So You Don't Believe in Chem Trails, Eh?

1. 76

   Wesman Todd Shawposted 12 years ago

   Poor you.  You must be  an Ostrich, a noble bird with the habit of burying it's head in the sand.
   
   There's a patent for contrails, actually.  We're all being experimented on without our consent.
   
   http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl … EmtZyWTg#!
   
   
   

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      Druid Dudeposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Using common citizenry for experimentation isn't new. The old stories centered around the release of biological agents in close proximity to urban centers. Living on the coast, I have seen some strange things. Black helicopters with no visible markings, contrails made by weather patterns or virtually invisible aircraft (who knows) The first atomic tests were conducted in deference to long term contamination and the vagaries of the prevailing winds. Industry has been given free-hand to pollute as they wish. One aspect by itself would be bad enough, but, we have been subjected to a toxification of our habitat which renders the possibility of gleaning any useful data from any observations that could be helpful, impossible to interpret.

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         EmpressFelicityposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         You are quite right, sadly:
         
         http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/1999/nov/0 … n.politics
         
         "The experiments changed tack in 1955. On six occasions, Porton scientists disseminated large quantities of the chemical for 25 miles around their establishment so that RAF planes could fly through the clouds and measure their progress. Sampling equipment fitted on to vehicles also tracked the particles on roads around Wiltshire.
         
         From 1956, the trials were greatly expanded as military planes began to spray large amounts of zinc cadmium sulphide around the country.
         
         It was revealed last year that in at least 12 trials in the late 1950s, these planes flew long distances - usually 250 miles - along the coast, dropping the chemical which then drifted miles inland.
         
         In one trial, zinc cadmium sulphide was discharged from a plane from Cornwall to Sussex. Samples of the cloud were collected throughout south-west and central England, parts of Wales, and as far as Yorkshire."

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   2. 60

      pedrogposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Chemtrails: Just misunderstood contrails (condensation trails).
      
      http://contrailscience.com/
      
      http://www.skepdic.com/chemtrails.html
      
      http://www.theskepticsguide.org/archive … amp;pid=89
      
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chemtrail_ … acy_theory

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      1. 76

         Wesman Todd Shawposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         You didn't watch the video, I got that.

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            pedrogposted 12 years agoin reply to this

            I didn't, sorry for that, just watched half of it...
            
            Come on, really? That isn't even convincing...
            
            This is just a conspiracy theory and a bad one, Ancient Aliens are much more amusing

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               Wesman Todd Shawposted 12 years agoin reply to this

               Gotcha, envelope statement that disputes nothing because it named nothing to dispute.

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2. 77

   psycheskinnerposted 12 years ago

   I think "chemtrails" are a basic public misunderstanding about "contrails"--which are made of water vapor. Sometimes combined with a basic misunderstanding of legal air-spraying by farmers etc.
   
   That is more plausible than something that looks exactly like a contrail, not being one--and a huge silent conspiracy attaching invisible evil chemical tanks to commercial airliners.

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3. 59

   Evan G Rogersposted 12 years ago

   I'm not sure about the one photo that you posted, but most of the photos in your video are just from normal airplane traffic.
   
   As you enter the higher altitudes, the wing design of an airplane is such that a higher and lower pressure system is generated above/below the wing. As we all learned with thermodynamics, temperature, pressure and volume are all closely related. This is why if you heat up an already full balloon, it will burst as the pressure becomes too high.
   
   Also, water is held in air depending on the dew-point. This dew-point is a balance between pressures, moisture in the air, and temperature in the air.
   
   As the plane flies through the air, the temperature changes, and the moisture that is in the air becomes suspended particles, rather than rain / humidity.
   
   This is all high school level basic physics.
   
   ALSO - regarding the expelling of chemicals into the air to control global warming: this needs to be done at altitudes MUCH higher than where a normal airplane can fly.

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4. 82

   Pcunixposted 12 years ago

   You can count me in with the ostriches.
   
   Not that I think ANY pollution is good, but there is no way we are going to stop using airplanes so we just have to live with it.
   
   Or shoot them down.  Naaw, that won't work.  Bad idea and my rubber band powered missiles can't get that high.

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      Josakposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      The funniest thing is that Ostriches don't even bury their heads in the sand (would'nt be many ostriches left if they did now would there?) it just goes to show how well researched the whole topic is!
      
      When threatened, Ostriches run away, but they can cause serious injury and death with kicks from their powerful legs.[15] Their legs can only kick forward.[33] Contrary to popular belief, Ostriches do not bury their heads in sand.[34] This myth likely began with Pliny the Elder (AD 23-79), who wrote that Ostriches "imagine, when they have thrust their head and neck into a bush, that the whole of their body is concealed."[35]

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         calculus-geometryposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         Like

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         1. 60

            Druid Dudeposted 12 years agoin reply to this

            Jet fuel is predominantly kerosene....water vapor? Hardly.  Thank you for the class on ostriches.

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            1. 61

               Josakposted 12 years agoin reply to this

               your welcome, now for a class on "chemtrails" *sigh* this really shouldn't be necessary.
               Contrails, or condensation trails, are "streaks of condensed water vapor created in the air by an airplane or rocket at high altitudes."[4] These condensation trails are the result of normal emissions of water vapor from piston engines and jet engines at high altitudes in which the water vapor condenses into a visible cloud. Contrails are formed when hot humid air from the engines mixes with the colder surrounding air. The rate at which contrails dissipate is entirely dependent on weather conditions and altitude. If the atmosphere is near saturation, the contrail may exist for some time. Conversely, if the atmosphere is dry, the contrail will dissipate quickly.[4]
               
               This is the terrifying boogeyman, yes it's water vapor.

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                  Druid Dudeposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                  Do you work for the auto makers? You would have been a great PR guy. So...where does the vaporized kerosene go? Or do you think jets run on water. Here's an idea...check out what happened to the twin towers, mainly because of vaporizing jet fuel. They must exhaust, or the engines wouldn't work. How about planes that disperse insecticides and de-foliants? This is more widespread than water vapor trails.

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                  1. 77

                     psycheskinnerposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                     The visible contrail is water.  Exhaust is also obviously expelled but it not easily visible at a distance.
                     
                     But a 'chemtrail' is an alleged chemical *secretly* dispersed separate from normal operation of the engine.

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                        Druid Dudeposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                        Thank you. Not so sure about the make-up of what you are seeing, as I have never analyzed it in a lab...neither have you. You have to take THEIR word for it. The insecticides and de-foliants can qualify as these are also toxic to human life and health, and we have a documented ability to disperse these from any kind of aircraft, which would mean that we can equally disperse other chems too. No reason to believe we aren't.

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                           Pcunixposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                           No reason to believe we ARE.

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                           psycheskinnerposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                           The physics of it is open source (beat ice with hammer, make white opaque stuff, etc). The examples of known objects with known outputs on video are legion. 
                           
                           But if we are in fact 100% ignorant--why would we believe the government is deliberately spraying us with stuff based on a complete lack of evidence?

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                              Pcunixposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                              It's that evil leeberal guvmint, I bet!
                              
                              They probably only spray Red States.

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                              Wesman Todd Shawposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                              Okay, you believe someone patented water vapour, brilliant as always.

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                                 psycheskinnerposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                                 What is your point?  because I never said any such thing.
                                 
                                 I just know that even gliders have contrails under the right conditions.  They mean nothing.  They are made of water.

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                              Marisa Wrightposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                              +1

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                  2. 82

                     Pcunixposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                     Well, crashing into a building is just a little bit different than normal operation
                     
                     As I said, I don't like any pollution, but it's impossible to stop this stuff.  Too much industrial and military need, never mind the folks who fly for personal reasons.

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                        Druid Dudeposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                        EXPENDABLE!!!

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               2. 76

                  Wesman Todd Shawposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                  Dude, nobody patents water vapour.
                  
                  Did you watch the video?

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                  1. 77

                     psycheskinnerposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                     What patent are you talking about?
                     
                     IMHO you didn't even come into this knowing what "contrail" means.

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                        Wesman Todd Shawposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                        You didn't watch the video, obviously....brilliant.

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                        1. 77

                           psycheskinnerposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                           I am asking if you read the patent and know what it covers.
                           
                           Or do you just believe everything on YouTube.  That must be fun.
                           
                           The patent is for a device that throws powder into the contrail. So?  I've seen airshows so it is no surprise to me that contrails can be "painted" different colors.
                           
                           (They did not "patent contrails".  Contrail is just a word: "A trail of condensed water from an aircraft or rocket at high altitude, seen as a white streak against the sky" -- it means what it means.)
                           
                           I even think someone could make chemtrails if the wanted to.
                           
                           I just don't think they have done so as a huge government conspiracy to poison or experiment on the public using commercial planes.  It is the conspiracy I think is bunk.
                           
                           p.s. 1975 patent, more boring than sinister: http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Pars … PN/3899144

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                     2. 76

                        Wesman Todd Shawposted 12 years agoin reply to this

                        Literally, I don't care what you think about much of anything.  I've already figured out your perspective, and I'm pleased for you to just go on with it.
                        
                        Did you watch the video?
                        
                        I know the answer is "no," - I'm only pointing out why you don't know what the fuck I'm talking about, or what the fuck you are talking about.

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5. 60

   Druid Dudeposted 12 years ago

   Really? Trustful soul. How wunnerful. You are expendable. We all are.

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6. 74

   Mighty Momposted 12 years ago

   You mean to tell me all those sinister and unnatural looking (meaning not natural or normal as otherwise explainable, normal jet exhaust would look) all over the sky here in the west are NOT chemtrails?
   Does this mean my government is NOT working its hardest to mitigate and correct global warming by altering weather patterns through the clouds?
   
   All those crazy patterns are nothing more than water vapor?
   Really?
   I am beyond disillusioned.
   I have no faith left in my government.
   None.
   

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   1. 76

      Wesman Todd Shawposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      +1

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      Josakposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      GUYS GUYS!!! NO SERIOUSLY GUYS!!! the government is trying to poison us by spreading some unknown chemical over the whole world using airplanes and none of the millions of people who must be involved in this are saying anyhting about it or are concerned that they would infact be poisoning themselves too BUT I KNOW THE TRUTH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! NO SERIOUSLY! GUYS STOP LAUGHING!!!! WHY ARE YOU LAUGHING?!
      C'mon I dont want to be mean but seriously? I wouldnt mind if you presented it as a theory but you're like no if you dont believe it you have your head in the sand and then provide no credible evidence, your kind of asking for it.

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         Eric Newlandposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         There's a point I'd like to see addressed. Why is the government poisoning itself? They're human too (or ARE THEY?), and we all breathe the same air.
         
         Occam's Razor seems to get pretty dull around conspiracy theorists.

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            Pcunixposted 12 years agoin reply to this

            Eric, I told you: we are only spraying the Red States.
            
            And it's only a mild sedative anyway.. We are only trying to get them to chill a bit!

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               Eric Newlandposted 12 years agoin reply to this

               I guess that's only fair, since they blew up the twin towers. Touche.

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            Wesman Todd Shawposted 12 years agoin reply to this

            What makes you think the US Government isn't controlled by outside forces?

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7. 60

   Eztransferposted 12 years ago

   Our government is now just cronies taking turns lining their pockets...

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      psycheskinnerposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      That was very... on topic. [cough].

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         Josakposted 12 years agoin reply to this

         Well atleast that one is true.

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      Wesman Todd Shawposted 12 years agoin reply to this

      Exactly, and that escalated with the logical fallacy called "corporate person hood."

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8. 60

   Eric Newlandposted 12 years ago

   Say, does this thread have anything to do with me making fun of conspiracy theorists? Because that would be so awesome.

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9. 57

   R. J. Lefebvreposted 12 years ago

   I happen to believe, we don't know 'everything' about anything! It seems logical to me that all materials, biological or not, leave evidence as a trail.

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