Do you think or are angry against God for giving humans a rigged 'poker hand' @

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   ptosisposted 10 years ago

   Do you think or are angry against God for giving humans a rigged 'poker hand' @ Eden?
   
   I was and still angry that the "Alpha & Omega" that knows the number of hairs on my head from the 'dawn' of time before I was ever born has/had this Grand Design to have the entire scope of humanity throughout the ages fail from the start. Then I read about this and I'm wondering.  Talked about the wiki, Logical_order_of_God's_decrees
   
   Talking about Supralapsarianism  / antelapsarianism
   
   Inquiring minds want to know. So let me know you opinion on this. Thanks
   
   

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   dashingscorpioposted 10 years ago

   I tend to view the stories of the bibles as offering lessons or guidance and not as historical data. I don't believe there was a literal Garden of Eden nor do I believe Adam lived to be over 900 years old or anyone for that matter!
   I also don't believe that Samson killed (1000) men with just the jawbone of a donkey! Did they come at him one at a time? Did he take any breaks? Come on! LOL!
   Clearly the lesson here is: with a little faith you can accomplish a lot. However people insist  the bible is literal and is historical facts.

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      ptosisposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      I too believe that these are lessons and not literal. There were 2 'eves' the first was Lilith who asserted she's an equal. After she left, God gave a 'more compliant' "does what she's is told 2nd Eve" And she did what she was told. Inequality = fail

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   Dave36posted 10 years ago

   Well iv'e never read the bible but i do believe in a creator, & when people tell me i'm brainwashed for believing it doesn't sway me at all....I can only believe what i realise in life myself, & nothing from any book will convince me otherwise....I might read something from a book that gets me thinking/philosophizing, but until i have the realisation moment myself i'm still on the fence, & i can only get those realization moments from real life experiences....Now what i'd say about our creator, is that our creator is a greater knowledge than anything we can comprehend....So great in fact that 1000's of scientists/philosophers etc over 1000's of years, still can't quite put there finger on life yet, In fact they can't even define what life really is....So can you really be angry at god until you know the reason "why" we're here, & why we came here etc?....I don't think humanity was designed to fail, but humanity is failing....I think that has to do with man's ego, & not knowing who we really are....For instance do i really need wealth/fame/fortune/mansions/yachts etc, or do they only exist to tempt me away from who i really am?....I say life is a blatant test & learning curve, & that makes more sense to me than any other idea about life....I'm confused i must admit, but certainly not angry as angry is manifested by our mind only.

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      Dave36posted 10 years agoin reply to this

      I should say that when i say book, i'm not referring to the bible....What i mean't was i could read something, but that's not realising something..Seeing/doing/investigating something iv'e read would lead to realising something, but not just reading.

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   Justin Earickposted 10 years ago

   God was created in man's jealous and vengeful image so that peasants, prisoners and slaves would bow their heads and be happy with their downtrodden lives because they are told that they will have a better (after) life once they die.
   The bible tells slaves to be faithful to their masters, women to obey and submit to men, and the poor not to fret because their rewards will be in heaven. (Oh, and tells the ignorant that consumption of knowledge is what makes us all sinners.)
   Jesus was a good dude to emulate, but many "christians" only follow the old testament and eschew the teachings of christ.  Jesus never said anything about abortion, gays, or premarital sex.  Jesus said to simply love your god and love your neighbor (especially the poor) above all else. 
   Instead, I hear Paul's intense prudishness and his "don't work, don't eat" quoted (out of context, of course) ad nausea; and misunderstood interpretations of Onan's seed being spilled and Levitical ceremonial rituals.  (Jesus never said he brought a new law or covenant btw, he said specifically in Matthew 5 that he came to *fulfill* the old law. That too was Saint Paul, Galatians 5...)
   Christ isn't the problem, it's the christians who use their religion to push their own selfish agenda.

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      lone77starposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      Bunk! You speak from ignorance and blindness.
      
      You do touch on some spot of truth when you mention the selfishness of some (most?) Christians. The problem isn't religion, but Ego, and everyone was burdened with that in the Garden

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   tbHistorianposted 10 years ago

   NO, I am not angry with God for Creating the World, the woman eating of the forbidden fruit, or permitting humans to rule the earth while physically walking it.
   Through the path of the righteous, the entire scope of humanity throughout the ages strives for innovation leading to better physical and emotional stability.
   Some will argue with this, but God has stated that positive actions will always result in positive outcomes, while negative actions will result in negative outcomes.
   The decision for each path is based within the individual following it.

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      Dave36posted 10 years agoin reply to this

      I agree buddy the decision for each path is based within us, we know what we should be doing for ourselves & others, & we all know the difference between right & wrong..It's a question of will power, & we won't ever get that until we

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      Justin Earickposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      Good trees bear good fruit, bad fruit only from bad trees.
      How about consensual homosexual relationships? No good can come from a homosexual pretending to be content in a hetero-normative relationship which cannot be satisfactory by very definition.

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      Dave36posted 10 years agoin reply to this

      Exactly so if that person feels in their heart it's what they want, then they are right..The homosexual would be lying to himself, if he was with a woman so he should use his free will to choose..He shouldn't be bothered what "other" people think.

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      tbHistorianposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      Dave36 - you hit the nail on the head. The individual must choose their path. If that path is truth then positive good is the reward. But when that path is lies, then negative is the result.  Pretending bad is good is in reality a lie.

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      Dave36posted 10 years agoin reply to this

      Your right tbHistorian about positivity, & if a person puts nothing but positivity out there..They'l start getting it back, but from different sources than the "causes" would suggest they should..Only, if their doing it for the right reasons thou

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      ptosisposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      f there can be objective morality without a God (and there can), then there can be an objective morality with a God. It just wouldn't be subject to God's will. God would be subject to it.e

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   grand old ladyposted 10 years ago

   Don't agree with it. I do believe what the Bible says in Genesis. We had this Garden of Eden and Eve listened to the snake. It is what it is. But maybe, man is really fundamentally a creature of free will and making a choice like that may have been part of our own natural unraveling. I enjoy free will on earth as I am today. I enjoy choice, and feel lucky to live in the Philippines where free will is respected as opposed to societies that don't have free will. I've lived under Martial Law when Marcos ruled the country for 20 years and we had no free press and all that shit, and free will is a good, thing, believe me.

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      grand old ladyposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      To clarify, don't agree with the wiki chart.

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      Justin Earickposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      Good job ignoring the subject at hand and moving on to your testimonial.  Nice effort.  Unfortunately, christianity does not allow free will (assuming you have an interest in what we call "heaven").  Sorry to disappoint.

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      grand old ladyposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      Justin Earick, didn't ignore the subject, I clearly said I don't agree with the Wiki Chart. Agenda suspicions like yours are the musings of conspiracy theorists.

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      ptosisposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      I believe in Free Will - I must. - http://hub.me/a63En

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      Justin Earickposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      I didn't bother with Supralapsarianism because its mumbo jumbo. So she is asking - why be good if my fate is decided before conception? Seeing people twist themselves in knots to satisfy their imaginary friends is quite amazing to me.

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      Justin Earickposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      I was answering the first and more important part of the ?. Why would god create a world where horrible things happen to his people?
      The answer is that he didn't. We created him to control other people with the fear of what happens when we die.

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      grand old ladyposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      Seem you have an agenda after all, which is to postulate your own opinion. No prob, anyone who answers this has the similar intention of saying what they think. Even the question poses its own opinion within the question.  I ramble.

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   lone77starposted 10 years ago

   No, God did not rig the hand we were dealt. That's a misconception of ego and ignorance (ego = ignorance = selfishness = separateness).
   
   First off, Eden was a non-physical "place." We sometimes call it Heaven.
   
   Read Ezekiel 18:18–20 and ask yourself about us paying for the sins of Adam and Eve. Feel any cognitive dissonance? The solution to that disparity in concepts is that we were the ones in the Garden. "Adam" was merely a symbol for part of us.
   
   The product (fruit) of Good-Evil are the dichotomies of Ego. Ego was the blindfold which gave us spiritual darkness. That darkness is what made it necessary for the creation of Homo sapiens so that we would have a method for our escape. If you don't understand this, then imagine balancing your checkbook or solving calculus derivatives in your sleep. Impossible. Get the picture? "Life" as described in the Bible is all about "continuity of consciousness." Everlasting life is the return to continuity of consciousness in spirit, rather than in the meat body brain of Homo sapiens.
   
   Turning away from God -- becoming separate -- choosing Ego -- that was our doing. Get a spine, man! Take some responsibility. It was your doing, just as it was mine. We did it to ourselves.
   
   The loving Heavenly Father merely mounted a rescue mission eons ago. Now, it's almost done, and most don't seem to be making it. Many don't even care. They think they are their human bodies -- or worse, their egos.
   
   But ego is the problem and the barrier. You created your ego many millennia ago. Stop whining and take responsibility for it.

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