Inform Hubber why a Hub was flagged

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   SandCastlesposted 11 years ago

   I think it is vital that when someone flags your hub you are told who did it and why.
   
   If someone complained about you at work, protocol dictates that the person is supposed to go to you first and let you know that they are having a problem with you. They shouldn't just complain to the boss about you. Complaining behind someone's back seems cowardly to me. Why would the person want to hide their identity? If the person retaliated and flagged the flaggers hub, they would not be able to do it anonymously either.

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      psycheskinnerposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      I disagree for the reason that I don't want angry hubbers harassing me just from pointing out what I see as problems with their hubs.
      
      Flags just draw the hub staff member's attention, they make the decision.  So if the hubber disagrees, he/she needs to talk to the staff member.

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         SandCastlesposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         But wouldn't it be more helpful to write a comment to the hubber first before you flag their hub?
         
         A few people did tell me that when people 'over' flag, moderators begin to look at them just like on youtube if someone flags too many youtube videos.

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            psycheskinnerposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            The only opinion about the hub that matters is that of the staff member that unpublishes it.  Hearing from random people who hit the flag button is probably just going to cause confusion.

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               SandCastlesposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               True, but I think people who get carried hitting the flag button, especially when the criticisms are unfounded, are also monitored.

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                  SandCastlesposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                  True, the staff members are the ones that unpublish the hub but I disagree that random people's opinions do not matter. If other people's opinions didn't matter there wouldn't be a comment section.

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                     tussinposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                     I think what psycheskinner is trying to say is that *ultimately* it is only the staff's opinion that matters.  In case you're worried about people flagging without reason, staff will not unpublish a good hub that gets flagged by someone with a grudge. But moderators will unpublish something that gets enough legit flags.
                     
                     The comments section is independent of the flagging system.  Some people actually do leave comments pointing out errors and problems with the hubs, but the only way to get staff to look at a problematic hub is through the flagging system.

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                        SandCastlesposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                        Thank you for you comments tussin.
                        
                        I think leaving feedback is better than simply flagging someone unless the hub is really offensive. If opinions are constructive, people are not likely to retaliate. It's best to leave feedback and suggestions on hubs rather than simply flagging them.
                        
                        Things should be up front and out in the open. If your article is flagged, you should be informed. People who like flagging anonymously seem like cowards to me.

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                           wildernessposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                           I think you are confusing feedback and flagging.  Feedback is provided to the hubber to let him know what people think about the hub.  It is virtually worthless, as few will click a thumbs down and when they do there is no way to leave a message as to why it was done.  Poor quality, disagree with conclusions, incorrect facts, using quotes without indicating so, whatever.
                           
                           Flagging on the other hand is a tool to let the moderators know that you believe there is a violation of HP TOS or rules associated with the hub.  It has nothing to do with what is actually said or conclusions drawn, just with following the rules of HP.  As few hubbers are completely familiar with the rules all a flag does is notify the moderators that there MAY be a rule violation. 
                           
                           Given that, it is in the best interests of all hubbers to flag any and all hubs that they believe violate the policies and rules of HP; those rules are put into place to make the site a better place to write and need to be followed.  If the flagger is wrong there is no damage and no need for the writer to ever know.  If they are right and there IS a violation, the moderators will inform the writer of that, but there is still no reason to tell that writer just who found the violation first.  All that matters is that there is a violation that needs correction.

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                     SandCastlesposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                     Cyber-bullying flourishes because people are anonymous.

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      tussinposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      Where is this protocol codified?  I do not know of any workplace where employees are expected to confront their coworkers about a problem before notifying the boss about it. 
      
      Regarding the flagging of hubs, the whole point of the anonymous flagging system is relieve readers of the pressure of confronting authors about their substandard work and to prevent retaliatory action.

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         SandCastlesposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         In many work places that is the protocol. It is cowardly to just go behind someone's back and tell on them.
         
         Why would a person fear retaliatory action? What can the person do besides flagging your hub? The staff still makes the final decision.

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            psycheskinnerposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            I don't know of a workplace where i couldn't go straight to the boss and have them handle it as discretely as required. That's the bosses job.
            
            Sometimes i will try and work it our with a peer, sometimes I go to the boss--as I see fit.  It's the same with comments versus flags.  People use the option they think best applies.
            
            For example: if I see a page of explicit barely legal porn I don't politely ask the hubber to remove the offending beaver shots, I flag it. And when I do so I do not want my information given to the hubber.
            
            No one compulsory feedback system will cover all situations.

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               SandCastlesposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               Exactly, if the hub is offensive or evil, you flag it. But you don't flag a hub for a spelling mistake, you write a comment.
               
               In most job situations, if you complain about someone, you will eventually have to face them to work out the situation. In most situations, grown ups can handle problems without running to the boss to tell. Let's face it, some people are tattle tales that constantly run to the boss for every little thing rather than having the guts to talk to someone face to face.
               
               In some cases, you have to complain anonymously (if the person has more power and can harm you) but in most cases a person could talk directly to someone.  That's the honorable way.
               
               Even in the bible it says in Matthew 18:
               
               Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his of fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother.
               
               16 But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.
               
               17 And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church...
               
               I'm not pushing religion on anybody; it's just another example of protocol.

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                  kathleenkatposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                  Seriously, where do you work? Because if it's a problem with their work quality that I am complaining to their supervisor about, I would not be the one facing them to work it out...it would be their supervisor. And eventually, a cardboard box full of their office trinkets, if their work continues to not meet the expectations of the establishment.
                  
                  Most people are at work, to produce work. They don't have some personal agenda to ruin somebody's reputation. In a workplace, you worry about the work. Is the person not producing quality work? Not your job to discipline them. It's their supervisor's job. Most people can separate personal feelings from work, and what needs to be done, and at what quality.

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                     Millionaire Tipsposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                     It is common courtesy to bring up an issue directly with the person.  Only if that person doesn't respond, then I would go over their head to discuss it with the supervisor.  I wouldn't want my coworkers tattling to the supervisor about things that bother them without giving me a chance to fix or explain it.
                     
                     Flagging is different though - since the person flagging could be wrong and there really wasn't a  violation.  If I told the Hubber that they weren't allowed to write about a particular topic, and they were, that Hubber may stop writing about the topic or stop writing altogether because of incorrect information I gave him.  It really is better to get the information from the moderators so the rules are consistent and clear.

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      kathleenkatposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      Where do you work? That's odd. In my experience, if you have a problem with someone on another team, you go to the leader of that team. The leader of that team would see you as undermining their authority by not addressing the problem with them first.
      
      Also, this is the internet. Anonymous critique is to be expected. And Hubpages tells you why Hubs were identified as needing editing, or removed. This is a lot more than other sites, as it helps you address your writing and improve upon it.

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         SandCastlesposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         Yes, constructive comments are welcome.

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      SandCastlesposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      Maybe some people prefer to be flagged; I never thought of that. Thanks for all the feed back everyone!  If people want to be flagged they should say so in their profile. Maybe for some it is better than comments.

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      Marisa Wrightposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      Why?  A flag is not a complaint about a person, and it's not personal.   It's more like referring a document to an auditor, so that auditor can determine its accuracy and compliance with company rules.  And it's much better to refer the document to the auditor than for me to advise the author myself - because after all, I might be wrong.
      
      If someone flags your Hub, all that happens is that it's placed in a queue for a moderator to look at.   The moderator then assesses the Hub to make sure it complies with HubPages' rules.   
      
      If the flag is not justified, e.g. if someone has flagged for ideological reasons or for a few spelling mistakes, the moderator cancels the flag and nothing happens - you don't even know it's been flagged. 
      
      If the flag is justified, then you will get a warning or the Hub will be unpublished.  And in that case, you should be grateful to the person who noticed you were breaking HubPages TOS - because they probably protected you from losing your Adsense account.

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         SandCastlesposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         Thank you. Good points.

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         relacheposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         This is an excellent description of how flagging and moderation works.

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   HoneyBBposted 11 years ago

   When I first joined HubPages I thought that if I flagged a hub it would keep it in a list for me to go back to easily. Kind of like email...I had no idea it would be telling somebody that it was bad...I don't know if I flagged any. I hope not.

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      SandCastlesposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      Really! That's an honest mistake though
      
      I'm sensitive to people complaining behind my back. I'd rather let a  person know about a problem than tell on them. It's so Nazi mentality to me.
      
      Thanks for your reply.

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         HoneyBBposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         I know it's an honest mistake but it worries me that others may make the same mistake when they start out. Maybe they should give it a different name so beginning don't click it thinking they are saving it. I think I may have flagged a few of my own when I started....lol!

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            SandCastlesposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            Good Points HoneyBB 

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            wildernessposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            The worst thing that could happen with your excessive "flagging" (as in bookmarking) is that your name would then be put on a list of flaggers to ignore.  Your flags were obviously mostly wrong - there's nothing wrong with the hub - and the moderators won't pay much attention to your flags as a result.
            
            Not something to worry about. 
            
            That's something I'd never thought of, though.  I'll bet they see a fair number of newbies "bookmarking" the hubs they like by flagging them.  It actually makes sense, and that's never a good thing!

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               SandCastlesposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               Thanks wilderness for your comments. That sounds like a good idea for excessive flaggers to be put on the 'ignore' list.

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                  wildernessposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                  My understanding is that they definitely are, just as hubbers that produce only correct flags are given priority in looking at what they've flagged.  It's a time saver both ways for HP, and one way to prioritize what the moderators will look at next.

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      Millionaire Tipsposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      I doubt very much that you did this.  When you press the flag, you have to indicate the reason for flagging the hub.  When you see those, you would understand that they are for alerting the moderators, and not to bookmark them.

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   psycheskinnerposted 11 years ago

   If someone flags a hub for one spelling mistake or ideological reasons all that will happen is their flags will start to be ignored.
   
   And what is honorable depend on a person's own ethical structures. My opinion is that of a hub breaks the rules, I flag it. And that's perfectly honorable whether I do it to someone else or they do it to me.  We all need to follow the rules.
   
   It isn't personal. What I am doing is not different to what the automated duplicate detector is doing and you would not expect to have a conversation with it.

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   brakel2posted 11 years ago

   The only people I have ever flagged is a person who wrote like a third grader and people who are spammers. They were abvious. When you flag someone, a list of reasons for flagging come up which have to to with rules violations. You might look over some hubs and see if you see any rules violations to get a good overview of flagging.

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