Understanding the philosophy of Medicine and Prayer

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   paarsurreyposted 14 years ago

   Does everybody who falls sick is cured by the medicine?
   
   If that would have been correct, then nobody would have died; even then medicine is used.
   
   The Promised Messiah 1835-1908 has explained the philosophy and blessings of prayer in a book "Blessings of Prayer":
   
   "If someone is in doubt because some prayers are
   not accepted and are apparently ineffectual, I would
   say that the same is also true of medicines. Have
   medicines closed the door of death, or is it impossible
   for them to fail in their purpose? And yet can anyone
   deny their effect?”
   
   http://www.alislam.org/library/books/Bl … Prayer.pdf

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      dutchman1951posted 14 years agoin reply to this

      If your saying that medicine does not cure everything....whats the point
      thats why the Doctors call it a Practice- (Medical Practice)
      
      use of medicine is not an exact science, even though much research is closing the gaps, it is still not exact.
      
      as for Prayer, well I can say that after some experimentation, it has been writen about in the New Englad Journal of Medicine that  it could relax a person long enough to allow the Body to start a natural healing process, the mind taking over and slowing down the stress, pulse rate, heart rate etc... to allow more natural healing, but prayer...  by itself alone, no- no cure, and no medical proof as to it doing that.
      
      time, medicines, relaxation techniques, diet, movement, all togeather would be the best way to heal. prayer to calm your head also if it is meaningfull to you..
      
      but self help techniques work quicker on the mind. without the worry that the prayer was heard.

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      1. 51

         paarsurreyposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         Hi friend dutchman1951
         
         Medicine and prayer are complementary, one supporting the other, and are not exclusive; both should be used for the cure; that is the point I want to stress.
         
         Medicine is not 100% accurate; and it will never be; that in itself makes a reasonable ground for the prayer.
         
         All the ingredients and tool used in medicine are made from materials already existing in the universe; not even one has been created by the Physicians from annihilation.
         
         It is a mix of medicine and prayer that cure a person.
         
         Thanks
         
         I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

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         1. 60

            dutchman1951posted 14 years agoin reply to this

            I think we agree on this one Parr

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            1. 51

               paarsurreyposted 14 years agoin reply to this

               Thanks for appreciating

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   2. 73

      Rishy Richposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      There might be a relationship between these two but not in the way you intended to prove. Medicine is designed to recover your body while prayer can calm & relax your psychology & might bring peace to your mind. Relaxation & peace can help a patient during his treatment, in that point of view Prayer does help cure a patient.
      
      However, the effectiveness of prayer would vary from person to person. If you are a devout follower of Allah, then knowing that hindus are praying for you to Kaali will not ease your mind, nor it will bring peace to you. Thus a Hindu or Buddhist follower will not find any peace if someone prays for him to Allah or Yahweh.
      
      & finally, an hardcore atheist, who does not believe in any higher entity, will not find any peace from any kind of prayer & will rely solely on his medicines.

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2. 75

   skyfireposted 14 years ago

   1. http://www.csicop.org/si/show/columbia_ … and_fraud/
   
   2. http://www.csicop.org/sb/show/science_of_prayer

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      Pcunixposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      They keep trying though.
      
      The funniest thing to me about the prayer nonsense is not that it contradicts the whole idea of omniscience because you had to call the god's attention to the illness. It's not even the idea that this arbiter of ultimate justice would seem to be influenced by human votes: I was going to make little Jimmy wither and die, but you made me change my mind!
      
      No, it's not all that idiocy. It is the brushing away of inconsistent results with the old  "God has a plan"  junk.  If that were true, why would you try to interfere with it? Little Jimmy must be sick for a reason - all praise the Divine Plan!

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3. 75

   skyfireposted 14 years ago

   This statement will make sense only when we all share the same metabolism rate and many other health factors. So you can see the flaw here.
   
   Single medicine can't cure every health issue and you expect deluded stuff like prayer to work on body ? Besides that even single medicine has dosage requirements like 25mg, 50mg and higher. If not properly diagnosed higher or lower dose or no dose is likely to kill someone.
   
   You have to understand one important fact that YOU are not qualified to talk about medicine and discard them with such sweeping statement.

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4. 51

   paarsurreyposted 14 years ago

   All the ingredients and tools used in medicine are made from materials already existing in the universe; not even one has been created by the Physicians from annihilation.
   
   It is a mix of medicine and prayer that cure a person.

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   1. 75

      skyfireposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      How come there is prayer inside the ingredients of medicine?

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5. 72

   earnestshubposted 14 years ago

   There is no "philosophy" of medicine and prayer, just religion imposing it's stupid myths on medicine.

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6. 51

   paarsurreyposted 14 years ago

   All the ingredients and tools used in medicine are made from materials already existing in the universe; not even one has been created by the Physicians from annihilation.
   
   Who agrees?

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7. 51

   paarsurreyposted 14 years ago

   Refuting the wrong concept of Sir Sayyid Ahmad Khan Sahib about accepting of the prayer, the Promised Messiah 1835-1908 writes:
   
   “It is obvious from the discourse I have summarised
   above that Sayyid Sahib does not believe prayer to be
   the means of attaining an objective, nor does he
   believe it to be helpful in achieving any purpose. He
   believes that a person who prays for the sole purpose
   of attaining an objective is grossly mistaken, because
   something which has been predetermined does not
   need any prayers; and crying and beseeching is of no
   avail when something has not been preordained. It is
   quite clear from this discourse that Sayyid Sahib
   believes prayer to be related only to worship, and that
   he considers it a folly to think of it as a means for
   achieving any worldly objective. Let it be clear that
   Sayyid Sahib is seriously mistaken in his
   understanding of the verses of the Holy Quran.
   God willing, I shall elaborate on this misconception
   later on.
   
   Here it pains me to point out that if Sayyid Sahib
   did not have enough understating to comprehend the
   verses of the Holy Quran, was also the law of nature
   hidden from his eyes when he wrote on this subject?
   How could he have ignored the law of nature while he
   professes to follow it and regards it as the interpreter
   of Divine guidance and of the hidden mysteries of the
   Holy Quran? Was Sayyid Sahib not aware that though
   there is nothing good or evil in the world which has
   not been preordained, nature has nevertheless
   appointed certain means for their occurrence, and no
   reasonable person will ever question the effectiveness
   of these means.
   
   For instance, if we were to take
   everything to have been predetermined, it would be as
   ineffectual to use or not to use medicine as it would
   be to pray or not to pray. But Sayyid Sahib would
   never say that medical science is utterly baseless, and
   that the True Physician has placed no effect in
   medicine? If Sayyid Sahib, in spite of his faith in the
   Divine Decree, also believes in the efficacy of
   medicine, then why is he creating mischief and why
   he is discriminating in the similar and parallel laws of
   God Almighty?
   
   Does he believe that God Almighty
   had the power to invest certain medicines such as
   Turbad, Scammony, Senna and Cottonseed with such
   powerful effects that one full dose of one of them
   immediately relieves diarrhoea; or, for instance, that
   God has endowed Arsenic, Beesh and other fatal
   poisons with such powerful effects that imbibing a
   pure extract of these is enough to dispatch a person
   from this world within minutes; and yet He treats as
   dead and ineffective the earnest and heartfelt
   supplications of His chosen ones as if they were
   without any effect whatsoever!
   
   Is it possible that there
   should be disharmony in the Divine order, and that
   the Will which God has manifested in medicines for
   the benefit of His creatures should fail to manifest
   itself in the case of prayers? This is definitely not so.”
   
   24
   http://www.alislam.org/library/books/Bl … Prayer.pdf

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      skipper112posted 14 years agoin reply to this

      gee I was almost going to agree with paar, then he comes up with a long winded story were even paar puts his understanding over his Messiah.!!
      Gee paar must have more knowldge than his Massiah, it is then I decovered that paar must have a God complex because only paar reasonably understands and paar corrects EVERY Body in the whole world. So paar even tells his OWN MASSIAH  that paar understands the Quran better that any liveing person. Now I belive that paar suffers from delusions of GREATNESS, next paar will say ONLY PAAR CAN UNDERSTAND THE QURAN, now I understand why paar always attacks Jesus, paar hates anybody that conflicts with paars concept of God.
      but a word of WARNING paar do not  try to tell MAINSTREAM ISLAM you understand the Quran better than they do.

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8. 70

   Cagsilposted 14 years ago

   Understanding the philosophy of Medicine and Prayer.
   
   Simple...neither has anything to do with the other.
   
   The "philosophy" of Medicine is to aid in recovery, improve people's lives and provide people with a prolonged life.
   
   The "philosophy" of Prayer is to ask some higher authority for help, while never realizing that the highest authority in one's life is oneself. It's a flawed philosophy because human consciousness supercedes all other authority that is external.

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      Jeramiposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      I disagree...   A good prayer that they give ya the right medacine for the right thing always helps...   
      And it ever hurt a thing.

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         Cagsilposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         

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9. 61

   skipper112posted 14 years ago

   I must say this I have had "The Last Rites' or the 'blessing of the sick' by a priest as I am Catholic, I belive the inner peace that you get as a true beliver, helps you recover better.
   
   My last surgery was emergency surgery, I was scared stiff. but my priest with his kind blessing and fogiveness on Gods behalf made me calm and allowed my body to heal better.
   
   In 1975 I nealy died from horific injuries, I had 3 nun's ( which I did know about as I was packed in ice at the time in a coma with a temp of 39 to 40c for over 7 days)when I came out of the coma and started to recover, I was told 'you will need caliper's to walk again and you will never get enployment except at a sheltered workshop'.But nobody told the nuns, who were still praying, it took me 4 years to return to the factory floor as a fitter/welder in heavy structral steel. So I know the power of PRAYER, I know the peace prayer's can bring, I know prayer's do help you recover, thank's to 3 nun's prayer's and good Doctors I survived.
   that is a true story, even though I am now disabled, and have retired.My right leg still is 2 1/2 ins shorter with 30% less muscle mass below the knee, and I have poor balence the results of massive head injuries I lead a verry active retirement, I sail and race sail boats every weekend. Now with the Grace of God I will be sailing in the  Sydney to Hobart Yacht race this year, this is one of the toughest yacht races in the world. I belive the human spirit, is unstopple with the help and belief in My Lord Jesus Christ.
   Paar this time we agree my friend.
   God bless

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   1. 51

      paarsurreyposted 14 years agoin reply to this

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         skipper112posted 14 years agoin reply to this

         gee paar no comment?

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            paarsurreyposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            Thanks

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