Wow, Voters Thumbing Noses at both GOP and DEM 'Establishment' Candidates

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   Credence2posted 8 years ago

   Politics are exciting to watch, it always fascinated me as to who the voter selects for their candidate and why.
   
   There has been a trend over the last 5 or 6 years of populist movements either to right in the case of the GOP or to left, in the case of the Democrats that defy the wisdom of their respective party establishments.
   
   The people will be heard, look what happened to Cantor, of Virginia. Not saying that it is the end of the two party system, but maybe cracks in the monolith can now be identified?
   
   For the GOP, wasn't the mainstream pick either Rubio, or Jeb Bush? Look who is ahead, Donald Trump and Ted Cruz. While the GOP establishment winces that they are 'too far out there', conservative voters believe that these men speak for them more directly than does the "Party's' selection process, smoke filled rooms and such.
   
   For the Dems, we are seeing the same thing, We, of the populist left, are more attracted to Bernie Sanders as the 'out of the mainstream' party establishment candidate.  While Hillary Clinton has checked all the appropriate blocks on the application, the Left, as with the Right are wanting issues actually addressed that has really only been given lip service from the party regulars.
   
   So, I make a political plug being on the left, Sanders is an attractive candidate. He is getting all of his support from small donors and avoiding the 'big money' contribution thing. While Ms Clinton is willing to dance with the devil, Bernie will vanquish it.  Most of us progressive types will support Ms Clinton if she is ultimately the nominee, but only after 'the Bern' burns out.
   
   In any case, this will be an interesting year for Presidential politics,  Your Thoughts?

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      rhamsonposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      I believe you make a good point. Trump gains support in the face of the GOP establishment and while Bernie has been in Congress for many years as an Independent he flourishes despite the Clinton machine. I am with America in this regard but I stray from your Hillary if Bernie fails. Hillary would be a sell out to the mainstream thinking and I would rather throw a hand grenade like Bernie or Trump at the establishment. If Trump runs against Bernie I will vote for Bernie. If Trump runs against Hillary I will vote for Trump. If Cruz gets in I will reassess.

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         Credence2posted 8 years agoin reply to this

         As always, nice to hear from you RH.
         
         Where we differ is that while Bernie will vanquish the devil and Clinton dances with it, Trump is the Devil, himself.
         
         For US we see Trump as a dangerous bigot, who is opening a Pandora's box of racism, and civil rights retrenchment that we have spent decades closing and making sure stay closed. I have nothing in common with a man that has attracted support from White Citizens councils, and every variety of KKK knockoffs. While I criticize Secretary Clinton for standing still and moving to slowly against the true enemies of the people, Trump will take us back to their embrace.
         
         Family and relations had said to me that Sanders is not up on civil rights issues. The man is from Vermont, not a lot of colored people there. I don't need to have Ms. Clinton visit my church and sing old negro spirituals. Bernie's record and background tells me he already gets IT or is certainly willing to pick up on it very quickly. I will lean toward the authentic over the disengenious. I don't need another voice in the chorus, I need someone ready to do battle against the most fundamental problems that confronts us today, and that is bringing us ALL down. You must do more than just tickle my ears for that.
         
         Think hard about Cruz, he is way out there and in many ways he is much more rigidly conservative and unyielding than Trump.
         
         Trump is out of the question for me and many others.

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            rhamsonposted 8 years agoin reply to this

            Let us just hope Bernie beats the odds the media is stacking up against him in favor of their shoe in of Hillary. I don't much like Trump but I don't much favor the status quo. We are promised change and then have the rug pulled from beneath our feet. I am for Bernie and not another elitist such as Hillary.

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         Alternative Primeposted 8 years agoin reply to this

         Maybe you and everyone else should simply IGNORE the "Personalities" of the Candidates and Ignore NONSENSE Propaganda Channels like "FOX Loser Snooze" and VOTE for an individual's actual Policies & Ideas ~
         
         LISTEN for a Change and You would be AMAZED at some of the INSANELY Dangerous  CONservative Rhetoric ~
         
         Just a Suggestion ~

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            rhamsonposted 8 years agoin reply to this

            This is nothing about personalities for me and never has been. I am an independent that chooses the best person I feel can accomplish what is best for the country and myself. I don't care about the rhetoric that comes out of their mouths as they tell us warmed over talking points, nothing more, nothing less. As I said if Bernie doesn't make it I want to throw a hand grenade at the whole mess and Trump is just that type of person. No PC and no pretentious fodder. He speaks what is on his mind. I don't like much of it but it is refreshing never the less.

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               colorfuloneposted 8 years agoin reply to this

               You are by far one of the clearest thinking people on HubPages Forums when it come down the politics. 
               
               When "rhamson" talks, everyone should listen.   IMHO!

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               Alternative Primeposted 8 years agoin reply to this

               If you look at the issues, there's not much "Daylight" between Hillary & Bernie ~ Bernie just takes the Progressive Democratic VALUES much Further ~ The Vast MAJORITY of Bernie Supporters will EASILY Convert to Hillary and Vice Versa ~
               
               Both will STRIVE to give 'We the People" a better Quality of Life, unlike CONservative Republicans like Jed BUSH or Ted Cruz who simply want Americans to "Work Harder" while "RACING" to GIVE Even MORE of OUR Wealth to Wall Street & Corporations ~

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                  rhamsonposted 8 years agoin reply to this

                  You may be right but I don't like Hillary and never will with the past exploits from Whitewater up to now. Very untrustworthy.

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                     Alternative Primeposted 8 years agoin reply to this

                     ~ Still "Wallowing" in all that Right Wing Propaganda NONSENSE ? Hillary would be in JAIL 100 Times over if even a tiny Fraction of that BS were true ~ 
                     
                     Just like the Republican Led Benghazi SHAM which Wasted MILLION's in OUR Tax Monies, the ONLY person in HOT Water over that Gigantic Politically Motivated Fiasco is the CHAIMAN himself, Republican Trey Gowdy who is now Battling Law SUITS Filed against him ~ ~ Couldn't have hapened to a NICER Guy ~

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                        rhamsonposted 8 years agoin reply to this

                        No wallowing in the factual history of her controversies. This is not the place nor the time to rehash those mishaps on her part but happen they did. The writing is on the wall for Hillary as she has the support of the establishment in media and the DNC. She is bought and paid for by Wall Street which she has all but admitted openly but plentifully by omission of an out and out statement. That is the main reason I don't support her. At least Bernie and Trump have sworn off their money.

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                           Alternative Primeposted 8 years agoin reply to this

                           Everyone in the UNIVERSE has "Mishaps" rhamson, it's not uncommon ~
                           
                           But from what your saying, you must REALLY Despise Ted "The Carpet Bomber" Cruz, because not only is this Radically Dangerous  Numbskull "Bought & Paid for" by Wall Street Swindlers, but his Wife actually WORKS FOR  & HAS DIRECT Connections to GOLDMAN SACHS !! ~ ALL HAIL Ted's Christian VALUES ~    
                           
                           You can just ADD this to the G*R*O*W*I*N*G LIST of "Disqualifying" issues for little Foreign BORN Teddy Boy ~

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                              rhamsonposted 8 years agoin reply to this

                              Mishaps notwithstanding Hillary is a slick package that provides us with little more than personality and "plans" that seem to be good but turn out to be based on the same old, same old. No change with this one.
                              
                              I wouldn't characterize it despising Ted Cruz but I would not trust him either. I don't trust politicians who want to drag religion into a campaign with all of it's caveats. There are enough theocracies around the world and arguing religion on top of all the other issues is silliness.
                              
                              I am for a change good or bad and the outsiders are offering.

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      Ken Burgessposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      This is the anti-Washington election, voters will not support Clinton, and they will not support Bush.
      It is why Sanders and Trump are gaining so much momentum, they are considered anti-establishment, they are considered Washington outsiders, and it is what America will demand from this election.
      The funny thing about it is, if either Hillary or Bush get their Party's nomination, and the other Party provides Sanders or Trump, that is the surest way to get the outsider elected, regardless of how badly they are trashed by the media.  Just look Trump, the more thepound at him for the nonPC comments he makes, the more support he gets from voters.

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         rhamsonposted 8 years agoin reply to this

         I agree. For me if Hillary gets the Democratic nomination and Trump gets the GOP nomination I will vote for Trump. If Bernie beats out Hillary I will vote for him. No more inside the beltway crap.

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   colorfuloneposted 8 years ago

   This is a good post. -  I read it hours ago with it coming to mind several times since as I read, etc.  I saw this old tweet of Trumps that Glenn Beck posted about an hour ago.  Surprise!...Trump tweeted, I always vote for the winners. Congratulations to My Friend @BarackObama.  Nov 8, 2012
   
   Trump's values are more liberal than you might think, Cred. 
   *  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KHAHKGP10yc
   
   
   Hey, everyone makes mistakes, right! 
   Then again...

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      Credence2posted 8 years agoin reply to this

      Yes, I think that Cruz' strategy is to paint Donald Trump as not being conservative enough for the true believers. His comment about New York City not being America is part of the attack. Trump has not be conservative long and consistently in the social issues area. This is where much of the battle between the two titans will be. Remember, that you heard it here, first

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         Alternative Primeposted 8 years agoin reply to this

         Titan ? Cruz ? Not even CLOSE Credence2 ~ but you did HIT On one of Ted's Major Problems, and that is, with his "Archaic & Strange VALUES" he ONLY relates to a few RURAL Backward Hillbillies like "Dirt-Pile"  Phil Robertson who reside in places that are home to TINY Somewhat Insignificant "Angry White MAN" Populations ~
         
         Ted, as a Foreign BORN Individual, also has an Insurmountable "United States Citizenship" Problem which needs to be resolved ~ Without "Supreme COURT Adjudication", there's NOT a Human Being alive on this EARTH who can say Definitively that Ted Cruz is "Unequivically Eligible" to run for the Presidency of the United States ~

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   tirelesstravelerposted 8 years ago

   Well, the trouble here is the establishment is just that.  It doesn't matter if they are Democrat or Republican  they are the same.  They walk in lock step.  If you don't think so,  why has POTUS gotten everything he's  wanted the last 7 years?
   And what did we get as a New Years present?
   As a brief reminder for those who forgot or for many that didn't know
   
   Here is what happened, quietly, on January 1, 2016
   
   
   Medicare tax went from 1.45% to 2.35%
   
   Top Income tax bracket went from 35% to 39.6%
   
   Top Income payroll tax went from 37.4% to 52.2%
   
   Capital Gains tax went from 15% to 28%
   
   Dividend tax went from 15% to 39.6%
   
   Estate tax went from 0% to 55%
   
   A 3.5% Real Estate transaction tax was added. Health care.  If you didn't sell your home last year if you don't have more than 3.5% equity in it and you plan to sell don't bother.  Tax and Real Estate agent fee may take all your prophet..

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      Alternative Primeposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      I'm not sure where you get your information, hopefully not FOX Right Wing Propaganda Channel, but If you spend a little time to STUDY the Issues using reliable sources, I'm confident you'll discover there is an ENORMOUS Difference between Democrats & Republicans ~
      
      Democrats FIGHT for "We the People" while Republicans Fight for "We the Corporations" ~ That's just the way it is ~
      
      Just because the Republican Party has "Self Destructed", dosen't mean the ENTIRE Political System has followed suit ~ OUR Federal Government & Progressive Democratic Party is operating just fine while the RIGHT Side of the isle has become OBSOLETE ~
      
      P.S. ~ "Profit" NOT "Prophet"

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      GA Andersonposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      Oops! Looks like believing everything you read has made you another chain e-mail victim.
      
      Everything stated is either wrong, purposely misstated, or happened back in 2013/2015 - not 2016 - according to Politifact Truth Meter
      
      GA

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   colorfuloneposted 8 years ago

   Here's a story about the generosity of Donald Trump that most people haven't heard about. 
   
   http://www.hannity.com/articles/hanpr-e … -14289119/
   
   Trump's limo was broke down and a passer-by stopped to help.  Trump sent them flowers with a card that said "we've paid off your mortgage".    He does acts of kindness that are very generous.  I hadn't read about this one.  News to me!   
   
   When asked...Trump said that if he won that big lottery recently that he would give the money to our Veterans.  I believe he would have.
   
   When Hillary was asked what she would do with the money if she won the big lottery, she said she would use it to fund her campaign.  Big difference.

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   colorfuloneposted 8 years ago

   Cred, this was posted about four hours ago by Drudge Report with over 1 million votes cast. 
   
   TRUMP WINS DRUDGE SUPERPOLL WITH 36.05%
   SANDERS TAKES SHOW AT 29.69%
   CRUZ IN PLACE AT 19.23%

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      Alternative Primeposted 8 years agoin reply to this

      NOW for the TRUTH ~
      
      Everyone understands the FACT that "Drudge" is an Extreme RIGHT Wing Web-Site so it's NO Big Surprise a Republican would win their SLANTED Poll ~
      
      Moreover, with that Sea-Barnacle Sarah Palin CRAWLING Out of the Alaskan Woodwork and attaching herself to the DONALD's rear-end, Trump's chances of winning the Presidency more than likely just went from "Extremely SLIM to ALMOST NIL" ~ But unfortunately for the GOP, that's 100 times better than any of the other CONservative Republican Candidates ~
      
      I'm sure John McCain hasn't STOPPED Laughing since Sarah Popped her WEIRDO Head UP at Trumps' last Iowa Circus Performance ~

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         colorfuloneposted 8 years agoin reply to this

         Over 1 million votes...and Trump is in first place and Sanders in second place.
            
         If Drudge was extreme right-wing....Cruz would be in second place I think...don't you?   
         
         Ha!  Heck, Cruz would be in 1st place if the Drudge Report was extreme ring-wing (as you say) because only Cruz has a proven record of fighting for conservative values?
         
         Never mind.     (carry on as you were!)
         
         ADDED: As for Sarah Palin and John McCain...I prefer not to talk about those two.

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      Credence2posted 8 years agoin reply to this

      Thanks for the info, but I have heard the same thing about the bias preferences of this Drudge Report.

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   PrettyPantherposted 8 years ago

   I'm for Bernie, but he won't be able to get much done without a cooperative Congress, so it is important to vote out the insane, uncompromising loonies and vote in new blood who actually will work with the President to get something done.

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   ahorsebackposted 8 years ago

   I have a revelation for all , Democrats or Republicans ,   Ted Cruz is going to be the next president of the United States ,    Why you ask ?     Look at Hillary's  popularity right now , She is being trodden upon by an unknown  socialist !    Why ?  That is a good question , Is she that Boring ? Is she not but an empty pantsuit  ?  Or ........Is the democratic party looking for something new , something besides the norm ?
   
   Ted Cruz , although I'm not so sure that he's not a possible phony ,  at least represents something historically important ,a  few times in our history  America , right or left , has awakened itself  to the need of  the working mans political  trials  and elected a  candidate who returns  us to our founding ideologies !
   
   Is he  that person , that Ronald Reagan ?   Or s he a phony ?

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      Credence2posted 8 years agoin reply to this

      I think that he is a phony...

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   Perspycaciousposted 8 years ago

   What has been fooling the insiders is the depth of public disillusionment with the status quo.  It is deep, strong, and pervasive.  Those candidates voters perceive as part of it will pay the price for letting folks down.  Inactive voters are motivated and determined like never before. They want to see the real changes and compromising that President Obama promised and then failed to deliver. The mid-term elections were a prelude to what will inevitably follow, and the Old Washington Hands will be wringing.

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