If there is a hell, than explain these verses

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   SwordofManticorEposted 10 years ago

   If there is a hell, than explain these verses
   
   Col 1:20,
   
   1Tim4:9-11,
   
   1Tim2:3-4,
   
   I have 600 more verses

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   krillcoposted 10 years ago

   These verses reinforce my understandings of 'hell'; that it is basically an existence outside of the contact of God. Of course, we choose to this by our conscious turning away from this love. As a clinical counselor (and a human being) the most terrible fear and pain people experience, I think, is being alone and not having someone to be intimate with. To not be known or to know another, at the most intimate depth, is a loneliness so profound as to threaten one's sanity and to drive one into the depths of existential depression and pain. Yes, hell is being without God, hopeless, alone.

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      SwordofManticorEposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      How do these verse reinforce your belief of hell? How does the Gospel support any notion of a place called hell?

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      TerryK81posted 10 years agoin reply to this

      "Hell" is another translation for grave in the greek context, just as "sheol" in the old testamament means the same in hebrew. There is no hell right now. If so, none are dead. Must be alive to be punished in hell.

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   TerryK81posted 10 years ago

   In Colossians 1:20, "and by Him to reconcile all things to Himself, by Him, whether things on earth or things in heaven, having made peace through the blood of His cross" is clear in that because of our iniquities we needed a Saviour; One Who was able to be just and merciful at the same time. We as sinners could not pay the price of our sins without having to eternally forfeit our lives and living with God. In Isaiah 59:2, it is written: "But your INIQUITIES HAVE SEPARATED YOU from your God; And your sins have HIDDEN HIS FACE from you, so that He will not hear." Turn to the very first chapter in the book of Isaiah and you will read beginnig in verses 10 thru 20. Here, God is displeased with the hypocrisy and legalism. "legalism" is your own attempt to make up for your sins, sort of along the lines of "penance" that the catholic system employs. God is tired of the meaning prayers and sinful living of the people, and yet they prayer and offer incense and sacrifice to God. In Psalm 66:18 it is written, "If I regard iniquity in my heart, the Lord will not hear". In Isaiah 1:16-20, the Lord is clearly telling them to repent, becauseHe is telling them to put away their evil doings and learn to do good by rebuking evil in a way in that it shows love and mercy ("seek justice, rebuke the oppressor, defend the fatherless"). Then the Lord tells them His Promise that, should they repent (turn from all sin, and sin is the transgression of the law as revealed in 1 John 3:4). So, back to the question of Colossians 1:20. As the above verses (among many, many more) you should have the understanding that we could not appraoch God on our own, hence the priestly services in the temple. When Jesus dided, all of that ended. The sacrificial lamb about to be slain escaped from the temple, because all of that ended upon Christ dying. Now we have a way to Christ (Hebrews 4:15, 5:6, and 1 Timothy 2:5).
   1 Timothy 4:9-11 in no way shape or form even minutely refers to any "hell", save only that Paul is instructing the young pastor-to-be Timothy on teaching the brethren to seek good things, and to do more than bodily (physical) exercise, but to exercise godliness (salvation alone in Christ, not by works which is legalism) so that by faith and acceptance we maay have eternal life in Christ Jesus. 1 Timothy 2:2:3-4 is instruction. SOM, there is nowhere in the bible that teaches eternally burning hell and I challenge anyone to show me otherwise. God is merciful. eternal hell isnt mercy.

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      SwordofManticorEposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      I totally agree with you Terry. If you read my question again, you might see that I appose the belief of hell. Because I to believe that hell is a man made myth.

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      TerryK81posted 10 years agoin reply to this

      Yes, the LIE that man made, saying hell is eternal and currently in-the-works, is a lie. Read Gen. 3:19. If hell is real now, or eternal then the soul is NOT dead and God would be an unmerciful liar.

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   Mitch Alanposted 10 years ago

   Colossians 1:20 taken in the context of both the chapter which starts with," For he resaved us from the domain of darkness, and transformed us to the Kingdom of His beloved Son, in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sin" and the audience he Paul was writing to, the believers in Corinth I His a clear indication that the believers were saved out of something and into something else. "From the domain of darkness" and into the "kingdom of His beloved Son". If the domain of darkness is not separations from God, what is known as hell, then what is it?
   1 Timothy 4: 9-11 reference back to the preceding verses with "It is a trustworthy statement deserving full acceptance." It references the first 8 verses of the chapter concerning the concerns Paul has that false teaching were/or would be entering their teachings. "But the Spirit explicitly says that in later times some will fall away from their faith..." Verses 6-8 continue this warning about false teachings and the need to teach true doctrine as they had been. He knew people would come along saying "there is no hell'', "there is no sin"," there is no need of Savior".
   1 Timothy 2:3-4 again looks back at the previous verses in telling believers to pray for all men for both peace while hereon earth and for each man's salvation through Christ. Verse 4 clearly states." Who (God) desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of truth" The terms "to be saved" and "come to" are clearly denoting that not all have. It is looking to the future. Christ's payment on the Cross was make for all, but not all accept it.
   Think of it this way:
   A generous man in a town of 100 puts a $1000 in 100 different safe deposit boxes, each with one of the town folks names on it. He says it's free to take. Only one box per person. If someone didn't believe the money was there didn't go pick it up, would that mean that the benefactor didn't offer the gift?

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      TerryK81posted 10 years agoin reply to this

      They were saved from certain eternal death by the grace of God in the person of His Son Jesus Christ. Revelation 20:9-10,14 and Revelation 21:1-4.. Just posted new article "Eternal Hell....but God is merciful isn't He??" scripture is provided.

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      SwordofManticorEposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      I agree Terry

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      Mitch Alanposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      Is it your opinion that "certain eternal death" is a ceasing to exist, rather than eternal separation from God? The soul is temporary and not eternal?

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      SwordofManticorEposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      The soul only exists as long as the body still has life. When the body dies, the soul ceases to exist and the spirit goes back to God thanks be given to Christ.

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      Mitch Alanposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      So, the soul is eternal? I believe it is.
      What happens to a soul who rejects Christ's offer of salvation? Eternal separation from God or nihilism?

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      SwordofManticorEposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      When the body dies the soul ceases to exist. Why do you ask me what happenes to it after we die when I already told you what I believe?

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      Mitch Alanposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      What is you differentiation between the spirit and the soul?

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      SwordofManticorEposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      Genesis 2:7 says that when God created Adam, he became a living soul. Now I maybe wrong, but Christ tells me that when God destroys the body, He destroys the soul as well. This was what death was before Christ. An unconsience sleep in our graves.

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      Mitch Alanposted 10 years agoin reply to this

      Where is the destruction of the soul/spirit descibed by Christ? Did everyone prior to the Cross cease to exist when their bodies died? Why are soul/spirits now eternal? Is faith in Christ needed for salvation or do you believe everone is saved?

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       SwordofManticorEposted 10 years agoin reply to this

       I never mentioned anything about the destruction of the spirit. I said both body and soul.

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       Mitch Alanposted 10 years agoin reply to this

       How do you define the difference? What happened to the spirits of those that died prior to the cross? Does faith in the finished work of the cross have any bearing on salvation or are all saved?

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       SwordofManticorEposted 10 years agoin reply to this

       Scripture says that the living know they shall die, but the dead know nothing Ecc9:5-6. But as to now in this day and age, have you ever studied the three feasts of ancient Israel? i believe the answer lies in this old tradition and 1Cor 15:20-23

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       TerryK81posted 10 years agoin reply to this

       Mr. Alan, please read: Genesis 3:19, Romans 3:23, Revelation 20:14, Ezekiel 18:4, Gen. 2:17. Notice in revelation 20 the tense of "devoured"  if you burn 4ever u r not dead because u must live to feel pain of hell.

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       Mitch Alanposted 10 years agoin reply to this

       What do you do with verses like Matthew 25:46 which reads, “These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.” Hell is real and just as eternal as heaven. One in the presence of God and the other separated from Him.

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       SwordofManticorEposted 10 years agoin reply to this

       The word is :age", not everlasting. Who was Christ talking about? The Jews, not the gentiles.

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       Mitch Alanposted 10 years agoin reply to this

       The chapter starts with "All the nations will be gathered before Him". It is Jew and Gentile, all peoples. The word aionios is always forever, aion is a time. aionios is used in Mat 25:46 & in John 6:40 where eternal life is spoken about. same wo

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       SwordofManticorEposted 10 years agoin reply to this

       matt 23-25 is about the second coming of Christ. He came back spiritually AD70 with the destruction of Jerusalem, the temple and the Jewish religion. Everything He spoke was spiritually spoken and not to be taken literally. John 6:63

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       Mitch Alanposted 10 years agoin reply to this

       You believe He has returned, battled Armeggedon, taken His believers with Him in the sky...ruled on earth for a 1000 years, released Satan and banished him? When did this happen? why are we still here? where is the new earth?

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       SwordofManticorEposted 10 years agoin reply to this

       Mike, I understand your interpretation of scripture because I was in the same ditch. God has removed the carnal sight, and now I see scripture as it was meant to be understood. You should pray for this gift. It helps.

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       Mitch Alanposted 10 years agoin reply to this

       Do you just ramdomly dismiss verses & chapters of the Bible? Do you decide to give your own definition to words? Help me understand how logically, gramatically etc, you dismiss the verses I've quoted, Not just quote another verse, but address tho

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       SwordofManticorEposted 10 years agoin reply to this

       It is your interpretation of these verses that I dismiss.
       
       We do not read the Bible the way it is; we read it the way we are. --Evelyn Uyemura

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