The Beliefs of the Taliban

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   Kathryn L Hillposted 3 years ago

   What makes them do what they do and act as they do?
   I think it would be very interesting to compare notes in determining the basis of their actions, behaviors, beliefs, mission statements, guiding policies and their overall ability to govern a country.

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      Castlepalomaposted 3 years agoin reply to this

      Your know their religion will be their constitution law.

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         Kathryn L Hillposted 3 years agoin reply to this

         Apparently their beliefs are based on the religion that Mohamed invented. He borrowed from Christianity. He called God Allah but what kind of a God is Allah to them ... compared to other Muslims?
         
         I have always declared that other Muslims must counter Islamic extremism, but, they seem pretty quiet.
         
         What do the Muslims who live in America say about what President Biden has done in enabling these extremists to rule an entire country?

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            DrMark1961posted 3 years agoin reply to this

            If you start out the paragraph that way, you should add "from Christianity, the religion that Paul and the Apostles invented".

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               Misbah786posted 3 years agoin reply to this

               +1

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               MizBejabbersposted 3 years agoin reply to this

               I agree with you on that one. I believe in the teachings of Jesus, not the distorted rewrite by Paul and the Roman Catholic church that has morphed into a jillion protestant churches (I grew up in one of them). I've read the replies by Misbah, and I certainly don't see fit to argue with her. I can see how her religion may have suffered the same fate as rewritten by history as the teachings of Jesus.
               
               But even Jesus said to turn the other cheek. He did not give permission to fire back when fired upon.

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                  Misbah786posted 3 years agoin reply to this

                  According to the scriptures of Bible:
                  
                  Revenge is mentioned in the Old and New Testaments of the Bible. God warned His people to avoid seeking revenge and to let Him avenge them and bring about perfect justice how He saw fit. When we want to retaliate, we should keep in mind that causing another person harm will never undo the harm we have already endured. When we have been victimized, it is tempting to believe that revenge will make us feel better, but that isn’t the case. When we take the scope of Scripture into view, what we learn is that God knows the pain and hardship of injustice, and He promises that He will make things right for those who have been mistreated.
                  
                  “It is mine to avenge; I will repay. In due time their foot will slip; their day of disaster is near and their doom rushes upon them” (Deuteronomy 32:35).
                  
                  According to Islamic point of view:
                  
                  islam repeats the torah or old testament’s eye for an eye principle and uses both capital and corporal punishment for many crimes.  however what is often overlooked is that the quran and the traditions of Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) call for forgiveness instead of retaliation. Islam and its legal principles support forgiveness and peaceful arrangements between all parties.  The second of three categories of crime in islamic law is qisas.  Islamically qisas means the law of retaliation, however it is derived from the root "qess" meaning to track down the effect or trace of something, it may also be defined as tracking the footsteps of an enemy.
                  
                  "…punish with an equivalent of that with which you were harmed. but if you are patient - it is better for those who are patient." (quran 16:126)
                  
                  "and we ordained for them therein a life for a life, an eye for an eye, a nose for a nose, an ear for an ear, a tooth for a tooth, and for wounds is legal retribution.  but if anyone remits the retaliation by way of charity, it shall be for him an expiation. and whosoever does not judge by that which God has revealed, such are the wrongdoers." (Quran 5:45)
                  
                  Qisas is specifically for murder or serious assault.  whenever a person causes physical harm or death to another, the injured or a representative of the deceased has the right to retaliation.  In crimes covered under the laws of qisas the victim or his representative have three options, to insist upon the punishment, accept monetary recompense, or forgive the offender. forgiveness is even able to avert the death penalty. Quran urges forgiveness and mercy even in the direst of circumstances.
                  
                  "and there is (a saving of) life for you in al-qisas, o men of understanding, that you may become pious." (Quran 2:179)
                  
                  As mentioned above the law of retaliation or qisas refers to a particular set of crimes that may be lawfully punished in the same way and to the same degree. In the case of serious assault for example, the victim has the right to choose an eye for an eye, an ear for an ear or a leg for a leg. Qisas also allows for the victim or his representative to choose a different outcome. He may accept compensation also known as blood money or in arabic, diya or diyāt . Payment of the diya is calculated on a scale proportionate to the degree of incapacity or injury caused. On the other hand the victim or his representative may also choose to forgive, and despite the legality of all three choices, Quran makes it clear that the better option is to choose to forgive. In islam reconciliation is always preferable to retaliation.
                  
                  "…but whosoever forgives and makes amends, his reward is upon God." (quran 42: 40)
                  
                  
                  In The Quran Allah says,
                  "Indeed Qiyamah is approaching, so pardon (those who wrong you) with most graceful pardon (without revenge)". ~ Quran 15:85
                  
                  No religion teaches us to do wrong with others. But we are not talking on personal levels here.  We are talking on political levels.
                  
                  Why America and Talibans were having such a long war as both religions Christianity and Islam appreciate to forgive others and don't appreciate retaliation? No doubts that If there was no revenge earth would be a Paradise to live in.
                  
                  As of the changes in Quran over time. Allah has promised in Quran that the Quran will never change and will remain as it is till the Day of Judgment.
                  
                  In Quran Allah says,
                  
                  "Truly, we have sent down this Remembrance, and We shall, for sure, preserve it."
                  -- The Holy Qur’an (15:9)
                  
                  I respect your kind thoughts, MsDoris. I am not arguing but here things aren't being discussed on personal levels but on government and political levels.
                  
                  I would love to forgive a murderer and leave justice to Allah. When it comes to politics, however, things are a little different. If everyone forgave each other, the world would never have had a single war. I hope that make sense.
                  
                  Peace and Blessings always!!

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                     Kathryn L Hillposted 3 years agoin reply to this

                     ... one should not behave as a door mat, however.

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                        Misbah786posted 3 years agoin reply to this

                        It's all in the eye of the beholder. What you see may not be what others see.
                        Peace!!

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                     Miebakagh57posted 3 years agoin reply to this

                     Forgiveness is not in the dictionary of the politicians. But a christian government head of state can exercise prerogative of mercy. Whereas, the Taliban will go for the sword on the neck of a woman that commited adultery.

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         2. 82

            Misbah786posted 3 years agoin reply to this

            Just a few corrections here:
            1) Muhammad (PBUH) didn’t invented any religion.
            2) Islam is the religion by Allah the God.
            3) Muhammad was the messenger of Allah.
            4) Islam was not borrowed by Christianity.
            5) Judaism, Christianity and Islam are the 'Abrahamic religions' because Abraham is central in all.
            6) For Muslims, Muhammad is the last prophet of God. Over the final 23 years of his life, from the age of 40, he received revelations from God through the angel Gabriel (in Arabic, Jibril). These form the Qur'an, the basis of Islam.
            
            Muslims do not see Islam as a 'new religion', but as a restoration of God's word as revealed to earlier prophets such as Abraham, which they believe had become corrupted or distorted by the succeeding generations.
            
            7) Calling God as Allah. Don’t change God. I call Him Allah, and You call Him God. Both of us are calling the same God with different names. Allah knows the secrets of hearts.
            8) We are the people of book. The Quran uses the term in reference to Jews, Christians and Sabians. In that sense we are all holy brother and sister.
            9) No religion teaches anyone extremism and terrorism.
            10) If they are pushed to the brink of war. It is their right to retaliate.

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               MizBejabbersposted 3 years agoin reply to this

               Question, Misbah. On no. 4, did you mean to say "Islam was not borrowed FROM Christianity?" You said "...BY Christianity. Christianity is older than Islam.
               
               The Jews called their God "Jehovah" or some abbreviation of it. Muslims call their God "Allah". Jesus referred to a male deity as "My Father." Even some Christian sects are moving toward a genderless creator. Today's spiritualists are referring to the creator as "Mother Father" God and are claiming to usher in the Divine Feminine as the equal part of the creator. Can you agree that the creator is genderless since it has no need to procreate?

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                  Misbah786posted 3 years agoin reply to this

                  Answer to point no. 4 is already in point 5 &6. Borrowed from**
                  
                  Judaism, Christianity and Islam are the 'Abrahamic religions' because Abraham is central in all.
                  
                  Islam sees Judaism and Christianity as earlier versions of Islam, revelations given within the same tradition by Allah but misunderstood over time by their followers.
                  
                  Muslims see Islam as the final, complete, and correct revelation in the monotheistic tradition of the three faiths.
                  The Islamic tradition recognizes many of the Jewish and Christian prophets, including Abraham, Moses, and Jesus (although he is not considered to be the son of God). Many non-Muslims mistakenly believe that Muhammad (PBUH) is the equivalent of Jesus in the Islamic tradition; in fact, it is the Quran that stands in the same central position in Islam as Jesus does in Christianity.
                  
                  Muhammad himself is not divine, but a prophet chosen by God to deliver his message and an example of piety to emulate. Just a messenger and Prophet of Allah.
                  
                  Jews and Christians are specifically protected in the Quran as Peoples of the Book, reinforcing their spiritual connection to Islam by virtue of having been given revelations from Allah, the God. The Islamic legal tradition has upheld the rights of Jews and Christians to maintain their beliefs and practices within their communities in Islamic lands, and this policy of tolerance has generally been upheld.
                  
                  About the Gender: The Quran refers to Allah using the masculine pronoun "Huwa" because the word “Allah” is grammatically masculine, not because Allah is naturally masculine (Allah be our refuge from saying that!). In English, using “He” for something without natural gender connotes personification, but not in Arabic.
                  Hope I have answered your questions.
                  
                  Peace and Blessings!!

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               Miebakagh57posted 3 years agoin reply to this

               "If they are pushed to the brink of war, It is their right to retaliate.' Wondering who has ever push muslems to the wall?                                              Who has ever push the Taliban to the point of war? Apparently, their are a disgrunted political and militant class. Who form and head the Taliban as a group initially? Why don't it integrated itself into the mainstream moslen adherants? But act as a separatist? The thing is that the Taliban wants power.                                              A persm that profess Islam must be peaceable submitting the mind to God and fellow beings, even unbelievers. But to force the later to profess a religion at gun point is weird. That couldn't be God at work. But a mad person. My muslem friends, salam!

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                  Misbah786posted 3 years agoin reply to this

                  Thank you very much! If you read the entire discussion on this forum. I believe that you will get the answers to your questions.
                  Salaam (Peace!)

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            Miebakagh57posted 3 years agoin reply to this

            "but what kind of God is Allah to them'? That's the fundamental question.                                     Apparently, God is many interface to many different persons. Him you ignorantly worship, I declare to you said Apostle Paul.                                     Judaism, Christianity, and Islam seems to have certain things in common. But this is not so. Judaism is establishing relation of Jehovah(God) with the Jews. Christianity is either a by-product or transformation of Judaism. In Judaism, Jesus was noted to be a physical or political deliver. A ruler that weld the sword, or a Judah Maccabee. Jesus of the  Christian is not.                                 That said, Jesus is a spiritual Messiah, forgiving and blotting out the many sins of His peoples. The  Jews refused to believe Jesus died and rise from the dead. He's giving us more time to turn to God.

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               Misbah786posted 3 years agoin reply to this

               I believe, there are no different kinds of God in Islam. Allah has introduced Himself in Quran like this:
               
               Who is Allah?
               
               Allah! There is no God ˹worthy of worship˺ except Him, the Ever-Living, All-Sustaining. Neither drowsiness nor sleep overtakes Him. To Him belongs whatever is in the heavens and whatever is on the earth. Who could possibly intercede with Him without His permission? He ˹fully˺ knows what is ahead of them and what is behind them, but no one can grasp any of His knowledge—except what He wills ˹to reveal˺. His Seat encompasses the heavens and the earth, and the preservation of both does not tire Him. For He is the Most High, the Greatest.
               
               -- Holy Qur'an | Surah Baqarah | Verse 255
               
               God in Islam is the only deity and He is absolutely One, unique, and perfect, free from all faults, deficiencies and defects; He is omnipotent, omnipresent, omniscient, and completely infinite in all of His attributes, who has no partner or equal, being the sole creator of everything in existence.
               
               In all religions, and for all those who believe, God is the Most Gracious, the Most Merciful, the Most Forgiving, and the Most Beneficient.
               
               Peace!!

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                  Castlepalomaposted 3 years agoin reply to this

                  Religion throughout history I found.
                  Most wars and prisoners.
                  Most salvery and surpression
                  Most in the name of God for killings
                  Most people in hell because God loves you.
                  Worst all round criminals rap sheet
                  
                  Enough facts and evidences to trust in only one God... Me or yourself first.

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                  1. 82

                     Misbah786posted 3 years agoin reply to this

                     I believe, this is due to lack of knowledge and understanding
                     
                     I respect everyone's religious beliefs and am not here to defend any of them. Neither yours nor mine. No religion teaches us to do wrong in God's name. Where there is good, there is also evil. Where there is God, there is also Satan.
                     
                     Allah, the God, has given man the ability to understand and differentiate between Good and Evil.
                     
                     Peace!

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                        Castlepalomaposted 3 years agoin reply to this

                        Since religion is made up of different fairytales, poems and parts of vague history. A fellow online, challenge me to write about spiritual. This is about the most intense I got from the 99 percent spiritual unknowns.
                        
                        Did write something that has kept my world with a better understanding and something more important than knowledge.
                        
                        Fresh Imagination
                        
                        Imagination is the living agent of all human perception with both intent and effort. Your mind first produce a visual imagine, shortly afterward follows words . There are no rules of architecture for a castle in the clouds, the quality flows by the gift of fantasy conceives in images from objective reality. Imagination asks desired questions, it creates and grows with exercise. Anyone is enough of an artist to draw from their imagination as for it’s the basic health of every man. Concept may be lower form of imagination, and imagination is a poor substitute for experience. Few people have the imagination for reality and logic and reason can die off quickly. Your knowledge has limits but your imagination dose not. Reason respects differences, and imagination has a perceptible likeness of things. It’s an act not of reason but an intuition, Imagination is the eye of the soul and the voice of the daring. If there is anything Godlike about God it is that. When he dares to go beyond his wildest dreams, he can imagine everything.
                        
                        I can prove most everything I know was once imagined, it’s created in beauty, justice, and happiness. It’s the main source of value in the new economy and the supreme master of art as of life. You create your own universe as you go along. The stronger your imagination, the more expansive your universe becomes. If you forget your dreams of your universe, your Universe will cease to exist. When your will and the imagination are in conflict, it is the imagination that always wins.
                        
                        Why be so serious, and imagine our World will END, it might for you.
                        
                        Imagine our World is moving toward a spiritual age, our joys will never end.

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                           Misbah786posted 3 years agoin reply to this

                           Freedom of speech is everyone's right. Thank you for sharing your thoughts.
                           
                           I truly doubt people who say they are spiritual but not religious. Spirituality comes through religion that's what I believe
                           
                           Why just imagine make an effort to make it a reality. Nothing is impossible. Spread the words of Love and respect each other and their beliefs of course.
                           
                           I believe, What goes around comes around.

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                              Castlepalomaposted 3 years agoin reply to this

                              Arts and culture came long before religion was thought of.  Religion is a concept of a culture that evolves from the first religion of Hinduism  to Christian of 1000s of domonation of today.
                              
                              Like a water buffalo evolves to a cow. A cult is mainly a new religion.

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                                 Misbah786posted 3 years agoin reply to this

                                 I myself is a student of arts and psychology.
                                 
                                 Adam and Eve are believed to be the first humans on this planet "Earth".
                                 
                                 Were they sent here with culture or religion as the first people to disobey God?
                                 
                                 Wondering...

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                                    Miebakagh57posted 3 years agoin reply to this

                                    What were they sent down with here on earth? Wondering too.

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                                    Castlepalomaposted 3 years agoin reply to this

                                    The greatest influence to human kind is through the arts and culture artifacts, long before religion. If there were an Adam an Eve. It would have come from out of Africa according to most scientists and historicains.

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                           Miebakagh57posted 3 years agoin reply to this

                           Castlepaloma, Castlepaloma? You the weird rabbit hole guy! Weird and extreme imaginative. Some day you can't ever return. I can bet that.

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                              Castlepalomaposted 3 years agoin reply to this

                              I may return,  I may not, it's up to me. Religion is the greatest BS rabbit hole that one can imagine. Luckily it  is not as harmful as nationalism right now. Happy not to live in both those rabbit, one loss in space or other worst slaves stink holes.
                              
                              Thank for the compliment of being extremely imagative. I prize that more than knowledge itself. I'll  continue to encirle the globe as to not to gather mossy coat and be owned by those two puppet masters.

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                              1. 77

                                 Castlepalomaposted 3 years agoin reply to this

                                 Most people say they spiritual rather than religious today.
                                 
                                 I know my aim is spiritual.
                                 
                                 Why are they loosing their faith in religion. Unless your living in many Muslim countries, where it is law.

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                                    Miebakagh57posted 3 years agoin reply to this

                                    You're welcome. Don't get tired out.

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                                    MizBejabbersposted 3 years agoin reply to this

                                    There is a difference in most spirituality and religion. Religion follows a dogma, or rules particular to their church, temple, mosque, etc. usually written into a book. A truly spiritual person has no church, temple or mosque to be beholden, nor one book of rules that they follow. They may have a teacher who guides them, but again, they are free to make their own choices of what to believe and what not to believe. They don't use a holy book to live by. Some have had experiences that guide them. An exception are the cults who claim to be spiritual, but are actually ruled by a leader, and the members better not get out of line or they will suffer the consequences.
                                    
                                    Some people are losing faith in religion because they are having spiritual experiences that teach them that there is more to life than religious dogma.

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                                       Castlepalomaposted 3 years agoin reply to this

                                       +

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                        wildernessposted 3 years agoin reply to this

                        "No religion teaches us to do wrong in God's name."
                        
                        Most of the world's religions have taught to do wrong in God's name.  Islam is notorious for treating women and girls wrong, up to and including death.  Christianity had it's inquisition and witch murders.  The Aztecs kept slaves as sacrifices to the gods.  All three of the Abrahamic religions have a very bloody past as God instructed them to slaughter their enemies, including children.
                        
                        There has probably been more "wrong" done in God's name throughout history than for any other reason.  When it comes down to the bottom line the difference between right and wrong, good and evil, is mostly a matter of what people want...and declare that their God has instructed them to get.

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                           Misbah786posted 3 years agoin reply to this

                           As said above, It's all in the eye of the beholder. What you see may not be what others see.
                           Peace!!

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                              Castlepalomaposted 3 years agoin reply to this

                              Never heard on the News or anywhere.
                              
                              Today the atheist have invaded the agnostic strong hold. Wail bombing with bread and bombs. Bread was used as bait.
                              
                              The agnostic freedom fighters took the city. Unfortunately mostly women and children have been killed.
                              Good News,  in was in the name of atheistism

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                                 Misbah786posted 3 years agoin reply to this

                                 A woman here do you want everyone to become an atheist? Just wondering...

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                                    Castlepalomaposted 3 years agoin reply to this

                                    Not into any centralized over ego groups
                                    Because the hierarchy require more slaves as  the larger it gets. Today science is claiming covid as new world order normal. Religion like or similar to covid is just a tool for the 1% to overpower and control all others.
                                    
                                    Atheist is registered as a religion in the US. Spiritual is the unknowns it can not come from a Brocken down parrot of contradiction and worst record of conflicts ever in history, on earth.

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                                       Misbah786posted 3 years agoin reply to this

                                       As mentioned above, I respect everyone's religion. So I respect yours as well.
                                       Peace!!

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                                       Castlepalomaposted 3 years agoin reply to this

                                       I respect, just don't understand or maybe don't want to for reasons with those criminals long history rap sheets.

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                              wildernessposted 3 years agoin reply to this

                              Of course it's in the eye of the beholder!  But it always begins with an assumption that whatever the gods want is right and good - without that religion could not exist.  Consider how far our moral and ethical structures have evolved over the millenia and think how older versions of modern religions would go over today.  Islam may be the farthest behind, but even it is changing, with all but the most radical of believers slowly coming into the modern age.

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                                 Castlepalomaposted 3 years agoin reply to this

                                 +

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2. 81

   Kathryn L Hillposted 3 years ago

   what does the Catholic Pope say for that matter?

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3. 81

   Kathryn L Hillposted 3 years ago

   Didn't we, the US, know that when The Taliban extremists took over Afghanistan, China would swoop in?
   
   Are the Taliban on board with Godless communism?

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      Kathryn L Hillposted 3 years agoin reply to this

      How can China help the Taliban ... from the Taliban viewpoint?

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      1. 81

         Kathryn L Hillposted 3 years agoin reply to this

         Will the Taliban become what they themselves despise? what they themselves stand against?
         will they become greedy for money, riches, wealth, luxuries, entertainments? and will they finally let out the women for the sheer boredom of too many males in their world?
         will it all work out in the end?
         and they will be happy ....
         finally?
          
         Wondering.

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            Kathryn L Hillposted 3 years agoin reply to this

            No, because they too will be beholden to Ch Ch  C H I  N   A  !

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   Kathryn L Hillposted 3 years ago

   Joy of Life - comes from freedom to guide ones own will.
   Respecting others.
   Accepting others.
   When these qualities are not fostered in a religion, those who follow such a religion will not be traveling on a positive path toward spiritual evolution/happiness.
   
   Do the Taliban concern themselves with what is truly spiritual?
   Do we?

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      MizBejabbersposted 3 years agoin reply to this

      I believe the Taliban and similar groups are more of a political nature than a religion. They praise the name of their god in a truly blasphemous way and work to control others. A truly spiritual people don't treat their women lower than they treat their dogs. But getting back to their origins -- I'm not a student of the Koran, in fact, I can't stand to even read the thing, but compare it to Christianity, which in Matthew has The Great Commission in which Jesus urged his followers to go forth into all nations, "teaching them and baptizing them...." Nowhere does Jesus say to kill unbelievers.
      
      https://theconversation.com/what-is-the … ial-111138
      
      The Koran has a "Great Commission" too. It is "Kill the Infidel." Kill those who don't convert and submit to our way of life. That is more political, like a dictatorship, than religious.
      
      https://www.bozemandailychronicle.com/o … ee6e1.html
      
      I see a big difference between "teach and baptize" and "kill". Anyone with that much hatred in their hearts can't be pursuing a path to happiness, and spiritual evolution is out of the question.

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         Miebakagh57posted 3 years agoin reply to this

         Mizbejabbee, thank you for your input. I buy your thoughts that were aptly put.

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   Kathryn L Hillposted 3 years ago

   "The Koran (translated by Dawood in Penguin Classics series) says, “When the sacred months are over slay the idolaters wherever you find them” (Sura 9:5). “When you meet the unbelievers in the battlefield, strike off their heads” (Sura 47:4). “Prophet, make war on the unbelievers and the hypocrites and deal rigorously with them. Hell shall be their home: an evil fate” (Sura 9:73). “The true believers fight for the cause of God, but the infidels fight for the devil. Fight then against the friends of Satan” (Sura 4:76). Who are these idolaters and unbelievers and infidels? Those who are not strict Muslims. “Muhammad is God’s Apostle. Those who follow him are ruthless to the unbelievers but merciful to one another” (Sura 48:29).
   
   For the orthodox Muslim, the Koran’s commands are valid for all time. Fifteen hundred years later, Iran’s Ayatollah Khomeini (a better authority on the Koran than either Smalley or I) is able to say, “Islam says: Kill all the unbelievers just as they would kill you all! Islam says Kill them (the non-Muslims), put them to the sword and scatter [their armies]. Kill in the service of Allah those who may want to kill you!” (quoted in “Islam Unveiled” by Robert Spencer, p. 35).
   
   Islam is the not same as Unitarianism or Christian Science, and wishful thinking won’t make it so."
   
   https://www.bozemandailychronicle.com/o … ee6e1.html
   
   
   
   
   I appreciate your response, MizBejabbers.

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      Misbah786posted 3 years agoin reply to this

      Today, the most quoted — and the most misinterpreted — Quranic passage (2:190-192) is the one giving permission to fight the unbelievers. What many don’t know is that it speaks only to a specific time, and only at the city of Mecca, when the idol worshippers of Mecca had broken a truce with the Muslims and did horrible injustices.
      
      The passage speaks to the Muslims with numerous conditions, including that fighting in self-defense was a last resort.
      
      Lesley Hazleton, of Seattle, an agnostic Jew and an award-winning British-American writer.
      
      Over a period of three months, she read in their entirety four well-known translations and a transliteration of the Quran, along with the Arabic text, then offered an interpretation of this disputed verse.
      
      She describes the conditions of this verse as: not that you must kill, but that to do so at that time was allowed only under many conditions: including only after a defined grace period had passed; only if no other pact was in place; only if the idol worshippers stopped you from going to the Kaba (in Mecca); and only if they attacked you first — and even then, God is merciful, forgiveness is supreme.
      
      Her findings reveal that the verse is allowing Muslims to defend themselves only with peace as their ultimate goal, which mirrors the interpretation of Islamic scholars today.
      
      God speaks to all of humankind in the Quran without regard to race, color, social or financial situation or even genealogy. The clear unveiling of its truthful message can only come by reading it cover to cover with understanding.
      
      From the beginning of creation God has sent prophets, messengers with divine scriptures, to guide mankind. Muslims believe his final unchanged text is in the Quran.
      
      https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-ne … ead-words/
      
      Peace!

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6. 0

   ValKarasposted 3 years ago

   For a lack of a better understanding, my impression -- not a qualified opinion is -- that our whole fascination with Taliban stems from our generally selective sticking our nose into the rest of the world's business.
   Why am I saying "selectively"?
   Because our political and strategic friend Saudi Arabia is professing just the same kind of "horrible religious attitudes" as we are seeing in Afghanistan, Iran, Iraq, or Syria -- and by some miracle, it doesn't seem to bother us one bit.
   Those people have had their ways of life for thousands of years, and I am simply wondering what makes us called upon to judge -- let alone try to change it.
   On the other hand, we, the God-loving Christians, started those Crusade Wars, because the Pope heard about some treasures in the Middle East to be collected -- under a cute religious excuse.
   Then we had our Spanish Inquisition which was prosecuting the heretics -- or call them "infidels", if you want. Then we, the God loving Christians, colonized, killed, enslaved others. Then we forcefully seized this land of the Natives, killing every one who would dare to oppose.
   
   So, is anybody still in the mood to question "what Taliban is all about"? For years after the WW2 we never heard about Taliban, ISIS,or  Al Qaida. Why now?
   Could it be because they don't want our neo-colonialistic asses on their territory telling them how to live, exploiting their natural resources, and selling them our "fucking-perfect sample of democracy" over a gun barrel? Remember the Catholic missionaries in South America, forcing the locals to accept Catholicism, burning their holy books?
   I am not "taking any sides" here. I just LOVE truth, I am virtually crazy about it, even if it's not comfortable to me.
   Can anyone still remember what Osama bin Laden said in that cassette he sent to the American people: "You live us alone, and we'll leave you alone".
   The question is -- are we capable of doing it? And who is really a "terrorist"?
   
   The whole discussion about those "fine interpretations of Quran" may not be relevant at all in all this issue.

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      wildernessposted 3 years agoin reply to this

      "Could it be because they don't want our neo-colonialistic asses on their territory telling them how to live, exploiting their natural resources, and selling them our "fucking-perfect sample of democracy" over a gun barrel?"
      
      No.  There are two major reasons, IMO.  One is that the people there look at us and see a rich, luxury ridden lifestyle they want...but don't want the things that give rise to that lifestyle.  In particular, the leaders and shamans refuse to accept those things (among them the working woman) and refuse to allow the people to participate in that life either.
      
      The second, of course, is that they need a scapegoat, just as Hitler did.  "Kill the infidel" has become the rallying cry, even to the point that killing an American will result in an afterlife that we can only dream about.  God has demanded that all infidels be killed, and coupled with that promised reward we see a great many more than willing to die for the reward God has promised them.

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      Castlepalomaposted 3 years agoin reply to this

      Rarely I have had long discussion with Muslim about the middle East, even though I'm always open. For decades we have been on Muslim terrorist alarm signals. When our cops kill us 40 times greater than a Muslim terrorist.
      
      American are by far the greatest terrorist organization in the world
      They are at it again with covid . Cannabis was another worldwide terrorist attack on the people, wow over a plant that has killed no one directly.

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         Misbah786posted 3 years agoin reply to this

         Castlepaloma, I am a Muslim and from Middle East. I never understood this term "Muslim terrorist". I am not here to defend Afghanis, Talibans or Americans. I just like to question people when they speak on things they themselves don't understand. May be they'll learn something new from me or who knows I will learn something new from them. I like when people say truth and become Rebel. Majority of people don't appreciate them but in the end it's always truth that wins. I appreciate you for talking things based on facts.

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         MizBejabbersposted 3 years agoin reply to this

         I think that thinking people can agree that the War on Drugs in this country has killed more people than drugs ever did before the "war". I don't have statistics to back this up. I hope someone else has the time to do the research to prove me right or wrong.

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      Misbah786posted 3 years agoin reply to this

      Mr. ValKaras, I agree with you. The problem was solved the day Osama Bin Laden was killed. Has anyone seen his body till now? Are there any records? Has the Pakistani or American governments provided any evidence? Why was Sadam Hussain prosecuted openly, while bin Laden was killed in secret? I agree with you that the verses of the Quran have nothing to do with this matter here.
      However, some people simply enjoy dragging things that attract the attention of others. I really try to avoid and do not appreciate people who enjoy playing religion games. I don't do that with other people's religion so I don't appreciate others doing that with my religion. As easy as ABC. The truth is that "you can't read a line and tell the entire book's summary." We should not say anything about things we don't completely understand, in my opinion.
      
      Peace and Blessings!!

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   ValKarasposted 3 years ago

   Wilderness -- What "rich, luxury ridden lifestyle" are you talking about?
   
   Do you mean half million homeless, a little handful of rich, and a dying out middle class that's struggling and keeping their "style" by maxing up credit cards?
   Do you really believe that the world is envious of America? Walk through Europe and ask them -- you might be surprised by your little poll.
   
   And, about their "mission to kill Americans"...-- wouldn't you have the same "mission" if someone came into your house to help themselves with what they find there, impose on your way of life, and even kill some of yours?
   
   So which Americans are you talking about? Do you really think they hate with a deadly passion an ordinary Joe in an American farm -- or they hate the one dressed in a uniform that they see on their streets.
   To me it sounds like you have some God-given rights to be there, and then it's them "terrorists" who dare to deny you that right.

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   bhattucposted 3 years ago

   The whole world is suffering and perturbed by the extremists or terrorists or fundamentalist groups present at various places. These people are so rigid and strong minded that it is very difficult to reform them. The experience shows that they can be only controlled or eradicated by counter attacks.

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      Kathryn L Hillposted 3 years agoin reply to this

      As America did when confronted by them in the early days of this country's history.

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   Jodahposted 3 years ago

   Very well answered and explained, Misbah.

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      Misbah786posted 3 years agoin reply to this

      Thank you very much for your support, John. Greatly appreciated, dear friend.
      Many many Blessings to you!!

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    Kathryn L Hillposted 3 years ago

    The Taliban are in need of reformation, The ones to do it are the the non-extreme Muslims.
    Is it wise to enable extremists, rather than reform them? Is it wise to run from them rather than fight them?
    We went into Afghanistan to help the Afghan people. We pulled out in such a way as to undo all the good we tried to do in the last twenty years. The truth is plain to see, as it is this simple. Why, then, so hard to accept?
    We should have stayed longer and we should have kept helping the Afghan people to resist and reform the Taliban.
    But alas, we gave up.

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    Kathryn L Hillposted 3 years ago

    PS Many Christians are staying in Afghanistan. They feel they are needed. Miracles can happen. Perhaps they will happen if Christians and Muslims work together for the same Mighty Triple O: The omniscient, omnipresent, omnipotent spiritual presence of/in the physical and metaphysical realms of the universe (s).

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       Castlepalomaposted 3 years agoin reply to this

       Yes, One World.Religion, we'll fight to hell and back to get it.

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    Kathryn L Hillposted 3 years ago

    https://www.ohchr.org/documents/publica … et32En.pdf

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    ValKarasposted 3 years ago

    Someone said: "Faith without deeds is dead" -- so on its own, what we "believe" is of no consequence at all. Actually the greatest majority of believers in this or that spiritual teaching are not mentally equipped, or advanced enough, to follow any of the known spiritual teachers.
    Proof?
    Just look at the state of this world where conflict of one or another kind is the mark of coexistence. Who are we kidding by calling ourselves religious, after the majority of the world's populace are believing in a "loving God" -- while producing these results?
    
    After millennia of religious professing, we are still studying those holy books, and if it was a regular schooling scenario, we might as well be called "students with special needs" -- because we still don't seem to get it.
    
    So we do our due rituals, and then get passionately drawn into political hatred, racial crap, addicted to daily negative news, no stress management, meditation, or any other self-cultivating act that would make our religious belief proactive.
    
    So, ultimately, who really cares if we believe this or that holy book if it's all just a mental construct, a passing interest, or a derivative of our need for protection, as we pray to a merciful celestial entity to spare us.
    
    In so many cases it's just a popular matter of self-identification with this or that group, giving us a sense of belonging to something bigger than ourselves. Something to do with titles, not much different than calling ourselves "devoted  Democrats/Republicans/vegans/whatever.
    
    We are not mentally equipped, not advanced enough, to grasp the truth at the level where it existed in heads and hearts of those teachers of the mankind.
    But at least TRYING may do.
    So why aren't we collectively and personally TRYING a little harder, that might show something different than we are viewing on the daily news.

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    Kathryn L Hillposted 3 years ago

    So, what are the beliefs of the Taliban?

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       Revirioposted 3 years agoin reply to this

       They want money!

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          Miebakagh57posted 3 years agoin reply to this

          Money? Eh eh eh!

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       Misbah786posted 3 years agoin reply to this

       Their beliefs? They need Peace! Actually, the whole world needs peace. Even the US needs Peace!! They can do drug trade if they want to but denied to do so. According to the bbc report, Afghanistan is the world's largest producer of opium, which can be refined to make heroin.
       
       With an estimated annual export value of $1.5-$3bn, opium is big business, supplying the overwhelming majority of heroin worldwide. A 10% cultivation tax is collected from opium farmers, according to Afghan government officials.
       
       Taxes are also reportedly collected from the laboratories converting opium into heroin, as well as the traders who smuggle the illicit drugs.
       Estimates of the Taliban's annual earnings from the illicit drug economy range from $100m-$400m.
       
       The drug trade accounts for up to 60% of the Taliban's annual revenue, said US commander General John Nicholson in the 2018. However, they don't wish to do this business/trade anymore. Allow time to disclose what comes next.
       
       Secondly, Afghanistan is rich in stones and minerals. The mining industry in Afghanistan is worth an estimated $1bn annually, according to Afghan government officials.
       
       They don't need money, I believe. I think, they have enough resources through many sources to survive and to make the government.
       
       https://www.bbc.com/news/world-46554097

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          Castlepalomaposted 3 years agoin reply to this

          https://www.cnn.com/2021/08/18/business … index.html
          
          Afghanistan is sitting on trillions of dollars of wealth and the west wants it. It's the main reason they have had to fight off the Russian and American.

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             Misbah786posted 3 years agoin reply to this

             +1

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             Misbah786posted 3 years agoin reply to this

             I believe, It was never a fight for religion and for women rights.
             
             The role of America in the Cold War has been a closely guarded secret where it supported the Afghan warlords or better known as Mujahideens to form the Taliban in December 1979. At the peak of the Cold War, the Soviet Union decided to invade Afghanistan under the pretext of upholding the Soviet-Afghan Friendship Treaty of 1978.
             
             At the time, the US went ahead and supported the Mujahideens to safeguard its interests, which is the official story.
             
             The Soviet Union occupation over Afghanistan lasted for a decade and throughout this period the CIA kept expanding its program under the code name - Operation Cyclone.
             
             Moral of the story is that It's the US government that gave power and weapons to those Mujhahidins, supported them for their own needs and benefits. Which goes around comes around.
             
             I think,  If the world calls Talibans as extremists then let's be assured of  that It's the US who gave birth to the Talibans. The confidence they have now is a gifted by America. I believe, as the call, so the echo.
             
             I am not defending anyone but these are the facts that can't be denied.
             
             Many people believe, America is at war—with itself.

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                Castlepalomaposted 3 years agoin reply to this

                After touring throughout the Middle East. I personally wouldn't live there due to a great lack of freedom.
                
                On the other hand, I support anyone choice of religion, country or culture and to defend their homeland. It's no business of America, especially decades of invasions, raping and pillaging. Where is there an international law preventing greed, the worst virtue to human kind.

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                   Misbah786posted 3 years agoin reply to this

                   As previously said, I am not defending anyone, but rather remaining neutral and having discussions based on facts.
                   
                   Unfortunately, we do not always have complete control over certain situations. It takes some time. Let time unveil what comes next. I believe, even though we follow different religions and cultures, we can all live in peace and harmony. We are all human beings. The world is a global village.
                   
                   "When the power of love overcomes the love of power, the world will know peace" --Jimi Hendrix.
                   
                   Peace!!!

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                      Castlepalomaposted 3 years agoin reply to this

                      That is sooo hippy,..
                      Lol.

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                         Misbah786posted 3 years agoin reply to this

                         Peace is all that's needed!

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                            Kathryn L Hillposted 3 years agoin reply to this

                            ... and swords when appropriate.

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                               Misbah786posted 3 years agoin reply to this

                               Who trained the Talibans?
                               
                               Can you deny this fact: " Afghanistan remained neutral during the First and Second World Wars. From the 1960s to the early 1990s, the Afghan Army was equipped by the Soviet Union. Under the Islamic Republic of Afghanistan, the Army was under the Ministry of Defense in Kabul and was largely trained by US-led NATO forces."
                               
                               Or can you deny this: "The Taliban, a force of 75,000 militants, overwhelmed a U.S.-trained army numbering about 300,000 — at times without a single bullet fired."
                               
                               https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/tali … y-n1276911
                               
                               I'll take the word "sword" as power. My question is who used that sword?
                               
                               The use of sword is never appropriate. But as said above If anyone is pushed to the brink of war. It is their right to retaliate.
                               
                               With all due respect, deny the facts with appropriate reasons and backup  resources or just accept them as they are. I am feeling fed up of answering same questions again and again
                               
                               Peace!!!

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                               Castlepalomaposted 3 years agoin reply to this

                               Yes, if they are going to kill your family.

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                            Miebakagh57posted 3 years agoin reply to this

                            Peace is enforce with the sword, by a stronger party.

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                               Castlepalomaposted 3 years agoin reply to this

                               If a military troopers came into my country and was going to kill my daughter, I would kill him first.
                               
                               Same if it was a God who tried.

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