China owns our debt and they finance our dubious wars. If that is not beholding to someone I don't know what is. That is why we pamper them when it comes to human rights and slave labor laws. We can't be getting in the way of the cheap accessible labor market to feed our Walmarts and Target stores.
As far as the bomb goes you get a great deal of respect when your country joins the bomb club. Look how well it has worked and is being worked by tyrants like Ahmadinijad and Jong-Il. North Korea got nuclear power plants from it from Clinton and Iran is working their magic in getting concessions lifted and a say in the regions politics.
Pakistan is a whole other subject and while they may not pose a threat to the US directly there is evidense to support the bomb is making them a credible player in the region for an aliance. This is why we just don't invade them going after Al Qaeda.
So they do, for what they recognize as their own best interests. It has nothing to do with specific actions the US government takes, as evidenced by the fact that China very often disagrees strongly with actions the US government takes.
We can vote with our wallets and not buy from those stores who use labor so cheep as to be thought of as slave labor..... I am found of buying from charity shops for cheep clothing n such, supports a good charity and I often find real treasures that way!
Is this a kind of joke on democracy? Pakistan is an important ally thats true but why? this is the real question. Everyone knows whats going on in Pakistan but US still following ''see no evil'' rule in pakistan and for your kind information it never had a real democracy so find reason other than democracy
Wrong, wrong, wrong. This stuff is really scary, and absolutely no joke. You have got no more right to invade another country than another country has the right to invade you. Was it right for Iraq to invade Kuwait? Was it right for the Soviets to invade Afghanistan? But this is going to veer off into a large debate; just suffice to say, invading other countries is extremely dangerous; not least because it ends up generating a whole bunch of terrorists out of people who wouldn't have been terrorists if you'd left them alone. But, as I say, this is a very large topic...
I don't know if it's as much turning a blind eye as misinterpretation and confusion about different cultures. Take for example the manner in which Japan infiltrated America. Their way of doing business was, well it was foreign for us here in the states and they easily swept through American business transforming our economy. Not good or bad, it just happened, changing the way we (Americans) do business. That's just in the economic context, but it extends to the socio-political sphere as well. No country can truly be isolationist because that only invites, in a way even demands, trade in the black market & other underground channels. Even as we condemn, or conversely accept another country's behavior, or culture, we invite others to either perpetuate or work to halt behavior we may find disagreeable. May the best man/woman (read speices) win. Not the 'good' one, but the one(s) with the survival skills, whatever they may be for that particular climate.
...and if you refused to do business with every country that committed transgressions of any seriousness, you'd be trading with Denmark, Mauritius, and Togo, and that'd be it. (which doesn't excuse it, but at some point there is a practicality issue)
No money???? We will just print more and they will buy more junk bonds so we can buy their junk....who's the bigger idiot? Besides if China calls the debt, the US won't be able to pay. What are they going to do????? Its a wash is what it is. It only really means we can't tell them what to do in regards to Tibet, Tiawan or Hong Kong... which we shouldn't do anyway.
Well China could begin to do what Japan did and that is to start buying up some of our banks and industries. This would give them a foothold and influence that could undermine even our smaller business'. The whole issue is a mute one if you take into account the way this whole trade relationship exists. We lazy Americans in an effort to not do the the smaller menial jobs associated with manufacturing have elected to allow American business to ship those jobs overseas so that we can do the more prized service oriented jobs that require less manual labor. Paper handeling and financial jobs as well as technology jobs is where we are headed. Forget the debt, times will be better is the mantra we have heard for years and are still sold on.
You think so. How did we let Mexican labor overtake the job market? And what have unions done to assure that skilled labor rises above unskilled. You make the same no matter your skill level in the unions. Seniority is what pays. I could go on and on about this including people paid to not plow their fields and how often someone is paid medical disability never to return to working a lesser job.
Because of its size, population and economy, China cannot take over sooner or later... It will happen never.
History tells us that a small nation called Japan defeated the most powerful Russian (Tsarist) empire in 1905. A small nation called Britain ruled over half of humanity. A small nation called Nepal held Tibet captive till 1959, receiving annual taxes from them. A small country called Manipur (now in India) ruled over Burma more than a 100 years ago. Most parts of China came under Japan during WW-2.
Even now, a small country called Israel faces more than 100 times its own population, ready to destroy it.
No matter what their size, population is, the winners always are not the biggest and largest.
It is fair enough to give examples of small nations that have dominated but to suggest that because of large size, large population and strong economy that China CANNOT take over... that seems a big leap
Some additional points... China is advocating a wrong side, underestimating its own neighbours, has no democracy, (which enables to take collective & proper decisions).
Larger empires have fallen like cards against ruthless invaders. This region has seen everything. In the 11th and 16th century, large and wealthy empires in India were wiped out by Md.Ghori and Babar, who not even had a dwelling place. They came, they saw, they conquered. Wealth and size cannot protect anyone.
China can harass, torture, dismember or even kill only unarmed Tibetan monks. ("The Rape of Shangri la") They cant come out of their borders and do it. For strange reasons, the world keep silence on these points, while it sees "human right violations" in petty cases in other countries.
The world is not silent on the persecution of Tibetans, I don't agree with that statement, and within China, most of us know there are human rights violations -- now, whether governments refuse to do business with the Chinese as a result is a different question...
As I wrote earlier, who would you have left to do business with if you didn't do business with countries that have committed atrocities - look what Canada did to its aboriginal peoples, look how Britain dominated people with "iron fist in velvet glove" -- who are you going to do business with: Russia???
No, I think perhaps that business and economic ties can be *leverage* to pressure China and other countries to shape up: of course, our Western politicians don't *actually* care about human rights in any case. *That* is the real problem
I have made this clear many times before, I like China. I hope they take over the world. The fact Australia supplies Iron ore to China is a good thing. What is it you are trying to reveal here? What bargaining weight does US have with China?
Look at it this way, America has functioned for a long time without anything to offer the world, besides arms and custom. If China takes over, it cannot do the same thing? You believe China needs the US?
Think about it hypthetically, China takes over, still maintains all its current business interests, plus takes over the role of dominant power. Not difficult.
I am Australian, yes. I am not sure what you are getting at now. I have mentioned my nationality previously, well before this forum topic. I do recall intentionally not mentioning it at one point a few weeks back. You still side step the point.
So far as Australia being insignifcant in world politics, well yes, of course! That is one of its benefits. It is a nice place for some reasons, not so nice for others. I am not Australia tho, I just live here.
I hope I am not intruding, this conversation has been fun to read
As for what america has offered the world, well there is more then guns and American customers (custom) We also have offered the world Mc Donalds and other fine fast foods, not to mention an industry of cool that has seen the rise of the tween. Global American imports like fast food and cool trendy ways to waste money are loved by the rest of the world, right?
Back the the original question, I don't know what Pakistans deal is, do they have nukes? That would make em dangerous enough to pamper.
As for China, well they own Americas debt, they have the upper hand now. Growing up I was taught that being in debt to someone means they own a piece of you, owe money to the bank and they kinda own you. Think about the old company store, workers had to borrow against their earnings to buy the tools they needed to do the job as well as the food and other goods they needed to survive, workers were nothing more then slaves to the company store. I believe there was a song with the line "I owe my soul to the company store". Personally I have never taken out a loan or gotten a credit card, the only money I have ever owed anyone was to close friends who were more like family then my real family, and they usually told me to forget about it or offered some easy to way to pay em back.
However, America is in a position to negotiate with China. Their strong (though very negative) card is the promise not to go belly up without paying back some of the debt. They have the power to say be nice to me or I'll go bankrupt on you!
Because of the economic weakness, America will never succumb to China. If that is so, here in Pakistan, there is nothing called economy. Its whole ruling apparatus is hanging on American and other muslim countries' financial help. It never gets any loan from others... only "aid". In that position, it bargains with America, China and the terrorists. They are already bankrupt but that country is pulling on. Why not America? Its economy is not bad as others imagine. Even now, it is the strongest.
Valid point. However, this imposes the necessary question, will the US be able to pay such a debt. Whether China and the US go to war it may not be a case of economic relations between those two but necessary due to other conflicts of interest. If the US is going bankrupt anyway... the are more significant causes that could lead to war.
The answer is 'yes,' and did you expect such a silly, presumptuous and arrogant attitude to aggrandize yourself in some way? Why does everyone who has ever stepped outside their village assume they are Marco-freakin-Polo?
Well the only thing I can assume from your response is the trip was not very informative. Your inference that it is not neccessary to visit a place to get a real perspective of the situation says it all. Sorry, it really is a TK world for you isn't it?
The US is not invading Pakistan, not because it is a democracy. If America is sincere about democracy, it should advocate India, a perfect democracy for over 60 years. But American eyes are somewhere else. American support for terrorist Pakistan has created more trouble than good in this region.
Its strategic geographical position helps Pakistan. It lies just south of the former Soviet Union's borders. It separates the oil-rich middle-east from South Asia. With a shaky political apparatus, Pakistan serves American interests! Since 1947, Pakistan has never seen a democratic government. Even if there is one, the President and Prime Minister will always be on the fear of what the army will do next, and when will the army arrest them and take over.
America thinks that with Israel on the west and Pakistan on the east, it can control the oil regions. It has failed to take note of the fact that there are people in those areas, who have their own aspirations and dreams.
When the buyer has some plans, why not the sellers (of oil)?
Why would America advocate a sixty-year old model when it has had a model that has lasted since 1776 - and Britain the makings of a model since the Middle-Ages... Besides, in all of these examples (America, Britain, India), there is still poverty and deprivation, (in India on a horrific scale) so what good is democracy if you can't feed your kids
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