a conservative perspective says it violates the Constitution...

Jump to Last Post 1-6 of 6 discussions (14 posts)
  1. SparklingJewel profile image71
    SparklingJewelposted 9 years ago

    Shame on Pelosi's "Deem and Pass" Trickery    

    Take Action!

    March 17, 2010

    House Speaker Nancy Pelosi's (D-CA) shameful scheme to "deem" the Senate Obamacare bill into law without a vote violates Article I, Section 7 of the U.S. Constitution.

    As we mentioned in our action alert two days ago, House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-CA) is plotting to use a parliamentary procedure to prevent a recorded vote on the Senate Obamacare bill in the House because she lacks the necessary 216 votes needed to pass it.  This shameful tactic to simply "deem" the Senate bill as passed by bringing the 2,309-page "fixer" bill to a House vote has been dubbed as the "Slaughter Solution," aptly named after liberal House Rules Committee Chairwoman Louise Slaughter (D-NY).

    The "Slaughter Solution" violates Article I, Section 7 of the U.S. Constitution which states:

    "Every Bill which shall have passed the House of Representatives
    and the Senate, shall, before it becomes a Law,
    be presented to the President of the United States."

        * The Slaughter Solution attempts to allow the House to pass the Senate bill, plus a bill amending it, with a single vote.
        * The Senators would then vote only on the amendatory bill, but this means that no single bill will have passed both houses in the same form.
        * As the Supreme Court wrote in Clinton v. City of NY (1998), a bill containing the "exact text" must be approved by one house and the other house must approve "precisely the same text."
        * What the House is aiming to do is attach a new bill to an existing bill in order to create the illusion that only half of this bill is receiving a vote.
        * Arthur Fergenson, a constitutional law expert and the lawyer who litigated Buckley v. Valeo-the case which enshrined campaign spending as a form of constitutionally protected speech-attests that a bill must be the same item, not a collection of multiple bills.
        * The bill receiving a vote in one chamber must be the identical piece of legislation that receives a vote in the other chamber in order to become law.
        * If the Senate bill does not receive a direct vote in the House, then it is understood that the "fixer" bill is only being agreed to because it contains changes, adjustments, or fixes to an existing piece of legislation.
        * The Senate has never voted on this exact package, or pairing of Obamacare bills.  This means that if President Obama were to sign such a package, the presumed law would be a nullity.
        * Thus, a vote for the Slaughter Solution rule is a vote for the Senate Obamacare bill.

    Rep. Ted Poe (R-TX) described this shameful tactic on the House floor:

    "Democrats are trying to use a sneaky snake oil gimmick.
    Let's have an up-or-down vote on this bill
    and not hide behind some procedural mumbo jumbo!"

    Rep. Poe described this stealth move perfectly-as an attempt to give vulnerable Democrats cover and the excuse that they did not actually vote in favor of Obamacare becoming the law of the land.  Rather, they are trying to make the claim that they only voted for the "fixer" bill, not for the highly objectionable, corrupt, bribery, and extortion-ridden Senate bill.

    The House Democrat Leadership is committed to using this underhanded approach in order to get the Senate health care bill to Obama's desk for signing and to become law before he leaves for his vacation to Indonesia at 1:00pm Eastern on Sunday, March 21st.

  2. ledefensetech profile image68
    ledefensetechposted 9 years ago

    It'll be interesting to see what happens to the Democratic party this fall.  I don't see it enduring past the elections.  The leadership is basically throwing their rank and file under the bus.  According to one poll 79% of conservatives and 70% of independents would vote to kick an incumbent out of office.  This would be disastrous for the Dems. 

    The really interesting thing is going to be how the Republican leadership reacts.  If they go Progressive like Bush and his allies in Congress did, I think you'll see a split in the Reps like you're going to see in the Dems this fall. 

    I don't think many professional political analysts get this yet, indeed they may never understand it.  Should both parties crumble, we will, for the first time in about 150 years see an entirely new political party enter the scene.

  3. profile image0
    Brenda Durhamposted 9 years ago

    I saw on Fox News the Attorney General for the State of Virginia saying they're gonna try to hold Pelosi accountable for this because it's illegal.

  4. ledefensetech profile image68
    ledefensetechposted 9 years ago

    States won't have any other choice but to fight this.  They're already struggling with massive deficits in their budgets.  What is interesting is the number of states that are considering remedies.  38.  That's a Constitutionally significant number.  Few people realize that states, themselves, can call a Constitutional Convention, Congress is not needed.  If I were in Washington right now, I'd be wary of pushing the states too far.  But like many who are consumed by a lust for power it would seem that pride goeth before a fall.

  5. Michael Willis profile image74
    Michael Willisposted 9 years ago

    I posted this link a while back and no one saw it or replied to it. But it goes with the subject here.

    Virginia Approves Bill Banning Mandated Health Care

    I guess the next step for the Demogods Obama and Pelosi will be to try to Usurp State Sovereignty and re-write the Constitution.
    With this tactic they are using...why not?
    Think of the possibilities of full Government control if the Constitution can be walked upon without legal consequences by a single majority decision.

    1. ledefensetech profile image68
      ledefensetechposted 9 years agoin reply to this

      That's the first shot across the bow of big government.  Something else I've been wondering about is how the Supreme Court will rule when someone inevitably brings suit against the provisions of the bill, should it pass.  It's a little known fact that no law has the force of law unless and until the Supreme Court rules on the constitutionality of said law.  The SCOTUS of FDR's time, for example, struck down many New Deal bills as unconstitutional.  So FDR fought back by threatening to pack the Court with "his" supporters.  Mr. Obama has already offended most of the contemporary Court, so I think any threat of his to do something similar would fall on deaf ears.  Not to mention inflame the passions of the public at large even more against this administration.

      1. Michael Willis profile image74
        Michael Willisposted 9 years agoin reply to this

        You are right. Obama has already offended the Supreme Court. And the people are angry and he had better start listening to The People. So many are going to be voted out of Office in the upcoming election, leaving him basically with a "lame-duck" administration after this attempt to destroy the Constitution and walk on American's rights.

        1. Arthur Fontes profile image82
          Arthur Fontesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

          But at least he was awarded the "Nobel".

          I think you can find "Nobel"s in Cracker Jack boxes now though.

          1. Michael Willis profile image74
            Michael Willisposted 9 years agoin reply to this

            lol, I bet they wish they could have a recount on that selection now.

          2. ledefensetech profile image68
            ledefensetechposted 9 years agoin reply to this

            The Nobel has been steadily losing any real meaning for some time.  I mean they even gave Al Gore one, which turns out to have been based on fraudulent science.  Perhaps the Nobel Committee needs to rethink their selection criteria.

            1. Arthur Fontes profile image82
              Arthur Fontesposted 9 years agoin reply to this

              Kissinger has a "Nobel" and he is wanted for war crimes in some countries.

              1. profile image0
                Brenda Durhamposted 9 years agoin reply to this

                What war crimes, do you know?

                Kissinger seems to be....rather an enigma, from what I gather.
                Stays outta the limelight a lot, but I think has had and still has some major influence in America....

  6. ledefensetech profile image68
    ledefensetechposted 9 years ago

    Kissinger was and is a moron.  His only claim to fame was shepherding the Paris peace process along.  He's wanted for war crimes for the bombing of Cambodia.  Personally I find the whole idea of "war crimes" to be somewhat stupid.  For the most part war crimes are just spoils of victory.  How many Allies were convicted of war crimes in WW II, for example?

    As for Kissinger, I'd argue that he was the main reason American prestige took such a beating until the Reagan presidency.  It was Kissinger that paved the way for the limp-wristed way Ford and Carter dealt with the Soviet Union.


This website uses cookies

As a user in the EEA, your approval is needed on a few things. To provide a better website experience, hubpages.com uses cookies (and other similar technologies) and may collect, process, and share personal data. Please choose which areas of our service you consent to our doing so.

For more information on managing or withdrawing consents and how we handle data, visit our Privacy Policy at: https://hubpages.com/privacy-policy#gdpr

Show Details
HubPages Device IDThis is used to identify particular browsers or devices when the access the service, and is used for security reasons.
LoginThis is necessary to sign in to the HubPages Service.
Google RecaptchaThis is used to prevent bots and spam. (Privacy Policy)
AkismetThis is used to detect comment spam. (Privacy Policy)
HubPages Google AnalyticsThis is used to provide data on traffic to our website, all personally identifyable data is anonymized. (Privacy Policy)
HubPages Traffic PixelThis is used to collect data on traffic to articles and other pages on our site. Unless you are signed in to a HubPages account, all personally identifiable information is anonymized.
Amazon Web ServicesThis is a cloud services platform that we used to host our service. (Privacy Policy)
CloudflareThis is a cloud CDN service that we use to efficiently deliver files required for our service to operate such as javascript, cascading style sheets, images, and videos. (Privacy Policy)
Google Hosted LibrariesJavascript software libraries such as jQuery are loaded at endpoints on the googleapis.com or gstatic.com domains, for performance and efficiency reasons. (Privacy Policy)
Google Custom SearchThis is feature allows you to search the site. (Privacy Policy)
Google MapsSome articles have Google Maps embedded in them. (Privacy Policy)
Google ChartsThis is used to display charts and graphs on articles and the author center. (Privacy Policy)
Google AdSense Host APIThis service allows you to sign up for or associate a Google AdSense account with HubPages, so that you can earn money from ads on your articles. No data is shared unless you engage with this feature. (Privacy Policy)
Google YouTubeSome articles have YouTube videos embedded in them. (Privacy Policy)
VimeoSome articles have Vimeo videos embedded in them. (Privacy Policy)
PaypalThis is used for a registered author who enrolls in the HubPages Earnings program and requests to be paid via PayPal. No data is shared with Paypal unless you engage with this feature. (Privacy Policy)
Facebook LoginYou can use this to streamline signing up for, or signing in to your Hubpages account. No data is shared with Facebook unless you engage with this feature. (Privacy Policy)
MavenThis supports the Maven widget and search functionality. (Privacy Policy)
Google AdSenseThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Google DoubleClickGoogle provides ad serving technology and runs an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Index ExchangeThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
SovrnThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Facebook AdsThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Amazon Unified Ad MarketplaceThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
AppNexusThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
OpenxThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Rubicon ProjectThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
TripleLiftThis is an ad network. (Privacy Policy)
Say MediaWe partner with Say Media to deliver ad campaigns on our sites. (Privacy Policy)
Remarketing PixelsWe may use remarketing pixels from advertising networks such as Google AdWords, Bing Ads, and Facebook in order to advertise the HubPages Service to people that have visited our sites.
Conversion Tracking PixelsWe may use conversion tracking pixels from advertising networks such as Google AdWords, Bing Ads, and Facebook in order to identify when an advertisement has successfully resulted in the desired action, such as signing up for the HubPages Service or publishing an article on the HubPages Service.
Author Google AnalyticsThis is used to provide traffic data and reports to the authors of articles on the HubPages Service. (Privacy Policy)
ComscoreComScore is a media measurement and analytics company providing marketing data and analytics to enterprises, media and advertising agencies, and publishers. Non-consent will result in ComScore only processing obfuscated personal data. (Privacy Policy)
Amazon Tracking PixelSome articles display amazon products as part of the Amazon Affiliate program, this pixel provides traffic statistics for those products (Privacy Policy)
ClickscoThis is a data management platform studying reader behavior (Privacy Policy)