The Right receives a great black eye in Europe

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   Credence2posted 2 years ago

   https://news.yahoo.com/macron-france-el … 43781.html
   
   At least the French people know extreme and madness when they see it. They clearly voted LePen and her rightwing away. One less area of concern on the geopolitical map.
   
   Great news, just saying....

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      Nathanvilleposted 2 years agoin reply to this

      Yep, defiantly great news.

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         Credence2posted 2 years agoin reply to this

         We had a time when Trump's people was trying to curry favor with various authoritarian groups across the European continent. I am relieved that wiser minds prevailed during the onslaught as reflected in what and who the French people trusted to hold the reins of Government.

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            Nathanvilleposted 2 years agoin reply to this

            Yep, defiantly:
            
            What might interest you is the current political make-up of the EU’s Parliament.
            
            In the Chart Below:-
            
            For a reference point – The Republicans would align with the ECR (European Conservatives and Reformists Group), who have just 64 seats; and the Democrats would align with the EPP (European Peoples Party)(Christian Democrats), which with a 177 seats is the largest political group in the EU.
            
            And of course the British Labour Party would align with the S&D (Progressive Alliance of Socialists and Democrats; the 2nd largest party in the EU Parliament with 145 seats – which shows far more left-wing politics stretched in Europe and UK compared to the USA.
            
            The extreme parties; which we wouldn’t want to see winning absolute power are the Identity and Democracy (ID) on the extreme right; with 9.2% of the seats, and of course the 5.5% on the extreme left.
            
            

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               Credence2posted 2 years agoin reply to this

               To get a better understanding of what is "extreme" in British politics, I am curious as to what are the kinds of policies that the extremist end of either pole would advocate?

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                  Nathanvilleposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                  Good question:  There isn't a simple answer.  I’ll answer in respect to the UK as a whole, and then cover each of the four nations of the UK separately as the politics for the UK as a whole is different to the politics in each of the four nations (England, Northern Ireland, Scotland and Wales).
                  
                  In UK national politics e.g. Parliament in Westminster, London, the most extreme parties of importance are Labour (left) and Conservative (right). 
                  
                  Within the Conservative party is a political group on the far right of the party who call themselves the ERG (European Research Group).  Although Boris Johnson is not a ERG member, he was supportive of them as a means of getting their support in his bid to become the Conservative Party Leader, and thus the ERG was instrumental in getting Boris Johnson elected as the Conservative Party Leader, and in return when the Conservatives won the General Election and Boris Johnson became Prime Minister he rewarded the ERG’s support by promoting many of them e.g. Priti Patel to senior ministerial posts on the Government’s Cabinet (a position of power).
                  
                  The ERG are:-
                  
                  •    Right-wing Nationalists.
                  •    Anti EU, and
                  •    Anti-Immigration
                  •    Pro Privatisation/anti nationalisation
                  •    Pro nuclear power and pro-nuclear defence.
                  
                  At the other extreme, within the Labour Party, on the far-left of the Labour Party are the Corbynites e.g. Socialist politicians who are:-
                  
                  *       not nationalists,
                  *       not anti-immigration,
                  *       not anti-EU,
                  *       very pro nationalisation, and
                  *       anti-nuclear, including a desire for Britain to scrap Britain's nuclear deterrent. 
                  
                  Below, link to the last Labour General Election Manifesto:-
                  
                  https://labour.org.uk/wp-content/upload … ifesto.pdf
                  
                  Both the Welsh and Scottish Governments are Socialist Governments, with the SNP (Scottish National Party) being the Government in power in Scotland.  The SNP is more radical than the Welsh Government, with their prime policies of the SNP being:
                  
                  *      ‘anti-English’,
                  *      ‘Pro-EU’,
                  *       Pro Renewable Energy’,
                  *       anti-fracking.
                  
                  The most extreme political parties in the UK are in Northern Ireland, with the DUP (Democratic Unionist Party) being far more right-wing than the Conservatives, and Sinn Fein being far more left-wing than Labour.
                  
                  The DUP (the political wing of the terrorist group that used to fight the IRA) are Protestants and stand for:-
                  
                  •    Anti-Abortion
                  •    Anti-gay
                  •    Anti-EU
                  •    Pro English
                  
                  While Sinn Fein (the political wing of the IRA) are Catholics, and stand for:-
                  
                  •    Pro-Abortion
                  •    Pro-Gay
                  •    Pro-EU
                  •    Anti- English
                  
                  Under the Northern Ireland Peace Treaty of 1998 (Good Friday Agreement) the Government can only legal operate if both DUP and Sinn Fein ‘Power Share’ make decisions and laws together. 
                  
                  Surprisingly the Northern Ireland Power Sharing Government has worked reasonable well from its creation in 1999, except for a period of three years from Jan 2017 to Jan 2020 when the two parties had a spat where the DUP were caught giving back-handers in a ‘Renewable Energy’ scam, and refused to apologies to Sinn Fein for their indiscretion, so Sinn Fein refused to sit on the Northern Ireland Government.  Then, late in 2019 when Sinn Fein was ready to re-sit in their Government, the DUP refused to resume their Government, to their loss. 
                  
                  Under the Peace Treaty Agreement, in the event that the two sides can’t work together then the power of Governing Northern Ireland fall to Westminster e.g. Boris Johnson.  Late in 2019 Boris Johnson threatened the DUP that if they continued to refuse to resume the Northern Ireland Government then the British Government (Boris Johnson) will pass laws in Northern Ireland to legalise gay rights e.g. same sex marriages (as Northern Ireland was the only part of the UK where same sex marriages was illegal because it’s something the DUP are prejudice against.  DUP called Boris Johnson’s bluff and lost e.g. gay marriages was legalised in Northern Ireland.
                  
                  But as from Jan 2020 the two extreme sides have resumed power sharing in Northern Ireland.
                  
                  This is how ‘Power Sharing’ Works in Northern Ireland:  https://youtu.be/FzspzvkDlrY

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                     Credence2posted 2 years agoin reply to this

                     Thanks for the explanation, Arthur. I used your comment to make some comparisons and contrasts.
                     
                     Looking up info about the ERG, sounds a lot like our current Republicans. The different and problem being that their attitudes are in mainstream of American politics rather than at the periphery.
                     
                     The SNP takes on much of the laundry list of the Democratic Party here  and is mostly mainstream. I speak primarily about renewable energy and opposition to fracking. The Democrats are more concerned about environmental degradation. The Republicans are about business and profits and whoever and whatever gets in the way, be it an oil spill or threatening a species of wildlife, is immaterial to them.
                     
                     With the DUP, I am home, this is our Republican Party to a T.
                     The anti abortion and anti gay stance by them is what is clearly illuminated in American politics, today.
                     
                     Our extreme left is not quite that of yours. We all acknowledge the need for a nuclear deterrent, it is just that defense spending is too often over the top and not justified in the face of pressing domestic concerns. Socialism in the form of nationalizing industries is never even considered, as this is a capitalist economy. Democrats are less fearful of immigration as the Republicans seem to be concerned about immigrant entry as altering the American culture, whatever that is.

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                        Nathanvilleposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                        Thanks for the comparisons, most enlightening.  I mentioned the extremes in British politics as asked, so I didn’t cover the Liberal Democrats, and what they stand for; as the Liberal Democrats are a centralist party e.g. in the middle of the political spectrum in British politics.
                        
                        So briefly, the main politics of the British Liberal Democrats is:-
                        
                        •    To raise the tax on wages modestly so as to spend more money Health & Education.
                        •    Pro-Renewable Energy.
                        •    To re-join the EU.
                        •    Reform the electoral system e.g. to introduce Proportional Representation.
                        
                        Liberal Democrats last Election Manifesto: https://www.libdems.org.uk/plan
                        
                        Certainly in the UK the Conservatives are capitalists, but not anywhere near as ruthless as the Republicans in the USA; in the UK the Conservatives take a more balanced view. 
                        
                        The ERG, the hard right in the Conservatives are not partially green, but the main stream Conservative party is quite green and committed to net-zero carbon emissions by 2050.
                        
                        Fracking has been banned in Scotland by the SNP; while for England and Wales although the Conservatives Government are not anti-fracking per se they did deliberately introduce Regulations that makes fracking in England and Wales commercially unviable – the one company that did attempt to frack, in trying to comply with the Regulations, just went bankrupt.  The Regulations that the UK Conservative Government imposed was that “if fracking induces quakes above 0.5 magnitude then all drilling must cease for 18 hours.”
                        
                        UK halts fracking amid earthquake fears: Should it be banned?  https://youtu.be/daPTa8Oi5gY
                        
                        Since it’s become internationally accepted on how serious and urgent the issue of climate change (global warming) has become; Environmental issues have ceased to be political in the UK, and virtually all political parties in the UK supports a lot of the Environment policies; which makes it easier for different political parties to work together on these issues.
                        
                        As mentioned below yesterday, we’ve just had Local and Local Government Elections across the whole of the UK, and the counts for England started overnight, so some results are in; although the full results will not be known until the end of the day.  The counts for Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland don’t start until this morning.
                        
                        For England, so far half the Local Government results have been counted; and the picture at the half-way point is heavy losses for the Conservatives while all the other political parties are making good gains; as follows:-
                        
                        •    Conservatives have LOST 124 seats, and lost control of 6 Councils (Local Governments).
                        
                        •    Labour has gained 38 seats, and gained control of 3 Councils (Local Governments).
                        
                        •    Liberal democrats have gained 57 seats, and gained control of 1 Council (Local Government).
                        
                        •    Residents Associations have gained 6 seats.
                        
                        •    Green Party has gained 23 seats.
                        
                        •    Reform UK (Pro EU party) has gained 2 seats.
                        
                        •    UKIP (Anti EU Party) has lost 2 seats.
                        
                        •    2 more Councils have gone into NOC (No Overall Control) e.g. where a coalition government will have to be formed in order to govern.

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                        1. 92

                           Nathanvilleposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                           As of end of day on Friday 6th May, most results are now in; and at this point the results of the Local Elections in England, Wales, Scotland and the General Election for the Northern Ireland Government, are as follows:-
                           
                           As you can see from the results the Conservatives have taken a beating from the voters, while all other political parties have made big gains.
                           
                           In ENGLAND:-
                           •    Conservatives has lost 341 seats, and lost control of 10 Local Councils (Local Government).
                           •    Labour has gained 52 seats, and gained control of an additional 5 Local Councils (Local Governments).
                           •    Liberal Democrats have gained 191 seats, and gained control of an additional 3 Local Governments (Councils).
                           •    Independent Councillors (local politicians) have gained an additional 28 seats.
                           •    Green Party has gained an additional 60 seats.
                           •    Residents’ Associations have gained 10 seats.
                           •    Reform UK (Pro EU) has gained 2 seats.
                           •    UKIP (Brexit Party) has lost 2 seats.
                           •    2 additional Councils now with NOC (No Overall Control) e.g. Coalitions.
                           
                           
                           In WALES:-
                           •    Conservatives has lost 82 seats, and lost control of one Local Government.
                           •    Labour has gained 65 seats, and gained control of an additional Local Government.
                           •    Plaid Cymru has lost 9 seats, but gained control of three additional Local Governments.
                           •    Independent Councillors gain 7 seats but lose control of 2 Local Councils (Local Governments).
                           •    Liberal Democrats gain 11 seats.
                           •    The Green Party gain 8 seats.
                           •    One less Local Government with NOC (No Overall Control).
                           
                           In SCOTLAND:-
                           •    Conservatives lost 63 seats.
                           •    Independent Councillors (local politicians) lost 15 seats.
                           •    Scottish National Party gain 22 seats, and gain control of an additional Local Government (Council).
                           •    Labour gain 20 seats, and gain control of an additional Local Government (Council).
                           •    Liberal Democrats gain 20 seats.
                           •    The Green Party gain 16 seats
                           •    Two less Local Governments with NOC (No Overall Control).
                           
                           In Northern Ireland:  Only a third of the votes counted so far, but Sinn Féin is set to win a landslide victory, which will be a first time that a Nationalist Party has won the most seats in Northern Ireland; and it will put Sinn Fein one step closer to achieving their goal of a referendum in Ireland for Northern Ireland to leave the UK and be re-united with the Republic of Ireland.

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                           1. 79

                              Credence2posted 2 years agoin reply to this

                              Arthur, the Conservatives have done badly this round. Care to guess as why they did so badly time time across the board?  Some sort of albatross is being hung around their necks in the mind of so many voters. What is the issue or issues that can explain this drastic loss?

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                                 Nathanvilleposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                                 The two main issues that have come up time and time again in these local elections are:-
                                 
                                 1.    Partygate:  Boris Johnson (and other Senior Conservative MPs) breaking his own Laws on Covid Rules by holding numerous social parties when they were illegal during the pandemic; and subsequently being the first sitting Prime Minister ever to have been found guilty by the police for breaking the law.
                                 
                                 2.    Cost of Living, spurred on by the worldwide gas crisis this winter, followed by the worldwide gas & oil crisis due to the Ukrainians war.
                                 
                                 An increasing number of Conservative MPs see Boris as a liability, so it is quite likely that the Conservative Party will dump Boris as their leader before the next General Election in a couple of years.

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                                    Credence2posted 2 years agoin reply to this

                                    Thanks, Arthur.
                                    
                                    Leaders that have been free to break the law has been commonplace around here..

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                                       Nathanvilleposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                                       Yes I know, and it puts a bad light on democracy.  Until Boris, politicians in the UK have had a good track record of doing the honourable thing and resigning, for even minor matters compared to what we see American politicians do e.g. resigning for having an affair etc.
                                       
                                       For example in 1996 a Conservative politician (Rod Richards MP) resigned just 18 hours after his extramarital affair was made public.  https://www.irishtimes.com/news/tory-mi … ed-1.55046
                                       
                                       At the time, Conservative politician, David Evans MP said “People who accept high office, a minister of the Crown, or wear an England shirt have to set an example. There are standards to be set and if a minister misbehaves in this way then that is it." 
                                       
                                       And of course the famous CCTV footage of a more recent extramarital affair where last summer the Conservative Health Secretary (Senior Conservative Politician) resigned from the Government for being caught kissing his aide.  The CCTV footage was made public by The Sun Newspaper, the Sun Newspaper being a staunch Conservative Paper, but they do like a good controversy.  https://youtu.be/wh8KscD256c

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                           Nathanvilleposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                           As of end of day on Friday 6th May, most results are now in; and at this point the results of the Local Elections in England, Wales, Scotland and the General Election for the Northern Ireland Government, are as follows:-
                           
                           As you can see from the results the Conservatives have taken a beating from the voters, while all other political parties have made big gains.
                           
                           In ENGLAND:-
                           •    Conservatives has lost 341 seats, and lost control of 10 Local Councils (Local Government).
                           •    Labour has gained 52 seats, and gained control of an additional 5 Local Councils (Local Governments).
                           •    Liberal Democrats have gained 191 seats, and gained control of an additional 3 Local Governments (Councils).
                           •    Independent Councillors (local politicians) have gained an additional 28 seats.
                           •    Green Party has gained an additional 60 seats.
                           •    Residents’ Associations have gained 10 seats.
                           •    Reform UK (Pro EU) has gained 2 seats.
                           •    UKIP (Brexit Party) has lost 2 seats.
                           •    2 additional Councils now with NOC (No Overall Control) e.g. Coalitions.
                           
                           
                           In WALES:-
                           
                           
                           •    Conservatives has lost 82 seats, and lost control of one Local Government.
                           •    Labour has gained 65 seats, and gained control of an additional Local Government.
                           •    Plaid Cymru has lost 9 seats, but gained control of three additional Local Governments.
                           •    Independent Councillors gain 7 seats but lose control of 2 Local Councils (Local Governments).
                           •    Liberal Democrats gain 11 seats.
                           •    The Green Party gain 8 seats.
                           •    One less Local Government with NOC (No Overall Control).
                           
                           In SCOTLAND:-
                           •    Conservatives lost 63 seats.
                           •    Independent Councillors (local politicians) lost 15 seats.
                           •    Scottish National Party gain 22 seats, and gain control of an additional Local Government (Council).
                           •    Labour gain 20 seats, and gain control of an additional Local Government (Council).
                           •    Liberal Democrats gain 20 seats.
                           •    The Green Party gain 16 seats
                           •    Two less Local Governments with NOC (No Overall Control).
                           In Northern Ireland:  Only a third of the votes counted so far, but Sinn Féin is set to win a landslide victory, which will be a first time that a Nationalist Party has won the most seats in Northern Ireland; and it will put Sinn Fein one step closer to achieving their goal of a referendum in Ireland for Northern Ireland to leave the UK and be re-united with the Republic of Ireland.

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                  Nathanvilleposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                  And addendum to my above comments:-
                  
                  Today is voting day for Local Government Elections and Mayoral Elections across the whole of the UK; so today will be a reflection of what people think of the National Government e.g. although in local elections people should be voting on local issues, a lot of voters will be influenced by national issues.
                  
                  Some interesting points in today’s Local Elections that will be worth watching are:-
                  
                  •    16 year olds will be voting in Scotland and Wales (Wales for the first time), so it will be interesting to see what influence that has on Welsh politics.
                  
                  •    Mayoral elections is Proportional  Representation, all other elections are still first past the post system; except that  the Scottish Government has actually introduced Proportional Representation for elections in Scotland, so it will be interesting to see what effect that has on Scottish politics.
                  
                  •    And in Northern Ireland Sinn Fein is expected to do exceptionally well in their re-election of the Northern Ireland Government, becoming the largest party, and one step closer to calling for a Referendum to get Northern Ireland reunited with the Republic of Ireland (in other words, break away from the UK).  Conversely, DUP (Democratic Unionist Party) are threatening not to sit in their Parliament (meaning that the under the 1998 peace treaty the Northern Ireland Parliament would be suspended again (a legal requirement for power sharing).  DUP’s gripe is with the UK Government in that as part of the Brexit agreement the border between the EU and UK had to go somewhere, and it couldn’t go down between the Republic of Ireland and Northern Ireland as that would break the 1998 Peace Treaty (re-spark civil war in Northern Ireland), so the UK Government agreed to put the border between mainland Britain and the island of Ireland, effectively cutting Northern Ireland off from the rest of the UK.

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   Stephen Tomkinsonposted 2 years ago

   I agree, Credence.  It was a victory against extremism. Macron has been cleverly straddling the center ground of French politics. The way that the system works - a run-off between two candidates - effectively means that any opposition to Macron was bound to be extreme. Le Pen's relatively high vote reflects that Macron is not universally popular.

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      Credence2posted 2 years agoin reply to this

      Now, if we just had a little more of that common sense in American politics......
      
      It is concerning that LePen did much better than the last time. Those advocates of democracy and moderation need to take notice, so as they won't have to experience what we here in America are currently experiencing.

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      1. 79

         Kathryn L Hillposted 2 years agoin reply to this

         What would common-sense look like to you?
         I would say we need to curb the formation of monopolies.
         Do you agree?

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            Credence2posted 2 years agoin reply to this

            Yes, that is certainly part of it...

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         Ken Burgessposted 2 years agoin reply to this

         Sometimes we agree on so much Cred, but your belief in our politicians, as reprehensible as they are, just makes it unbridgeable.
         
         I watched a few minutes of Biden during the white house correspondents dinner, what an arrogant, pretentious prick he is.
         
         Very dismissive of America's "deplorables"... and trust me, that is YOU just as much as it is me, Biden and the click he represents, don't care at all how badly you struggle or suffer, they only care about keeping themselves in power.

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         1. 79

            Credence2posted 2 years agoin reply to this

            We can agree on much of the "big picture". But, the devil is found in the details.
            
            Yet, the Trump, McConnell, DeSantis and the other cast of characters in that clique does not give me any more reason to expect competence nor experience comfort.
            
            Politicians have always been the same, the quality of which has generally declined over the last two to three generations. None of them care in the final analysis, it is just that some, on top of that, add additional angst.

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            1. 71

               Ken Burgessposted 2 years agoin reply to this

               I don't consider Trump, or DeSantis to be in their clique.
               
               They are outsiders and will always be considered abhorrent entities and the clique's enemies, they are hated more than Putin ever will be by that group.
               
               But you are correct, the quality of politicians has declined.
               
               Just like investigative reporters have all but ceased to exist.
               
               We have more access to information than ever before, politicians can be seen and heard by people easier than ever before...
               
               Yet this is what we got.
               
               Its become a Bread & Circuses society, our politicians generate public approval, not by excellence in public service or public policy, but by diversion, distraction or by satisfying the most immediate or base requirements of their supporters. With the backing of a compromised and compliant MSM.

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               1. 79

                  Credence2posted 2 years agoin reply to this

                  No, Trump, DeSantis and McConnell are in their own clique. I consider their clique to measure a damn site lower.
                  
                  NO ONE has the authority to do what Trump and the GOP did regarding the 2020 election.
                  
                  You cannot disrupt the orderly transfer of power without "irrefutable" evidence proving fraud. Despite the excuses and lame explanations from conservatives, we have yet to see any proof.
                  
                  You cannot attempt to change a slate of authorized electors to change an election's outcome. Let's face it, that is what Trump and GOP attempted to do.
                  
                  You do not assign a role to the Vice President of rendering an election null and void solely on the basis of suspicion not anchored with any proof.
                  
                  I agree to play along as long as we follow the procedures established under the Constitution of the United States, when you don't, I consider this to be a breach of contract. This is what is meant by the "consent of the governed". Anyone breaking the rules in such a way is not fit to be my leader.
                  
                  People that do this threaten my democracy in a way in which I shall not abide.
                  
                  Those are the sort of "outsiders" that I don't need.

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                  1. 71

                     Ken Burgessposted 2 years agoin reply to this

                     I know you like to bring all things back to Jan 6th and your belief that it was an attempt to overthrow the government.
                     
                     But I'm not going that route, you'll have to go talk to Esoteric, he loves nothing better than to talk about Trump.
                     
                     I simply stated Trump and Desantis are not part of that clique.
                     
                     That clique that considers you and all Americans not the likes of which are found in that correspondent's dinner the other night annoying and troublesome.
                     
                     That clique that cares only about retaining their power and wealth and ensuring there is no one that comes along to disrupt their control.
                     
                     That self-absorbed, pretentious, arrogant, clique that is happily sending our economy into the gutters at record pace.  While they still fly around on their jets, eat their 5 star dinners, and in general do as they please.

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                        Credence2posted 2 years agoin reply to this

                        Well, Ken, this will be just another one of those times when we do not agree...

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3. 74

   Kathleen Cochranposted 2 years ago

   Think about this for a minute. Secretary Clinton got three million more votes but lost. She came to the inauguration, sat on the podium, and watched the man who lost to her take the oath of office. Trump lost by seven million votes and wouldn't even show up. America doesn't need anybody with that poor character in any position of power ever again. Add to that January 6 and the big lie. How can any reasonable person support that?

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      wildernessposted 2 years agoin reply to this

      How can anyone support a president that refuses to even try to fulfill their sworn oath (Obama, Biden on immigration)?  Obama even went so far as to make it legal to avoid the law!
      
      How can one support a president that thinks printing money is the solution to all things?  A known, understood, primary component of inflation the world has seen over and over, yet Biden did just that (and now tries to say our inflation was not due to his poorly thought out actions).
      
      As always any more it is the lesser of two evils.  Personally I would rather hear a boorish person, with a foul mouth, than suffer through the massive inflation we are seeing, or have to support millions upon millions of criminals crossing our borders.  Our country, our culture, our living standards, are far more important than how aristocratic a President is, or was.

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   IslandBitesposted 2 years ago

   Not Europe but...
   
   Australian voters deliver strong message on climate, ending conservative government's 9-year rule
   
   Australian voters have delivered a sharp rebuke to the center-right government, ending nine years of conservative rule, in favor of the center-left opposition that promised stronger action on climate change.

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