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Is Atheism a European Disease?

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Cromperposted 6 years ago
Matt Dillahunty, best known as presenter of 'The Atheist Experience', asked, in his presentation at this year's Texas Freethought Convention; (from memory) "why does the US media always drag atheist spokepersons over from the UK to talk about atheism when there are plenty of American atheists to choose from?"
Is it simply that people like Richard Dawkins are experts in their respective fields, or could it be the 'Holywood' method of only using European accents to represent something which is deemed evil?
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  A Troubled Manposted 6 years ago in reply to this
  There's a contradiction in terms.
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  Cromperposted 6 years ago in reply to this
  What is?
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  A Troubled Manposted 6 years ago in reply to this
  Texas and Freethought, or any kind of thought for that matter.
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  Cromperposted 6 years ago in reply to this
  I must insist that we keep this forum politically correct. Naughty!
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  wildernessposted 6 years ago in reply to this
  Are you implying that cows can't think? They can (usually) find their way to the barn, and I believe the average Texan can do the same.
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  Cromperposted 6 years ago in reply to this
  We call them 'sheepshaggers'. Is that allowed?
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  A Troubled Manposted 6 years ago in reply to this
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  psycheskinnerposted 6 years ago in reply to this
  Well, um, Dawkin's *is* the highest profile activist athiest alive. Why wouldn't they have him over from time to time?
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  livelongerposted 6 years ago in reply to this
  American atheists would want atheism connected with "European" (I assume you mean British) accents because they want atheism connected with evil?
  
  It sounds like you haven't sorted this idea out yet.
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  Cromperposted 6 years ago in reply to this
  No - European! Ayn Rand and other non-British folks came out of the woodwork as WWII ended. German accent/Danish accent/ take your pick.
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  psycheskinnerposted 6 years ago in reply to this
  I have no idea what you mean by that.
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  Cromperposted 6 years ago in reply to this
  By what?
  OK Ayn Rand was Russian but the accent sounded European.
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  psycheskinnerposted 6 years ago in reply to this
  And your point is that someone made Ayn Rand famous because they thought Americans would mistake her Russian accent for a European one and based on the post WWII hatred for our evil European allies, assume her philosophy was evil?
  
  Seriously, I don't know what you are trying to say. That was my best guess.
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  Cromperposted 6 years ago in reply to this
  psycheskinner, You are commenting in a thread that was started by 'livelonger'. Maybe that is why you don't understand.
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  livelongerposted 6 years ago in reply to this
  Ayn Rand is not a favorite among the "crusading atheists" here (she is among libertarians), but Dawkins and Hitchens are. I don't know which Germans and Danes you're talking about.
  
  Besides, I don't understand: why would American atheists want to portray atheism as an evil European import?
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  Cromperposted 6 years ago in reply to this
  Did you read my original post?
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  livelongerposted 6 years ago in reply to this
  I sure did. It does not help me understand your "Holywood" theory.
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  Cromperposted 6 years ago in reply to this
  I guess you are a big fan of Holywood movies then.
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  livelongerposted 6 years ago in reply to this
  You can stop being snide and maybe explain yourself better (maybe you can't).
  
  I understand your point about evil characters in Hollywood movies being given European accents, because they imply guile and deviousness to simpleminded Americans.
  
  What I don't understand is why American atheists, who presumably would not want atheism to be conflated with evil, would want to draw the same parallel. (It's not atheist-hating evangelical Christians who are inviting Dawkins over to speak.) Since they have no reason to, I would consider this theory as brainless and not well thought-out.
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  Cromperposted 6 years ago in reply to this
  If you read my initial post again, it is the American MEDIA who are getting the Brits to discuss atheism. They are ignoring the home-grown atheists.
  This in itself implies something, and all I am trying to do is get to the bottom of it.
  Does that clarify things for you?
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  livelongerposted 6 years ago in reply to this
  Who are the home-grown atheists who are well-known, by publishing bestselling books on atheism?
  
  I'm not an atheist myself, but I know Dawkins' "The God Delusion" and Hitchens' "God is Not Great." I don't think either is begrudging their own success. I'm at a loss to name any American atheist except maybe Sam Harris, and I have no idea if he's written anything.
  
  So, like psycheskinner says, they are simply well-known.
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  Cromperposted 6 years ago in reply to this
  " I'm at a loss to name any American atheist except maybe Sam Harris, and I have no idea if he's written anything."
  You have just demonstrated perfectly your own ignorance.
  I live in an insignificant town in an insignificant part of the UK and even I know the books written by Sam Harris!
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  livelongerposted 6 years ago in reply to this
  Hey, they need a real British atheist on some news segments this coming week. Are you in?
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  Cromperposted 6 years ago in reply to this
  LOL!
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  toobsuckerposted 6 years ago in reply to this
  Atheism is predominately a liberal "religion". Europe has far more liberals than America does, hence more atheists
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  earnestshubposted 6 years ago in reply to this
  “In fact, "atheism" is a term that should not even exist. No one ever needs to identify himself as a "non-astrologer" or a "non-alchemist." We do not have words for people who doubt that Elvis is still alive or that aliens have traversed the galaxy only to molest ranchers and their cattle. Atheism is nothing more than the noises reasonable people make in the presence of unjustified religious beliefs.”
  ― Sam Harris, Letter to a Christian Nation
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Emile Rposted 6 years ago
It makes perfect sense. They say if you have a british accent, americans think you're smarter. Maybe they are trying to create the illusion that atheists are smarter. It might be a sales gimmick.
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  Cromperposted 6 years ago in reply to this
  It depends on the accent. You're thinking of the 'posh' accent. What about; "Cor blimey guvnor! Me chimney needs sweeping and no doubt about it." ??
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  Wentworth35posted 6 years ago in reply to this
  No, that isn't an English accent, that is a Dick van Dyke accent. They aren't the same thing.
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  Cromperposted 6 years ago in reply to this
  Are you trying to tell me they don't talk like that in London? Please don't destroy my illusion!
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  Chasukposted 6 years ago in reply to this
  As someone who lived in England for eleven years, that most certainly is an "English" accent. in fact, the uneducated English accent is far more common than the "posh" one.
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  earnestshubposted 6 years ago in reply to this
  As an Australian with English friends who speak both ways, I prefer the "uneducated" accent myself. although the lispy upper-class accent is hilarious!
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Wentworth35posted 6 years ago
I think atheism is more acceptable in Europe than in the US, because there are more of us. In Sweden for example, 85% of the population are atheists. America seen from a European perspective seems very religious in a very old fashioned way, much like Britain in the 1950s.

However, there is a Hollywood bias, which portrays the British as evil. I think it all began with Joan Collins in Dynasty. She played such a good role, that ever since, the evil character has to have a British (or rather English) accent. Richard Dawkins is ideal for this role, as is Christopher Hitchens, even though he is now an American citizen. However, he is still the ideal, hard-drinking and smoking, cynical Brit in many people's eyes.
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  Cromperposted 6 years ago in reply to this
  Wentworth! Gotta laugh!
  I think you're right about religion in America. It does seem very 'Victorian' in nature.
  Darth Vadar had an English accent. I think he came before Joan in Dallas.
  ...or was it Dynasty?
  The 'cynical Brit'; that's the reality! We are cynical in Europe because of the World Wars and all the propaganda that was involved in twisting people's perceptions. After the last war, all of the secrets came out and we learnt our lessons (on both sides). No wonder religion (which uses the same techniques) is losing support.
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  AntonOfTheNorthposted 6 years ago in reply to this
  Yes, but the voice of Darth Vader was James Earl Jones, who is American (African American at that)
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  Cromperposted 6 years ago in reply to this
  Exactly!
  Does that not add weight to my argument?
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EmpressFelicityposted 6 years ago
This thread is even more confusing than the "is Cagsil an atheist/agnostic?" one.
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  Cromperposted 6 years ago in reply to this
  It's kind of 'loaded'. If you read between the lines you will see where I'm going with this.
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Chasukposted 6 years ago
I already understood what you meant, but hopefully that clarifies it for those who didn't.

I think the real "cause" is that, Chavs, lager-louts and "yobbos" aside, it isn't stigmatized, to be an intellectual in the UK.. Grab a newspaper in England -- not a tabloid -- and flip to the letter column. The letters are notable in that they aren't written by idiots. The authors know how to spell, punctuate, and form complete thoughts with complete sentences.
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earnestshubposted 6 years ago
“In fact, "atheism" is a term that should not even exist. No one ever needs to identify himself as a "non-astrologer" or a "non-alchemist." We do not have words for people who doubt that Elvis is still alive or that aliens have traversed the galaxy only to molest ranchers and their cattle. Atheism is nothing more than the noises reasonable people make in the presence of unjustified religious beliefs.”
― Sam Harris, Letter to a Christian Nation.
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earnestshubposted 6 years ago
More from Sam.

“Tell a devout Christian that his wife is cheating on him, or that frozen yogurt can make a man invisible, and he is likely to require as much evidence as anyone else, and to be persuaded only to the extent that you give it. Tell him that the book he keeps by his bed was written by an invisible deity who will punish him with fire for eternity if he fails to accept its every incredible claim about the universe, and he seems to require no evidence what so ever.”
― Sam Harris
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psycheskinnerposted 6 years ago
Basically, foreign experts are only bemusing if you assume nothing important ever happens outside of the United States.
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