Biden Claims He Will Stop Sending Bombs And Artillery To Israel

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   Sharlee01posted 7 months ago

   
   
   
   Biden announced on Wednesday that he would cease sending bombs and artillery shells to Israel if it initiated a significant military invasion into the southern Gaza city of Rafah. This statement follows media reports that Israeli forces seemed prepared to escalate operations in the densely populated city of 1.7 million, despite strong advisories against such actions from the U.S. government. 
   
   “I made it clear that if they go into Rafah — they haven’t gone in Rafah yet — if they go into Rafah, I’m not supplying the weapons that have been used historically to deal with Rafah, to deal with the cities — that deal with that problem,”  President Biden
   
   Thoughts

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      Readmikenowposted 7 months agoin reply to this

      As a sovereign nation, Israel has the right to procure its bombs and artillery shells from other countries.
      
      This is what Ukraine has had to do many times.
      
      The biden administration is not held in the highest esteem by our foreign allies.  It has a reputation of abandoning allies when they find themselves in a difficult situation.  This is just more proof of it.

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         Sharlee01posted 7 months agoin reply to this

         "Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu refrained from directly commenting on Biden's remarks, but on Thursday afternoon, he reposted a video on X from a speech he delivered earlier this week saying: "If Israel is forced to stand alone, Israel will stand alone."
         
         One would not have imagined that A US president would turn on a valued ally to buy votes.  In my view, this shows a vileness that is hard to imagine.

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            Willowarborposted 7 months agoin reply to this

            How many innocent people, children need to die before it becomes vile?

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               Sharlee01posted 7 months agoin reply to this

               People die in wars, this is obvious, and this is a historical fact.  Many are dying in Ukraine, yet no protests. 500, 000 died in Syria. Not to mention 9/11... People die in war, period.  Hopefully, Israel will push ahead more quickly to take Gaza and end the war. Terrorists deserve no land, they deserve nowhere to hide on this earth, in my view.
               
               Thus far what has been vile is babys put in micros, women mutilated and raped, and many killed in their homes while loved ones were made to watch... So I have no sympathy for Hamas or those who voted them in to represent them.  I hope that once and for all these people will seek peace, and stop warring with a peaceful people that just hope to live and enjoy their lives.

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   Willowarborposted 7 months ago

   Can I ask who believes that Israel needs military assistance from the US to prosecute a war against a loosely organized terrorist group? By all accounts they  (Hamas) have rudimentary weaponry, no real command structure in Gaza and  no air capabilities, unless you count hang gliders LOL ?   
   The Israeli army is one of the most sophisticated in the world.  Seems like they would be capable even with one arm tied behind every soldier's back to wipe out the entire population of Gaza... Quite easily.   17%, of all Israel's losses have come not at the hands of Hamas but from mishaps on its own... Friendly fire and even incidences of them running over their own soldiers with tanks.  It seems pretty clear that the IDF is meeting little resistance. But they need our help? For what exactly?

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      Sharlee01posted 7 months agoin reply to this

      "Can I ask who believes that Israel needs military assistance from the US to prosecute a war against a loosely organized terrorist group? "
      
      How would anyone be able to answer this on this forum?
      
      " By all accounts they  (Hamas) have rudimentary weaponry, no real command structure in Gaza and  no air capabilities, unless you count hang gliders"
      https://apnews.com/article/israel-hamas … materials.
      
      Perhaps they should have not decided to butcher over 1000 Jewish civilians. Seems they have a lack of intelligence to start a war with a Nation that is well equipt with weapons.  But they did, did they not?
      
      "The Israeli army is one of the most sophisticated in the world.  Seems like they would be capable even with one arm tied behind every soldier's back of wiping out the entire population of Gaza... Quite easily."
      
      Yes very true, and gives good proof that Israel has taken as much care as they could to pursue wiping out their enemy.
      
      "Most of the aid—approximately $3.3 billion a year—is provided as grants under the Foreign Military Financing (FMF) program, funds that Israel must use to purchase U.S. military equipment and services. Israel has also historically been permitted to use a portion of its FMF aid to buy equipment from Israeli defense firms—a benefit not granted to other recipients of U.S. military aid—but this domestic procurement is to be phased out in the next few years. U.S. aid reportedly accounts for some 15 percent of Israel’s defense budget. Israel, like many other countries, also buys U.S. military products outside of the FMF program."
      https://www.cfr.org/article/us-aid-israel-four-charts
      
      believe a significant aspect of the issue lies in Biden's alignment with certain viewpoints that are perceived as sympathetic to terrorists.

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         Willowarborposted 7 months agoin reply to this

         From the AP source.
         
         "Hamas fighters are typically armed only with what they can carry and employ hit-and-run tactics against lopsided Israeli advantages in arms and technology."
         
         There is no sympathy for terrorists but for innocent people. 
         
         Ukraine is fighting an organized, capable Russian military.  Israel is "fighting" a street gang.   
         
         About 75% of Gaza's population is under the age of 25.  This situation is not of their making. 
         
         "Perhaps they should have not decided to butcher over 1000 Jewish civilians."
         
         Does Hamas act with the direction, with the permission of the people of Gaza?  I don't think they do since there hasn't been an election in 20 years.  I suppose it's tough to get out from under authoritarian rule once it's taken hold.  Gaza is not a democracy. I don't know if people realize that there is actually no governing structure within Gaza itself. The so called leaders of Hamas live in five star hotels in Doha Qatar.
         
         But I'm still waiting for that investigation, which Netanyahu will not let go forward, the details why Hamas was able to murder with no response from the IDF for many , many hours.  We have witnesses from those kibbutz that help didn't come for up to 8 hours. 
         
         Israel may kill many who associate themselves with Hamas but the ideology won't be extinguished by war, actually I'd guess it will only embed it more firmly.  I don't know, it's hard to get into the mindset of the 10 year old currently starving to death among the rubble of Gaza. Probably a good bet  that child's mind will be pliable to terrorist recruiters. And the cycle will continue. 
         
         In my view, enough is enough already. I don't support American dollars in this so-called war.  Not because I sympathize with terrorists but because I can't find a justification to continuing to kill innocent people who have had no part in the decisions  of Hamas.

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            Readmikenowposted 7 months agoin reply to this

            I disagree.  Hamas is an army complete with rockets, small arms as well as missiles and more.  They are organized and well-funded by Iran.  They and their followers must be destroyed at all costs for the safety of Israel.
            
            This is a war.  It takes trained soldiers to eliminate them.  I support Israel and how they are conducting this war.  They have been put in a situation where they have no other choice.
            
            The palestinians have supported hamas.  They have said nothing as the terrorist tunnels were build.  They train their CHILDREN to hate jews and how to conduct military missions.  If they do not want hamas in power, they could remove them from power.  Citizens have done this often in the over time.  The civilian deaths are the responsibility of hamas who willingly sacrifices civilians when it benefits them.  Hiding behind civilians is how hamas conducts war. 
            
            "To enable its genocidal atrocities, Hamas created a conventional army able to overrun Israel Defense Forces (IDF) posts on its way to the border communities. Having seized multiple positions as far as 25 kilometers into Israel from the 60-km Gaza border, some of the Hamas cadres held their ground and attempted to defend against the coming IDF counter, which defeated them within several days and initiated a ground incursion into Gaza. The IDF says that at least 278 Israeli soldiers were among the dead of October 7. Indeed, this war has featured a clash of military forces to seize or defend territory and followed defined frontlines and orders of battle. It is now clear that Hamas possesses and is willing to use conventional military power alongside its traditional terrorist tactics.
            
            Hamas acquired its military capabilities through years of fighting experience, training, Iranian tutelage, and resource accumulation. It learned to adapt irregular and terrorist tactics for conventional warfare. I trace the development of Hamas’s conventional warfighting capabilities and place it within a larger pattern of armed nonstate actors seeking to form armies. Because Hamas is now clearly an army, and not only a terrorist group, the ongoing IDF conventional campaign against it must continue until the group can no longer control territory.
            
            "Hamas has shown a significant degree of military capability deployed on October 7 to enable it to commit the atrocities of that day. It leveraged its training and experience using irregular tactics. Hamas has so far not performed well as an urban defender and relied more on information warfare and its hostages to keep the IDF from advancing.
            
            However, an underperforming army is still an army, and conventional ground operations must continue to completely dislodge Hamas from the territory it holds. A counterterrorism approach centered on precision strikes on high-value targets and special forces raids, as some officials and observers have called for, will not suffice for the task of collapsing Hamas’s combat brigades. Once Hamas can no longer hold territory, Israel can shift back to such an approach to hunt down terrorist remnants that attempt to carry on an insurgency. As long as Hamas controls Gaza, it will continue to regenerate combat power and improve its military capabilities, as it has done following previous more limited Israeli campaigns against it. "
            
            https://www.washingtoninstitute.org/pol … built-army

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            Sharlee01posted 7 months agoin reply to this

            .I will be honest, I don't care if Hamas is fighting with pea shooters. They butchered human beings, in horrendous ways. So, I don't think we have anywhere to go with this conversation. One thing I am is bluntly honest. I have every hope that Israel goes full out in this war, and sends whoever is left into any other country that will take them. Middle Eastern nations want nothing to do with these warring people. It's sad for civilians the young have been caught up in a war. I doubt they will choose war after they see the result of war after Israel has finished this war. I very much doubt they will have a land to live in or a land where they will be welcome. The Middle Eastern nations as of late seek living in peace. Evidenced by The Abraham Accords. Trump was making attempts to make peace between Palestine and Israel.
            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trump_pea … 0conflict.
            
            I don't want to spend a dime on any war, period.

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               Willowarborposted 7 months agoin reply to this

               Where are these 'warring people"?  I see them pathetically shuffling back and forth on donkey carts  to points that Israel tells them it's safe and then consequently bombs them.  I see them drinking salt water, starving, and eating animal feed.  Hamas itself has given little to no resistance to the Israeli army. Where are the examples of the "warring " Palestinian people fighting?
               
                 Now Ukraine would be a different story, wouldn't it? With even the idea of a Russian invasion, we saw these grandmothers learning how to make molotov cocktails and grandpa's enlisting in the army... Really a truly warring people, right? Ready to hand Russians their asses and good for them.  Absolutely more power to them.
               
               The Palestinian people in the same circumstance?  Eh, they're not really choosing to fight are they?  I don't know, not so much or not even at all.
               
               I would expect a "warring" people to be thwarting the Israeli efforts at every turn, causing casualties... Are there any accounts?  Where is the resistance movement?
               Sort of just looks like these people want to live.
               
               It's also hard for me to accept a blanket label of an entire people. I mean how could we blanket label the American people? A stupid people? An easily lead people?  Can we do that? Can we put a blanket label on all of us?

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                  Readmikenowposted 7 months agoin reply to this

                  "Hamas itself has given little to no resistance to the Israeli army."
                  
                  Where do you come up with this stuff?  There have been over 590 Israeli soldiers killed in Gaza conflict since Oct.  That is NOT little to no resistance.  I bet you aren't aware how difficult urban warfare is and that is what the IDF is facing.
                  
                  I bet if you were able to be with the IDF in Gaza on a day to day basis and see what they are facing you'd have a whole different perception of things.
                  
                  It is so easy for people to sit in their comfortable homes and pass judgment.  Same thing during the Iraq/Afghanistan war.  I had people tell me our army couldn't be that strong if we couldn't wipe out the enemy in a month or so.  It is so easy to pass judgment on things you've never experienced or don't understand.
                  
                  If the palestinian people are against hamas, they can join with the IDF and fight them.  That won't happen.  They have been engaged in murdering jews and terrorist attacks for years.  It is all they know.
                  
                  Ukraine is not like the palestinians.  Ukraine has been a nation/state for over 1,000 years.  Palestinians only came into being in the 1960s under Yasir Arafat.  There has never been a palestinian nation/state. 
                  
                  You may not know this but if you have friends or know people from that part of the middle east you'll hear how other nations in that area don't want palestinian refugees.  They only bring trouble because they have a society that honors and promotes terrorists.  No nation of sane people wants to bring that into their country.

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