Bill Gates donate 4.6 billion worth of stock

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   jackclee lmposted 7 years ago

   What do you think of Bill Gates announcing he is giving 4.6 billion of Stock to charity?
   He is worth 90 billion and has created  the Gates Foundation which has been helping with health and education around the world. He is one of the proponent of Common Core in the US publication system.

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      Glenis Rixposted 7 years agoin reply to this

      So that still leaves him with 85.4 billion to play with? Nobody needs that much money. I am pleased to see that he has made a huge donation. Perhaps sometime in the future he will consider giving more.

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         jackclee lmposted 7 years agoin reply to this

         I don't think you realize how this works.
         Bill Gates may be the richest man in the world but that does not mean he has billions sitting around his house...
         These assets are stocks he own in Microsoft...
         These stocks are traded everyday and can go up and down...
         He can donate the stocks which then get sold in the open market to raise the funds for his charities...

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            Will Apseposted 7 years agoin reply to this

            The notion that there is more to life than making money is still hard for many.
            
            The interesting thing is that you can trace back the whole accumulation of wealth thing through western civilization (which is obviously not all of civilization, but still interesting) if you want to.
            
            Did you know that in Dante's Inferno, usurers (those who lent  money, like bankers) were consigned to the 7th circle of hell?
            
            This included murderers, suicides, blasphemers and sodomites.
            
            The usurers were condemned to constantly move their hands, because in life they had done no useful work.

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               jackclee lmposted 7 years agoin reply to this

               What's your point? Is profit bad in your opinion?
               Did Bill Gates created Microsoft and earn billions-- is that a good or bad thing?
               Did people pay their hard earned money to buy Microsoft products or were they compelled?
               The charity work bill gates involved with in his later years pales compared to the good he has done for society in my opinion.

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                  Will Apseposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                  The point is, if you are completely sunk in the present value system you have no way of understanding what that system is.
                  
                  In this case, almost any belief system that is not entirely a product of capitalism will help you to understand what capitalism is. And whether it has value.
                  
                  Bill Gates is an interesting example of a man born outside the world that he currently finds himself in.
                  
                  I can see that he irks you. But I am still trying to understand why.

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                     jackclee lmposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                     I dislike Bill Gates for what he did to obtain his wealth...
                     I wrote about it in my memoir or auto biography...
                     It is too detailed to describe here.
                     
                     I almost see it as the Godfather movie... where at the end, michael corleone was treated as an upstanding citizen, contribution to the vatican...and yet made his fortune by being a thug and a killer...
                     In a way, he was atoning for his sins by donation his wealth.
                     
                     Bill Gates was a ruthless businessman and many will atest to it.
                     He did not make it fairly in a free market capitalism system.
                     For that reason. His charity work will always be tainted in my mind. I can't help it.

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                        Will Apseposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                        So America allowed Bill Gates to acquire vast wealth in an unjust way?

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                           jackclee lmposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                           Yes and no... He was shrewd and skirted the law.  We have laws on the books but were not sufficient to deal with him...
                           For example, he was sued by IBM regarding the whole OS/2 debacle, he lost in court years later and had to a pay hundreds of million in damages. But guess what, he made billions with Windows... so he won even though he clearly lost the legal case.

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                              jackclee lmposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                              by the way, I am for capitalism. I have no issues with Steve Jobs and Apple. They created wonderful products people are willing to buy. End of story.

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                                 Will Apseposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                                 Steve Jobs ensured that no Apple products were made in the US. He is an icon for offshoring. And now Foxcon is well past needing US investment.
                                 
                                 Are you picking the right hero here? And is hero worship in anyway meaningful?

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                                    jackclee lmposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                                    No hero picking...
                                    Just stating the facts.
                                    There is no problem with outsourcing when it makes sense.
                                    If Apple build the iPhone in the US, it would cost three times the current amount...
                                    What doesn't make sense is to outsource jobs that Americans can do better here, like IT support or accounting... or increase H1B visa so foreigners can be hired to do jobs americans can do like what the Disney company did...

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                                       Will Apseposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                                       You are not really a Trump style nationalist, then? More of a globalist?

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                                          jackclee lmposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                                          Why do you think that?
                                          I am for a strong country consisting of language, borders and culture. A strong country is what keep the world safe from tyranny.

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                                             Will Apseposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                                             You picked a loser in Trump if you believe those things.
                                             
                                             Going back a little, I have a feeling that you dislike Gates because he is a do-gooder.  He is not hoarding his wealth, he is not going to create a dynasty by leaving vast wealth to his children, he is donating almost all of his money to good causes, like the fight against malaria in Africa.
                                             
                                             Steve Jobs, on the other hand, was notorious for his lack of charitable giving.
                                             
                                             I sense that for you and many rightwingers, the very act of giving is a kind of sin. The act of helping others seems to be a sort of crime against the free market.

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                                                jackclee lmposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                                                That is where you are wrong on many counts. I did not support Trump or voted for him.
                                                If you been following my posts, you would know that.
                                                As a conservative, I value private charities over government handouts and entitlements...
                                                The problem with Gates is that his charities has not done very much good and in fact, I may add, has contributed to the decline in American public education system. He supported common core ... need I say more.
                                                
                                                His many other charitable acts relating to the Gates Foundation may have done some good in the area of improved health in third world nations...
                                                However, as many large private foundations, too much is spent on administration and the middleman and not enough is going to the people themselves...
                                                
                                                As I said, his charitable giving may also be his way of paying back for his sins...only he and God knows.
                                                
                                                I realize Jobs may not be the perfect manager or boss, however, he had the vision and the insight to know what people want in a product. That is his genius. He build a great company Apple and his company stocks and wealth generated has benefited many more people than Gates ever will.

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                                                   Will Apseposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                                                   As I said, there are always good reasons to condemn those who believe in public service or helping others.
                                                   
                                                   And always plenty of reasons to applaud selfishness.
                                                   
                                                   Still trying to burrow into this mindset.
                                                   
                                                   It seems to be based around a fear of acknowledging ones own vulnerability. And a horror of remembering that one was once entirely dependent on others. Or some such thing. Then amplified through various rightwing ideologies, like the weak must go to the wall, social Darwinism etc etc.
                                                   
                                                   Help me out. Tell me why those too poor to afford healthcare in the US deserve to die?

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                                                      Marisa Wrightposted 7 years agoin reply to this

                                                      Will, we often cross swords but on this subject, we agree 100%

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            Glenis Rixposted 7 years agoin reply to this

            I feel this is a rather condescending remark. Speaking personally, I have a university degree in Business and Finance and a post graduate certificate in management studies, so I am well aware of how it works.

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               jackclee lmposted 7 years agoin reply to this

               I am sorry. I didn't mean to be condecending...
               Just your remark seems to show a lack of understanding of wealth.
               He is worth 90 billion on paper. If the market goes through a correction like we had in 2008, he can easily lose 40 percent or more of his wealth...on paper.

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   William F. Torpeyposted 7 years ago

   Poor guy is down to his last $86.4 billion. Maybe we should take up a collection for him?

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   Marisa Wrightposted 7 years ago

   I'm glad to see it.   There comes a point where you really don't need any more money.   Some people just keep on amassing and amassing wealth for the sake of it, when they could never hope to spend it in their lifetime or even in their children's lifetime. 
   
   He is taking the very sensible view that it's more important to ensure the longevity of civilisation by using his money for the good of all.

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      jackclee lmposted 7 years agoin reply to this

      You are thinking about this in a wrong way. It is not bad for Bill Gates to build a company like Microsoft and in the process became super rich... you are missing the fact that millions of people profitted from his corporation. In terms of people using his products to be more productive...in terms of investors in stock that made profits, employees that made a good living working at this company... the city of Seattle benefiting from the Microsoft presence...
      
      The debate is what is the best way for Gates to share his wealth?
      
      Some here on HP have commented that he could donate more of it to help poor people...
      Or he could reinvest it and get more returns to help society in this intangeble way...
      Which is more effective?
      
      Think of it this way, suppose Gates having made his first billion dollar back in 1990s decided to sell his company, cash our and donated the bulk of it and retire early and have a great live...
      
      Or by doing what he did, amassed a much bigger fortune and is now able to donate much more to give back...
      For those who critcize capitalism, for all the greed and the abuses...missed the fact that capitalism is what got us the wealth in the first place. It is the golden goose that keeps laying the egg...

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   William F. Torpeyposted 7 years ago

   It's very sad that so many gullible people swallow the capitalism line. Under capitalism "the few" inevitably wind up with virtually all the wealth (That's why there are so many poor people and "middle class" people who falsely think they're doing "great" with the moderate amount they are able to accumulate. There is nothing wrong with making money under the capitalist system, but the game is rigged. The laws of incorporation give the business leaders "huge" advantages. By way of mergers and acquisitions corporations become so large that they are truly monopolies -- but they are so wealthy that they control our politicians largely by way of campaign contributions (They donate to both sides (Democrats and Republicans.) Politicians must rely on their contributions for re-election (which means the politicians must kow tow to them on important issues.) Because the corporations are required to put their stockholders first before all else they virtually "must" show increased earnings every quarter (or their stock prices will suffer along with the remuneration to board members and officers.) This results in corporations having to either increase prices or cut labor and other costs. All of this means that stockholders (like Bill Gates and others) gain more and more wealth virtually every three months. Thus stockholders end up making huge amounts of money -- which really means the corporations prices end up being too high and their labor is being remunerated at a far too low rate. Bottom line: The wealth of Bill Gates and others comes at the expense of the underpaid workers and over-priced products. (In plain English: Workers get the shaft.)

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      jackclee lmposted 7 years agoin reply to this

      There is nothing to swallow. The proof is in the results...
      The per capita income of Capitalistic nations are much higher than other types...
      The wealth pie is bigger and more to go around.

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   William F. Torpeyposted 7 years ago

   The pie may be bigger, but it's hogged by a tiny minority of investors. The large majority of Americans have to share the crumbs that fall off the table.

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