How do you protect your children from the Evil Within ? Yes thats right , Within ? Today there is more self damning finger pointing going on everywhere ! The image of pointing fingers as strong as any image ......... sabors rattling in the air over the head of the masses . But I know , .as decent human beings we need answers right ? But how about this , real answers ! Mommy points her finger at guns , daddy points his at the schools . The pacifist points his at guns , knives and anything else , but the right place to point your finger just might be .....right back at yourselves or ourselves ! The shooter in Connecticut is but barely out of childhood himself .And yet , "the evil within " ! dominated his actions ! Are we holding the personal accountability of the elements of evil inside him up for the world to see ? No ! Check out the forum threads all over the place ......fingers pointing everywhere but within ! Guns , video games , schools , doting mothers , absentee fathers . But the number one most responsible place to look is within ourselves . How are we creating such evil to be nurtured into existence ? Did not we create this ourselves ? Does our culture of the ever increasingly detachment of our children from reality and from family values itself sound like it might be to blame ? Are you going to point your finger at the easy object of blame or look within ........are you nurturing evil within your child ?
We didn't create it. We were born into it.
It is a fallen world.
We didn't create it, but we nurture it and grow it rather than make a serious effort to shrivel it.
Hey here's a thought.
Let's teach the kids there actually is no such thing as evil.
That it was all made up to manipulate them and keep them under submission.
Then let's convince everyone they are just another kind of monkey and be real surprised when they behave that way.
That'll do it!
Here's another thought.
Let's start from the perspective that modern society consists of lots of different social groups living in close proximity to each another.
And let's assume a sensible goal might be: for those groups to live in harmony, while maintaining something of their individual identities.
Then let's determine what helps and what hinders us in achieving that goal. Then let's look at those things hindering us, and work out how to change them.
That might work also.
Two possible paths; either eliminate groups somehow, or somehow teach that all groups are equivalent.
Which is more palatable? Which is more effective? Which is easier to accomplish? Will either or both last?
Seems what you're suggestion would definitely help - we just need specifics. But then isn't that what a discussion is for, after all?
Or - rather than adopt that defeatist mentality - let's teach our children that goodness, kindness, and gentleness are the most effective tools for overcoming evil. Teach our children never to return hatred when it's dished out to them, but rather to return compassion and understanding. Teach our children that their friends in school who have less than they do deserve the same respect as the ones who have more. Teach our children that it is not about what you 'have' but about what you do, how you treat people. That the most valuable gift you can ever offer to someone is encouragement and love. That the only time it is ever appropriate to look down on someone is when you're "helping them up."
Mostly, let's actually do the unthinkable. Let's model this behavior to our children so that it isn't foreign to them. Rather than standing back and letting the schools, the government, and the general public raise our children, let's do it ourselves. Let's love and guide the children who are abandoned and left to their own devices so that they can learn their worth before the world strips them of it.
This is the ideal in an ideal society, which we don't have. Some parents can't model this because they don't have it themselves, or they have fringe beliefs and teach their children that the world is 'evil' and they isolate them to the point that these children can't function well in society. (Nor can their parents who resort to drugs in order to cope with life's responsibilities.)
I'm not saying this isn't what parents should be doing, but I think all adults have a responsibility to model and teach our young people. I'm a teacher and the responsibility is huge. Some children simply don't have responsible role models in their lives.
It appears that Adam Lanza came from a rather dysfunctional home environment. Who is then responsible for the Adams in our world?
Ultimately, he is responsible for himself. When that can't work (as it often can't) then it becomes the responsibility of society as a whole.
Not the parent, not the spouse and not friends or employers although all can help. Society in general is responsible.
I agree completely. We have much more to do as a culture, accepting that we all are responsible. John Donne's famous line comes to mind; No man is an island, entire of itself, every man is part of the continent, part of the main... He goes on to say that in essence we are all connected.
Yes and no. I see a problem even now in that some use that sentiment (which I agree with) to put the responsibility on society instead of themselves, and that's the wrong thing to do.
People are (or should be) responsible for themselves and the only time society should have to bear that responsibility is when the individual fails. Here, the shooter was incapable of taking that responsibility but I reject that notion that a broken home, for instance, also moves the responsibility to society.
I agree, rebekah. First and foremost, Adam is responsible for himself and his actions. When I talked about the abandoned ones, I meant that ALL adults need to share the responsibility for loving and educating children, just like you said.
I have a teenager girl in my home. She came to me from a neighbor with whom I was friendly who was recently evicted. That neighbor has issues with drugs and other things that keep her from being able to properly parent her daughter. Rather than let that young lady go with her mother into a very uncertain situation, my husband and I took her into our home. At least here, she has a stable environment and two responsible adults who love her and make it a priority to provide for her needs as part of the family.
For me, that's a very pointed, very specific action that helps me meet the more generalized goals I mentioned originally. Each of us has to take this type of action ourselves to help overcome the evil that threatens our children.
wilderness, I hope that addresses your question to me also.
I understand what you're saying. I have three times taken homeless in and fed and sheltered them for periods of weeks or months. Don't know that I could handle a child, which is what we're talking about, but I've made an effort.
But it can't come from just the handful of people that will actually do something; that handful will very quickly become overwhelmed. It needs to come from everyone, so how do we do that?
Unfortunately, the only way to ensure that everyone does anything is to force them to face the consequences of what happens if they don't. This country if facing consequences now, but there are still too few willing to take steps to change anything. We can only control ourselves. But a step at a time is enough to finish a journey for at least one person.
I wish I knew how to make it happen for everyone.
Yeah. Call me an emotional old fool, call me a child crying because he can't reach that pretty shiny thing in the sky at night, but I don't want to wait for generations for the human race to grow up.
When I drive by a school with children playing in the playground, when I hold my grandchildren that are, or soon will be, in school I think of Sandy elementary. I don't want to wait.
I'm a sentimental, middle-aged fool. I want it now. But if there's a lesson I've internalized more deeply than any other, it's that waiting is an absolute must. But waiting does not imply inaction.
Now Mo, that's cruel. You could have lied and said you were old too.
It will take time and waiting does not imply inaction, but neither does it imply that we jump blind into counterproductive or ineffective actions just to make it seem like we're doing something.
I like this thread - it's the place where we might actually find solutions instead of jumping blind. No, we won't solve the world's problems, but maybe we can produce a thought. A thought that might spread to a few more that will add to it and spread again. A thought that could grown into a solution one day.
You are speaking lot' s of generalities without a real plan there.
It's not defeatist it is what has been happening.
Of course, but are those generalities sound? If you agree that some might help what's your idea on implementation?
Yes, it is what's been happening. It's the laying down and accepting it that's defeatist, IMO. On a global scale, I can only offer generalities. It's up to each person individually to determine the specific actions that need to be taken to make the world better.
I like it - all very good suggestions. Playing devil's advocate, thought, how do we accomplish it? You know as well as I do that parents aren't going to cooperate.
Create massive govt. run nurseries from birth? Parents are either trained or don't get their kids? Over my dead body!!
Begin teaching now, recognizing that it won't changed anything for generations? Don't like that, either.
What you're saying makes too much sense to me, the devil is in the application. Suggestions?
I happen to TRULY BELIEVE THIS! This is exactly what the govt. is and has done and I am not being facetious. See post as above:
Hey here's a thought.
Let's teach the kids there actually is no such thing as evil.
That it was all made up to manipulate them and keep them under submission.
Then let's convince everyone they are just another kind of monkey and be real surprised when they behave that way.
That'll do it!
Barefoot, I don't know. I'm not knowledgeable enough in the social sciences to provide any real solutions. Here are some thoughts, though, that might encourage others that are knowledgeable (and will leave their own prejudices and wants aside) to think about it. One of the big problems, seems to me, is that we separate ourselves into "them" vs "us" - with that in mind:
1. Religion is a major bone of contention - should we outlaw all churches?
2. Should we instead teach comparative religion courses to elementary students with an eye towards teaching there is no right or wrong religious belief, that all are equal?
3. Should we continue integration efforts? Govt. subsidized home purchases if you buy in an area that is of a predominately different race than you are?
4. Should we teach ethics and morality to young children, pounding it in from day 1 in school?
5. Should we eliminate all political parties?
Another major cause, seems to me, is lack of responsibility, just as the OP says. Should we:
1. Remove nearly all the welfare safety net, make everyone responsible for their own welfare? Make it "root, hog or die"?
2. Should we expand the safety net, making everyone as nearly equal as possible in how they live?
3. Should we set free all drug users from jail, using the space to increase punishment for violent crimes? Sock someone, get 30 days?
4. With #3, should we make our jails a hell hole? A real punishment for shorter periods, but with nearly unlivable conditions?
5. Should we remove any and all consideration of a criminals past when sentencing? Broken home, drunk, drug abuser, mental illness, etc. no longer considered - you and only you are responsible for your actions?
IMHO, none of these will work and nearly all violate our current ethics to the point the cure is worse than the disease. Do they make you think, though, produce an idea that might work and is worth discussing?
And, that "evil within" is what exactly? Can you be more specific?
You just answered your own question. Yes, the vast majority of folks are "decent human beings".
You're jumping to conclusions by assigning an undefined concept (evil within) as a cause, stating it dominated his actions and then asked about personal accountability. It really is difficult trying to follow your argument here. What is your point exactly?
What the heck are you talking about? Please define "evil within"???
My answer is cliche because it is true: This is the world we live in. The world consist of disparate beings with disparate consciences. Discord is much more practical than accord, because in order for us to live peacefully, we have to compromise; and it is this that we do not want to comply with the ethical creed of being humanely human.
I greatly fear you are riding a horse that won't run. What you say is 100% correct - the root of our violence problem lies within us, not in an outside tool.
It just isn't a popular concept. It is far easier to convince the population that if we take away guns the problem is solved - an awful lot of people already believe that - than it is to convince people that our culture itself is the cause and all of us need to change, not just a select few. Plus, of course, guns are an easy target and one that for the most part requires no change in ourselves.
A few will actually look at the real problem, but then declare that the killer came from a broken home, was addicted to drugs, or had a tough childhood and therefore can't be held responsible. Our soft hearts and care for our fellow man won't allow any action but to hold them close, to include them in all we do and hope it won't happen again even as we assure that it will by encouraging behavior that produce such atrocities.
It hasn't worked in the past, it isn't working now and it won't work in the future, but it's going to be all that we're willing to do. We're not willing, as a society, to either acknowledge the roots of the cause or to make the effort to correct it. Just put on a bandaid without cutting out the cancer.
Motown, I understand what you are saying, and it's wonderful that you are helping the young teen. Yes, we all play a part. And we can each have a function to perform in our own unique manner and capacity.
As far as Adam being responsible for himself, I don't think his brain was formed properly to feel human empathy and social connectivity. In his case, from all that I have read, he could not, alone, be responsible for his behavior.
I'm off, way too much to do. Enjoy the holidays.
It begins at home ! From day one , and it begins with reclaiming what once was . This is not new age folks its rethinking the last fifty years of moral and ethical decline beginning here at home in America ! "Free range" child developement doesn't work . It isn't about nurturing the freedom of spirit . It's about ........yes I'm gonna use that age old dirty word ,personal" Accountability" ! News flash !........ The older generation wasn't evil for using punishment to help form the pschcy's of their kids . Free will and free range behavior and activities by parents in public , allowing children to determine their own behaviors doesn't work , Symbolic group hugs and every body gets a trophy education practices doesn't work . With one half of marriages ending now in failure , while mommy works nights andd sleeps days and daddy screws the secratary at his new job doesn't work . Where does this "new -Old" way begin , within yourself and within the children , maturity and accountability , for each and every action by a child . One huge problem today ! Children- raising children -raisiing children ! Thirty year olds still having mommy comb their hair , thirty year olds still attached at the wombs,no controls , no blame , no personal accountability! Thats probably the best way to discribe our problems in this culture today ,"free range child developement" ! And then quickly pass them off to the rest of society !
You really set me back with this one. I agree with much of what you say, but the dual worker family really catches my attention as I firmly believe that such families are doing a major disservice to the children that they have voluntarily brought into this world.
Should we limit households with children to one earner? Say, limit any family earning at least $50,000 (insert your own figure here) to one source of employment? Diddle with it to prevent divorce simply to allow dual earners, allow home based business, etc. but basically ensure that children have a stay at home parent?
Is this what you're talking about?
"Free Range Kids are children and young people who experience freedom from their front door. They have the confidence to travel independently, play outdoors and explore their local community, and have the skills, opportunities and support to do so safely."
http://www.sustrans.org.uk/freerangekid … range-kids
There are huge misconseptions about free range parenting! If anything it requires more parenting to have children who are capable of being free range children.
Hi Folks. It's interesting to watch the flow of answers in this thread:
Ahorseback wrote: "How do you protect your children from the Evil Within ?" Obviously pointing the finger backwards at each one of US - ME - not something "out there."
Then Barefootfae wrote:
" We didn't create it. We were born into it.
It is a fallen world."
This is obviously not going along with ahorseback's intention.
wilderness starts out really well: :"A few will actually look at the real problem, but..." Then: "I greatly fear you are riding a horse that won't run. What you say is 100% correct - the root of our violence problem lies within us, not in an outside tool."
Then wilderness comes back to the conventional path "out there" :"Two possible paths; either eliminate groups somehow, or somehow teach that all groups are equivalent." "Society in general is responsible"
Isn't it difficult to maintain focus on that "person within?" I am just observing, not judging.
There are two facets; changing the "person within" ourselves and changing it by means of societal action.
One of the things that might be creating an unacceptable (by societies definition) person within is the divisive results of belonging to a group - the question is to eliminate grouping or do something else so that it isn't divisive any more. Either way the "person within" no longer hates those that belong to a different group.
Some people cannot change that person within, and there society must step in and do it for them. Or so I see it.
Stiil believe its GOT to come from within and I believe if most us really think about it , its all developemental, generally speaking its how we are raised ! Most of our personality , and behavioral traits are through developiing by the time were young adults . This shooters problem was from his raising , not the outside world . Father , mother ....and the home environment created this monster ! media , war games , guns ,school mates , no one is responsible for this exceept him and his parents ! AND no one could have affected a different outcome ,other than his upbringing ! Society is far to good at turning its head the other way to help the individual with problems !
Maybe, in this case, the cause was parental, social, environmental, etc.
Or, and I think more likely, is that the cause was totally within the individual; that the chemical/physical makeup of the brain wasn't normal and could not produce rational behavior.
If so, fault might lie with the environment or might lie totally within the genetics of the individual.
The individual yes ! And the big question , How do we effect change in that individual ? When the parent and the home envirenment is the first source of developement , For a few years we began to hold the parent responsible for the acts of a teen /minor in the courts ! What happened to that ! Perhaps we can look to this idiots father and ask Why ? Or to the publicly employed councilors at schools and hospitals or in the legal systems . But hey .....we could take the easy road and call for one more gun law too !
Are we not presuming that the individual has total control over his actions, however bad they might be?
What is he has some underlying psychiatric illness or condition over which he has no control or responsibility at all? What if he has been labouring over such an illness, not knowing what it is, maybe an inherent difficulty in communicating his feelings, a condition which might be so slight that no one else is aware of it and there is not able to "reach" him?
It's all too easy to jump to conclusions and judge when a horrific incident has taken place.
I would love to know how many of the mass and spree killers come from homes of 2 parent families with a stay at home parent.
I would guess (and it's pure guess) that very few do, but that's simply because there are few stay at home parents any more.
The point, though, is to create a society where gratuitous violence of any kind is not only forbidden but nearly inconceivable. Where the very thought of killing doesn't enter the mind.
You don't produce that by plonking kids in front of the TV for endless hours of violence laden programming. You don't do it by leaving them alone to fight amongst themselves. You do it by constant supervision, by providing a constant role model instead of one for a couple of hours a day. You do it by teaching love and kindness all the time, not just in the hour that a parent can spare from work and household chores.
Or should it be Hare! Hare!? Rabbits seem to understand making love not war...
Ahhhh yeas ! I remember making love ..................You guys?
Never happened for me.... but I did breed rabbits at one time when a kid, so I think I understand it.....
I think...somewhere back there in antiquity...let me think about that one.
I'll ask my son if I ever spoke on that.
Peeples , That would seem "normal " wouldn't it , And yet probably as many come from there as in a broken home . It's all about how the individual misfit develops still though . Totally broken homes produce wise and educated , well developed kids . And so too the normal household. ...Is evil just as indescrimenant no matter the upbringing ? I fear that it is ....:-}
For the record, I am a pacifist and anti-prohibition. People who argue for prohibition are not pacifists, neither are they anti-gun, because one necessarily needs aggression and guns to carry out prohibition.
Are all you posters AWARE that on the exact SAME day at the same time in CHINA a man also at an elementary school knifed 22 children????? No one in America seems to hear about that!!! Google it LOOK and LEARN!!! Is this highly coincidental????
Villager slashes 22 kids with knife at elementary school gates in China
Dec 14, 2012 – Ax-wielding man kills 3 kids, wounds 13 in China ... slashed 28 children, two teachers and a security guard in a kindergarten in eastern China.
http://worldnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012 … china?lite
HERE IS THE URL for that
It's very sad but since he only had a knife, many were wounded but there were no deaths in the incident cited by Islandantoinette. In her second link, the man with the axe also wounded people but only killed 3. The story says that in the entire year 2010, nearly 20 were killed in China. In the Sandy Hook alone, 26 died -- more died than in one year in China. Knives are less efficient in killing than guns are.
GUNS are ONLY USED FOR KILLING!!! To make any comparison between knives and guns are not equivalent to one another. A knife carves my Thanksgiving Turkey. A gun kills Bambi, and humans, dogs by the police and people by the police and people by people.
The point I am trying to make by the CHINA knifing of 22 children in China is it was the SAME EXACT DAY and TIME!! Anyone ever heard of or read about the Illuminati???? Watch a movie called "The Calling" Educate yourselves. They OWN the World BANK which owns ALL other banks which owns the only 4 remaining media news outlets which OWNS YOU! It's free for you to watch to becomes AWARE! That is where is all starts, HISTORY and the AWARENESS that people NEED to put 2 and 2 together. IT is a wake up call.
Gun control would be extremely beneficial to the illuminati, would it not?
Absolutely Inner smiff! Good point. Glad to see someone here knows what they are. The GMO foods on one of our islands of Hawaii called Molokai are so deadly that people who have eaten the corn have died! And the dust causes cancer in all the population there. None of this is being reported, yet we KNOW because we live here.
We have no children however my husband has a daughter who is in her 20s and a son who is married and 30. It is amazing that they grew up and wonderful as they did because they had to grow up in the U.S.S.R. as Latvia was still under Communism rule when they were born. I guess what saved them from have a traumatic childhood was that when they were in their teens Latvia was already independent again. If I had children and lived in the states I'd wish for them the kind of life I grew up in. Although the world has drastically changed since I was a child I would raise mine the way my parents did. In a loving and understanding family where I had no worries. Raised religiously to love Jesus and even had a Children's Bible. So when I ventured out into the world I knew I could return to the safe haven of my home no matter what. It is a good way to raise kids. The unfortunate part is that in this world today there is so much evil that you cannot be sure your child will be safe outside the home and for that I don't know how to prepare children because you certainly don't want the to be afraid of even their own shadows.
I agree with your summation and the direction your comments are going.
It appears to me that we as Americans become more and more selfish. As usual it's all about ME! We don't like the way somebody driving on the roadway welcome to road rage. A schoolteacher raised their voice to our disruptive child, time to take that schoolteacher and the school to court.
Until we get a handle on what it means to have trust, decency and humanity we are simply stuck in the mud spinning our wheels.
If we see violence in a poor part of town we simply accept it but that violence, that attitude is contagious and though the population in inner cities is great than in rural areas the fact of the matter is, evil can be fostered anywhere and we perpetuate that violence by our desire for guns and more guns.
I guess as far as finger pointing goes some people need to clean up there own backyards before trying to clean up someone else's.There are so many latchkey kids today,because so many households need to have both parents working to provide the general needs of the family unit.Kids come home from school and no one is there so they turn to video games and their peers to fill that parental void.Is this a factor maybe ? The situation of the latchkey child is not new it started in the early 90's and continues today.
Where does the need for both parents to be out "at work" come from? Keeping up appearances with the neighbours? Wanting the latest kitchen equipment/wifi/playstation/car/new washing machine/pool in the back yard/ etc. etc. Chucking out a perfectly serviceable bathroom suite and replacing it with the latest fashionable marble. All designed to prove to the neighbours that this family is part of the scene and to be reckoned with. Your kids might be doing a similar act in school.
All this stuff costs money, and you have been encouraged listening to the ads on TV that you "can afford it, zero deposit, no repayments for 6 months, easy repayments after that." Suckers!
Instead, make do, repair things, do some of the chores a bit more slowly, by hand whisk or beater. Get a couple of thousand-dollar uplift on the old car - make it shine and be proud of it. Have the engine steam cleaned and fully serviced, the upholstery renovated, the tires renewed all round. Make it last another 5 years. What you don't want is another millstone of a loan around your neck!
So many ways to avoid the huge demand on your household budget, then Mum or Dad can stay at home, make sure a good breakfast is on the table at the beginning of the day, and welcome the kids home from school with a hug or a kiss and the evening meal ready.
Roboview , thats the answer ! All change begins at home . I was a latchkey kid and when I think about how we develope individually I wonder ,isn't this answer just inside each of us ? "teach your children well ",comes to mind , great song but........ the idea never took off .?
Yes Horse it starts at home the needs of the child and the need of material things creates a paradox,
but in the end the child that always had one parent available are much richer then those that had not.
Understanding that material things are nice but they fade.Guidance nurturers the spirit and sheds light
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