Seen a video that asked this question! If one some feel the world would be better without religion, or supernatural, spiritual. Explain how it would make people's lives better?
Becoming an atheist has made my life better in these ways:
1) Erasing the excessive unnecessary guilt I felt growing up. As a teenager I would pray before I went to bed afraid that all the swearing a dirty jokes of a normal high school life had put me in danger of eternal hell fire.
2) No more fear of Hell either.
3) Gaining the freedom to make one's own opinions without fear of retribution
4) Valuing learning about the world, as opposed to just being told what to believe about it and doing so blindly.
I can't even begin to relate the negative emotions my religious upbringing left me with. When I was a believer I dreaded every time I heard a plane go overhead, believing that the Rapture was imminent and that that plane might simply fall out of the sky. The guilt, paranoia, and fear that religion caused me was pretty bad though I understand not everyone is raised in the environment I was.
Religion often makes people do and believe things for obscure reasons. With the Christian faith the problem is that the bible is extremely open to interpretation. There are verses that can be convincingly argued to mean several things. Yet each interpretation is held by the believer to be "God's word" and for some reason many believers think they should force "God's word" onto the morals of others. This is particularly painful in areas where one religion holds majority and can make actual laws that everyone is required to follow, regardless of their personal beliefs.
In those areas, without the "God said so" people would all be on the same ground. There would be no groupthink and each person would have to debate their positions based on it's merits without falling back on faith to support sometimes otherwise largely unsupportable opinions.
That's just one way that lack of religion would be helpful. I could have argued the "why religion is helpful" side as well.
Wow, there is so much I can say about this topic. I'm not lying to myself anymore. I realize I do good because I want to, not out of guilt, shame or fear of Hell. I want to help people more. I care more for the environment. I guess some would see that as ironic but we only get one life and I want to use my life to do the right thing. Life for me is so much better without religion.
This is a great question Hattie . I had to throw my hat in the ring, and that's for one reason , how I was bought up, because I "Think" that's the way most humans are first introduced to religion or God or good and evil.
Through our parents.
My parents never spoke much to me about religion, however they stressed the importance of being the best person that I could be.
I grew to realize that best don't necessarily means good, and that everything do have two sides, when you come down to the meat of it.
As a young man I spend lots of time going in and out of trying to hold onto the one my inner self was trying to point out was best for me but it was a struggle . Growing up could be quite difficult.
Through all this, is how I came to realize that inside of every man is where that decision will be made . What makes it sad and difficult , is that I know that it's the same spirit which is urging us all on, as humans , but it's all up to the individual . And believe me after this they know whether or not they have made the correct choice. It stays with you , it haunts you and brings things to your attention,
So I would say obeying ones truthful inner self / spirit and understanding it's calling and why they are, how they are, and whether or not they are better or worse.
But for the lights of me , in looking at my own existence , and using my own abilities, it's impossible to think that God don't exist .
But the question will stay inside of us till we take our last breath, knowing that's the last potion of good speaking to its own, as it leaves.
I'm an atheist, but I don't know that it makes my life "better."
All of my beliefs -- at least those concerning questions of fact -- are provisional. I will happily replace any fact-based belief with any other belief that seems, to me, more likely.
Tomorrow, I might believe in God. I don't, today, because his existence seems, to me, more unlikely than likely.
This approach seems "better" to me because it is more honest than prolonging a belief which is not the belief supported by the best evidence.
Without God, anything goes.
Anyone can do whatever they want.
No accountability, but to self. And self is always right, (always justifies itself).
Really? You don't think the censure of family, friends and our laws matters?
How do you explain that I, a life long atheist, do not feel that I have license to act immorally?
Freak of nature?
Just kidding. I always have to roll my eyes when I run across posts like that. It makes me wonder what Christians fantasize about.
Alot of religious folk will point fingers at those that don't see it their way.
Maybe we should be thankful that imaginary moral police exist for some people. I guess the golden rule, laws, threat of jail, societies frowns, disapproval of friends and family and basic human decency is not enough to contain some people.
Exactly. We are free to live our lives morally and ethically, without the fear of retribution from invisible gods who have no morals or ethics whatsoever.
But, what's really hypocritical about what you say is that believers still do whatever they want and then shift their accountability over to invisible demons whenever they get caught. They lie, cheat and then judge others for exactly the same atrocious behavior they themselves commit leaving them with a "clean" conscience.
You like to make a lot of judgements and generalizations about those who believe differently than you do...not all of the people of a faith fit your hateful rants, and thankfully, not all atheist or agnostics are as quick to throw stones as you are.
Focusing on me personally and being victimized is what believers do, so it appears you are just acting exactly as my "generalizations" have predicted.
No we just enjoy watching you be a fool!
More personal insults. Despicable behavior.
I don't preach, but obviously you do not practice what you preach.
Crazy as it sounds, you had this long list of I didn't need to follow you and be a troll like you. So fortunately if you saw my post under another person, I was not following you, but than you decided to start following me. Of course we could keep this up trouble. But no point in it. Just be happy on your forums, and leave me be, and I'll leave you be. No its time to move on, because I enjoy hearing other people speak, and learning from them.
He's not a fool.
He's angry. That's an easy place for the non-religious to go. If you put yourself into his shoes for a moment, you ought to be able to understand it.
I'm not an 'angry' atheist. I think some people need religion and if it is responsible for some evil, I can hope that is at least balanced off by the good deeds it can inspire also.
I don't even believe that much evil has ever come from religion - it has been used as the excuse and justification for evil, but the root cause is usually elsewhere. I could say the same about the good, of course, so my general feeling is that it's all mostly window dressing.
It's easy to get angry, though. I can fall into that trap myself. I get angry when I read about those ugly Westboro Church folks or those vicious minded Rhode Island school children. It's easy to rail against religion when those people wrap themselves up in that cloak. I try to remember that even if they are not aware of it themselves, the religion is just an excuse and not the major cause.
Our Troubled Man may sometimes say foolish things. We all do, don't we? He's not a fool.
Not sure where folks are getting this angry bit.
Perhaps, I don't post enough of these --->
Why do you not write hubs? It would greatly improve your standing with those that disagree with your position.
I dunno about that. In my case, it seems to make more of them dislike me
Considering many of those who disagree turn to personally insulting me because they have nothing to say, which would show their hubs probably have nothing of value to say, either. At least, that's what I've found after reading them.
I agree to an extent... But what of making a little extra cash and speaking your true mind? Arguing here with others is not gainful in totallity.
What does writing hubs have to do with speaking ones mind?
1) You can make money doing so.
2) Other hubbers will have no ground to judge you, based on the fact that you haven't written one.
3) The other hubbers will have the opportunity to read your mind and thus will have no room to make such judgements.
Most people have a tendancy to judge that which is misunderstood by them. They do not understand you because your mind is shrouded in a way. That is the best I can do, as to an explanation of sorts.
While not disagreeing with your conclusion that ATM should write hubs, I'll argue that people shoot first and ask questions later in forums.
If you say something that I find upsetting, I won't go searching your hubs to see if you have explained yourself more fully there. Nor will you do that for me. We will both simply react to what we think we read.
Agreed and yet people are so much more aware of what others are thinking, rather than taking into account the thoughts of the self.
We are a reactionary species, acting only on whim of bias and individual identity.
All very good points mischeviousme and Pcunix for some reason I don't think he gets it, or even cares. I think he's just here because he can. lol
It's easy to be the critic of another's mind... Yet many leave themselve's out of their own judgements.
Notice that Hattie has well over a thousand hubs yet all she does is toss out personal insults to those who criticize her religious beliefs.
Hence, the points made were moot.
With God, anything goes.
Anyone can do whatever they want.
No accountability, but to one's own idea of "God." And one's own personal "God" is always right.
You can't prove that God wants X, Y or Z. All things are possible.
We are both correct, depending on your perspective.
(If) There is a God. The one and only, true God, who is creator of all, and the lawgiver to all, then I am correct, because, if "we" can do away with Him, we can do whatever we want. All things are possible, no accountability.
IF, god is only imagined, and formed by ones own design, then you are correct. It's obvious, we can make our god be any way we want, and do whatever we want. No accountability. (Atheists are good at doing just that. Create ones own morals and ethics, and are always correct, based on these self determining standards.
The clash of perspectives and opinions occurs, when true accountability is required by the Creator, who is impartial, and totally just in His judgements. Even those you accuse of "passing the buck" will not be excused.
Yes, just as you have done, imagined and formed by your own design, a god you can make be any way you want.
Actually there is far greater diversity in moral thought among theists (including Christians), where you have everything from Mother Teresa to Osama bin Laden, from Martin Luther King to Torquemada.
The problem for the theists is what I said above: you cannot prove that God, assuming he exists, wants this or that. That is why anything goes. Because true knowledge of God is impossible, and therefore God is totally up to the individual's interpretation.
You sound as if you've discovered buddhism or something close to it...?
Well, I discovered Buddhism a long time ago, along with all the other religions. This is just my application of logic.
To me it's very sound logic. I agree with you.
Related to eastern religions, I seem to remember a story about Confucius. A student asked "how shall we serve the spirits?" And Confucius replied "You are not able even to serve man. How can you serve the spirits?"
What you need is a good police aka-dj.
And thanks for thinking everybody is as morally bankrupt as you are!
Is there such a thing as "good police"?
It seems all governments keep legislating more and more limitations on them, making them less effective every day!
No need to get personal about my morals.
You don't even know what they are.
So may I infer that as a believer, the only thing keeping you from pillage and rapine is the fear of divine retribution? It seems rather tenuous to base all your civilized behavior only on fear of reprisals. Most "moral" behaviors are attributable to evolution.
Oh yes, murder, pillage and rapine are just three of my favorite past times.
Lucky I believe in God, then, Huh?
"me shakes me head in disbelief"
So you've proved my hypothesis: the fear of god ISN'T what's making you behave, or at least not the only thing. Civilized behavior, such as teamwork, charity, refraining from killing, taking care of young, etc. are hard-wired into us by evolution.
Let me rephrase it just a little, So you've proved my hypothesis: the fear of god ISN'T what's making you behave, or at least not the only thing. Civilized behavior, such as teamwork, charity, refraining from killing, taking care of young, etc. are hard-wired into us by God, our creator
Civilized behavior, such as teamwork, charity, refraining from killing, taking care of young, etc. are hard-wired into us by God, our creator
the above is one way of seeing things...
now here is another way...human species had very less chance of survival alone when it was competing with other species...communities was way of life...teamwork was must in hunting days , charity too comes from survial of species norm , refraining from killing too is part of that , taking care of young is obvious with continuation of species norm...so yes we were hard wired but not from concept like god but our dna ...we evolved into that way...
I'm glad to see your fully sold out to the evolution deception.
Nothing you have said that I haven't seen before.
Where did the DNA come from, exactly?
How did it just "come together at random"?
I have many more, but that'll do for now.
@aka-dj cant believe this...u call it deception...oh my...so according to u world is 6k yr old?...i hope not...
coming from where did DNA come from exactly?...answer is exact date is unknown...much like bible prophecy of end world...but we can be sure that we would crack that someday...but did it come from creator?...hmmm...if it did why did human beings take so long to evolve to present state?...we have fossils ...so it is not like noah's ark...it has got evidence....answer to that may be creator intended like that...if creator intended like that ...then atleast abhrahmic religion is myth.....
Muller-Urey experiment, primordial soup.
And that's the end of that chapter
http://www.answersingenesis.org/article … biogenesis
Enjoy your soup!
I'd have to say in some ways, it's made my life worse. I have to tiptoe around my non-belief with my extended family, at work and in a large youth organization I belong to (which shall remain nameless). Also, I know some people who feel kind of alone once they realize a cosmic sugar daddy isn't watching over them.
But also, I don't think it's religion per se that is the problem so much as non-critical belief in the supernatural in general. How much money and time is wasted on BS remedies that do nothing? On psychics and card readers? A few years ago my wife & I went on Phish tour and we set up a table in the parking lot where she did Tarot card readings, just telling people pure poppycock. She made a bundle selling people lies.
1. Being able to use my mind to logically assess a situation as opposed to it being influenced by a religious text/fear of God. This results in a more efficient way of living.
2. Not having to spend my time learning about, reading, or visiting religious related things meant that I had more time to work on myself, and spend more time with my family and friends.
3. Being able to accept all aspects of science as I see fit, knowing better how the world works, one of the most satisfying experiences I've known.
4. Forming my own philosophy that includes consequentialism, as opposed to the rigid deontology most religions afford.
I guess it took away the uncertainty. I never really bought into the teachings of the Christian church, but I did suffer some doubts that maybe I was wrong in my assessment of Christianity. Now that I've resolved myself to agnosticism I don't feel that anymore. I feel pretty good about having swept the cobwebs of religion out of the corners of my head. I feel that I am more open to finding answers on a spiritual level than I was before.
I could, of course, be deluding myself.
Delution is nothing compare to the realities of life, the voidness in man will make his soul yearn for answers. there is no such thing as being atheist. It is either you are religious or you are not.
And for the record, atheism is a new religious dogma.
i know you know better Emile R
Ok, I'm not an atheist.
But, for the record, I consider atheism as valid an outlook as any other. We can only go by what we know. And'what we know' is defined differently by each individual. As long as an atheist gives me room to search in the directions I feel drawn toward, I respect their rights to do the same.
Ha Ha Emile, I think that is part of the journey seeking the truth out for ourselves. What feels right to us personally. I think researching myself has changed my views and perceptions, as well as talking to others from every aspect of life. Stepping out of the box you learn maybe man tries to define who God is, but I think it's beyond religion, or what man tries to define. Delusional or not, I fail to see that there isn't something higher than ourselves in control of things.
Have to agree with you, the answers are always lying dormant inside of you. It used to be acceptable living in a small town with one perspective, until I jumped online and talked to people all over the globe with many different faiths, religions, dogma, and yet atheist, agnostic, and everyone in between. We live in a world filled with diversity.
In my own mind, I have to believe that God made diversity for a reason. So it's hard to understand how any one group can war for centuries stating this is the only way and right way. I believe man has always chosen the war path, and continues to do so. I think it makes me stand in awe, we've been doing wars physically,emotionally,spiritually for centuries and never get it. Never learn the lessons that are so simple.
I found myself reflecting back today on Mother Theresa's words
"I’ve always said we should help a Hindu become a better Hindu, a Muslim become a better Muslim, a Catholic become a better Catholic. We believe our work should be our example to people."
You could take this a step further help Atheists and Agnostics or whom ever be better people. I like her approach, because she understood the diversity. We all contribute something to this world, but its by our example no matter what belief we stand behind. Harming others is not the answer, and it is gets me how people can harm others using the name of God. I guess in my life I was just never taught that I was better than someone else, or I had the right to play God even if someone disagreed with me. I am as fallible as any other person on this earth, no matter what are beliefs.
I doubt that anything would change at all.
We would still have terrible people, obviously. Just as obviously, we'd still have good people.
Some of you would have some extra time on the weekend. For most of us, that wouldn't change.
Strength to live and fight against feelings of suicide live within us. Nothing to do with religion, and everything to do with inner strengths.
Religions have teachings, and for those of your who follow, I have no doubt you acquire strength from them.
But the real strength is within you. Even those that feel that all their strengths have gone can succumb.
While the world today may seem the worst place ever, tomorrow may be be brighter
You said it so nicely IzzyM, glad you appreciate diversity!
Thankyou. Just this evening I read this - http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article … g-her.html
Two young lives cut down in their prime, and for what?
In 10 years time, neither would even remember the other, had they lived.
Made my life better? It's just how I am, ad what feels true to me. Even if I thought it would make my life better to believe in God I couldn't just decide to do it and more than I could just decide the sky was pink.
first thing for me is being in charge rather than waiting for some god or messiah etc to do something about my life , world i live in....Secondly since i dont believe in heaven and hell , my motive of doing anything is out of my passion rather than greed ....my accountability doesnot come from some figure which nobody sees but from my own desire to hold me to account...i am accountable to coming generations and what world i leave behind me...
one more things which helps me in god less world is seeing and acknowledging human greatness and how far we have reached and that makes my faith on humanness more profound...
We are our own enemy Pcunix! I know we are just mirrors in each others eyes, but at the opposite spectrum. The question is asking what do you see in the mirror in the other person. We are all the same, but unique. Different in the aspect we have different beliefs, but same feelings and emotions. Fortunately we all have darkness and light. It's just balancing the two and being neutral, and not allowing others to throw us off balance. Anger we all feel, and we can all relate too. We can all relate to being judged, criticized, and all of us can relate to prejudice, and discrimination. It's easy to take shots at someone else with out looking at yourself first, and ask yourself why you are acting the way you are, even on a forum. We are all guilty above at some point in our lives. It don't matter what religion, what belief, what side of politics. We resist diversity, even when we claim we agree with it. We are always figting what we tell someone else not to do, but do ourselves. As long as you believe Christians are evil that you will believe it. If you believe atheists are you believe it. I don't believe either one, but when someone does believe this they throw themselves out of balance, because they have to be right about fighting the evil that is really not there. It is just an illusion in someone's mind and so if someone is angry, they should ask themselves why they are angry. Why are they aiming it at another person or group? Evil is only there if you believe it is. So of course in his eyes I am evil. lol So the best thing to do is allow him to believe this! I guess there is nothing much more you can do. lol
You are wasting your time and emotions on losers like ATM.
All people like him/her know to do is keep winding up the emotions so that you show a crack, and then condemn you for being "human".
Opinionated, self-righteous, condescending, ridiculing and childish.
That was one of the main reasons I started the thread about the level of intelligence of Atheists.
In their wisdom, they have become fools!
My emotions are in check, I've dealt with worse than him. I think it just shows off the hardwork I've done on myself over the past few years to understand that when you meet one, they can't bother you. The point is I don't need to waste energy and time on him. I have many positive friends in the world, and rich hearted ones. Even some on hubpages. For the most part the people on hubpages have been all a pleasure to meet. I understand it is not my issue. Just was making the point he needs to move on and get over it. I don't need to play the game.
Way to group over a billion people on a sample you met on HubPages.
You can't be all too shocked when they reply to you in a condescending tone when you say things like that now, can you?
Atheism or agnosticism may be a permanent belief for some people, but others use it as a transition into what they recognize as their own spirituality. It may be a rejection of beliefs they were taught as children. I went through a period of agnosticism as a rejection of the fundamentalist protestant beliefs that I held and worked in until I was in my 20s. Now I am comfortable with what I have experienced in the psychic world. My ex-husband did the same thing, but he returned even more strongly to his protestant fundamentalist background. He has one of our sons convinced that I am going to hell because of my spiritual beliefs. His favorite joke is: "The Methodists say there ain't no hell. The Baptists say the hell there ain't." To each his own path, I guess.
Frees up your weekend for time with the family, getting exercise or just relaxing. Also frees yourself from the guilt cycle promoted by religion. Also allows one to be curious about the world and continue to learn. Plus it allows one to focus on your current life rather than concentrating on a fantasy life after death.
Being an atheist hasn't made my life any better or worse. There are challenges involved with non-belief, as there are with belief. I am an atheist because of my belief that the likelihood of God or gods existing to be very small, rather than because I think that belief or non-belief is a happier lifestyle.
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