.9 11 was clintons baby droped off on bushs door. bush did what was and is needed . took the fight to them.we must show up for the fight . i know it sucks but when people want war with you you give it to them.
You are right that Clinton was involved in the neglect that led up to that event. It also makes sense that if there is evidence that the perpetrators are in Afghanistan, you would send troops there... BUT THE IRAQIS HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH IT... FOR THE LAST FREAKING TIME
It's definitely difficult to figure out what happened, especially behind the scenes. I have a friend who is a magician. He is constantly doing things that don't make sense to the naked eye. I wonder if the movie Loose Change isn't a bit like that. Because it is very believable. But it is, ultimately, because it is itself part of the media, to be viewed cautiously.
It seems close-to-likely that certain individuals in government could have considered orchestrating such an event. But the argument that says that no-one has leaked info about it since anywhere in government seems reasonable too... I mean surely SOMEONE would have let on by now
fact is saddam was our man . we made him we used him to undermine iran . we made a mess we cleaned it up . same with bin laden. we must stop this proxy fighting bs . we arm and train our evintual enemys
You're right of course that Saddam was your man (I am not in America, and am not American, but I am British, and it wouldn't surprise me in the least if the British government did not also back Saddam in those days).
But I am not really convinced that you, together with the British armed forces "cleaned up" exactly. Yes, you cleaned up the dictatorship. But....
I also agree that proxy fighting is abhorrent. Both the West and the Soviets (and the Chinese) did this for half a century. Diabolical.
Islam seems to have made a mess of Iran, and I would also say Saudi Arabia. And, of course, Afghanistan. It has also contributed to the post-Saddam mess in Iraq. And it decimated Algeria. (Of course, there are different kinds of Islam, so it's not quite as simple as all that. I mean, did Christianity make a mess of Ireland.... not a simple issue...).
But the truth is that there are plenty of messes that have nothing to do with religion. They have to do with CORRUPTION, GREED AND POWER-GRABBING
Actually I would say that, in many countries, the suppression of people by their own government is the problem. In the case of Iran, this is done because of religious belief. "Islamists" like the Taliban do it for the same reasons (or claim to). But many "Muslim" states are simply ruled either by military juntas or kings who pretend to have democracy but don't really.
Muslim people in general would LOVE to have the kind of democracy you and I take for granted in the US, Canada, Germany, Britain, etc. Who doesn't want a real say in how their own country is run, let's be honest.
Perhaps the real question is whether we can use the corruption and power-grabbing going on in other places (not just Muslim) as mirrors to examine our own leaders...
every where you look millions are being killed and suppressed by mere thousands . in africa 1000 troops assail a refugee camp where 30 000 are then slaughtered . how can this be? why dont the masses stampede .
If you mean the masses here in the West in the face of such atrocity, I completely agree with you.
If you mean the masses in Africa, I am not sure how you stand up to people with machine guns and rocket launchers. I believe the reason that the millions of Germans who did not like the Nazis did not stampede is because they knew their families would be taken away in the night if they did. Even though the Nazi government was only composed of a few thousand.
But we in the West have no such excuses. We are just criminally complacent... back to your personal responsibility point
Thanks. I guess it's important to see that other people often have something you agree with in their statements, even if you don't agree with the main point. You might as well point out where you agree, so they don't think you disagree with everything.
I also think logic is important. The whole "God is all-compassionate and capable of intervening but chooses to respect our free-will instead" is simply illogical to me. I am not particularly religious, but I would agree with a religious point of view if it fits with what I see to be logical. God could save all of those children suffering right now but chooses not to? Not logical.
On the other hand, lifting up the life of Jesus as something to emulate seems perfectly logical to me, because for the most part he embodied compassion in what he did.
So, that's my take. I can't say Islam never does any harm. Clearly it does. I don't think Islam is the reason for all of the world's ills.. that just seems stupid to me. Many people are inspired BY Islam to do good works. It just never gets reported by CNN.
If I just wanted a fight, I'd go learn a martial art, not hang out on Hubpages.
Indeed. Besides, true debate that is not simply a slagging match sharpens your own wit. And God knows we could all use that. (That song "We won't get fooled again" comes to mind every time I think of the Bush-Cheney Iraq=9/11 swindle. But I am sure we will)
To be honest, I don't think either president in the last decade has done a very good job regarding terrorism. I do not understand the logic of spending all of this money in Afghanistan-Pakistan, when al Qaeda could EASILY just move off somewhere else. The PLO used to move around all the time. And Osama himself used to be in the Sudan (that's why Clinton bombed them).
I actually am not sure it is possible to stop terrorism to be honest. But, hey, what do I know. I certainly am no terrorism expert
I actually completely agree. I am suspicious of all this labelling... I mean, surely it was an act of terrorism, right? Well, maybe, not 100 percent sure - but at the very least, there is an argument for this
I don't know who this is addressed to. But if you think you have the authority to end a thread.... (muffled laughter).
I, for one, just SAID that the conspiracy theory probably isn't realistic. Perhaps you should learn to read.
There were no cases of terrorism perpetrated by American citizens under Bush. Fine. But September 11th was the first attack on American soil by non-Americans since Pearl Harbor. Clinton set the stage for it, but Bush had been in power nearly two years when it happened... should he share NONE of the blame???
Technically I guess you are right. You can define domestic terrorism as terrorism perpetrated by an American. That is true. So technically Giuliani was not wrong... technically.
What I do not understand, however, is why you are not outraged at the snakey, sneaky way ALL politicians try to fool the American people with this sort of language trick.
I mean, there WAS a terrorist attack in 2001. Maybe none of them were Americans, but there WAS a terrorist attack. Maybe Gore would not have stopped it either. Quite probable...
But what is going on is that Giuliani is trying to FOOL you. Doesn't that bother you???
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