Our United States of America is the only First World Country in the world where people are afraid to call medical 911.
Wrong! What about Canada, Britain, Australia, Germany, France and others.
I personally fear 411 more than 911, but that's just me...
Were the only first world country that doesn't have universal health care either!
And the government lobbyist will see to it never happening. This has been on the ballot since the 1950's. Yet, in a heartbeat they could vote to go from analog television to digital and force you to purchase a new antenna or satellite depending on your situation. Who made money on that deal?
I had to make the call.
My dad is now under the care of the most corrupt hospital in the state.
Just my personal opinion.
Why are there security guards at every corridor intersection?
Why are there security guards at the elevator doors?
Why are there security guards at where you are supposed to sign the admittance forms?
Welcome to American hospitals.
And the daily covered up patient billing response from people pushed over the edge.
Sick. I have thrown up. I will walk away.
Just a personal opinion.
This is a good clue actually.
Visit the local hospital.
If it is infested with security guards, you know it is someplace you do not want to live.
Medical corruption does indeed vary by county.
In the UK, we are lucky to have free medical care for everyone. True, the hospitals are dirty and rarely cleaned, they harbour a lovely choice of bacteria, and the nurses leave patients lying in their own dirt for days on end, patients families have to take in their own pillows and some are left in hallways for hours, before anyone notices that they have died, and the elderly are regularly abused. But at least it is free.
I am thoroughly confused. Only sense I could make of OP was that he was referencing being afraid of the BILL.
No, that's not it, though. He's going on and on about security guards with a bizarre paranoid fervor.
My friend, try NOT dropping acid before going tot he hospital next time, and see if it seems just a bit less like a police state.
Fortunately for you, if your apparent adverse drug reaction causes cardiac issues, you happen to be in a country who's QUALITY of healthcare is unsurpassed.
Valeman, I don't recognise your description of a UK hospital.
I was in hospital at the end of last year, the hospital was perfectly clean and cleaned at least every day. Though on a stroke unit where incontinence abounds, nobody was left lying in their own dirt for hours, let alone days. The pillows provided were perfectly adequate, nobody was left dead in corridors and the elderly weren't abused.
I am not saying that these things never happen, but to present it as a picture of health care in the UK. When something does go wrong it's usually jumped on pretty quickly, and most often in the private sector.
I was in hospital a couple of years ago. Believe me, the things I witnessed disgusted me. An elderly patient in the bed next to me, begged for hours for the nurses to help him because he needed the toilet. I heard them tell him to shut up. Eventually, he messed the bed, and the smell spread through the entire ward. It was then that the nurse shouted at him, telling him he was a 'dirty old man.' In the week I was in there, the ward was not cleaned once. I also have witnessed another old man, who could not get out of his chair, and also was left to mess himself. I called for a nurse and told her about the man. All she said was ' No speak English.' She then walked off and never came back. Also, when my grandmoither was dying, there were no pillows for her bed, and my grandfather had to bring in hers from home. So, maybe you have been lucky, but others are not so. I also had to visit a neighbour, in a ward, where the ceiling was falling down onto the floor and the walls were covered in black dirt. All of these hospitals were in Birmingham.
Then the fault is with the health authority, not the health service as a whole.
Believe me, such conditions do not occur generally.
I am sorry but I don't believe you. I have been in many UK hospitals and am aware of the 'rules' etc that these places are run to. You may have had a bad experience and want to hit out at them but grossly exaggerating does not help your case.
Now if you were referring to an old peoples home it might contain a gram or two more truth.
So I am lying? What I actually did see, you are suggesting in pure invention. You may believe what you want, it really is of no interest. As long as I know that what I have stated is the truth, then this is good enough for me. Pretending that I have not witnessed such things, and attempting to brush them under the carpet really does no one any good. And perhaps, this failure to believe that some people have witnessed such things will ensure that nothing is ever done about these conditions.
Not entirely correct - I am suggesting that you are exaggerating in order to support those things you actually did witness.
The lack of care among some nurses, both mentally and physically, I have no trouble accepting, too long waits in corridors I have no trouble with, abuse of he elderly I also accept as at least not far from the truth.
But fallen ceilings and black 'dirt' on the walls - I suspect is not true and is painted in to your word picture for effect.
I suggest that your refusal to believe what you have not witnessed yourself is a fault that lies with you, and is in itself for effect. You cannot imagine it, so it cannot possibly be true. So indeed you are calling me a liar. I have just mentioned this to my mother, who was with me and also witnessed these things. She too must be lying of course. I really have no intention of trying to defend myself for stating perfectly truthfully what I have seen. I fail to see how you can possibly judge what is true from China, when I have been in Birmingham hospitals and seen and experienced first-hand the things I have honestly stated. Refuse to believe all you like, and argue against what is beyond your imaginings, if it suits you. But to suggest that because you have not seen what I have seen that I am lying or exaggerating is ignorant. But, as they say - ignorance is bliss.
No - it is not ignorant, it comes from living all of my life in the UK and seeing for myself. A hospital in the state you describe would be shut down immediately. I am no fan of the UK health care system but I have used it on many occasions both for myself, relations and my large number of employees - and I have witnessed things like those that you describe. I am suggesting that you are 'over-egging your cake' and that does your cause no good as most people who have been there know it is not true and consequently will not believe the valid part of your issue that does require exposing.
I have also lived my entire life in the UK. I have lived in the West of Scotland, the East of Scotland and London. I have visited hospitals of many types extensively in all these locales and more for a great many reasons, occasionally as a patient. I have never at any time witnessed anything like that suggested in this thread and although I am not by any means calling any individual a liar, I am strongly calling in to question the testimony and would strongly suggest that evidentiary proof of such potentially slanderous/libelous allegations against our beloved Florence Nightingales and devoted health professionals should be available prior to publication in any form.
I am confused now. You state that you have witnessed the things I have described, yet would seem not to believe the things I have witnessed, simply because it was I that witnessed them and not you. Well, I don't believe you. You have not witnessed similar things to those I have described. You are simply saying this for effect. You are exaggerating, by saying you have witnessed them. I do not believe you could possibly have seen things similar to those seen by me, because I was not with you, so did not witness it for myself. So I simply refuse to believe you. Rather a circular argument, isn't it?
No - it is a simple point that does not require any further exaggeration or word waving and it will probably resolve itself when you take your bedtime medication.
You are the most insulting of hubbers, and you obviously enjoy an argument for its own sake. Have they let you out for the day? Perhaps you need your carer before you totally lose it. And it is not a simple point to suggest you have witnessed things similar to those seen by me. You expect me to believe you, yet call me a liar. I think it is you that needs medication.
Might I suggest recommend1 that you actually read some of the links I have added here, which are BBC and newspaper reports, which detail circumstances in UK hospitals, which are very similar to those I have experienced. I am sure will suggest that this reporting is biased, and that the expereinces of people detailed also did not happen. But if you want to keep your head in the clouds, that is up to you.
The fact that these occasions that you speak of are newsworthy suggests that they are not at all common.
So therefore, they didn't happen. Neither did the things I have witnessed happen. It has all been a lie - every word of it.. Now I have said what people want me to say can you all please stop attacking me. When I was in hospital with heart problems, the treatment I witnessed was all in my mind. That poor old man in the next bed did not exist. In fact, I do not exist. I promise never to say anything which is not in agreement with other people. And, if I am ever to witness such things, I will look the other way and tell myself it is all in my mind. I will never again assume the right of freedom of speech to avoid being attacked by so many people. I don't like being called a liar. If I have lied, then fair enough, I deserve everything I get, but I feel now that I have to deny real experiences because it obviously causes so much anger.
No matter how often they happen, the fact that they do means that someone has to have had such experiences. Yet, all I have tried to do is relate what I have witnessed, and have been called a liar over and over again. Perhaps all of the people in these reports were also lying. Maybe they are like me and have an over-active imagination.
Hmmm... I strongly suggest that you read my words again...
I strongly suggest you realise that my response was to recomment1 by reading previous posts. And I strongly suggest you and recommend do not suggest someone who you don't even know, who has simply told the truth about things he has witnessed is lying. This is very insulting, and bullying for the sake of it. Suggesting that I, and my mother, who also witnessed these things are liars, for simply stating fact is very upsetting. And such online bullying is not acceptable.
Yes, I have fallen for it, and should not have let myself get pulled into something for the entertainment of people of whom I know nothing and who probably enjoy winding people up. I have quite calmed down now and can see it for the foolishness it was.
Now that you are calmed down perhaps you can see that nobody from the UK has popped up to support the most unbelievable parts of your post.
I have stated clearly that some elements of your complaint I have also seen and experienced but that there are parts that I believe are exaggeration !
If you were so angry at what you saw why didn't you get a photo of the falling ceilings and dirty black walls ? Where is any other information or support for such things in a UK hospital.
And don't think for one minute that you are at the depths plumbed by TMMason, I suspect that you are a generally nice guy who has had a shocking experience at a time of loss and grief - that should be talked about and propogated, but over-exaggeration hinders the cause rather than helps.
As I said, but it is gone now, that is how some on here are friend. Do yourself the favor and don't let 'em bring you down to their level.
Wow appearently I am having an edit buitton problem... or someone just doesn't like what I said, that wouldn't suprise me, but as long as you got the message man. Have a good nite.
That sounds incredibly terrible. I think I"d rather just die at home.
Valeman's descrition sounds like a couple hosptials here in the states that were the focus on a TV report. It sounds like the individual hospital is at fault, not the system.
That sounds like a Cuban hospital (see picture)
And this is the sad truth.
Do you not feel even a twinge of shame for your countries part in embargoes on medical supplies and cleaning equipment?
Well, I would feel bad about the embargo if the government got treated in such hospitals, but they are not. In fact, Cuba has some of the best doctors and surgeons in the world, and there are a lot of people that pay good money to get treated in the same hospital that Castro gets treated at. So, yes... embargo or not, the people are never going to see a change as long as the Castro brothers are in power.
Funny my cardiologist talks about his trips to cuba for the medical conventions, and cannot speak lower of their system and their incompetance.
We can discount your views on this subject, not because you are a right wing nut with pathological hatred of all things people power oriented - BUT BECAUSE
Having a cardiologist would require you to have a heart which is clearly not the case
TM, we're talking about a country that stopped seeing the light of progress back in 1959. They're still driving 1950's Fords, Buicks, and Pontiacs. My sister studied and later taught maritime engineering at the University of Havana. The only thing she ever learned was the mechanics of the Soviet ships. Figures! A career gone to waste! As children they didn't teach us English, they taught us Russian.
So, yes... there are a lot of good doctors in Cuba. Most of them are sent out to Venezuela, Bolivia, and other socialist countries with the intention of helping the needy. Yet, they fail to provide decent healthcare to the nationals.
I could agree with that. I am sure there are some talented Drs there, but facilities, system wise, equipment, etc, if as oyu say in the late 50s.
So you will get no argument here. What do you think of the kids and left in this country calling Che a hero?
Che was nothing but a paid murderer. A lot of misinformation out there. People want to idolize iconic figures without doing their homework. Guevara went wherever they paid him to make war. There is no honor in that.
Exactly. And so many today propagate he was a hero. He was a murdering piece of trash. God bless you Klara, and I am so glad you made it out and found a better life. I only wish we could help those who still need it. May God keep them in his heart.
I cannot understand African Americans and their worship of him, as he thought they were trash. What a sad state of affairs it is.
Thanks TM. I was very lucky to have the opportunity to come here, and to have adapted so well to the US - (something that seems more and more difficult with newer immigrants, especially here in Miami) I've lived in the US than in Cuba, but I was 14 when I left. I remember everything clearly, and I still have family there. If people only knew!
You should write some hubs on the subject Klara. I bet they would be very interesting and eye opening.
Ugh! I'm so done talking about Cuba! That's all you hear here in Miami. But yes, I should definitely write some hubs about it. If I can make one person understand, that will be terrific.
Yes, it would. So many have been deluded by the myth of the greatness of Socialism and Communism, and those who espoused it, the truth would be refreshing.
And as I said, you probrably have access to the people who do know the truth. Of course most times people who have been threough such things find it very difficult to speak of. But if just one person could be shown the truth. You never know, that one person may be the one who changes the world.
I for one would be most interested in them.
Excellent, Klara. I will be watching your Hubs for them. Thank you. And have a good nite, nice to meet you. I am out for a while, time to sleep a lil.
Why in the world would YOU need a cardiologist? Don't they work on hearts?
Cube ranks 39 in health care where we are hanging in at 37. http://www.photius.com/rankings/healthranks.html
It would be nice to find a happy median between the filthy, but free, conditions of the hospitals in the UK and Cuba; and the bankrupting cost of the clean and cutting edge medicine available in America.
"Filthy but free conditions of the hospitals in the UK?" I would love to know upon what evidence you base that inflammatory, libelous and offensive remark??? The UK's health service knows a great deal of criticism both internally and externally but an off the cuff, ridiculous comment such as you have just posted serves no practical purpose whatsoever. I would be interested to know in which country you live and how many UK hospitals you have actually visited??? Our hospitals have failings in certain circumstances - as do all hospitals around the world - but in the vast majority of circumstances they are spotlessly clean, staffed by angels and afford patient care which can be bettered nowhere else on the planet (except possibly Germany.)
Hey. Don't blame me. I was responding to the comments posted in this thread by current citizens of the UK. It's been a while since I've been there. I wouldn't know the current conditions in your hospitals. I can only go by the eye witness reports.
I wouldn't go by eye witness reports if I was you. Those of us who have witnessed abuse of the health system are lying apparently. I have been firmly put in my place for telling the truth. All of the cases which have reached the news must also be pure invention.
That is the running stand of any contradictory opinions, of any topic, which is cherished by certain people on here. Anyone who doesn't agree and see it their way is a liar. Don't fall for it, Vale. Make your point, move on.
I do not know if we agree on anything, you and I, but I hope you will agree with me on that. It isn't worth it, bro. They will not agree with anything you say, and will only continue with attacks, call you names such as liar, and blame you for the attacks.
It is a very telling plan, and obvious.
And then when you warn someone else and lay it out for them to see, they will say you are playing the victim card, etc... it is an old tactic the LL's have been playing for decades. You dis-agree, you are a liar and a racist, a bigot, etc, etc, etc...
So your're saying that I should agree with Valeman even though all my experience, the experience of friends and acquaintances, and those I know who work within the NHS doesn't support his suggested wholesale breakdown of the system?
I am saying he should not be called a liar, straight out, for what he has seen, heard, and is attesting to, as you should not be either, John.
I haven't called him a liar but I called him out for implying that his experience was typical of the NHS.
Well, my remark was not directly aimed at yourself, John. You have simply wandered into it. I was speaking to the BS that occured last night in here and another thread, were people were very free at calling others liars.
I am sorry to have you think is was intended to yourself, and I probrably should have clearified it earlier, friend. I did not mean to acuse you, simply point out unacceptable behaviour.
As I said dis-agreeing is one thing, personally atacking someone as a liar is another. I would think you would agree with that.
Sal Alinsky Tactics have spread across all liberal circles. "If they disagree call them liars. If they offer proof change the subject. If they don't shut up call them racists and bigots. ect" It really is rather pitiful when you think about it.
Not for "telling the truth" but for implying that the exception was the rule. For putting down the 99.9% of health service staff who are loyal and dedicated.
If abuses of the system are as common as you imply why has nobody come rushing to your side?
How many times does an exception to a rule occur, before it is no longer an exception, but a serious flaw, or the norm?
I think that the US should adopt unversal healthcare with a copay.
That would be nice. A handful of European countries who have a "socialist" government have been able to accomplish this. I don't know where they rank but I've been told that it seems to work. The Cuban government has always lied about their census, so it would be wrong to believe that they have better healthcare than the US. I will have to write a hub about the truth of healthcare in Cuba to show what it's really like. I have pictures taken by my sister to prove that what I'm saying is true.
The risk of having universal healthcare in the US is that the service might be provided in the same fashion as other governmental and state services (such as DMV, Immigration, and Social Security offices). There won't be competition and employees stop caring about what type of service they offer because you have no choice but to go.
I wish there was a way to provide free quality service. The only reason why I haven't had children is that my insurance does not cover a paid maternity leave and my husband does not make enough to cover all expenses on his own. But I rather struggle for a few months following the birth of my child knowing that his and my health is in good hands.
Sounds like a good plan, but someone has to get a handle on the costs. The medical industry needs to be reigned in.
The cost of Health Care in America did, and will, go up because of Govt. interferance. So get ready for unaffordable care till the Govt crashes this system with their Obama-care like they did the Housing and Financial sytems.
TMM MASON - Most of the hubbers here noticed that the housing crash happened under Bush. After 7 years of low to no government regulation of Wall Street.
Trying to blame the housing crash on Obama is like trying to blame Clinton for WWII.
I hope if anyone cares to read any of these articles, that it might go some way to show that the things I have described are not lies, that I am not a liar, as has been stated on here, and that people who have experienced very real terrible conditions in some hospitals, should not be bullied to shut them up.
I haven't failed to notice Gordon, that rather than actually reading these articles and commenting upon them, you have instead chosen to post "stopspam" . This would suggest that you are afraid of such horror stories being brought to public attention. I have not written these articles myself, which have been written by the BBC and British newspapers. I suppose they are lying too. What is it you fear? If this is the only response you are able to come up with, I would suggest it is because you know the articles to represent the truth in some hospitals. It is a shame that people who have experienced such things have insult added to injury by being called a liars.
I notice you've changed your position somewhat from the NHS in general to "some hospitals".
I think your criticism should be reserved for those trying to dismantle the NHS rather than the NHS itself. It is apparent that some local trusts are failing but fixing that does not require switching to an American two tier system where some can not afford health care.
Think Fannie mea and freddy mac, Doug. And nowhere did I mention President Obama in my post doug, I did not. "Obama-care", and Obama, are two different things. Get real.
And wait till the new financial regs kick in, you know the ones the lame duck Democrat Congress pushed through in Dec 2010, after they had all been voted out, and before they left. And where in my post did you see the name Obama? You didn't Doug, but I would expect that from you all. Democrats and Progressives have done this to our country, to overload the system, as with their welfare state and 99weeks of unemployment, their class warfare, etc. Same as what they have accomplished starting in Greece and many of the European nations. They over-load the system, as planned by Cloward and piven, and as is being implimented world-wide by the Socialist Progressive leant leftists.
We see you all... and we will not allow it.
What a bunch of jokes the Democrats and Progressives are.
And I will get to my Hub on the leant leftist plan to wreck the system and re-structure it closer to their Socialist dreams in a few days. I will point out Cloward and Piven, the Frankfurt School and Cultural Marxism, as it has been implimented in this nation and others as a tool, in said hub.
There are certain services that don't need to be ran by the private sector. Can you imagine the military being ran by oil companies or the prison system being owned by Microsoft and IBM? Our public schools, libraries, human services, etc, etc, are government ran. The united States is NOT a pure Capitalist country. Since George Washington was elected president, this government started to run certain services in this country. Regulation within the private sector really got underway when President Teddy Rooselvet outlawed child labor and monopolies. The further regulation started happening. Laws against wage descrimination and making employers responsible for their employees. More followed because we (the working class) wanted and demanded it. Sorry, socialism existes in this counrty and that's how it is. Now how many people out ther know what the word "socialism" actually means. Here's a clue, it has nothing to do with Communism or Fascism.
I have been in hospitals in four different countries including the UK and the US (five if you count Scotland separately), they were all about the same. Also the outcome statistics are very similar. The costs per citizen are *also* similar just gathered by different mechanisms.
I would like to know more about Cuba as well. The only things I THINK I know are not very good.
Hubs on Cuba are pending. They'll be coming soon. THanks!
I appreciate it, thank you. I will look for it/them.
I am the mother of Valeman, and I was there when these incidents happened. I am nearly 70 and I have seen quite a few of these incidents when visiting people in hospital and when I have been in hospital. One which stuck in my mind was that of an elderly woman asking nurses for a bedpan, and was told she would have to wait. When she wet the bed, I witnessed a nurse slapping her, telling her she was dirty. I have seen several other such incidents, always against the elderly. As I am now elderly, it worries me should I need to go into hospital again.
So every elderly woman is deprived of a bedpan and left to lie in her own urine?
I am not saying that every person receives the same treatment, but to have witnessed so many events in my life and read about so many others, and been told of them by other people I know. It is just not good enough to suggest every experience is an isolated case. How many isolated cases do you need before you think something should be done? Perhaps because they happen mostly to the elderly means it does not matter so much. I hope when you are elderly that you do not receive the same treatment.
OK, wait a minute, people are attempting to have a serious debate on this issue?
How is it less than obvious that the OP was simply having some sort of paranoid acid flashback?
On and on and on about the security guards... and throwing up (peyote maybe)
My dad is having surgery tomorrow.
As for the security guards, I’ve visited patients in other hospitals where there was no security in sight. This hospital has them all over the place. The reason is obvious and has to do with the hospital’s fear of all the disgruntled former patients. The local newspaper archives back this up.
As to your fallacious drug reference, you obviously like to kick and hurt people when they are vulnerable and scared. The only mentally sick person on this thread is you.
Dude, in only a few posts, you made references to corruption, cover-ups, vomiting, and infestation.
Before I responded at all, you had mentioned security guards 4 times. When another poster made fun of your paranoid rant, you just kept on going.
It honestly sounded like you were purposefully TRYING to sound paranoid.
Seriously. Go back and read what you wrote.
If you do, and it doesn't sound to you like intentionally paranoid trollbait, then humble apologies, sir, and I hope your father recovers soon.
I see that you live in Florida. Go visit your nearest hospital and tell us what you see. Better yet, website and news Google them.
As for your feeding on other people’s misery, I want nothing more to do with you. My fault that. There are plenty of grieving websites out there. I should have gone there instead of here.
I had no intention of coming back here, but I see that peace now reigns here.
I shall report any unethical conduct as to any entity that has any connection to this situation.
I will also very much report any positive actions by any entities that are connected to this situation.
USA medical in action. I’ve been negative based on news reports. My new opinions will be based on actual experience.
Addressing standard troll ambiguity technique: When I say I am referring to the situation, what I mean is that I will give reports on all things relating to my dad and how he is treated.
I would appreciate support from everyone; especially my followers.
I am sorry, but this needs to be said....what in the world would make anyone believe and/or think that America is still a FIRST World Nation, considering all the problems we presently have.
America is a third world nation.
Funny because I look around and see the rule of law, nice roads, cops, shops full of reasonably priced food, and when i got sick I went to the hospital and was treated by skilled doctors.
In a third world nation the typical person of average means has no access to legal recourse, no cops, no roads, no shops and when you get sick you stay home and hope you don't die.
If the average American thinks they have it hard they need to pop over to Somalia or Congo and develop a sense of perspective.
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