each line is so important to poets.  To me, if it's a good poem, I'm too busy appreciating the words to worry about how they're arranged on the page.  If it's not a good poem, a fancy layout just makes me feel the poet is trying to cover up their inadequacies with gimmicks.
      
      Adding extra spaces between the stanzas I can understand, to make them easier to read.

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         homesteadboundposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         Okay! Thanks so much!

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      2. 87

         DzyMsLizzyposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         Yes, Marisa--precisely so!

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      3. 87

         DzyMsLizzyposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         @ Marisa--
           OMG--I had an explanation all typed out, and it vanished into thin air!  Let me try again, and cross my fingers!
         
         I can understand your not understanding, but let me try to explain why this kind of spacing is important to (some) poets.  If one is writing traditional poetry, with rhyme and formal stanzas, then no, this kind of formatting is not needed.
         
         However, many of us who write "blank" or "free" verse that is not rhymed, and is more word pictures, make use of these kinds of extra line spaces and breaks to introduce significant pauses for particular emphasis.
         Note that these are not the kinds of emphases with which you need or want bold, italic or underline typeface formatting; but more akin to the "pregnant pause" that can be used when reading aloud or giving a speech.
         
         It is a long pause, much longer than a simple comma or new sentence break would accommodate.
         By breaking up the lines visually in this way, that pause is formed as the eye seeks the next line.  It does not take "hunting" for the line in a way that completely destroys the flow or train of thought, but just forces a longer pause, to emphasize the next idea, and it certainly avoids writing in a totally distracting manner of stage directions, thusly:
         
         "As she beheld the forgotten...("long wistful pause") ...bouquet..."
         
         I hope that clarifies things somewhat.
         
         
         (There are also some other fun things that you just cannot do with a computer, and that I used to have fun with back in the days of old manual typewriters...you can draw actual pictures by playing with the lines up and down to make shapes out of the words; imagine, for example, the word "pocket" written actually shaped like a pocket... it was fun.)

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         1. 85

            Marisa Wrightposted 12 years agoin reply to this

            It does, but I have to say it doesn't work for me personally.  I can't stand poets who read their poems out with long pauses!  I always feel they're trying to make ordinary words sound important by adding "significant" pauses, instead of making the effort to find more descriptive words that would've done the job on their own.  But then maybe I'm misunderstanding the whole concept of free verse.

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4. 61

   capricornrisingposted 12 years ago

   Hi Miss Lizzy - I have two clunky suggestions:
   
   1) It's not perfect, but you might try the blockquote function. Use the capsule toolbar icon that looks like a set of beginning quotes (“). That will indent a full line that has a carriage return at the end. If you want to indent further lines in from any line you have already indented, you'll need to go into the HTML screen, by clicking the HTML button all the way over to the left of the toolbar in your capsule, and type in <blockquote> at the beginning and </blockquote> at the end of any text you want to further indent. I realize this is convoluted.
   
   2) Format your text by selecting "Preformatted" in the dropdown menu that lets you choose "Paragraph" or "Header." Unfortunately, this will turn your text into a fixed-width typewriter font. But you can indent it at will. The main problem is that the editor will stop wrapping your text, so you'll want to make sure you insert carriage returns to avoid the text overlapping the right column. Finally, you'll want to view your text in a different browser to make sure it's interpreted well in all of them.
   
   Best of luck - I hope this helps! (I should probably write a hub!)

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      capricornrisingposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Whoops - re suggestion #2, I should have said to type in all your text, select it, then choose "Preformatted" from the drop down menu. Then play with it. I hope that's a little clearer.

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