American Health Care Debate

1. 67

   TimTurnerposted 14 years ago

   Andrew, thats the problem with Obama's plan...it's not free.
   
   We would still pay for insurance.  It's not a universal plan like in Europe.
   
   17 million Americans still won't have medical coverage with Obama's plan.
   
   If Obama wanted to make it universal and raise our taxes to get it, I'm all for it.  But that's not the plan.
   
   Obama's plan and what you guys have in Europe are no where near the same.
   
   We would still have to make monthly payments for insurance.  If you are one of the 17 million without insurance, then you don't get medical coverage.

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2. 67

   TimTurnerposted 14 years ago

   And Obama has promised not to raise taxes on the middle class to pay for it.  None of it makes sense.
   
   $900 billion is a ton of money but no new taxes.  Hmmmm....

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   1. 60

      Pr0metheusposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      He'll probably raise them for the upper class...
      
      Either way this post is ridiculous.  No health care is free.

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      1. 67

         TimTurnerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         Well, taxes are looked upon differently in Europe.  I lived in Germany for 3 years and they are taxed like crazy but no one ever complains because of the things they get out of it that seem "free."
         
         In Germany, there are no TV commercials because everyone pays a flat monthly tax to pay for the stations.  You can't option out of the tax.  Everyone just pays it and everyone has "free", commercial-free TV.
         
         No one complains.
         
         You could never do that in the U.S.

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         1. 69

            Jeffrey Nealposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            Why would you even want to?

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            1. 60

               Pr0metheusposted 14 years agoin reply to this

               Seriously....  Commercials give me pee breaks, and when I don't want to watch them I've got TiVo.
               
               Nothing worth having in life is free, but we can attempt to minimize the costs.

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            2. 56

               Rosa Bergerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

               Because in America we pay high cable fees and have to be bothered by commercials. It should be one or the other, but not both.

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         2. 69

            ledefensetechposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            Just because the Germans have been duped into believing you can get something for "free" that doesn't mean we have to get taken in by the same nonsense.  Oh, by the way, when was the last time you saw a German syndicated show playing on stations around the world?  When was the last time you saw American syndicated shows playing on stations around the world?  I wonder why there is a difference?

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            1. 67

               TimTurnerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

               Whoa Whoa Whoa....I was explaining why the original poster (Andrew, who's English) was using the term "free."
               
               Europeans are taxed and everything is included so it seems like it's "free" to them.
               
               That was my point!

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               1. 69

                  ledefensetechposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                  That wasn't necessarily an attack against you.  I just wanted to illustrate the difference in quality you get when you have something that is subsidized or run by the government versus those run by the free market.

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            2. 79

               Sufidreamerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

               Because it's in German?
               
               Actually, we do get some here, with subtitles.
               
               Maybe the BBC is a better example - plenty of syndicated shows.

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               1. 69

                  ledefensetechposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                  Sure, but I think the BBC is somewhat influenced by the free market.  I'll have to look into it more, I suppose.

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                  1. 79

                     Sufidreamerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                     Paid for by license fees.
                     
                     I think that some of the problem is that English speakers are not very keen on subtitles or dubbing. Greeks are brought up with it, so it comes naturally to them - with a few notable exceptions, Greek TV is pretty dire anyway

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3. 69

   Jeffrey Nealposted 14 years ago

   Just a correction:  Paying higher taxes to get government provided healthcare = not free.  You ARE paying for it.  I don't think any of those countries you listed have *free* healthcare.
   
   This is the problem with the debate in the US, is too many people think it is going to be free.  Either you pay for care as needed, and get insurance for the big stuff, or you agree to pay much higher taxes to fund a plan (the proposed plan doesn't even claim to cover everyone).
   
   No having the cake and eating to.
   
   Employer-based coverage and the thinking that we need first-dollar coverage is the reason this is so complicated and why it's not likely to be easily fixed, no matter what gets passed. 
   
   I don't buy insurance for my car to put gas in it or for flat tire repair, it is for the big accidents.  Heath insurance, in my opinion, should be the same.

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   1. 69

      ledefensetechposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Thank you, someone else who gets it.  It's about supply and demand.  There are way too many barriers to entry as concerns the health field in this country.  From limiting the number of doctors who can practice to giving drug companies monopolies, healthcare providers get a sweetheart deal from federal and state governments.  Before we continue to screw things up even more, we might want to consider getting rid of most of the red tape first.

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4. 94

   habeeposted 14 years ago

   Occasionally, the commercials are better than the show!

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   1. 69

      ledefensetechposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      During the Superbowl maybe.

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5. 0

   A Texanposted 14 years ago

   Gotta love the Aflac commercials.

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6. 91

   Rochelle Frankposted 14 years ago

   This whole discussion reminds me of a comic strip from "The Wizard of Id".
   A royal official comes to announce to the people that the king has decided that housing, food, utilities and medical care will be free to everyone. Furthermore-- everyone will have a job.
   One of the peasants asks: "Why do we need jobs?"

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