Race baiters

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   ahorsebackposted 9 years ago

   
   Racial rainbow
   
   I wonder when  we'll ever learn that all the colors
   of the rainbow are what matter
   Not just one or two but as much
   the first as the latter
   
   The color of all people are one
   yet what do we chose to see
   Just one or two  by the narrow minded
   who refuse to be set free
   
   What color are you and you and you
   the blind man  has to ask
   Maybe God should blind us all
   set us on the task
   
   So there is a rainbow love for those
   who could  never hate
   Come on and join us all
   it aint' never too late

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      gmwilliamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      People unfortunately still exist at the tribal level.  It is the mentality of us vs. them.  The concept of the ingroup and outgroup is alive and well.  Humankind loves to establish artificial boundaries which separates people from each other in that some will be glorified, even elevated while others will be ostracized, marginalized, even demonized to the extent that they will be separated, ghettoized, even exterminated.   When humankind grows up and evolve beyond the tribal consciousness, there will be a realization that ALL is ONE.   There is ONE race, THE HUMAN RACE.

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         Kathryn L Hillposted 9 years agoin reply to this

         - like a rainbow or a prism refracting one light… thanks ahorseback.

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            ahorsebackposted 9 years agoin reply to this

            I believe that all of this media hog-wash will do nothing but bring decent people closer together , AND there are far more decent people  in America ,than not !

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               KFlippinposted 9 years agoin reply to this

               We can only hope it would . . . but, it's not what I'm hearing and reading - or I wouldn't have come back here after a couple years and more gone to hear what hubbers say plainly.  It is all so very disturbing, even tonight on CNN they just keep ginning the race angle -- it's like there's never ever anyone but a black or brown person arrested or killed in process of resisting arrest.  IMO race had nothing to do with all of these events, instead the deadly state of affairs without regard to race for all police officers drives there actions.  That said, my heart broke seeing the Garner video, but it would have as well for a white or pink or yellow person . . . that seems to be so very missed in the discussion by CNN, CNBC, and the 3 networks.  Strange and sorry state of affairs in the USA.  Driven by . . . let us all wonder.  Disturbing theme that seems to be agenda/'talking points' driven . . . for what future purpose, we'll only know as the weeks and months pass.

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      Don Wposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      What is a race baiter?

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         KFlippinposted 9 years agoin reply to this

         What is the difference between a stupid person and a dumb person?  Both very good questions.  Easy answers.

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            GA Andersonposted 9 years agoin reply to this

            You can't fix stupid. You can educate dumb.
            
            GA

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               wildernessposted 9 years agoin reply to this

               How? Teach them sign language?

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                  gmwilliamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                  Funny, need a sense of humor regarding this thread.

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            gmwilliamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

            A stupid person willingly wants to be ignorant while a dumb person is totally clueless.   As Mr. Anderson eloquently put it, stupid people are beyond hope while dumb people can be somewhat helped.  Another analogy is stupid people=hell while dumb people=purgatory.
            

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         gmwilliamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

         One who knowingly instigates racial division.  Simple, ISN'T IT!
         
         
         
         
         
         

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            Don Wposted 9 years agoin reply to this

            Thanks gmwilliams. Shame the author of the thread was not able to come forward and define the terminology he is using for us. If we take it to mean: "one who knowingly instigates racial division". Instigate means to start something, and division means separation, so "one who knowingly instigates racial division" means someone who knowingly brings about racial separation.
            
            Of the three images you posted, I'd say that Al Sharpton is the odd one out because he doesn't fit your definition. He isn't advocating racial separation, he is advocating that people of different races be treated equally, especially in the areas of justice and law enforcement. The other two are advocates for racial separation, so fit your definition exactly.
            
            The reason definitions are important is because the term 'race baiter' gets broadly applied these days to anyone who highlights injustices that happen because of racial bias. This is a tactic used to shut down criticism of the status quo. With that broad usage, the following people would also be considered as 'race baiters' as they all highlighted injustices against minority groups due to racial bias:
            
            
            
            
            
            
            
            So how about it. Are these people 'race baiters' too? If not, why not?

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         ahorsebackposted 9 years agoin reply to this

         For he most part ; the media + those who  see  some kind of a God in the media !

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      cjhunsingerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      ahorseback
      As an American with German ancestory, I do not identify as a German American,  so for starters, woud it be a good idea for people to simply identify as American, providing that is your citizenship. It would seem that such identies, as to skin tone, gender, sexual preference, person of color and this would assume that the rest of us are invisible, only serve to separate and divide a society.
      I do not see where skin tone has any value, unless one wants to set himself apart and somehow above the rest of society. If this is the case, then I would say that such an embraced identity is racism.
      The human race does not have subgroups, as we are all homo sapiens-sapiens, so to divide by skin tone, are we saying that subgroups exist and some are less human then others?

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      Don Wposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Two questions:
      
      1) Is it fair to say that when the Republicans adopted the 'southern strategy' (implicitly appealing to racism against African Americans to gain the support of white, southern voters) that it was race baiting (just to get a clear idea of what we are talking about)?
      
      2) When is a statement race baiting, and when is it simply a fact? For example the statement "black men receive 20% longer prison sentences than white men, for the same crime". If I highlight that fact and suggest that it is wrong and needs to be addressed, is that race baiting, or is it just stating a fact?

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   bBereanposted 9 years ago

   Of the 6 people pictured so far I believe Sharpton is the best and perhaps only example of a "race baiter".  While "race baiter" is not a clearly defined term, "bait" infers misleading, tricking and being disingenuous in order to incite or trap the "baitee"  to their detriment for the benefit of the baiter.  All others shown, good and bad, were mostly transparent, clear, direct and unapologetic about their agendas, not covert and deceptive. 
   
   Sharpton, on the other hand, repeatedly exploits situations that are emotionally charged but are not genuinely about race, and spins them to appear to be, or just pushes an entirely false narrative to hide the truth, replacing it with something to create racial tension so he can pretend to address it.  He is in effect the quintessential fireman arsonist.  He baits people on both sides to create and fan the fire he pretends to be there to put out.

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      Don Wposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Ok, so this is a slight change to the working definition. The idea that there is an element if trickery or deceit involved.
      
      I know that Al Sharpton has campaigned in cases where injustices are perceived to have been inflicted because of racial bias. What evidence exists that he has been misleading and/or disingenuous in those campaigns? What examples are you referring to?
      
      Also applying this new definition, can we say that when the Republicans adopted the 'southern strategy' (implicitly appealing to racism against African Americans to gain the support of white, southern voters) was the party race baiting?
      
      Lastly, when is statement race baiting, and when is it simply a fact? For example the statement "black men receive 20% longer prison sentences than white men, for the same crime". Is that race baiting, or is it a fact supported by freely available, objectively verifiable information?

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   ahorsebackposted 9 years ago

   Probably the teachable irony here is that I have known people of lower intelligence that don't have a racial bone in  their heads ! Does higher intelligence breed  lesser integrity ?

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   Cgenaeaposted 9 years ago

   Such a great conversation!!!
   My definition of race baiting in the majority party of this thread is simply, highlighting injustice that always seems to be against minorities in this country,  and calling it a racially motivated phenomenon.
   But it seems that the consenus is that Black people commit more crimes, so naturally...
   Then we blame the media. I wonder if a tape of a 6'4, white man being taken to the ground and killed by any other nationality of 4 police officers or even their own nationality, would that not make the headlines???
   Could we say that the man was killed because he was white?
   Seems to me, that this phenomenon, is something that does not occur...
   If Michael Brown was a white guy from Yale, and he was walking in the street. Would he have been approached? My guess is no.
   "Hey Buddy, you lost? Need some help?"
   Race "baiting"? Or telling the truth?
   We approach black people differently because we know their sad shame. They're savages!!! Come look at this chart...
   And blacks who make it out, often join the chorus.

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      KFlippinposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Geez, don't you get it simply wouldn't have been reported?  Wouldn't have made the news?  Can't you see that both black and white cops were there?  Don't you know that locals called the cops on the guy?  Don't you know that the person in charge was a black female Sargent?  Of course the same would have happened with a white man, or any other color beyond black, and no one would have given a damn.  That said, I was appalled.  That said, it should not have been used by the media to incite riots by the likes of Sharpton's selfish agenda either.

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   ahorsebackposted 9 years ago

   Cgenaea ,
   Let me ask you this ?  Forget Michael Brown for a second , Would you , yes or no , rebel against  the cops in an arrest for committing  a crime  of robbery , assault ,  or whatever the charges  might be  ?
   Answer -..............
   And  then , would you not only rebel but actually assault the officer that's arresting you , attempting to take his gun ?
   Answer ...............
   And would you then  try to evade arrest for doing so ?
   Answer................
   
   If you cant answer honestly then you can't pretend that you are capable of objectively sitting  on the grand jury  and fairly judge a  case in a  court of law You would  be asked to leave the process  , by fair exclusion ,  the jury  or grand jury selection process .  Yet , you'd probably be an excellent news reporter  for CNN or MSNBC ,  You  would  really be an excellent reporter for the Huffington post , or perhaps Democracy Now .!  .

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   Cgenaeaposted 9 years ago

   I didn't even resist when I was arrested FOR NOTHING.  Though after I was FINALLY told WHY they were cuffing me, I almost flailed in response. But the boys in blue, 3 to be exact, were there with strong arms, KNOWING they themselves, were the guilty party.
   They forced me in cuffs for that thing, whatever it was, that they found in the alley. I never even saw it up close.
   Uh, so, I may not ever be put on a jury. I'm opinionated, and I have my own ideas about certain things.
   But, I do not believe Mike attacked the officer.  I believe DJs first account of the occurrence... the cop grabbed Mike by the neck of his shirt and held on... pulled him into the car, while Mike was trying to break free of the grip, the gun magically appears. The rest is recorded...
   I think they both should've just gotten their asses out of the street. But to force them out of the street was too lordly a task. Had they been from Harvard, and LOOKED a little prettier, they would have been allowed a bit of "liberty".
   I've seen and heard MANY times that white people ALWAYS put cops in their places with verbal assault even... not many dead because of it.

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      gmwilliamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      CG, HERE IT GOES YET AGAIN AD INFINITUM.   Yes, there is racism; that's a given for now.  However, yes......however, there is a prevalence of victimology and the plantation mindset, consciousness, and psychology among many in the Black American community.  There are Blacks who have such a negatively pathological mindset of passivity, even defeatism.  They maintain that to be "authentically Black" is to adapt a slave and woe is me mentality.  They act as if they are perpetual victims instead of proactive participators.  They refuse to better themselves educationally and socioeconomically.  They are happy with the poverty mindset, being fiercely anti-achievement and anti-success, being envious of other Blacks who are educated and successful. 
      
      Such Blacks have a crab in the barrel mentality.  This mentality is quite endemic in the Black American community.  There are many Black Americans with the slave and plantation mentality.  They refuse to take responsibility for their lives, blindly adhering to an adversely pathological subculture of failure which is reflective in their neighborhoods.  They act recklessly instead of implementing an intellect plan to improve their lives.  They are in dire situations because they ELECT to do so.   I, as a Black woman, am tired of the ad nauseam excuses in relation to this situation.  It seems to me that many Black Americans, especially from the lower socioeconomic subculture, DON'T want to improve themselves one iota.  Yes, some of the situation is race but most of it is of THEIR OWN choosing.   
      
      No one tells these poor Blacks to act the way they do.  You indicated that you were arrested "for nothing."   Ummm, the policepeople I interacted with, treated me with the utmost respect.   Now TRUTH be TOLD, yes I have the verbal arsenal.  Many policepersons act the way they do because many of these Black youth PROVOKE them, yes PROVOKE them in one way or another.  It is time for some Black Americans, especially those in the lower socioeconomic strata, to get their life in order educationally and socioeconomically.  They need to be smart- become educated, have a profitable career or their own business, DON'T have children before they are married or in a committal relationship, DON'T have children unless financially, emotionally, and psychologically prepared, DON'T have MORE children than one can financially, emotionally, and psychologically support-preferably have a small family, and invest in their and their descendant's future.  Also, Blacks in America must establish some type of economic base in order to generate businesses which in turn will build up their communities; in addition to that, having a strong economic base means more political clout as politicians and other power players respect people with a strong economic base.  Now, I am tired and off to bed to rest.

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         ahorsebackposted 9 years agoin reply to this

         You nailed that one !+++++

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         Cgenaeaposted 9 years agoin reply to this

         I missed this post yesterday. I was on your other poor people bashing forum.
         I think that you have a crab in SOMEBODY'S barrel, but it seems nothing to be proud of. Though pride is evident in your words.
         I have no issue with your issues and I pray that you are informed soon.
         You judge ad infinitum. and there is a scripture saying, "Judge not, lest ye be judged." Hear... or dont.
         You know nothing of the struggle of poor people. Your parents cushioned your blows. However, not many blacks have such backing. Instead of being thankful for your fortune, you wrongfully attribute it. Then you throw it in faces. I PROMISE...you are in NO WAY, better...
         Luckily for me, I am happy and unphased by the rants. I know the TRUTH of the matters. I'm no victim, I just KNOW from experience...
         If I were at fault in my situation, I would not bring it up here. I know how kind, cooperative, learned, and respectful I was that day; and still...
         My story will be told to all who listen, like it or no...
         Please do not wave your education in my face. I'm starting to feel that I have surpassed you there, as well.

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            gmwilliamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

            I smell VICTIM here!  Many Blacks are poor, uneducated, and are in adverse circumstances because of their own selected negative mindset, psychology, and consciousness.  If they wanted to do better, they would have.  You admitted that you elect to be in the situation you are in although you further acknowledged that you could have done better.
            
            Everything is a choice whether one admits it or not.  I, as other middle income and educated Blacks, made intelligent choices which is reaped by our high level of education and good jobs which, in turn, improved our standard of living.  Even though, racism is present, we middle class Blacks refuse to let that preclude us from realizing our dreams.  The poor Black is fond of using racism as an excuse for a culture of abject failure. Nice to talk to you again, CG.  Have to EDUCATE, EDUCATE!
            

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               cjhunsingerposted 9 years agoin reply to this

               gm
               I just read your profile. I applaud your postion and your strength.

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                  gmwilliamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                  Hell YEAH, I am so sick of people whining about their dire life choices.  With some exceptions such as any type of disability, mental illness, and being too old, most of us willingly and knowingly make our life choices.  if they are constructive and intelligent choices, we will be successful in life.  Make stupid, uneducated, and destructive choices, well guess what, your life will SUCK!   If one is unsuccessful, don't hate on the more successful person.  Also do not blame SOCIETY or THE MAN for one's predictament.  The fault lies not in society nor other factors for the most part but within us.  Mature people MAKE opportunities and OWN their lives.  Immature people let life DUMP on them and are....OWNED!

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         Don Wposted 9 years agoin reply to this

         gmwilliams, I've mentioned this before, but I feel I have to mention it again because I think it's important.
         
         Victimology is the study of victims. Real victims. People who have actually suffered victimization. It is a field of academic study.
         
         Victim-mentality is when someone believes they are unfairly impacted by the negative actions of others, even though there is no evidence that this is the case.
         
         You are talking about victim-mentality, not victimology which is something completely different. I'm not saying that just to be picky. Just trying to prevent misunderstanding based on a mistaken use of terminology.

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         Don Wposted 9 years agoin reply to this

         Regarding what you say in your post, you have grossly underestimated the psychological impact of racism and racial bias on individuals. To suggest that people simply shrug of systemic racism and racial bias reveals a lack of understanding of what systemic racial bias actually is, how it works and its effect on the human psyche.
         
         I asked someone about racism, what it's like for them personally. She said the effect is like having someone in your face shouting "YOU ARE NOT GOOD ENOUGH. YOU WILL NEVER BE GOOD ENOUGH. YOU ARE WORTHLESS. YOU ARE NOTHING" continuously, all day, every day. I'm paraphrasing but that was the gist. I think it's a great description because it allows people like me to begin to imagine what the psychological impact of that must be. She also asked how she as a parent is meant to give enough positive encouragement to counter such a devastating influence on her daughter's self-esteem. I had no answer. But I now realised if that's the question being asked, then  we (society) are asking the wrong question, and placing the wrong emphasis. 
         
         We should not be asking black parents to train their children so they can cope better in a racist society. We should instead be asking how we can rid society of systemic racial bias. A black mother should not have to ask "how can I compensate for the devastating effect racism has on my child's self-esteem?". By putting the emphasis in the wrong place, we are asking black parents to compensate for a fault in society, instead of fixing the fault.
         
         There is also a bit (actually a lot) of victim blaming in your post too. What you're doing is the same as asking why someone in an abusive relationship stayed in that situation for so long. "Why didn't they just leave?", "Why not do something about it?". By implying that people somehow want to be victims because they haven't done something about it, you are again underestimating the impact that physical and psychological abuse has on human beings. I strongly suggest you read the literature available on the effects of domestic abuse. See if you see any similarities between that and the type of effects you observe among some black people. You may be very surprised. Then you might want to look into the concept of healthy self-esteem, what it is, why it's important, how it can be damaged and the effects of damaging it.
         
         If you have any doubts about the insidious effects of racism on the psychology of children watch this.
         
         These children are not saying these things because they "DON'T want to improve themselves one iota" in the case of the black children, or because they are maliciously racist in the case of the white children. They are saying them because this is what society has taught them.

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            KFlippinposted 9 years agoin reply to this

            You describe generational indoctrination at it's best.  If I had continued to speak the same language as my laborer forebears, the same slang English, I'd not have progressed.  Do I fault America for that? No.  Am I glad I respect the English language?   Yes.  The American culture shouldn't be held hostage to the jive of anyone.  That's not racism.  Present yourself properly and nothing, not anything, will stop you in the United States of America.  Head to England, or all of Europe, and see what you see, hear what you hear -- or do spend some time in other regions across the globe, then come back and complain.

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               Don Wposted 9 years agoin reply to this

               This type of ignorance really doesn't help the issue. Unfortunately you are not alone. There are millions of people who are either incapable, or unwilling to recognise that if you spend centuries systematically abusing, torturing (yes slavery was torture), murdering, de-humanising, and limiting the development of an entire group of people, it will take more than 50 years for the effects of those things to be overcome. This is especially true if systemic racial bias still exists within the institutions that are the foundations of society. Justice system, education, banking etc. And no, I won't tell you how those institutions are systemically racist. If you don't know, look it up. You have a wealth of information at your fingertips. There is no excuse for being ignorant of these things in this day and age.

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   word55posted 9 years ago

   Very beautiful rythmic poem here ahorseback. gmwms, I understand where you are coming from. Thank God that all Blacks are not the same. I've said before that people need the spiritual foundation of God and Christ as their personal Savior. People need a relationship with Christ to help them become sinless as we live on to being a Holy World Nation.

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   ahorsebackposted 9 years ago

   I fear we are living in a time of proud victim-ology , CJ , I didn't intend for  any skin color identification in my post ,  I too believe we are one color , I have strived , especially coming from  a  biased family  beginnings , to never see color !, To never see  a difference in the person that I'm looking at ,  driven into our  heads by my mother was that " No one is better than you  are and you don't look down your nose at anyone "! 
   Yet when it comes to those who gain a false pride in victimhood , there simply is no answer that will suffice . We will remain a divided  human race I fear , as long as  those with otherwise perfect vision , simply refuse to see ! .   We ARE all one,  in equality  !
   
   The love of victimhood - doe not mean there IS racism .

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      gmwilliamsposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      Sadly, some people feel a perverse rush in being the victim. They wear victimhood as a badge of honor.  That is becoming quite OLD.......and TIRED.  Victims actually sicken me!  They are negaholics to be AVOIDED at all costs.

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   ahorsebackposted 9 years ago

   Negaholics , what a word , probably a perfect description !

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