Can Holy Mary visit and move about freely in Italy?

1. 48

   paarsurreyposted 13 years ago

   Can Holy Mary visit and move about freely in Italy in her dresses she was used to wear as we see her depicted in the Catholic Churches?
   
   I think perhaps the new laws when enacted won’t allow her.

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      Greek Oneposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Hmmm.. good question... not sure about that, but if she moves to Saudi Arabia she would be welcome to wear a black sheet covering her from face to toe, and then marry a man who has 200 to 300 other wives.

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   2. 65

      2uesdayposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Can you explain what you mean as you have lost me on the meaning of this. Are you saying Italy is making a ruling against wearing a long dress and covering your head/hair?
      
      That would not make sense as the nuns in Italy dressed like this for many years.
      
      If you go to visit the Vatican as a tourist you are not allowed in with your shoulders/knees uncovered. If I visit a church in Italy to look at the art work inside I always cover my shoulders out of respect for the countries religious traditions.

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      1. 48

         paarsurreyposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         I know;but is it bad for an ordinary woman to attire like the Holy Mary did?
         
         Why should not every woman/girl dress like Mary?

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            Greek Oneposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            what do you mean 'is it bad'?
            
            And why would any woman want to wear 2000 year old fashions?
            Do we use the same type of bathrooms they did 2000 years ago? 
            Do we use the same means of transportation?

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               klarawieckposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               Sadly, I still go to work on a donkey.

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               1. 48

                  paarsurreyposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  Jesus also rode a donkey.

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                  Greek Oneposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  it's OK, my former girlfriends told me they dated a jackass

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                     klarawieckposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                     surely they weren't referring to you.

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                        Greek Oneposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                        I think they were, and don't call me Shirley... i haven't been known by that name since my stint with the Rockettes

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                           klarawieckposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                           Aw!

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         2. 65

            2uesdayposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Because Mary dressed the way she did because the women of her time and country dressed in that way.
            
            There are women of other religions who live in Italy who cover themselves completely - but I think I for one would faint from the heat if forced to travel dressed like that.
            
            Italy has many different ethnic groups living there and they all seem to (appear to) be able to follow their own cultures.
            
            I am not expert on this - just how it appears to me from short visit to the country.

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            1. 79

               schoolgirlforrealposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               Some Catholics or people like to dress modestly, wearing a dress covering their knees and sleeves down to elbow, and neckline not more than 2 inches below collar bone.
               But either way it's a personal choice really.
               It's good we're not forced to -at least not in USA- to wear it cause like
               2uesday, I may be bothered with the heat

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               1. 48

                  paarsurreyposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  USA is a free country; if someone wants to wear dresses as has been described by you above; at least one should not be bothered. Why violate personal freedom?

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                     schoolgirlforrealposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                     um, yeah , i think- it's a personal choice either way

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            2. 48

               paarsurreyposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               I know many Christians narrate their dreams of Mary visiting them; all describe Mary like I see in the Catholic Church; none describes her in the dresses like woman wear in the West.
               
               Jerusalem was a hot place you know.
               
               I am not forcing anything on you; just a food for thought.

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                  Greek Oneposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  what's your point?

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               2. 79

                  schoolgirlforrealposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  sure, it's better to be modest but w/ a reality check, you can't go around like Mary did as someone else stated, it's a different culture now.
                  The girls in India, I believe wear very attractive, and feminine modest clothing.
                  
                  enough with the exact outfit as Mary. Have you lost your mind??!!

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         3. 59

            Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Do you not see that having an opinion on what some one else should be doing is why Islam causes so much hatred and wars?

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               hanging outposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               is that your opinion? 
               
               oh, ribbit
               

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   3. 69

      IntimatEvolutionposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      St. Louis de Montfort believed that Mary had authority over the angels as a reward for her great humility on earth. And so because of this God gave "her the power and the mission of assigning to men the thrones made vacant by the fallen angels." God, therefore, as St. Louis goes on to explain, "made Mary queen of heaven and earth, the leader of his armies, the keeper of his treasury, the dispenser of his graces, the worker of his wonders, the destroyer of his enemies and the faithful associate in his great works and victories."  For more on this visit Mary.

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   4. 81

      Don Wposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      The laws in Italy and France relate to covering of the face (Italy) and the entire body including the face (France) in public. In that respect the figure of Mary as depicted in traditional images would not violate either law.
      
      However in either country if a nun in full habit covered her face in any way she would be liable to be stopped in the street and fined. Moreover, some nuns in both France and Italy live in 'enclosures' which are convents that have no contact with the outside world. They not only have to cover their entire bodies by wearing a habit, they are also not allowed to leave the enclosure. There has been no call for laws banning this practice, which gives the lie to suggestions it is about the 'emancipation' of women.
      
      Both laws violate both the European Charter of Human Rights and the United Nations Universal Declaration of Human Rights, which state not only that freedom of thought and religious belief are human rights but also that a person has the right 'to manifest his religion or belief in teaching, practice, worship and observance.'
      
      Neither of these laws would stand up to a legal challenge in the European Court of Human Rights. Indeed the French Conseil d'Etat (Counsel of State) advised the French government that the law "could not benefit from any irrefutable legal basis", i.e. would not stand if challenged. Amnesty International have also criticised the law stating it "violates the rights to freedom of expression and religion of women." It is only a matter of time before these laws are challenged as violations of human rights. The sooner the better in my opinion.

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      1. 48

         paarsurreyposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Hi friend Don W
         
         Your post gives me a lot of satisfaction; we Muslim love Mary and give her deeds much value, so i was shocked with the decisions of the European contries; though we cooperate with the states we live in.
         
         Thanks
         
         I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim

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      2. 48

         paarsurreyposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         I hightlight the above point.

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2. 0

   shazwellynposted 13 years ago

   lol... everyone knows that Holy Mary can visit anywhere - she is in spirti! gee! lol

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3. 48

   paarsurreyposted 13 years ago

   Can Holy Mary visit and move about freely in Italy?

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      Greek Oneposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Paar.. SHE IS DEAD

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      1. 48

         paarsurreyposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         I know that she accompanied Jesus while they migrated from Judea to India. Mary died and is buried at Murre, a hilly resort, near Islamabad, Pakistan.
         
         I was taking supposedly as per the Christians.

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         1. 48

            paarsurreyposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            .

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   2. 79

      schoolgirlforrealposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Are you ignorant, or trying to make some mysterious point!!

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         skipper112posted 13 years agoin reply to this

         schoolgirlfor real,
         yes paar is just trying to make trouble, paar is ingorant. It is the Burka ( full face cover ) that has been banned. Like paar even stated he understood the Quran better thah his own Massiah, paar even states Jesus and Mary went to India.
         And paar 'knows' Jesus and Mary went to India,and Mainstream Islam is wrong as only paar has a reasonable understanding of the Quran, but I must say paar cannot prove anything paar states as fact.
         yes schoolgirlforreal you are right paar is just ignorant, and a trouble maker.
         God bless

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4. 0

   klarawieckposted 13 years ago

   That means nothing! I have been dead many times and as you all can see, I'm still typing!

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      Greek Oneposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      ok.. then tell us.. what are you wearing

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         klarawieckposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Don't make me blush now. You know what I wear on Friday nights!

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            Greek Oneposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            nope.. i don't.. better send pictures to confirm you are inline with the latest religious trends

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               klarawieckposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               
               
               Will you believe me now?

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               1. 64

                  Greek Oneposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  sadly, yes

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                  dutchman1951posted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  sooo...by this picture can we say you can not kick the habbit!

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         2. 79

            schoolgirlforrealposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            you guys are funy

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5. 79

   mega1posted 13 years ago

   probably is a lot more difficult for her now that Italy is overrun with tourists and there are long lines for everything and huge traffic jams!

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      klarawieckposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Donkeys come very handy!

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   2. 48

      paarsurreyposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      You mean Jesus and Mary would be denied entry to Italy? They have lost relevance to the present day Italy?They would be total strangers to Italy due to their Jewish creeds and appearace, perhaps.

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         klarawieckposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         paarsurrey, don't take this out of context please. We are just having fun... letting our imagination run wild. You must try it sometime. It's very liberating!

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         mega1posted 13 years agoin reply to this

         whatever!

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         skipper112posted 13 years agoin reply to this

         no paar Jesus and Mary would not be banned from Italy, and you are as usual MISSINFORMED as you usualy are.

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      4. 61

         pisean282311posted 13 years agoin reply to this

         @paar if mary and jesus would have born today , we would have seen them wearing what people wear too...your idea doesnot make sense at all...dress is not something frozen in time...people wear as per current trend...

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6. 48

   paarsurreyposted 13 years ago

   Woman who would wear dresses like Mary won't be allowed to move about freely; that would be very sad.

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   1. 59

      Beelzedadposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Maybe women can move about more freely dressed in a Burka.
      
      

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         skipper112posted 13 years agoin reply to this

         ty beal for this photo, this just proves my point are you sure that this person is a woman, how can you identify this person if you see ( him or her) commit a crime?

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      2uesdayposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      This is simply not accurate - people from all over the world visit Italy and some who live there continue to dress in their own ethnic style - they wear what they want too.
      
      When i last wentto Italy (this summer) ladies were wearing beautiful saries, African ladies were wearing brightly coloured embroidered dresses and people whose religion demanded they cover up were also wearing the required garments.
      
      You wear what you want in Italy except when they visit the vatican then tourists must observe modesty dress clothes.
      
      France has/or maybe ruling out some religious headware styles but I do not think Italy has.

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   3. 60

      skipper112posted 13 years agoin reply to this

      again get your facts right paar, you are not telling the truth

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7. 48

   paarsurreyposted 13 years ago

   Mary was a pious lady; she should be welcomed in the East and the West.

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      skipper112posted 13 years agoin reply to this

      hello paar wake up Mary never wore the full Burqua, so what is your point that is if you have one. Only the FULL BURQUA has been banned ( full face cover) whivk Mary NEVER WORE, so what is your point paar?????

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8. 59

   Mark Knowlesposted 13 years ago

   The full burqua is now illegal in both France and Italy. Just another step - like this insidious inacurate attack is - in the upcoming religious war that seems inevitable - unless we can educate people in a hurry.

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   1. 65

      2uesdayposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      I am sorry I am wrong on this I have just read a newspaper report on-line of a woman being fined for wearing this - the full burqua she will have to remain in the house now her husband says in the report.
      
      Sorry my mistake - I thought it was just in France.

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      1. 59

         Mark Knowlesposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         They are talking about it in Holland and the UK as well. There are a lot of aggressive Christians in Holland and both the Muslims and the Christians have forced this issue into law.
         
         The Muslims so they can claim persecution and the Christians to show they still have more political clout than the Muslims.
         
         I - as usual am sitting here wondering WTF people are thinking and depressed at my inability to get my opinion heard.
         
         Seriously - making an item of clothing illegal? Good grief! But - the Muslims were pushing it and the Katholics flexed their muscle.
         
         Peace loving religions all.

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            skipper112posted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Mark Knowles to anwser you.
            ,If a person must remove a full face motor cycle helmet, when going into a shop or bank ( in australia) so you can see their face, why can Muslims cover their face and in extream cases have like rope ot heavy cord over their eyes.
            1st point is how do you know it is a woman.?
            2nd point if I can't see your face how can I identify you if you do something wrong.
            3rd point if you are involved in a traffic accident  and there are 3 people in full Burqua's and they get out and walk around , who was the driver.?
            
            I do not think the full Burqua is an  apporaite way to dress in a wastern type country  you can be dressed modestly without the full Burqua( the Quran says woman should dress modestly. PERIOD) so if you wish to wear the full Burqua do so at home , and do not go out. old saying' when in Rome do as the Romans do'
            I belive the main complaint about wearing the full Burqua is bassed on identifying a person. It has nothing to do with religon.This is not a attack on Islam. Also if you do not like it, go to a Muslim country were you can wear the full Burqua , also do not foget Islam wants to convert  the whole world to Sharia Law.
            To me banning the FULL Burqua is a reasonable request.
            What do you think.
            God bless

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9. 79

   schoolgirlforrealposted 13 years ago

   I don't get your point

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10. 79

    schoolgirlforrealposted 13 years ago

    Why do  you ask a question about a dead person?- or who is not on earth? Hello?

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11. 48

    paarsurreyposted 13 years ago

    So Holy Mary would be barred from entering Vatican,Italy,UK and Holland etc.
    
    What would be done of the people of these countries see Holy Mary in dreams in the same clothes; covered from head to toe?
    
    Any idea

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       skipper112posted 13 years agoin reply to this

       HELLO paar here you go again, Mary never wore full fave coverm so you have as usual NO POINT

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12. 65

    2uesdayposted 13 years ago

    From previous posts we have established that if  Mary were a living person she would be allowed to visit the Vatican as long as she covered her knees, shoulders etc. and was not wearing an item of clothing that was illegal in Italy.
    
    Plus she would probably have to be security checked before entering - which could involve a 'magic security wand' and being passed over her body and handbag or maybe even the sort of body check you get at air-ports.
    
    See this is too silly for me to continue - ciao.

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13. 48

    paarsurreyposted 13 years ago

    Woman who wear dresses like Mary won't be allowed to move about freely; that would be very sad.

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       skipper112posted 13 years agoin reply to this

       paar are you just stupid or a trouble maker, Mary never wore a full face cover, so as usual you have NO POINT

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    ralwusposted 13 years ago

    someone here wants to die stupid

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       paarsurreyposted 13 years agoin reply to this

       Why not die with a little more wisdom?

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          skipper112posted 13 years agoin reply to this

          paar go back to school Mary did not wear a full face cover like the Burka, Mary dressed according to the dress standards of the day. Mary could walk freely in Italy, and you know that so stop trying to make trouble. It is the Burka that has been banned full face cover has beed banned, so as usual paar only trys to cause trouble with paars uniformed  quotes.

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    hanging outposted 13 years ago

    Mary is dead and buried in the ground like every other human being THAT HAS DIED.
    She is not living in heaven nor did God listen to the pope when catholicism said she was EVEN MORE SPECIAL THAN JESUS.
    Yes she was numbered among the disciples, not of the 12 but of the group of people that was learned in the way of Jesus.
    Mary has no special authority, she does not sit on the right hand of God that is Jesus' place.
    Mark 16:19   So then after the Lord had spoken unto them, he was received up into heaven, and sat on the right hand of God.
    Luke 22:69   Hereafter shall the Son of man sit on the right hand of the power of God.

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       skipper112posted 13 years agoin reply to this

       hanging out as a Catholic I agree Mary never was and never will be more special than Jesus. As a catholic I pray to Jusus Christ, that is why my prayers end in AMEN not AMARY.

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16. 0

    ralwusposted 13 years ago

    if she was to do it, she'd be a spook. Sooooo, no problems.

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17. 76

    raisingmeposted 13 years ago

    Speechless, absolutely speechless!

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