Does Individual and Group = Separatism?

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   marinealways24posted 15 years ago

   How could it ever be expected for everyone to meet at a common ground and belief when everyone is a different individual. To have the same belief, wouldn't we all have to sacrifice individual belief to believe a common goal or belief? Looking at our past history, would this ever be possible?

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      Ken R. Abellposted 15 years agoin reply to this

      History & current events would certainly provide a negative reply to your final question. 
      
      Between individuality & our tribal instinct the idea of everyone on the planet having universal agreement on ANYTHING is out of the question.  Never going to happen without some kind of supernatural intervention & even then...who knows?
      
      I think the challenge is for individuals & groups to always be trying to find pieces of common ground & attempt to work forward together.
      
      Though looking at the bickering back & forth in any segment of society does not generate much optimism.

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         marinealways24posted 15 years agoin reply to this

         lol Thanks
         I agree with pretty much all of it. As far as all of us trying to find a common ground, I think most of us are busier trying to make another accept our belief than trying to find a common gound between our belief. Either way, one would likely have to sacrifice an individual belief to meet at the group belief. I think we are all insane.

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            Ken R. Abellposted 15 years agoin reply to this

            "I think we are all insane."  At some level you are probably quite correct. 
            
            Not sure what ever happened to respect or common courtesy...if those things actually ever existed.
            
            I know what I believe & why I believe it.  I will share it with anyone willing to read or listen, but if someone chooses to believe something different or opposite, why would that ever be any skin off my nose? (Not even sure what that old saying means, but it jumped off my fingers.)
            
            I guess my point is that simple respect goes a long way to understanding & common ground.  We need to comprehend that we all bleed the same color blood, breathe the same air & struggle with all the same existential questions.  And we all come at those questions with our own experiences, teaching & baggage.
            
            Yes, simple respect for each other would be a good place to start.

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               marinealways24posted 15 years agoin reply to this

               Thanks Abel. You are one of the few I have seen recognize the possibility that we could all be insane to an extent. I think as far as respect and common courtesy, every individual would have to be raised on the same morals and idea of respect and common courtesy. Respect in one neighborhood could be waving at someone as you drive by. Respect in another neighborhood could be shooting at them as you drive by. Every group and individuals have different ideas and belief of survival. Then the other question arrives of teaching the same beliefs and morals to everyone as absolute. If everyone had the same belief and morals, would there be an individual? Would it be possible to have every individual in the world to accept common morals and live by them without a miraculous event that goes against all history? I think only with faith. The logic of our repeated history of insanity say's different. I agree that all of us are the same and equal. I don't think anyone is favored for one belief over the other. I do think we would all favor ourselves if we favored everyone instead of only ourselves. This would require all individuals to be humble to meet at a common belief. Sadly, I don't see humility coming back into style anytime soon.

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   pgrundyposted 15 years ago

   well, we USED to hold the common belief that everyone was entitled to their own beliefs and values without interference or persecution. That was enough to bind us together for over 200 years, give or take a number of rough patches (the Civil War being the worst of them).
   
   I think the problem now is that some people do not want diversity, even though our country was founded on the principle that diversity is what makes us strong. When one group tries to impose its beliefs and values on another group we get strife.
   
   That's why all this talk about "the real Americans" bothers me.
   
   All Americans are real Americans.

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      marinealways24posted 15 years agoin reply to this

      Thanks pgrundy. I agree with you. Possibly this was to weed out those with individual beliefs for not going with the group belief because some individuals refuse to sacrifice to meet at a common ground? I don't know, just a theory.

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   Ken R. Abellposted 15 years ago

   >>Thanks Abel. You are one of the few I have seen recognize the possibility that we could all be insane to an extent.<<
   
   Just to reveal my level of insanity...
   
   My last name has two L's in it.  Abell.  I only point it out because my father taught me to never let anyone kick the L out of me.
   
   A marinealways ought to appreciate that... :>)
   
   "I do think we would all favor ourselves if we favored everyone instead of only ourselves. This would require all individuals to be humble to meet at a common belief. Sadly, I don't see humility coming back into style anytime soon."
   
   You've hit on it here & as unfortunate as it may be, reality is reality.  Our capacity for me-centrism has no known boundaries.

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      marinealways24posted 15 years agoin reply to this

      Thanks Abell, Sorry about that. I do appreciate it! I don't know if you made up me-centrism or if it was already a word. But I agree with it. lol
      Maybe two of our biggest freedoms are our biggest flaws? Money and titles.

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   Ken R. Abellposted 15 years ago

   >>Thanks Abell, Sorry about that. I do appreciate it! I don't know if you made up me-centrism or if it was already a word. But I agree with it. lol
   Maybe two of our biggest freedoms are our biggest flaws? Money and titles.<<
   
   Me-centrism?  I doubt I made it up...but have been using that idea & expressing it in those terms for a long time.
   
   Money & titles?  Money definitely, titles probably.

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      marinealways24posted 15 years agoin reply to this

      Thanks Abell.
      How would everyone humble themselves to find common ground to see beyond money and titles when we are taught from birth to be motivated from money and titles. Then, if everyone had equality in money and titles, there may be no motivation to grow if incentives were limited. This would also limit a persons freedom to make their individual life based on what they put in. I give up. I claim insanity.

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         Ken R. Abellposted 15 years agoin reply to this

         Claim insanity, but don't give up.
         
         Life is hard, life is short, but there is beauty & wonder in an awful lot of simple things.  Watchin a sunrise or holding an infant in my arms always stirs up optimism & hope.
         
         The way I figure as long as I am breathing I got another kick at the can.
         
         We cannot give up because us mere mortals will never figure out all the crappola of life.  It is way above our pay grade. :>)

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            marinealways24posted 15 years agoin reply to this

            Thanks Abell. I was jk. I'm not suicidal or anything. lol I do try to appreciate everyday and everything I have and make myself see through the eye's of those that have and think they have nothing. Marines aren't supposed to give up until they are dead. I'm not dead yet. lol
            I will keep trying to make sense of a world that doesn't make sense and claims sanity. lol

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   Ken R. Abellposted 15 years ago

   >>Thanks Abell. I was jk. I'm not suicidal or anything.<<
   
   Yeah, I know.  I should have put some smiley faces on my post. 
   
   I always say that you gotta keep kicking in life because when you stop kicking they toss you in a box, drop it in a hole & throw dirt on you.

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      marinealways24posted 15 years agoin reply to this

      I think we bury a lot of people alive even while they keep kicking.

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