Who has it?
Me. There's half a bottle of Schmirnof in my kitchen waiting for me.
Me. My cat, named Spirit, is on my lap.
My cat, however is a better example of having spirit than a bottle of spirits. And if I take a couple gulps of spirits, I loose mine.
I have it! I've got several issues of this series in my old comic book collection:
I hope I can find a copy! (The blond's body language says it all ... and Spirit says, "Not now, I haven't rescued you YET..."
Here is evidence of Spirit : Consciousness + Love + Intelligence.
Those three things when present are only evidence of a properly functioning human brain.
This discussion is really about the science of consciousness, I have come to understand.
men have the attributes of consciousness, love and intelligence.
neither gods nor God has free will; any god worthy of the name is omniscient by definition. Knowing everything, they also know the proper and best method to accomplish anything at all. Knowing that, there is precious little free will left; only a mentally deficient being will intentionally use an inferior method of doing something.
As neither gods nor God actually exist they cannot truly said to be "related". Any relation is only perceived by humanity, just as the gods/God is.
Or so my sources tell me...
- how about the random thought of energy.
- where does energy fit into all this?
- are spirit and energy related.
A random thought of energy has nothing to do with anything.
If you mean the energy of thought, that is the same as any other electrical activity. In the brain it is very, very small, though it takes a huge portion of the chemical energy we all exist on.
Spirit, energy, free will and consciousness are all intrinsically intertwined. Spirit is often interchanged with *enthusiasm.* (Indeed, Wikipedia uses energy as a defining word for enthusiasm.)
Therefore, it would appear that energy does have something to do with spirit.
Ah. You refer to a state of emotional being with the term "energy", not something that actually exists in the real world. "Free will" is another concept that exists only inside the mind and is not "real", either - perhaps they are indeed intertwined in some kind of mental orgy with consciousness.
In that case, it could very well have something to do with spirit, as the spirit would appear to reside or at least have a strong connection with the emotions of a human being. Could "spirit" merely be one's perception of self, and not some physical manifestation in this or other "dimension"?
...then what is causing everything outside of ourselves to manifest?
- and yes, a mental, physical, and emotional orgy with consciousness and freewill intertwining is indeed what we're talking about. Very astute finding.
I wish I were as smart as a lightning bolt. lol
I think you are that smart.
They are related like fairies and trees.
That's like saying beer, pretzels and sushi are evidence of the Loch Ness monster.
The Big Bang was evidence of spirit/energy.
How so? Outside of an unsupported claim that a spirit was necessary to touch it off, how do you claim it is evidence of spirit?
Jupiter and Mars are evidence of Superman.
- is electricity the same as light?
- or not.
- light from the sun is not the same as nerve light is it?
- what is nerve light? can it be considered electricity?
- what is E= MC squared?
- what starts a fire without a match... friction?
- is heat energy?
- Is heat evidence of spirit/energy?
- is electricity evidence of spirit/energy?
This discussion has led to the topic of *evidence vs. direct manifestation,* it seems.
Electricity is not the same as light. One is movement of electrons, one is photons.
Nerves do not produce light at all - sunlight is not nerve light.
Energy = mass X speed of light squared.
Friction, concentrated sunlight, lightning, other electrical discharges and probably some isolated chemical reactions that might get hot enough to ignite and burn specific substances. Volcanoes will light fires, as will any other very hot mass. It is possible to start a fire with radiation, or other nuclear reactions.
Heat, the motion of molecules, is a form of kinetic energy.
heat is not evidence of spirit unless spirit is material matter.
electricity is not evidence of spirit unless spirit contains electrons that are released to travel a conductor.
Seems more like a discussion leading to the topic of how many things can one imagine are real when one doesn't take their meds.
feelings are evidence of ...
intelligence is evidence of...
awareness is evidence of...
volition is evidence of...
self? consciousness? soul? all of which require energy or electricity or some animating force. What is the force? Is it wrong to call it spirit? Is it wrong to call it energy?
It is certainly not right to call it "perceptions." Who's to say that spirit is not material matter and does not contain electrons... I mean I have no idea. But we are discussing *evidence.*
If there is no evidence of an animating force then nothing really exists. It is all a figment of our individual imaginations. And in that case there is NO EVIDENCE whatsoever.
I'm sure the advertisers were not holding their breaths, here, anyway.
Apparently Nothing is very important.
and Something is not very important.
So, to some, negativity is important
and positivity is not.
I get the consciousness of that.
Redwood forests and gigantic redwood trees are evidence of Spirit.
as guided by nature,
and mankind itself
...is evidence of Spirit.
Music is evidence of Spirit.
Human Creativity is evidence of Spirit
Seems that everything in the universe is evidence of spirit. Conclusion: "spirit" is another word for "universe", at least as you have defined it.
…I would agree with that… everything in the universe positively exists. Something did not come out of Nothing. Right?
Nobody says the universe came from nothing, but things do pop in and out of detection.
This word isolates the true difficulty when discussing the existence of God.
Therefore, I'm focusing on physical manifestations which provide evidence of spirit.
What do you mean by this, Rad Man: "...things do pop in and out of detection."
http://www.scientificamerican.com/artic … ticles-rea
"something" does indeed come from "nothing" in some cases. Whether that happened with the universe we cannot know.
But the conclusion and the "Right?" was that "spirit" means "universe", it just has a different spelling and pronunciation. Kind of like "human" and "homo sapien".
No. Everything manifests out of something very subtle…to the point of being invisible… or a least not detectible by man-made instruments…or mathematical formulas, LOL!
And with that comes the old, old question - your evidence, Ma'am?
When you begin talking about something you know to be there but that you are defining as undetectable to man or machine, well, you have a wee problem with the truth of your claim.
So Redwood trees are not evidence of an animating spirit which is causing the trees to grow to be a certain height, of a certain style, of a certain majesty among all trees? I have heard that trees pump sap and have a circulatory system. The animating force figured out that trees needed hearts. Furthermore, how do we know that trees do not love with these hearts? There is no proof to claim otherwise. (Maybe this is why some people hug trees!)
Half Joking Half Serious
Not unless your "animating spirit" consists of a trillion copies of a DNA strand, the composition of the earth in that forest, the geology that results in a daily heavy mist but little rain, the climate of the area, etc.
If you wish to define spirit as the combination of all all those physical things that cause the Redwoods to grow as they do, then I guess it is there. If not, then no, there is no evidence of an "animating spirit".
You might want to re-consider the question of the trees loving. People do not love with hearts but with their brains and trees have no hearts anyway. A "circulatory" system perhaps, but no heart - they cannot have a heart with no muscle tissue in the tree. If you're going to make such a foolish claim at least make it with the stomach; that used to be considered the center of emotions, a tree "digests" "food" and perhaps could be considered to "feel" with it's "stomach". All very loosely defined (VERY loosely )
Why yes, I would agree that:
E v e r y t h i n g that contributes to life is evidence of Spirit!
Thank you for enlightening us!
Good! Then we begin to have a definition, something we can hang our hat on, with the word "spirit".
Now we can view it, watch it and experiment with it. Monsanto is, after all working with spirit (DNA) all the time - it is not all that difficult. Heck, Mendel was looking at spirit over 100 years ago and understanding it - we can do MUCH better today!
And you were right all along - it is in each of us! (not in empty space, though, and not in stars and maybe not in other planets). It could, in fact, be ONLY on earth and nowhere else in the universe.
why? If the earth (and dirt) is evidence of spirit… then so is every other heavenly body!
Uh oh. I think we may have a miscommunication.
I said that "Not unless your "animating spirit" consists of a trillion copies of a DNA strand, the composition of the earth in that forest, the geology that results in a daily heavy mist but little rain, the climate of the area, etc."
You apparently took that to mean that such things were evidence of spirit, not spirit itself. But I meant what I said - it works only if "spirit" IS DNA. And dirt and all the other stuff, but DNA especially as without the other stuff a Redwood will probably grow but without the right DNA it won't be a Redwood.
Your "spirit" is a complex chemical, with atoms arranged in a double helix configuration. Question, though - does "soul" = "spirit"? Is soul just a complex chemical as well?
No I stand by what I said. DNA is not spirit… It is evidence of an animating force. Scientists cannot define this mysterious invisible undetectable force. But is definitely the guiding force behind all Creation from the beginning of the universe and throughout all "time." That force I understand to be God.
Musings of a Former Atheist
Oh shoot. That puts us right back to that "Your evidence, Ma'am?" for some (force, chemical, what?) that is defined as undetectable by any means but that you know is there.
And That Is The Way It Is
YEP! Evidence is as good as it gets... and isn't that good enough?
humans love center is in the heart… I was just wondering if trees also a have a sense of love, due to their "pump."
Only if you think a small glass tube loves you, too. They both "pump" with the same capillary action, after all.
But whatever makes you think the center of human emotion is in the muscle of the heart?
Ya got me there! (referring to tube)
Whatever makes me think that center of human emotion is the heart? I know because that is where emotions come from.. The stomach seems to have a mind of it own... why not the heart?
Declaration of Independence of the United States of America is evidence of Spirit.
If there is no evidence of an Animating Force then Nothing exists.
Yet Something exists:
The Whole entire Universe and Everything in it!
If animating force = spirit
then spirit = energy
and evidence of spirit proves consciousness and everything that goes with consciousness...
which is a lot.
and "a lot" is a severe understatement.
U No I'm Rite
Hence, you would be wrong about an animating force.
? ...only if nothing exists.
That would be wrong, too, evidently by the fact our universe does exist.
I say everything that exists is proof of an animating spirit. What is there to not understand?
Honestly, you would think the atheists would agree! *Animating sprit* is more realistic and scientifically provable than a "supernatural creature from another universe!"
Simple, no such animating force has ever been shown to exist, it is only the physical laws of the universe that have been shown to cause everything. What is there not to understand.
That is pure baloney, no such animating spirit has ever been shown to exist, that is merely your religious beliefs talking.
Science is evidence of Spirit
Truly hilarious, Kathryn.
There is as much evidence for spirit as there is for leprechauns and unicorns; zero.
However, you have chosen to believe in something that has no evidence because of your religious beliefs.
Is Evidence of Spirit Enough?? Yes ? no?
I think the answer is no.
We are not satisfied with evidence. We just aren't. Actually this craving comes from somehow knowing that God exists. Until we sense this force directly we will never be content.
Back to ESP.
Back to Yoga.
Back to Meditation.
back to Jesus and Krishna who both made very clear:
"The harvest is abundant…"
"Heaven is (found) within."
According to My Sources.
(But now we are way off topic.)
Back to Evidence…
The moon is evidence of spirit… Although some say it was man-made and that it is hollow inside! LOL
Speak for yourself. For many of us "left brained" critters, evidence is sufficient for knowledge (not sure what else would be).
In this specific case, zero evidence results in zero knowledge and, for the left brained, zero belief.
For the right brained, though, it can and does result in belief. This comes about because of the craving you mention: "I want it very badly, so it must be so". "And if it's not, I will believe anyway because I want to". It works very well for the right brained and is all that is necessary to produce a massive belief system.
This keyboarding is evidence of a left brained atheist, for sure! But, also evidence of a very fine animating spirit if there ever was!
How does one explain a left brained believer?
A left brain believer believes that God can be found in a mathematical formula, obviously. A left brain non-believer doesn't think so, even though he is left brained.
Such an anomaly would simply shut off the brain when the spirit arises in them. Don't think about it in other words.
Interesting. Not accurate, but interesting.
Well, how else would a person that requires hard evidence come to believe in something that by definition can have no evidence?
Not all evidence is acceptable to all people. And what may seem like hard evidence of one thing may point to something else entirely. Happens all the time in courtrooms all around the world. People are convicted an acquitted because an evidentiary exposition leads to no other conclusion than the one at which they arrive. And then the real story comes out...because no one wanted ALL the evidence, just what they felt was sufficient to prove THEIR case.
The thing is that courtroom evidence is not the same thing as evidence required for science.
Of course, if Kathryn stood in a courtroom talking as she does here, they would cart her off for psychological evaluation.
That's kind of the point - evidence sometimes seems to point to one thing when another is actually true - except that there is zero evidence for a god out there. Evidence, not opinion - millions have an opinion without evidence to back it.
So that goes back to what I said - left brained people want evidence. Not opinion, not imagination, not rationalization or lies. Just hard, provable evidence available to anyone, and the very definitions used by most religious people today preclude anything like that.
Without evidence, then, the left brained person is left requiring that their brain shut down and utilize the emotional, wanting side of themselves. Which is what I said, after all.
Soft evidence is better.
Im going to separate you two. I don't even know what you're saying, but it's getting on my nerves.
You do eventually start to "hear" the person's voice don't you? Sorry about that Beth. Stop reading, then! You just can't help yourself can you? Because evidence is not enough, even for the God-believing Christian.
I haven't been reading... Ive been a bad girl. I just keep clicking on the notification when it pops up and then I'm like, "doh!" Why can't I stop clicking on it? lol
likely story. Where is your proof of God beyond Bible… beyond evidence of Spirit?
- appearing notifications are evidence of Spirit .
Clicking on them halfheartedly is evidence of a limited amount of spirit.
hahaha... I do believe that's the first joke Ive ever heard you make... it was a good one too.
- well, thats better than thinking everything I say is a joke! (Which some absolutely do!)
Thanks, Beth. I think "everyone" gets what I'm saying here. I will stop.
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