Demon Possession

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LeslieAdrienneposted 15 years ago
Friday Night's 20/20 is talking about children who are demonized....check it out.

They are not religious at all, so they will not be biased toward Christianity or any other religion......
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  Hokeyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Are exorcisms involved?
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  LeslieAdrienneposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I don't know, I just saw the commercial advertising the show.....
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I do not believe this show is about children who are demonized but instead are suffering from schizophrenia.
  
  http://abcnews.go.com/2020/
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  LeslieAdrienneposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You may be right, but the commercial used a phrase which included the word demons or seeing demons.....I half heard it, so, I yield to anyone who actually knows what it is about.....
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Believers have a most difficult time trying to understand whether or not they should believe when they 'half hear' something. Since no critical thinking skills have been developed and only a system of form fitting the world into their beliefs is available to them, they must seek out that which will best fit those beliefs.
  
  Hence, it's not about finding answers to questions and seeking understanding, it's all about propping up their indoctrination.
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  SirDentposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Have you ever thought that it might be even remotely possible that some of these diseases/illnesses might be demonic?
  
  I watched one of the short videos and one girl of 9 years of age tried to slit her wrists. I wonder where she learned to do this? She is only 9 after all and doesn't have a lifetime of experience to learn how to do these things.
  
  Who were the first people to ever self harm by cutting?
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  Disturbiaposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I don't know who were the first people cutting themselves, but I was a cutter and I can assure you, there was nothing demonic going on, only a lot of pain I didn't know what else to do with.
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  Hokeyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Really? Come on man.
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Only if I was insane, I might.
  
  So, the fact that you can't figure out something immediately forces you to believe in myths and superstitions. Well done.
  
  Who cares?
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  getitriteposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
  Yes I have thought that it might be remotely possible that some diseases might be demonic, but then I came to my senses, because the concept of demons was a human construct based on superstitioin and fear. In other words, belief in demons is nonsense.
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  What's the difference?
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  Pandoras Boxposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  What a ghoul!
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  Disturbiaposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I don't believe in demons, these poor children must suffer from mental illness. However, I haven't seen the show so I can't really comment on this. I'm just stating an opinion.
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  SirDentposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  If you are wrong about demons and they are possessed, wouldn't you want them to be able to get better?
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  Disturbiaposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Yes, of course I would want them to be able to get better and with the proper care and medications they just might. I had a chance to watch the previews of the show and it is obvious these children are suffering, but the demons that torture them exist only inside their own minds.
  
  But I keep an open mind myself and I'm more interested in concrete results than abstract discussions. I say do whatever works, be that modern medicine, exorcisms, or pole dancing. Whatever it is that works, just do it.
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  SirDentposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Jesus HImself cast devils out of many. it is written and easily understood if anyone wants to understand it. Many talk about how good Jesus was and that he was killed unjuustly. Jesus did not give the devil a foothold.
  
  Viruses all began at some point in time. What caused them to start with?
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  SirDent, only someone steeped heavily in myths and superstitions would believe in demons, let alone demons possessing people.
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  getitriteposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I guess advances in modern psychology means absolutely nothing to those who live their lives based on folklore.
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  getitriteposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
  There are no such things as demons, so your question is loaded.
  
  Do you even understand the nature of some psychological disorders, such as schizophrenia?
  
  Schizophrenia (pronounced /ˌskɪtsɵˈfrɛniə/ or /ˌskɪtsɵˈfriːniə/) is a mental disorder characterized by abnormalities in the perception or expression of reality. It most commonly manifests as auditory hallucinations, paranoid or bizarre delusions, or disorganized speech and thinking with significant social or occupational dysfunction
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  So speaking in multiple languages; becoming extremely strong; spitting up glass, iron the size of a finger, and other objects; and growling and howling using multiple voices are due to schizophrenia or other mental disorders?
  
  Now I believe some people can become possessed because there are some things a regular human cannot do.
  
  So the people in these videos are suffering from schizophrenia or other mental disorders as well?
  
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j82LWgqSnKc
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x4n9vK0_mdk
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KC5O2jS3P64
  
  What about this video from the CBN?
  
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vVkbL4xpzuk
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  So, you watch some videos on the internet and are convinced demonic possession is real? I have some swampland in Florida if you're interested.
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Nope I have read literature on the topic for several years. Multiple religions perform exorcisms besides Catholics...
  
  So where is your evidence to refute Exorcisms? So basically you are stating that this activity that has been around for hundreds of years is a hoax?
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  getitriteposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
  History is full hoaxes, or didn't you know that?
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Multiple snakeoil salesmen have successfully sold snakeoil, too. You make the assertion that they performed exorcisms just as the sucker who bought the snakeoil.
  
  Ah, so you're not familiar with the "burden of proof" fallacy. It is up to you to provide evidence to support exorcisms, which you have yet to do. Youtube videos are not evidence.
  
  And, you are assuming snakeoil salesmen haven't been around for longer than that? Are you really that gullible?
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  SirDentposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Snake oil salesen are the ones who would seel things to make sick people well, according to their stories. In other words, they could only sell something to those who were sick.
  
  Psychiatrists do the same thing. They sell drugs for the pharmaceutical compaines and make lots of money to line their own bank accounts with. They invent diseases to make surte everyone knows there are sick people that only they can help.
  
  Many seem to believe devils do not exist, but nearly all believe there are good things and bad things in the world today. Some even believe good spirits and bad spirits are in the world and still don't believe there are devils.
  
  Others would rather these children keep their diseases or devils so they can experiment on them. And now a very serious question below.
  
  I asked this before and it was totally ignored.
  
  How can a 9 year old girl learn how to cut herself and slit her wrists so that she can die?
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  No, they only sell to the gullible.
  
  More fabrications, SirDent?
  
  Some buy swampland in Florida, others buy used cars that are lemons and some even believe in the invisible and undetectable, too.
  
  It probably was ignored because it's a rather silly question. You are actually asking how a child can learn something. Are you serious?
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  SirDentposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I would never have thought you to be so gullible but I digress. You have bought it and drunk it willingly.
  
  These children are doing things that they should not even know about. They are too young to find out about them without some help from someone or something. Doesn't this even concern you just a tiny bit?
  
  Just so you know, cutting is mentioned in the Bible first in the Old Testament. The prophets of Baal cut thsemselves when Elijah challenged their god. Of course we know that Baal did not respond to cutting anymore than he did to their chanting.
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  What concerns me is how gullible people are and what lengths they'll go to look the fool.
  
  SirDent, no parent knows exactly everything that their children has learned or from what sources. It isn't even an argument.
  
  Whoopteedoo! Can I get a resounding, "So what?"
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  getitriteposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
  You seem like an intelligent person, judging from your posts in other forums, but this is where you have chosen to allow your thinking to be controlled by something other than reason.
  
  Those videos prove nothing on the subject of demonic possession. First of all, the first two are probably fakes. And the 20/20 video: Just because these people "claim" that there was no medical explanation for her afflictions, does not default to demonic possession.
  
  You believe this nonsense based upon your conditioning. You have no proof of demonic possession, only videos of people suffering from disturbing afflictions.
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Where is your proof to prove this is "nonsense" other than your own beliefs? Basically where is your proof to refute this ritual as nonsense that has been practiced by the Roman Catholics for several hundred years?
  
  Several exorcists describe people who are possessed with information similar below.
  
  "Father Amorth told La Repubblica that the devil was "pure spirit, invisible. But he manifests himself with blasphemies and afflictions in the person he possesses. He can remain hidden, or speak in different languages, transform himself or appear to be agreeable. At times he makes fun of me."
  
  He said it sometimes took six or seven of his assistants to to hold down a possessed person. Those possessed often yelled and screamed and spat out nails or pieces of glass, which he kept in a bag. "Anything can come out of their mouths – finger-length pieces of iron, but also rose petals."
  
  I pretty sure that people who were skeptical were allowed to witness a few of these events although this Exorcist does not allow or share video of his exorcisms.
  
  http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/commen … 056689.ece
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Again, you don't seem to get the fact that it is YOU who must demonstrate this isn't nonsense other than your own beliefs.
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Pope's exorcist squads will wage war on Satan
  
  The Pope has ordered his bishops to set up exorcism squads to tackle the rise of Satanism.
  
  Vatican chiefs are concerned at what they see as an increased interest in the occult.
  
  http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article … Satan.html
  
  So where is your proof that can allow you to tell Pope Benedict and all other Roman Catholics that exorcisms are a bunch of hogwash?
  
  I am not Catholic but believe evil is everywhere in this world and people can be possessed by demons or the devil.
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  getitriteposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
  The problem with you is your presupposition of the existence of someone called Satan, and minions called demons. I have no such presuppositions, therefore your premise is nonsense.
  
  Next, I think the Catholic faith is wretched ignorance, just as Protestant religions.
  
  So your task is to prove the existence of Satan, and demons, using something other than Catholicism or the biased bible, because that's where the presupposition lies.
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  So if Exorcists tell you that a possessed person can become extremely strong and can do things that no other human can do.... such as start speaking in multiple languages the individuals do not know, spit up practically anything, and so on...
  
  First would you agree that these are not symptoms of mental disorders?
  
  Next how can you verify that these described symptoms actually take place and are not a hoax?
  
  By observing these exorcisms on a daily basis for a extended period of time to view these events for yourself...
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  getitriteposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
  Have you ever tried to break up a fight? If so, did you notice how hard it is to pull two people apart, even people that are of only average strength? The reason is adrenaline.
  
  "The speaking of multiple languages the individuals do not know???" Do you have extraordinary proof of this?
  
  As for your other assertion, it defies the laws of nature, which is not possible. So it must be mere trickery!
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  So would you agree that some of the symptoms of exorcisms sound rather ridiculous or untrue?
  
  Now since, exorcisms have been around for hundreds of years, do you believe an psychosis expert or other medical expert and so on, have conducted a study or experiment by analyzing so-called exorcisms (to see if these symptoms or other ridiculous symptoms take place)?
  
  If so, what were their results or conclusions? Did they refute exorcisms or support that they may be valid?
  
  This is the fact-based analysis I am seeking from people who just state that exorcisms are non-sense.
  
  If not, let's contact some experts who believe exorcisms are hogwash and contact the Pope, Bishops, and/or Exorcists who believe in them and have both parties set up an extended study to observe these exorcisms.
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  It doesn't matter what they tell you. A snakeoil salesman will tell you everything you want to hear so you'll buy the snakeoil. Have you never dealt with a used car salesman or real estate agent before?
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Exactly. YOU believe. You haven't demonstrated anything other than that.
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  Mikel G Robertsposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Why do the exorcists need to keep secrets? Why don't they film/video all their exorcisms? Secrets in religion are big warning bells to me.
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Because they may not want to frighten people.
  
  When the Exorcist came out a few days before Christmas in 1973, before the movie was half way over it was reported that people were vomiting, fainting, running out of the theater, screaming, experiencing nauseous and trembling, others checking into the hospital, some rumored to had heart attacks, others could not sleep for several nights, some people experienced depression, and so on...
  
  When the 2000 re-release of the Exorcist came out claiming to be the scariest movie of all-time, I went with my friends. The graphics did not look all that great but the movie theater was packed with families and adults. I told my friends that these people are in for a rude awakening.
  
  As you may know, the movie starts off very slow and I heard people in the theater state out loud on occasions that this movie sucks. However, once Linda starting displaying signs of possession, kids started crying and screaming and their parents told them not to look. However the audio was just as frightening. I also could hear several of these individuals asking their friends and significant others can they leave.
  
  Before the movie got really good over 3/4 of the movie participants started to bail out of the theater.
  
  Now this movie was not real and was an exaggeration of exorcisms. Just imagine what would happen if you start showing real exorcisms to people.
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  earnestshubposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  It almost made me throw up too! It was a third rate screamer!
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
  When you begin to base your argument on a movie, then you really are stretching well beyond credibility.
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  The chief Exorcist knows a little about exorcisms...
  
  "He approves, however, of the 1973 film The Exorcist, which although "exaggerated" offered a "substantially exact" picture of possession."
  
  "Amorth's favorite film is The Exorcist. He thinks that it is substantially exact and based on a true story, although the special effects are exaggerated. He thinks that people should see it so that they would "know what we do".
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  getitriteposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
  This so-called Chief Exorcist knows nothing. He is deceiving you and other gullible people, and maybe even himself. Psychosis does exist, demons, NO!
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  Mikel G Robertsposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I don't have a tv.
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Twenty One Daysposted 15 years ago
That is far fetched, considering that religious people use more critical thinking in an attempt to find a or the truth of their purpose. Some spend a lifetime doing so -with or without documents.

By indoctrination, you mean the use of tools, texts, elements of experimentation, to accept or hypothesize some consideration? Funny how science does the same, a few different tools, definitions, but nonetheless the same. The argument is getting thin and stale.
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skyfireposted 15 years ago
Yeah,

H1N1== curse of pig monster
rabies== possession of Cerberus

go on... now HIV ?
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  SirDentposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  That's a very intelligent response. Can you even be a little serious about this?
  
  Where did they all actually originate anyway?
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  skyfireposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Disease have explanation about their origins unlike mythical creatures, demons who are part of human imagination. Now let's be serious about mythical creatures and demons,why they haunt us ? burning desire to do timepass ?
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  Obscurely Diverseposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  The Homo sapiens act as a disease/virus to Gaia/Mother Earth, so what's the explanation for that? Mythical creatures at least portray something better than the scientific hogwash of utmost confusion......
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  Disturbiaposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  N1H1, rabies, and HIV are all viruses, not curses, punishments, or demons.
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logic,commonsenseposted 15 years ago
Isn't it illegal to possess a demon inside the city limits without the proper liscence?
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  Disturbiaposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Oops! I didn't know that. Where do I apply for one?
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  logic,commonsenseposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Well you take the Highway to Hell and I'll be at the desk to fill it out for you!
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Lynda Garyposted 15 years ago
First, the 20/20 show (which I've pre-set to make sure I don't miss it) is about mental illness, not demon possession, but...

I can understand and appreciate how some parents (and bystanders) might question whether these severely affected children haven't some how been taken over by a demon. Some of their behaviors are so ... demon-like ... it naturally begs the question.

From my own experience, during the early stages of trying to understand why my son was suffering from, I, too, questioned whether it was possible. Parents who have no answers and are desperate for a resolution will consider ANYTHING.

In our case, we'd have a "perfect" baby who never got upset, always slept thru the night, etc. Suddenly, at the age of two, he changed. Drastically. We sought medical help, and they (first) questioned our parenting skills. We proved to them that our parenting methods were not to blame. By watching home videos, they finally "got it." It would be a long time before we got a diagnosis (autism, brain injury, seizure disorder), and in the mean time, while watching our son writhe, scream, and generally act demon-possessed. It wasn't his fault, and it wasn't ours. But it happened, frequently, and until we knew why, we -- intelligent, educated, rational parents -- considered everything.
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Typically medical professionals and an Exorcist will first determine if someone is actually sick from hysteria, mania, psychosis, Tourette's syndrome, epilepsy, schizophrenia or dissociative identity disorder and so on or is actually possessed...
  
  Well if you hear various strange voices and growls from your son, your son speaking in multiple languages, and your son becoming extremely strong (potentially stronger than you)... then maybe he could be possessed.
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  What would a so-called exorcist have to do with medical professionals?
  
  Notice how that sort of thing never happens except in movies and tv?
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  The answer is in my statement above.
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  So, the answer is that you're incredible gullible?
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  JeanMeriamposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Your son has turned into a teenager!!!
  
  Sorry! Couldn't help myself. My son just turned 14.
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Greek Oneposted 15 years ago
sometimes i feel as though my lower parts are under the direct control of evil demons...

but usually a quick glass of Metamucil helps exorcize the little buggers and returns me to a state of tranquility an inner peace
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JeanMeriamposted 15 years ago
I will tell you a little story about demonic possession.

When my daughter was 8, my husband was friends with a youth pastor who visited our home. This youth pastor was very "into" demons being able to oppress and possess from time he spent in Europe. He was at the table talking about something religious, can't remember what, something to do with secrets.

My daughter pipes in, "I have a secret. I can see the lord." He questions her and she says. "I talk to the lord and he talks to me,"
The youth pastor asked her how often and she told him a couple of times a day.

He has a big discussion with us about possession and blah blah blah blah. My daughter couldn't possibly see and talk to the lord so she must be interacting with a demon. I just kept shut up because he was a friend.

After he left I asked my daughter why on earth she would say that to him. Her answer was "He wanted to hear a secret."

"But you don't talk to or see the lord do you?"

"No but he works at church. I thought he would like that one."

I admit we still laugh about it, but this is the way it goes.
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skyfireposted 15 years ago
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earnestshubposted 15 years ago
Of all the insane beliefs on the religious forums, this one is only a 3/10.
A lot of the religious threads are misspelt, the posts are filled with more misspelling, blatant logic screw ups and nonsense replies.
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Your posts are filled with insults and non fact-based analysis.
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  Hokeyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  We forgive you for saying that. It wasn't you. It was the demons.
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  earnestshubposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You have the gall to accuse someone else of "non fact based analysis?"
  Now that is seriously funny!
  Do you think you may have missed your real calling?
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Where are the facts earnestshub to prove that this ritual, of a group of 1 billion plus members with the Pope serving as the highest authority, is hogwash?
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  earnestshubposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I don't need to provide proof. It is self evident.
  Where is your proof that it is not?
  The pope give advice on sex and family too, I feel pretty confident he knows less than nothing about either!
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  If I had to believe you or the Pope, Exorcists, and others who participate in exorcisms you know who I will believe.
  
  I provided you with some information regarding exorcisms. There is a lot more information available to you.
  
  However, you have not provided any information or supporting details to refute exorcisms.
  
  You have only provided your opinions.
  
  You do not need to provide proof, because you do not have any?
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  earnestshubposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You are correct. I have no evidence at all. Now I wonder why that is?
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Because you cannot refute exorcisms. Likewise, your comments in this thread are futile.
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  getitriteposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  First of all, you are giving undue authority to a joker wearing a funny hat, and a bunch of gullible delusional followers.
  
  Again, your abject nonsense is based on presuppositions that you assume everyone else has. It is more likely that 1 billion people are delusional, along with their leader, rather than your assertion that demons exists!
  
  Those in authority, who sanction primitive superstitious stupidity, should not be in authority.
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  Lynda Garyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  misspelled, not misspelt. (sorry earnest)
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earnestshubposted 15 years ago
Once again, no explanation needed other than the title.
Yet again the title is a dead give-away!
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earnestshubposted 15 years ago
Oh pleeeze!
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skyfireposted 15 years ago
I can speak 2 foreign languages (excluding English, 4 native languages). And i'm planning to give my multiple voices to animation firm as well. Not sure about being strong cause i don't feel strong by hitting or bullying someone. So am i possessed ? Hmm..
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Duh, the Exorcists will know what languages you can speak and will challenge the Demon or Devil to speak in other languages you do not know... to prove that they are dealing with something demonic.
  
  Can you also spat out nails or pieces of glass, finger-length pieces of iron, rose petals, and other objects?
  
  Over the past hundreds of years of so, I pretty sure that the skeptical has been allowed to view Exorcisms to see these events in person and left by eating crow.
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  Hokeyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I really hope you don't believe this nonsense.
  
  also they don't allow anyone to see.
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  getitriteposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
  It's no wonder Sylvia Brown and John Edwards make so much cash!
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  In your case, "pretty sure" and "dead wrong" are one and the same. Try offering something with substance rather than fabricating more nonsense.
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  foreignpressposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Pardon my interruption. But, what sort of proof would you need to convince you of demonic possession? Obviously these tit-for-tat accusations lead to nowhere. So there needs to be some substance. Scientific evidence? More YouTube videos? A personal audience with the Pope?
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Foreignpress, I do not believe any evidence will do for this group; since some if not the majority of them may be Atheists.
  
  I am not a Catholic but I respect all religions that promote peace and respect the views of Atheists as well.
  
  Likewise, I do not attempt to ridicule people who have opposing views.
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  That is where you're wrong, my deluded friend. You haven't offered any evidence as yet, so it would behest you to do so before making such statements.
  
  Opposing views may ver well be insane views but insane views are not opposing views, they're just insane.
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Evidence. Simple, really. Of course, one would have to provide evidence that gods and demons actually exist, first, yes?
  
  Anything, actually, that resembles hard evidence. Personal audiences with the Pope and Youtube videos don't cut it.
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Why don't you get your Atheist leaders (if you are Atheist) or medical professionals to convince the Vatican to allow you to witness hundreds of exorcisms. They use eye witness accounts and individuals experience as validation for their ritual.
  
  Below is a video you can watch although it seems to be an extremely minor case for exorcism; since the lady affected did not display some of the extreme possession symptoms.
  
  ABC's 20/20 Showing a Real Exorcism - 1991 - part 2 of 4!
  
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pTiGtIlMFSI
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Arthur Fontesposted 15 years ago
If an exorcist performs his job correctly would that be a repossession?
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  earnestshubposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
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  skyfireposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Lol.
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Hokeyposted 15 years ago
ggu6ir6i cghcrte4673hjdf.snuo;y5d8... What's wrong with me!!

hjklgyukxcje5jgmo4wq...... AM I.... f6ir6fir67i7tvi

hbsdl.W4Y8TLBHFUS;AHBSA.... POSSESSED?

BRRRRRPPPPPPPP!!!!!!!!!! Oh ok.

Just Gas...
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skyfireposted 15 years ago
and these exorcist live by faith right ? Any empirical evidence for their work against demons ? oh wait you've to prove demons exist first.
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Why don't you arrange a study or experiment to prove your hypothesis that Exorcisms are a hoax?
  
  First determine all of the extreme symptoms a possessed person displays per the Exorcists:
  
  -Speaking in languages the "possessed" person does not know
  -Becoming extremely or ridiculously strong
  -Spitting up any types of objects and so on
  
  Next determine if these extreme symptoms are also symptoms of mental disorders such as hysteria, mania, psychosis, Tourette's syndrome, epilepsy, schizophrenia or dissociative identity disorder.
  
  Finally observe these Exorcisms on a daily basis (whenever feasible) for an extended period of time to see if these extreme symptoms took place and how often or if you believed these individuals were just suffering from mental disorders.
  
  I have never seen an exorcism and based off of the symptoms these Exorcists state that take place... Spitting up any objects and so on.... I will state that's impossible... Let me view this for myself...
  
  Most importantly, do you think I am the first person to come up with this idea?
  
  So if you believe this is nonsense, provide evidence in which some reputable medical professionals or some other experts viewed these events or carried out similar experiments and studies and concluded that exorcisms are a bunch of baloney.
  
  Exorcisms have been around for hundreds of years and someone has to had conducted primary research on this topic.
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  Hokeyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Bring this person and I would gladly observe.
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  skyfireposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Debunked many such cases in india. This exorcism and BS is regular here and you can say 4-5 times in a week someone get possessed LOL. We've few cannibals as well here who worship god of demons(shiva-who according to hinduism has status of god of balance). His worshipers eat dead body and eat living humans as well(google for cannibals in india)there was lot of scientific study and such exorcism-junk is already proved as hoax/BS. Now do you want to try your christian way in my country ? come along we'll have fun with this exorcism stuff. And talking about languages lol, there are many cases here where people get possessed in temple and after sometime priest calms them down, so it's quite sure how these gibberish language comes from and how only priest understands language of demons.
  
  LOL, evidences of exorcism ? and it is peer reviewed by medical professionals right ? If you get any evidence from medical professionals for peer review of their exorcism as fact study, drop me an e-mail.
  
  it is on case by case basis. many cases varies when it comes possession and exorcism.
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I'm asking you to provide evidence that state Exorcisms are not true. I am not a Catholic...
  
  However, I know that the Catholic Church is the world's largest Christian church with more than 1 billion members with the Pope serving as their highest authority.
  
  Would you agree that believing exorcisms are BS is sort of a controversial belief since it's a Catholic ritual?
  
  Likewise, I am asking you for reputable information that can basically tell the Pope, bishops, Exorcists, and so on that their beliefs in exorcisms are hogwash.
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  Hokeyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You don't have to tell THEM!!! They already know!!
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Sure Hokey... Just like they believe you are an individual who provides substance instead of a religion forum troll.
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  Hokeyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Now it's trolls?
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Hokeyposted 15 years ago
I think if I had a choice of having either a demon or a priest inside me, I think I'm going to go for the demon. At least when the demon's exorcised, it's cast back into hell instead of just being relocated to another parish.
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  Hokeyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I love this joke!
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Arthur Fontesposted 15 years ago
Drowning deep in my sea of loathing
Broken your servant I kneel
(Will you give in to me?)
It seems what's left of my human side
Is slowly changing in me
(Will you give in to me?)

Looking at my own reflection
When suddenly it changes
Violently it changes (oh no)
There is no turning back now
You've woken up the demon in me

Disturbed
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skyfireposted 15 years ago
Logical fallacy(appeal to common practice) here. Just because it is there for hundreds of years doesn't make that practice true.
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  That was not my intention of the statement. My statement is if exorcisms have been around for hundreds of years some expert who believes they are hogwash should have conducted primary research to support his or her claim...
  
  Likewise, where is this information? Could you provide some information from a reputable source that states that exorcisms are not true?
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  skyfireposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Primary research ?LOL, as if Christians and exorcist give a damn to primary research. besides Christians are enough deluded to either bend their belief as per science or oppose it whenever required. exorcism is considered as superstition in my country and any random priest claiming such things gets treatment in bars. Government made this law after enough investigation and not as per investigation that pleases particular religious faith. so care to dig information from government instead of preaching exorcism.
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Your country is?
  
  How would your country treat a person who display these symptoms?
  
  -No symptoms of mental disorders or psychosis
  -The ability to curse/blaspheme in languages unknown to the person.
  -The ability to find secret things, read the mind, and divine future happenings.
  -Knowledge of things that is impossible for them to know
  -The ability to make physical efforts abnormal for that person.
  -The act of spitting or vomiting every object the person may have swallowed.
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Those claims are specious, at best. There is no evidence those phenomena occurred. They are merely claims of so-called exorcists who are the perpetrators of the hoax, simple fabrications.
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Hokeyposted 15 years ago
http://www.tonyfinlay.co.uk/ExorcismIntroduction.htm
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  This information seems to support exorcisms.
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Arthur Fontesposted 15 years ago
Maybe they are not demons.

Maybe they are the Annunaki.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kv2l93v4v0g
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Hokeyposted 15 years ago
[=Kenrick]If I had to believe you or the Pope, Exorcists, and others who participate in exorcisms you know who I will believe.

That is because you are brainwashed.
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Hokey, you seemed to post a link (in an earlier post) to information that contradicts your arguments. Likewise, I definitely will not put much thought into anything you write.
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  Hokeyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You asked for info. You got it. I do not care if you believe me. Your reputation with me is shot. Possession? Seriously?
  
  Whats next? Unicorns? Tooth fairy? Santa Claus?
  
  There was a team that looked into possession for years. Can't remember the name but will find it. Out of hundreds of cases they were all determined to be a hoax. How about the Easter Bunny? You believe in it too? Flying Spaghetti Monster? Boogie man? Get out of the dark ages. Wake up! Stop being a stooge to the fear mongers. AAAAhhhhhhhhhhh...
  
  Whatever
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Should I hold my breath while I wait for you to find that source?
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  earnestshubposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I would like that!
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I know you would because I would pass out waiting..
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  Hokeyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Please don't. You might die and try to possess me!
  
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Disturbiaposted 15 years ago
I'm possessed. I just know I am. I have red hair and I'm left-handed. I know those are signs. It runs in my family. My mother was possessed, she talked to spirits. My daughters are possessed. My husband is possessed. My dogs are possessed. We are just one big happy pot of possession. I'm calling the exorcist right now. I wonder if we can get rid of all our demons by supper time, I'm making tuna casserole, a known favorite food of demons.
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  Hokeyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You can possess me!!
  
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  Disturbiaposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Possession is 9/10s of the law!
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  Hokeyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I am yours to possess! Will you show me how to speak in tongues?
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  JeanMeriamposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  For only a few thousand dollars I can come in and rid you of the evil. L'Oreal or Nice n Easy? I can work with either.
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Arthur Fontesposted 15 years ago
If a demon enters my body would it be inappropriate to ask it to chip in for rent and food?
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Hokeyposted 15 years ago
http://friendlyatheist.com/2008/04/06/exorcism-fraud/

still looking but this is funny
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  In one of the videos I provided, one of the Exorcists discussed people serving as "Exorcists" for monetary purposes.
  
  Plus the information you provided is from an Atheist source.
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  Hokeyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  so?
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Hokeyposted 15 years ago
funny too

http://www.skeptic.com/eskeptic/05-07-07/
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Wow, what another great, reputable source... lol...
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  Hokeyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Did you think I was going to go on a catholic site?
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I was hoping you were going to go medical experts including psychosis experts sites.
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  Hokeyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Why? Are you asking for help?
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  No. Some of these individuals could believe exorcisms are hogwash.
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earnestshubposted 15 years ago
What the catholic church specialises in is the same as many other religions.
The sexual assault of children.
An abundance of proof is available.
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Out of over 1 billion people, there will be a few bad apples.
  
  I sure some people who were not religious have inflicted harm on children as well.
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  earnestshubposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  A few bad apples? Do you read? Religionists force the suppression of sexuality in the name of their god, that is why a disproportionate number of children are abused by god-botherers.
  Religionists took the children off the native people in my country to bring them up in a "proper christian manner" They were used like slaves on farms, bashed and sexually abuses enmasse by those wonderful "christians".
  Our Prime minister has apologised to them for it, but these peoples lives were stolen from them.
  They are known as "The stolen generation"
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Yes you have people who state they are "Christians" but do bad things.
  
  You have others who state they are "Christians" and try to do the right things all of the time.
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  earnestshubposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I have never heard of anyone other than religionists who have done this have you? Take a whole generation away from their parents and abuse them. If so show me proof of it!
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  To me, it sounds like you are describing cults such as David Koresh and the Branch Davidians.
  
  Do I believe the majority of Muslims are bad people due to Muslim extremists? No.
  
  Like I stated, there are a few bad apples in any religious group that promotes peace.
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  earnestshubposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Not any sect. Mainline religions, and you know it!
  Any non religionists you know who have done this?
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  earnestshubposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Cat got your tongue?
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  Hokeyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Easy Ernest! He's praying for an answer!
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  "What the catholic church specialises in is the same as many other religions.
  
  The sexual assault of children."
  
  There is no point to continue discussing things with individuals who make statements like the ones above.
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  earnestshubposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You mean true statements? I can understand that! Where are the hoards of child molesters who are not religionists?
  The Catholic church is on the news as I speak. Guess why? Germany, the latest country on the list.
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  Hokeyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Are all child molestations advertised?
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  earnestshubposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  No, the church is still trying to protect it's priest going back 50 years or so.
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  All religious groups have bad apples. All child molestations are not advertised. Only the extreme cases. Even atheists have a few bad apples:
  
  Jeffrey Dahmer
  Richard Speck
  Ted Bundy
  John Wayne Gayce
  John Dillinger
  Columbine killers
  The Unibomber, Theodore John Kaczynski
  Joseph Stalin
  Mao Tse Tung
  Pol Pat
  Bernie Madoff
  
  Likewise, people who live in glass houses should not throw stones.
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  earnestshubposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Nice way to move out of range!
  
  No, we are not talking about despots in or out of religion.
  No atheists or non believers who are sane would defend any of these loonies either.
  Which of these are child molesters by the way?
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  getitriteposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
  I think John Wayne Gayce was the only one on that list.
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  JeanMeriamposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  United Church, Catholic Church etc. You need to do some history reading.
  
  www.hiddenfromhistory.org
  
  The fromer pastor who made this website also made a documentary called Unrepentant. You can watch it on google video.
  
  I foster First Nations children and I can tell you without a doubt, these are a people destroyed by the churches. One of my good friends sisters died a few days ago. Victim of the residential school system. The horrors these kids were put through is unimaginable. They came out and became alcoholics and drug addicts, they had no parents so they couldn't parent. Sexual abuse, physical abuse, emotional abuse, genocide of a culture. And people say, why should we pay for what our ancestors did or be sorry. They don't have the education to realise that in my country anyway the last of the so called schools closed in 1996.
  
  And why was this done to them? To Christianise them.
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  earnestshubposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Thank you for this honest post. Too rare in the religious forums.
  
  I am sick of the hypocrisy of these sick loons.
  
  If religion had any grasp on reality they would not be doing this to our children.
  I would not let one of my kids near one of them!
  The story in my country was horrendous also, and is still happening in churches around the world even as I write this.
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Jeramiposted 15 years ago
I sure am glad that nothing exists that I don't already know about.
That makes me feel safe to walk anywhere any time I want to anywhere in the world that I want to go.
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You should not fear evil. Now if something evil starts attacking you (which is rare), then you should seek assistance.
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Arthur Fontesposted 15 years ago
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GgZPryMAsLE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NLhPXbhS … re=related

Plausible?
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donotfearposted 15 years ago
I had a client once who was in jail. I was called to assess him cause he was drinking toilet water, licking the walls and other gross stuff. He was brought to me in a wheelchair with 5 officers in tow and 2 nurses on staff. He was handcuffed behind his back to prevent him from attacking. He had a mask over his nose & mouth to keep him from spitting on me and others. He was banged up with gashes all over his head and face from hitting it against the cell wall. He looked down the whole time & would not make eye contact. He was a pitifully sick young man. I took one look and my eyes filled with tears. He began to growl like a wild dog, low at first, then louder. I made my recommendation, left the jail, and cried.

This was NOT demon possession. This was Schizophrenia, first psychotic break, age 20. It was not funny. This is not a joke. This is my work.

Whether I believe in demon possession or not is unimportant. This is what is important.
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  JeanMeriamposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I had a foster child with Reactive Attachment Disorder. Mental illness can be very horrifying.
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  donotfearposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
  Yes it can. And disturbing as well. Thank goodness for anti-psychotic drugs.
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Hokeyposted 15 years ago
nikepick your spam has been reported. Namaste
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Hokeyposted 15 years ago
Love yourself and be awake -
today, tomorrow, always.
First establish yourself in the way,
then teach others,
and so defeat sorrow.
To straighten the crooked
you must first do a harder thing -
straighten yourself.
You are the only master. Who else?
Subdue yourself,
and discover your master.

I'm not athiest. Buddhist. Just been messing with you. There is no such thing as possession. Catholics preach possession. You have already said that they are not to be trusted. Don't see your argument. Namaste
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Symptoms of "possession":
  
  -The ability to curse/blaspheme in languages unknown to the person.
  -The ability to find secret things, read the mind, and divine future happenings.
  -Knowledge of things that is impossible for them to know
  -The ability to make physical efforts abnormal for that person.
  -The act of spitting or vomiting every object the demons would have made the person swallow.
  
  Other symptoms occasionally listed include:
  -Fear and/or hatred of holy objects.
  -The inability to say the word "Christ"."
  
  Here is part of an interesting interview with an Exorcist. He stated less than 1% of the 50% of people they see who believe they are possessed are actually possessed.
  
  "JF: Phenomenon? No. What I've witnessed sometimes, though not always, is the ability to speak in other languages, great strength, knowledge of things impossible for them to know, and levitation twice.
  
  LTK: You saw levitation occur?
  
  JF: I had my eyes closed, praying, when it occurred, but others who were present saw the levitation twice.
  
  LTK: What was the most convincing case you've experienced?
  
  JF: The most convincing case is that of Marta, now a famous case and one that hasn't yet finished. That was the case where levitation occurred twice, and many other strange phenomenon. The case was made famous because, to my dismay, they introduced a hidden camera and broadcast it on TV. I am convinced by the case because I asked her something that she couldn't possibly know, and she said the name of a person in reply. Another time I told her, in Latin, to say the 22nd Psalm. She began to reply in Spanish, with a fully memorized version of the Psalm. Not even the Bishops, or the Pope himself, could memorize the entire Bible, word for word, and repeat entire sections on request. "
  
  http://paranormal.lovetoknow.com/Real_Life_Exorcist
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  From the link:
  
  "LTK: How can you know a person is truly possessed?
  
  JF: There are certain phenomenon that we know of, a pattern, that you simply don't see on TV or in the movies. But we can recognize that, and we can also recognize people improving with prayer. We've had cases where psychologists are given a demonic case and they simply don't know what to do. "
  
  Notice how JF never answers the question but refers to tv and movies and then defers the question to an assertion about psychologists.
  
  Snakeoil.
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earnestshubposted 15 years ago
And you believed the levitation as well?
By the way who of the people you listed were child molesters again?
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I do not have a database to all child molesters and their religious orientation. I only hear about the extreme cases like you do via the media.
  
  He stated that it was shown on TV. I am now going to search for this broadcast.
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  earnestshubposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Don't like to keep on track do you? I asked about child molesters, and you give me a list of despots.
  Do you always avoid direct questions?
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I emailed Father Jose Antonio Fortea and asked how I can view the Martha exorcism that was shown on television (as mentioned in his interview above).
  
  I found a link to this but I want to see the video.
  
  http://www.speroforum.com/a/16590/Marta … f-exorcism
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brianzenposted 15 years ago
alliotriophogy=the vomiting up of unusual objects often associated with demonic possession
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brianzenposted 15 years ago
You may try a show called paranormal state on a&e, it has loads of the paranormal info, even exorcisms. All of it seems legit.
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Nice brianzen. I just finished reading that long article above about the "exorcism" of Martha.
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skyfireposted 15 years ago
There is plenty of evidence from medical side that shows state of hallucinatory mind and quackery of exorcism. if you seek evidence in terms of medical professionals then seek to the government where exorcism is considered as quack/superstition, instead of seeking evidence in country where there is no law against exorcism BS.

Catholic ritual ? exorcism is done in many religions. "exorcism" name of removing possession is from Catholics. Just because many people follow some religion doesn't give any valid reason for that belief, shows more of delusion.

Reputable information for whom pope ? that guy who preached against condoms, stem cell research and asking his minions to increase follower count by ordering christian women to give birth to more than 2 kids will care for reputable information ? it took many years for Vatican to thrash creationism. in 2009 they made news that they don't support creationism, so what reputable information that convinces them is you need from me or medical professionals against exorcism ? don't you think exorcism works on belief that demons exist where exorcist fails to give evidence of demon's existence to begin with ?
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Links to this "plenty of evidence"?
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  skyfireposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  We have department of crime related to superstitious beliefs. There is enough documented evidence there against these exorcist. want to check the department? or expect some URL/URL gaming for evidence ?
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Yeah I will like some URLs to this information. I do not know how individuals can levitate on their own.
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  skyfireposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Sorry, i can guide you to departments in my country for information related to this. I don't preach with URL's which has no credibility. I prefer either peer-reviewed sites or government sites for the information,instead of blogs/forums/youtube.
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skyfireposted 15 years ago
India

After medical examination almost all cases showed either hallucination/hypnotic state of person.

Already explained in earlier reply, how come that language is known by priest and not any linguist throughout the world ? strange ? yes it is.

Evidence for such ability please, no sweeping statements. else we can have x-men school soon if we get any person with this ability.

any example that shows your point.
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You did not provide me with any sources for this information?
  
  Well not everything that is spoken is probably known by the priest... Maybe they record these sessions and allow linguists to listen afterwards to determine which languages and statements were made.
  
  What the Exorcist describes in this interview is similar to the movie the Exorcist.
  
  http://paranormal.lovetoknow.com/Real_Life_Exorcist
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  skyfireposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  That is because i prefer credible/peer reviewed sources. My sources are related to law in my country,and we have very less documentation on internet.
  
  That sort of session were already done when there was cannibal from US got arrested in india. If you find any linguist reporting any credible evidence let me know.
  
  Do you really think "lovetoknow.com" is credible site for the information ? do you understand this site is not peer reviewed when you seek for credible information ?
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Here is a link to a written version of this exorcism:
  
  http://www.speroforum.com/a/16590/Marta … f-exorcism
  
  I emailed the Exorcist and asked how I can gain access to the video since it was recorded without him knowing.
  
  There are also a few books and several interviews of Exorcists all over the Internet.
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  skyfireposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I don't find this information as credible, author is not giving any links for peer-review of his stuff.
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Here you can contact the Exorcist and tell him that you believe he is full of it at his site below:
  
  http://www.fortea.ws/
  
  Here is a link to one of his interviews on YouTube:
  
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kts28qlNI_g
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  skyfireposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  So you ask me to email him to demonstrate his BS and get found as Troll for personal remark? Instead i've a better deal, why not call all these exorcist at one place on TV-show and let them demonstrate their skills ? I'm not sure how it works cause different country/different laws and many times people favor such stuff could be hard for government to handle but still this will be a good demo from any exorcist if they really wish people should take them seriously.
  
  Checking youtube video now, it's gonna be fun i know.
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  He replied with this:
  
  "Hello
  Well, the case continues. It is a teaching about the value of the suffering as a participation on the Cross of Crist. Other people have diseases, other people economic problems, or family problems. She has a demonic suffering that is turn into graces for the souls in the hands of God.
  God bless you."
  
  I responded by stating I hope Martha is freed from the demon soon and asked if he can provide me with URLs to reputable sources (preferably non-Catholic) that validate exorcisms since a few people believe they are a hoax.
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  skyfireposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  And anywhere he came up with credible source/peer review of his study ?
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Jeramiposted 15 years ago
In all reality You can not prove with all certainty to ME that you are not a figmant of my imagination.
Because any proof that you can come up with would also be a figmant of my imagionation.

And if you realy wanted to think about it;
You could say the same thing to me.
Absolute proof is objective ????
We are all prisoners of our own imagination

I must not have want anyone that I have imagined to agree with me.
I wonder why I did that??? I must be crazy.
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Or, indoctrinated.
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  Jeramiposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I can not tell you how much I appreciate hearing that from you.
  bunches of thanks to ya.
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Jerami, it has been my experience, as I'm sure it has been the experience of many, that the vast majority of believers deal with many things in their lives in a reasonable and rational fashion, except when it comes to their religion, and then they do appear quite crazy.
  
  The physical laws always apply to them as we don't see them jumping off buildings as if they would believe their gods would have them defy gravity.
  
  But, if it has anything to do with their religion, all bets are off and physical laws don't apply anymore. Gravity is thusly defied.
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Jeramiposted 15 years ago
I gotta go paint a bathroom today but will check in after.
Youl have a great day
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Hokeyposted 15 years ago
hsdiwkw,,,dp0903k3mmwei$&BNK6676oG*O&TOoy

I'm Possessed! hnjk;87p&PO(Hbbhlbv

NI:O&*PHHU:BNJK>KNnljvr840qutn5;'n45q

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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Hokey, would you like for me to send you an Ouija board to help with the process. It is very rare for a person to become possessed. However, several people can either be exposed to or encounter demons consistently.
  
  Luckily for me that has not happened. If some invisible force starts touching or attacking me and knocking things over in my house, you better believe I will seek some assistance.
  
  I have started to ask Exorcists to provide information from reputable sources (preferably non-Catholic) that validates exorcisms.
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  Hokeyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Hey Kenrick. Just kidding around. Sorry if I have upset you lately. My brother died last week. Haven't been myself. If I have offended you I do sincerely apologize. Namaste my friend.
  
  Do not believe in anything simply because you have heard it. Do not believe in anything simply because it is spoken and rumored by many. Do not believe in anything simply because it is found written in your religious books. Do not believe in anything merely on the authority of your teachers and elders. Do not believe in traditions because they have been handed down for many generations. But after observation and analysis, when you find that anything agrees with reason and is conducive to the good and benefit of one and all, then accept it and live up to it.
  Buddha
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Hokey, I am not offended.
  
  I am working on acquiring some exorcism validation since I cannot believe Catholic leadership will lie about exorcisms.
  
  Catholics still have some pull in this world and if exorcisms were proven to be a hoax they would probably lose all of their credibility.
  
  Likewise, what they are describing could easily be viewed and validated.
  
  For example in the case above, a voice of a male coming from a 20 year old girl with her hands at time appearing to be talons or hooks. Now that's some creepy stuff that could be validated by secretly video recording all Roman Catholic exorcisms for several years since one of the Exorcists stated that extreme events like these (such as levitation) do not happen all of the time.
  
  Per the Exorcist, this girl above is still possessed by this demon several years later.
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  True, just like the Flat Earth Society would never lie about scientific data or the Disclosure Project would never lie about visiting aliens.
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  Hokeyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Then why is this not ever performed in front of doctors? Scientists? If this could be proven then why not show it to the world? If it's not all deception then why not show people this is real? Why cloak it in secrecy? If this was real would they not be hurting others by keeping it wrapped in myth and mystery? Just the choice to not let outsiders observe is itself a validation of misdirection. The only way to keep this fairy tale legend alive is not to let light shine on it. They have to hide it because it is a lie. I wen to Amityville New York and talked to neighbors around the house where they made the movie"The Amityville Horror." They said it was all a bunch of crap! Even went to the church. They said the same thing.
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I do not know if they have allowed medical experts or scientists to view exorcisms on a consistent basis.
  
  However, what the Catholics will probably state (if they do not allow experts to view all of their exorcisms for several years) is that they do not want people to view them since they will know that Satan and demons are real.
  
  For example in the article above, they kept asking the demon why he will not leave the girl and he kept responding with something similar to this: I want people to know that Satan exists.
  
  In Rome, the number of devil worshipping organizations is consistently growing.
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Brilliant! Actually, it is one of the oldest tricks in the book and one of the lamest, only to be used on the "hook, line and sinkers" of the world.
  
  So, rather than just producing himself to the world, he possesses little girls as a form of proof of his existence?
  
  Barnum was right.
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Actually only a very small number people are possessed to a point that exorcisms has to take place. He just afflicts other people, tries to tempt them to do evil things (such as harming themselves and others), and so on with the goal of destroying them.
  
  The others just go out and worship him and/or just commit evil acts. For example, one of the devil worshiping groups in Rome participated in human sacrifice. They stabbed teenagers and buried them alive since one of the teenagers looked like a biblical figure to them.
  
  "Father Amorth told La Repubblica that the devil was "pure spirit, invisible. But he manifests himself with blasphemies and afflictions in the person he possesses. He can remain hidden, or speak in different languages, transform himself or appear to be agreeable. At times he makes fun of me."
  
  Report: Satan Worshipers Killed, Ate 4 Teens in Russia
  http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/ne … 691088.ece http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,422748,00.html
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  tantrumposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  If you believe all the Evil in this world is Devil's creation with all the effort and shrewdness that implies, how come you believe the Devil to be so stupid as to play those foolish games with people ??
  
  DOESN'T MAKE SENSE !!
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Since the devil was cast out of heaven and is not powerful enough to deal with God or Jesus, his role is to try to entice as many good or bad people (including some religious leaders) on the face of the Earth to commit evil.
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  tantrumposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
  who can be afraid of such stupid Devil then ?? If you believe in God, you shouldn't !
  
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  So, if your gods are so powerful, why then doesn't your god and Jesus team up in a death match with the devil and be done with him?
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Notice how dangerous it is for people to believe in such things? And, it is the people who continue to propagate those beliefs that are at fault.
  
  Surely, there is no reason to make fun of someone who is clearly insane considering what lengths people will go as you've indicated.
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  sabrebIadeposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Okay, here's my question....
  If demonic possession really exists, then why IS Satan wasting his time with nine year olds?
  Why not just grab Obama, Putin, Hu Jintao for a few minutes, and have them launch a small scale nuclear war?
  "But other political leaders will stop them from launching an attack."
  Okay...I know there are more than just 3 or 4 demons around, just grab everyone that could legally stop the leaders.
  I'd say 100 to 1000 demonic possessions in about an hour in strategic places, and Satan could have the world in total chaos by tomorrow.
  So why hasn't he done this already?
  Masses of people would turn their backs on God for allowing such an event to take place and Satan would have his chaos, suffering...everything he wants.
  Forget subtle...he wins.
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  So why do you assume that individuals who participate in exorcisms are strictly 9 year olds?
  
  Well you saw what happened during WWII with Hitler and so on...
  
  Will you agree that evil acts are committed on a daily basis throughout the world?
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Because there is religion in the world.
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  So is Scientology and the Raelian movement. What's your point?
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You don't ask a snakeoil salesman to provide reputable sources for his product. That's like asking the fox to guard the hen house.
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  No. You just let experts who believe exorcisms are a hoax to view all of the Roman Catholic exorcisms for several years.
  
  It seems that they have multiple cases a week.
  
  For example, the Exorcists state that the possessed people can read minds and know answers to things the person will not know.
  
  So the experts can give the Exorcist a question like this in advance: What is the name of my father and what month and year did he die?
  
  Then prompt the Exorcist to tell the demon during the next exorcism that I am asking you a question with my mind. Could you provide me with the answer?
  
  And see if the demon answers this question correctly. They can do this exercise for all exorcisms to see how often the demons answer correctly.
  
  By observing hundreds of exorcisms, the experts can also view anything abnormal that humans cannot do including spitting up foreign objects and asking demons to respond in languages the possessed person does not know.
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  getitriteposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
  It seems these possessed people would be very useful in solving cold-case files!
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  getitriteposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
  Are you aware of Criss Angel, David Blaine, David Copperfield? Of course you probably believe they can levitate, saw people in half, disappear, produce a Tiger from thin air, read your mind, etc.
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I provided you with crazy things possessed people do per Exorcists...
  
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kts28qlNI_g
  
  Now where is your evidence to refute this?
  
  We are not talking about "seeing UFOs". We are talking about something that takes place every week.
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  sabrebIadeposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  There are hundreds of UFO reports from all over the world every day.
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  But Exorcisms probably take place on a weekly basis. Likewise if you are permitted, you can watch...
  
  You cannot go out and view an UFO... It is not like the reports state, hey there is an UFO parked in my driveway. Come over and see it.
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  sabrebIadeposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You mean that I can call my local Catholic Church and say "I wanna see your next exorcism." And they'll let me just come along?
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You need to visit Rome Italy to see if you can view Exorcisms. There are only a few Exorcists in the world. At least try to allow experts who believe exorcisms are a hoax to observe hundreds of exorcisms for several years as I mentioned plenty of times in this post.
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  Hokeyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  How do you know this? You checked into it?
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  tantrumposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Exorcisms are done all over the world. you don't need to go to Rome. Only to a Parish where everybody's insane !
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  There are also several "Exorcists" who do not have the blessings of the Vatican.
  
  So if you want to prove that the old Roman Catholic ritual is a hoax, go to Rome and witness exorcisms by their Exorcists.
  
  This is in reference to Father Jose Antonio Fortea who is located in Spain and who was trained by the Vatican's Chief Exorcist.
  
  "Because of the lack of exorcists, cases come all around the nation and other countries to his church and with a general permission of his bishop he prays for them."
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  tantrumposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I don't want to prove anything.
  The Devil is not inside of 'possessed' people. Only their insanity.
  Get real !!!
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  Hokeyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Watched the video. Means nothing. Some Guy talking. I can make a video talking about the Flying Spaghetti Monster. That makes it real?
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Are you credible? No. Is the Exorcist credible? Probably yes. He is an Exorcist priest and specialized theologian in Demonology.
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  getitriteposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
  Still you provide no answers! Do you really believe that a video of a delusional charlatan talking about things you would expect to hear in an insane asylum is sufficient?
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  How can you prove that this priest who was trained by the Vatican's Chief Exorcist is a delusional charlatan?
  
  If you want to attack's someone credibility, you need facts to back up your claims instead of resorting to grade school childish tactics.
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  tantrumposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  EXCUSE ME !
  
  as I said before ,you can't believe the Devil is so stupid as to mess around with children, ignorant and mental disordered people.
  
  It's so foolish !!!
  and I repeat:
  IT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE !!!!
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Because he was trained by the the Vatican's Chief Exorcist who is completely insane.
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  getitriteposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
  Your lack of logic is ridiculous!
  
  You accuse me of resorting to grade school tactics, while you are the one believing in childhood fantasy. You might as well tell me there are monsters under your bed!
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Hokeyposted 15 years ago
Well this makes no sense at all! Isn't this the reason for religion?!? To believe in God!?! If you believe in God you have to believe in the Devil!!
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Satan role is try to tempt God's people to do evil things since he was kicked out of heaven.
  
  That's why the Chief Exorcist for the Vatican has stated that the Devil has infiltrated the Vatican. People will least expect that a religious official would commit evil acts. That's why every time a Catholic priest or bishop is accused of child molestation it makes the headlines.
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  tantrumposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  the only thing that has infiltrated the Vatican is SEX !!
  
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Yes and maybe the Devil used lust to tempt these guilty officials to commit these crimes.
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  Hokeyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Lusting for little boys!!!???!!!
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  tantrumposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
  as I said before, why you're afraid of such stupid Devil ??
  DOESN'T MAKE SENSE !!
  
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Who is afraid of the Devil?
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  tantrumposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  It seems that you are!
  
  and all the people who believe in possession of course !
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Maybe you especially if you are an Atheist since you probably believe there is no way this stuff can actually happen.
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  tantrumposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  So why would I be afraid of something that doesn't exist ???
  
  You're funny, man !
  In the end, what's your point ??
  Make sense , please !!
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
  No, it's because Tantrum is not insane.
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  Hokeyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  you didn't answer the qustion. Hold on. Let's try again.
  
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  getitriteposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  He has not really, adequately, answered any questions. Everytime he gets cornered, he just eludes to some other brazen nonsense in support of his ridiculous belief in demonic possessions. He is on a truly disturbing mission!
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  tantrumposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  He is POSSESSED !!
  that's why !
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  Hokeyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Maybe he is Satan!!
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You have not supplied any information other than your opinion to refute exorcisms. There are tons of information from Exorcists describing exorcisms.
  
  So where is the information that refutes this? Other than maybe I am an Atheist and I do not believe in that crap.
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  Hokeyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You have not shown any evidence that proves it either except for people dressed as priests talking. Means nothing.
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  I provided you with plenty of evidence and claims from Vatican Exorcists.
  
  Now your goal is to refute it since you are claiming that a ritual for a group with over 1 billion people, led by the Pope is a bunch of baloney.
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  tantrumposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  What is baloney is believing in a Devil so weak and schizo, who attacks children and people with mental disorders, to have fun.
  I don't see any sensible human being ,being attacked by any Devil !!
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You see evil acts committed in this world on a daily basis.
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  No you didn't, you only provided claims.
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  getitriteposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
  You talk about the pope and his 1 billion followers as if they are the gold standard for reality! The pope and all of his followers mean nothing, absolutely nothing! DO YOU GET IT?
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  The Pope has more credibility and pull than you and all of your other friends who are posting on this thread.
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  skyfireposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Wrong.
  
  Pope knows rats a** when it comes to science. Also pope has no authority to talk on topics like psychology, study of hallucination/mental disorders as well and many claims he and any previous persona's made from Vatican proves the point.
  
  Just because it's said from Vatican or just because it is said by pope shows "appeal to popularity".
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  getitriteposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
  Your pope is a nobody!
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  He is not my Pope because I am not a Catholic but am a person who respects all religions that promote peace.
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  sabrebIadeposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Ummmm...promotes peace?
  The Crusades?
  The Spanish inquisition?
  The Holocaust? (the Catholic Church stood by quietly when Hitler was rounding up the Jews)
  Rwanda? (Catholic priests stand accused of inciting massacre during the 1994 genocide)
  The forced conversion of people to Catholicism?
  The institutionalised sexual abuse of children?
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  getitriteposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
  Not to mention the genocide of the indigenous people of America.
  And the enslavement of Africans.
  
  Anybody that sees these things as peaceful is clearly not thinking!
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  earnestshubposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  You can ad the Australian "Stolen generation" to that list.
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  What were the Catholics going to do with Hitler? Take out the Nazis with their military?
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  sabrebIadeposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Oppose him publicly.
  I think at least a public condemnation of his activities would have been nice.
  "Hitler was never excommunicated by the Catholic Church and several Catholic bishops in Germany or Austria are recorded as encouraging prayers of support for "The Führer"
  - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Nazi_Germany
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  Hokeyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Ok. Question. Again.
  
  kenrick wrote:
  However, what the Catholics will probably state (if they do not allow experts to view all of their exorcisms for several years) is that they do not want people to view them since they will know that Satan and demons are real.
  
  Hokey wrote:
  Well this makes no sense at all! Isn't this the reason for religion?!? To believe in God!?! If you believe in God you have to believe in the Devil!!
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  So, you don't have to provide a shred of evidence to support demonic possessions and we have to provide information refuting it?
  
  It would appear that you're indoctrinated and you do believe that crap.
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Notice how your claim has now reverted to using religious dogma as your source for evidence and the reason why the Vatican would make such claims and are diverting the responsibility of their own vile acts into the realm of demonic possessions.
  
  "The devil made me do it" does not cut it as an excuse for child molestations in the real world.
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Yes you are correct. Christians know that people cannot blame their evil acts on the devil. They also know that people who claimed to be righteous could be charlatans. Likewise, actions speak louder than words.
  
  They also know that they will always be tempted by various things such as greed, lust, and so on. Likewise, they have to fight these temptations.
  
  "Jesus, full of the Holy Spirit, returned from the Jordan and was led by
  the Spirit in the desert, where for forty days he was tempted by the devil.
  - Luke 4:1-2
  
  In the Bible, there are times when God allows His people to be tested,
  in order to prove what is in their heart (Deuteronomy 8:2; 13:3; 1
  Chronicles 29:17). This was the case with a man named Job. Job was
  a good man who had many blessings. He loved God. Satan accused Job
  of loving God only because God gave him so many good things. God
  allowed Satan to take away everything that Job had, because it would
  prove that Job loved God, even when he did not have the blessings. This
  test proved what was in Jobs heart since Job did not give in to Satan"
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  getitriteposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
  Job is a story of profound stupidity, and only an individual who has abdicated his mind will believe such nonsense.
  
  Why would a sensible God play a foolish game with the devil, just to say, "See, I told you so!." ?? Your God is such a foolish contruction.
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  So no one in this world has lost everything, did not resort to evil by committing evil acts, and as a result rebounded by reaching a higher level of success?
  
  Have you heard of this adage: If you talk the talk, you must walk the walk.
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  getitriteposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  
  YOU MAKE NOOOO SENSE!!!!!!!
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  (Q)posted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Yet, Christians DO blame their evil acts on the devil just as they praise good acts from their gods.
  
  That is a case of the pot calling the kettle black. It's like a used car salesman dissing another used car salesman.
  
  Sorry, but the story of Job is one of most vicious and callous stories about the Abrahamic god demonstrating just how petty and cruel he really was to his "children."
  
  It also does absolutely nothing to support your claims, or anyone else claims to demonic possession.
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  And where was I using that story to support demonic possession. I was using that story to show you why people may be tempted to commit evil acts. To test their resolve and see if they will crumble under pressure or do the right thing by consistently fighting these temptations.
  
  How is that cruel to people? Several people can lose it all. Take a look at some of our unemployed who have lost their homes and so on. What is important is the actions you take when you are facing adversity.
  
  "The ultimate measure of a man is not where he stands in moments of comfort and convenience, but where he stands at times of challenge and controversy." - MLK
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Arthur Fontesposted 15 years ago
http://www.videosat.org/reptilian/

Maybe?
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Arthur Fontesposted 15 years ago
That is a case of the pot calling the kettle black. It's like a used car salesman dissing another used car salesman.

Why you gotta bring used car salesmen into this?
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StormRyderposted 15 years ago
I think it's all a crock of...Oooo, damn I got this kink in my neck..it's killing me
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Storm, only a small percentage of people who believe they are possessed, are actually possessed according to the Exorcists.
  
  However, several people are affected by evil forces such as appearing to be touched by them or seeing them per the Exorcists.
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  Hokeyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Says who?
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  tantrumposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  He ! LOL
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  Kenrick Chatmanposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  The people who are affected and were cleared by medical including psychosis experts.
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Richieb799posted 15 years ago
Did they say that film 'paranormal activity' was based on a true story?
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Hokeyposted 15 years ago
HELP!!! huhuhib7yp9y-g7 I 79h6077-AM h7--7-7=Possessed!!!!

yh9-07-npu[9'8n -=]8]i-] HELP!!h67707-7 POSSESSED!! 7h-7-8ngbjbhkbjftcfgj fhfd5yur5yudcytcvtyfytifvtvuyg7y9p[iu-ilbtd54

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  earnestshubposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  Keep very still and don't panick hokey!
  
  I have Sarah Pailin here to help!
  
  Qujrgfrg8234rkhdc!
  
  y,kmdvoergw;'aw'ldvrn'lsx !!!!!!??? rungngri
  
  Better now?
  reply report
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  Hokeyposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  ghipohi7php978n ALMOST Y(*PHUN*PY(P&YHBIUBI PLEASE SARAH UIONIL"JMP(KMKMOPM I BUIHUIHPBUUBNU:BU NEED H*P{Y_Y*(HP*NNBVTY*&%TY(HNUKBYVYTD$S HELP!!!! gyuogiupb
  
  reply report
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  Obscurely Diverseposted 15 years agoin reply to this
  It might just be me, but I bet Sarah could suck a golf ball through a garden hose! AKA - BJ specialist!
  reply report

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