For Christians only-- What does this scripture from Ephesians mean to you?
This scripture appears two places in scripture, Corinthian and Ephesians. What do you believe it means to us.
11 And He Himself gave some to be apostles, some prophets, some evangelists, and some pastors and teachers,
They are are spiritual gifts to be used in the body for exhortation. People tend to have their own, sometimes self-serviing, interpretation. To fully understand the meaning and purpose it is necessary to study companion Scriptures. 1 & 2 Corinthians, Romans, Hebrews, Galatians, etc. Many love to exalt themselves as apostles and prophets.
"Till we all come in the unity of the faith" is when the brethren agree together on the doctrine of Jesus Christ. The surrounding context (vs. 11-14) addresses miracle-assisted first century servants of God who were anointed by God and enabled to edify the infant ekklesia (vs. 12) UNTIL their efforts were superseded by the arrival of the completed ONE system of faith (vs. 13), a benefit that permits followers of Christ to definitively discern between true and false doctrine (vs. 14; Hebrews 5:14).
"The UNITY of the faith" refers to the New Testament to which believers now can literally read and with certainty examine it and say, "This is what it teaches!"
Ephesians 4:11-14 compares to 1 Corinthians 13:8-13. Notice the similar illustration in the two passages with words like, "knowledge," "perfect," and "when I became a man, I put away childish things" vs. the "perfect," or "full grown" man.
Charlie: What about I Timothy 3:1-5 re: "Bishop"? And "deacons" (v813)?
yes- there are two "positions". Elder (bishop) & deacon. but not as in the churches. they are at overseers not bosses. they are to be SERVANT men serving the body in that city as a work of love,it is not a job but a position of servitud
N- order of value to church. church is established by apostles & prophets, who need guidance of prophets & then teachers etc are needed
The word deacon (diakoneo) simply means to serve. The words "OFFICE of overseer" was clearly an attempt to redefine what was once descriptive of loving service to a hierarchal office found in man-made "churches."
I Cor 12:28 "FIRST, SECOND, THIRD..." yet ONE SPIRIT (I Cor 12)! IT IS WRITTEN!
You guys are going to let your "PRIDE" overrule GOD"S WORD?
"Hypocrites" (Matthew 23)!!!
For I think that God has exhibited us apostles as LAST of all, like men sentenced to death, because we have become a spectacle to the world, to angels, and to men...and we labor, WORKING WITH OUR OWN HANDS. - 1 Corinthians 4:9-12
Yes "HUMBLE" yet set in CHURCH "1st, 2nd, 3rd...." Try running anything not decently & in order & see what happens! Even Christ, is Head; then (holy) husband then (holy) woman IF "in Christ yet "HUMBLE & ONE SPIRIT!
U know this!
It means what I Corinthians 12 speaks of: (v1) "Now concerning spiritual gifts, brethren, I would not have you ignorant. (v3) Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say Jesus is the Lord (God), but by the Holy Ghost. (v4) Now there are diversities of gifts, but the SAME SPIRIT. (v7) But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal. (v8) For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the SAME SPIRIT; (v9) To another faith by the SAME SPIRIT; to another the gifts of healing by the SAME SPIRIT; (v10) To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another interpretation of tongues; (v11) But all these worketh that ONE and SELFSAME SPIRIT, dividing to every man severally as he will. (v12) For the body is ONE, being MANY, are ONE BODY: "SO ALSO IS CHRIST."
So GOD has called those in Christ as members of His Body into the professions of apostles, prophets, evangelist, pastors and teachers for the edification of THE CHURCH (His Body)! (v31) "But covet earnestly the best gifts: and yet shew I unto you a more excellent way."
One night I responded to a question on HP, "Why are Christians Afraid to Follow Jesus," and went to bed. I was asleep when I heard a Voice call my name, "Norine!" I thought it was my husband and didn't move! Then the Voice screamed, "NORINE!" I sat up in bed, looked around, and no one was there! Then Something (in my mind) told me to go to the computer! As I walked toward the computer "Joan of Arc" was on TV and said "A life without courage & conviction, is a life without nothing!" I thought that rather strange but it resonated in my mind.
As I approached the computer, Something told me to go back to the last place I had commented. The author of the question has told all "It would be wise if you all would listen to this prophet!" I Screamed! Confirmation! I had dreamed dreams which came to pass and did not know the substance of the dreams were in the Bible. For instance, a dream of "trees" which GOD hued down was thereafter found in Daniel 4:15!
Supernatural things are happening in my life and I give GOD "ALL THE GLORY!"
Oh yes, He told me to ask all "unbelievers" to provide a book of as many "accurate" fulfilled prophecies written before Bible, and to date, no one has!
LOOK AT JESUS!
It means that as Christians we are given certain gifts. We should find out what they are, hone them and use them to the glory of God.
Answering question by only what this scripture "means to me"- won't address the situation. Paul is describing some certain (deep?) problem the Ephesians faced. (Reed chapter four, verse three and on...) For ones, the fellowship (church?) consisted by the immature members acting like children (verses thirteen, fourteen ). Obviously they - Paul and the ' 'christians' of his days didn't have written words of Jesus Christ (mainly gospels) to know and to follow His teaching/word. Because by Christ's determination "they" - His followers, the disciples- believers "ARE ONE" (John seventeen, twenty two/twenty three!) - filled by His Spirit - being "our" teacher, John fourteen , twenty six.)Perhaps some of those members of the Ephesian's fellowship didn't have Father and Son living within them , (John fourteen, twenty three.)...
What are u talking? Paul was "a vessel" through which JESUS spoke as HE did with The Prophets of Old! If you notice in I Cor 11:23 Paul "received of the Lord" which says JESUS spoke to him & told him what happened! Paul was not "just a man!"
n- i think you misunderstand what Michael said you need to be more careful and read to be sure you understand before replying.
i misunderstood til i read it the 3 time
"Obviously they - Paul and the ' 'christians' of his days didn't have written words of Jesus Christ (mainly gospels) to know and to follow His teaching/word."
I understood! He doesn't thk JESUS was speaking thru Paul! His last statement errs 2!
Norine, you are very gifted questioning your own misunderstanding , and blaming others for your problem. Even Charlie told you so. If you read and understand Paul's direct talking to each group's direct problem, fixing what was wrong -Jesus' would do
Norine W good for you if you know what you do know, but you are wrong telling me what I do believe/ think /know. Understand please if "christians" would be doers of Christ's' will Paul wouldn't write you poor,silly thoughtless senseless ; got it?
Norine W. Go and learn to reed what is written in the NT, Galatians 3::1 Amplified; and keep for yourself these unreasonable, unpolite , sarcastic names, what you are doing here on HP , is a disgrace to the humanity. May the YHWH be mercy to you.
That of your wisdom is enough for me N.W. You know so little of my belief, and you "Don't blvJer & Heb". Why don't you rather pray for yourself " that the eyes of ur hart be enlightened." Do at least something purposeful, please. Nice day !
noreen- I havehad enough of your foolishness. until you learn how to respond to people in a constructive manner you are no longer welcome
Thanks charlie, for your bold proclamation. It is important and necessary to protect the integrity and a high standard representing the Truth by those of us who live and share the Word of Life. .
Thanks Charlie for "DELETING THE WORD OF GOD!"
You will "stand before the judgment seat of Christ" with all of your "twisted" FRIENDS!
"UNCONSTRUCTIVE?" Is that what you think of WORD?
I Cor 10:21!
no norene I have N0 PROBLEM with the word of God. the problem is YOU and the way use scripture as a tool to beat people. I warned you repeatedly and gave you room & time to stop bringing confusion. YOU ATTACK instead of respond and that is w
Because "revelation" hasn't been given u yet (Peter re:circumcision) is no call for u to act UNCHRISTIAN. WORD given "search" to "see if these things r so!" DELETION shows no interest in GROWING as Scribes & Pharisees! JESUS presented diff as I
noreen- time to grow up your threats continue to show your immaturity. if you really understood scripture you would know making foolish threats with scripture is not right and only upsets folks. I do not want this on what I post , you are banned
You can "ban me" (Demonic spirit inside Charlie) but you will NEVER "ban" the WORD of GOD! IT will be told in ALL nations, then HE will return!
Pleasing "man" (FRIENDS) rather than GOD (STUDYING) will cause one to be "banned" from GOD!
Our Lord had the capacity to transmit Grace. Bu nature the Apostle or Disciple leads a purer life and is more receptive to this inner transformation. This wisdom they then utilised to bring Souls who were seeking, to the Lord. This increases the following and lightens God's burdens by elevating many to the Higher Path.
Truly speaking, we are all here to glorify or manifest the Divine; to praise, adulate or give thanks to the reverence of our Creator. That is why Surrender has been called the Highest Law. "Not my will, but Thine, O Lord." This is the spirit of unconditional Surrender. Much Love, Charlie.
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