Poll: What matters more to you?

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   JaxsonRaineposted 11 years ago

   If possible, please label yourself as conservative/moderate/liberal.
   
   What is more important to you? The amount of money you earn, or the 'class' you are in?
   
   To explain, let's say there are two countries, and you can choose which situation to live in.
   
   In Country A, you can earn $100,000/year, and be in the top 30% by income.
   In Country B, you can earn $50,000/year, and be in the top 10% by income.
   
   Dollars are worth the same in each country, and will buy the same amount of stuff. Which would you take? More money, or better social standing?
   
   Moderate-Conservative : More money.

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      Mighty Momposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      Who the heck looks at themselves as being in some imaginary percent "class" of income? That's a fake construct.
      Are you a 99%er or a 1%er?
      Are you a 53er or a 47%er?
      
      Seriously. Who ever thought of these things?
      
      
      If this is the sole criteria to decide which country to live in, I would have to go with:
      
      Country A.
      I have twice as much money.
      I don't care how many other people in my country also have that amount of money!
      
      Labeling: More moderate than some might think.

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         JaxsonRaineposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         I agree with you MM, but there are some on HP who have made the case that they prefer Country B...

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            Mighty Momposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            On what basis?
            Apples to apples, what is the benefit of living in country B?
            There is no information here on relative quality of life.
            And I have a hard time believing that those who I imagine are in the Country B camp are social snobs.
            What am I missing here?
            Are you trying to trick me?
            You are trying to trick me so I will blow my own cover!

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               JaxsonRaineposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               You already blew your cover! I'm not going to tell you how though!
               
               
               
               Seriously though, yes people have argued that on the basis that being among the 'elite' gives you more political power, and the social standing apparently strokes egos. Hopefully some of them will weigh in(I don't remember, but either Josak or John Holden have argued such).
               
               But, this also applies to people who think that relative income mobility is an important measure to look at. It's harder to move relative to the wealthiest in America because they are so freaking rich, than in some other countries. But, we still have a very nice absolute mobility... More people(probably because they don't understand what they are really saying) argue that we would be better off if we were more like other countries with higher mobility.

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         JaxsonRaineposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         I think MM is a tea-party plant trying to pass herself off as a moderate-liberal!
         
         The jig is up!

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            Mighty Momposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            Now that I'm making $100,000 I can afford to pay you more not to blow my clever disguise.
            Shhhhhhhhh!
            

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               JaxsonRaineposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               Suh-weet!
               
               I demand $35,000.03 per year.

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                  Mighty Momposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                  
                  
                  Here's the first installment. Take an IOU for the rest?
                  Wait, though. Why am I paying you hush money to keep a secret that's already out?
                  

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                     JaxsonRaineposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                     Deal.
                     
                     We can just pretend that I'm a loon and don't really have the evidence that I have... yeah, that's it.
                     
                     And then we can quickly release an ad attacking the other guy to make people forget all about it.
                     
                     GO!

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   PrettyPantherposted 11 years ago

   Your example is unrealistic.  It is highly unlikely that dollars would buy the same stuff in two different countries where $50,000 is in the top 10% and $100,000 is in the top 30%.  But, just for the sake of argument, let's say that's true
   
   Being in the top 10% of income would enable a person to have more power and influence over the direction of local, regional, and national policies, by virtue of being able to proportionally pour the most money into people and organizations that would benefit them personally.  That is what income inequality is all about:   power and influence.

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      JaxsonRaineposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      So... you would choose Country B?

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         PrettyPantherposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         I would never make a choice based solely on money, so I can't answer that question.

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            JaxsonRaineposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            Well, with everything else equal... You get everything else you want in either situation.
            
            The question is, what do you care more about? Money, or what percentile you are in?

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               PrettyPantherposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               Well, if I get everything else I want, then the money wouldn't matter.  Again, your example is unrealistic so making a choice of one over the other is meaningless in the real world.

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                  JaxsonRaineposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                  It's not really meaningless, unless you care exactly the same about money as you do percentile.
                  
                  Most people care about the two differently.
                  
                  I dunno, it just seems like you're being difficult for no good reason. I didn't mean you have everything you want, I just meant that the scenarios are the same. So if it's important for you to live in a country with strong social programs, they both have strong social programs.
                  
                  The difference is the money you have, and where you stand among income earners. If you can't make a decision based on money, would you not care at all whether you live in Country A, Country B, or Country C(where you make no money)?

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                     PrettyPantherposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                     Money is simply a means to an end.  If everything is EXACTLY equal in both scenarios, then I would choose the top 10% because then I would have more influence over things that affect the livability of my community.

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                        JaxsonRaineposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                        Everything except for money, and percentage.
                        
                        When I say the money you earn is different, it can be assumed that you have a difference in everything related to money(what you can buy).
                        
                        Like I said, it seems like you are just trying to be difficult... common sense wouldn't imply that a discussion about different incomes assumes that everyone has the exact same things.

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   psycheskinnerposted 11 years ago

   Who care what percentile they are in?
   
   That's not even how "class" is determined, It has more to do with access to exclusive events, wielding political power and other cultural things.

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      JaxsonRaineposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      You'd be surprised.

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   Sally's Troveposted 11 years ago

   ho hum

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   JaxsonRaineposted 11 years ago

   So, two things PP
   
   1 - If money doesn't matter, would you be just as happy living in Country C with no income?
   
   2 - If money doesn't matter, do you not care about food, clothing, electronics, or other assets?

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      PrettyPantherposted 11 years agoin reply to this

      I never said money doesn't matter.  I said I would never base a decision solely on money.  BIG difference.
      
      Also, I am not trying to be difficult; I answered your question.  I would choose to be in the top 10% for the greater influence, even though I would have a lesser ability to buy material items.

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         JaxsonRaineposted 11 years agoin reply to this

         Yet, the original scenario makes it clear that money/percentile is the only deciding factor different between the two situations.
         
         Thanks though, I thought you meant you would pick the 10% over more money if everything was the same(like how much wealth you had).

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            PrettyPantherposted 11 years agoin reply to this

            By "everything the same" I meant quality of life things like community, amenities, access to art, etc.

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               JaxsonRaineposted 11 years agoin reply to this

               Well, basically.
               
               You wouldn't live in as nice of a community in Country B, having less wealth. Or if you did, you would have less space...
               
               But yeah, all deciding factors other than money are the same. That's the whole point of trying to decide which of two things is more important.

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                  Mighty Momposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                  But ... Am I entitled to any entitlement programs in either country?
                  
                  Sorry, J.
                  I just could not resist that one, after seeing you pounded just now.

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                     JaxsonRaineposted 11 years agoin reply to this

                     ?o.O?
                     
                     (ignore my right ear, it's been inverted since birth)
                     
                     NO ENTITLEMENTS FOR YOU! NEXT!
                     
                     

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   kathleenkatposted 11 years ago

   More money.
   
   Don't label myself.

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