"Bailout" money has been returned to the government

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   wyanjenposted 14 years ago

   NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- General Motors has made a final payment of $5.8 billion to the U.S. and Canadian governments, paying off the last of its $6.7 billion in loans, the company said Wednesday.
   
   "I am very pleased to announce that, as of today, General Motors has repaid, in full and with interest, the loans made last July by the U.S. Treasury and Export Development Canada," said GM chief executive Ed Whitacre, speaking at a plant in Fairfax, Kan., where GM builds Chevrolet Malibu and Buick LaCrosse sedans.
   
   Thousands of jobs were saved because of the loan - including mine. I'm seeing signs here in Detroit that things may be turning around.
   Things don't seem as hopeless as they did this time last year.
   
   So if the auto bailout left a bad taste in your mouth, if you opposed it, if you complained about it...
   Rest easy. Your money has been returned.
   That wasn't so bad now, was it?
   
   

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   Pearldiverposted 14 years ago

   That's awesome Wyanjen
   
   Now if only the Bankers did the same huh?

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   livelongerposted 14 years ago

   I'm glad you brought this up. There are a lot of people who thought this was a giant handout (like the Iraq War was to military contractors, f'rinstance).
   
   And Pearldiver: the bankers have been paying back their bailout money.:
   http://newsroom.bankofamerica.com/index … ;item=8583
   http://online.wsj.com/article/SB126079048758690393.html

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4. 69

   wyanjenposted 14 years ago

   RE: giant handout:
   
   Yup.
   For the most part, I'm talking about people I've heard first hand, the opposing opinion was to deny the bailout and then kick us while we're on the ground.
   
   I mean, they weren't saying, "No that is fiscally irresponsible"
   They were saying "F@$# off Detroit! You deserve it!
   
   I'm not sure how I deserve to lose my apartment, my truck, and my retirement savings simply because I live in a county with a struggling industry.
   Do you sense that I'm still a little bitter?
   
   I've never heard the kind of "f#@* off" attitude from American citizens against other American citizens.
   
   And the whole time, these same people had NO IDEA that it was a loan, not a hand out. Completely oblivious. Thanks for the kick in the teeth, now go read a book. Try to learn something.
   The auto bailout opposers evolved into the tea partiers. Get yourself all worked up & pissed off, learn about the issue halfway, then go about yelling. If you're loud enough, you must know what you are talking about, right?
   
   Of course, as I've said before, there are some legitimate tea points. They're just really hard to hear above the squalling half-wits.
   
   I'm still working on this bitterness thing.

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5. 86

   livelongerposted 14 years ago

   Well, I suspect (and I wasn't one of them!) that they meant the Big 3, not Detroit residents/workers.
   
   But their callousness reminds me of that wife of a GM exec playing golf in Roger & Me: "why don't they stop complaining and just go get a job or something?"

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   Padrinoposted 14 years ago

   GM received more than 6.7 Billion in bailout money, so they haven't finished paying the money back.

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      livelongerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      So?

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         Padrinoposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         So, it makes the thread title a little misleading, but accuracy among those in support of this kind of theft from the American people is not all that important I guess.

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            livelongerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            It will eventually get all the money back, PLUS INTEREST. This second tranche repayment suggests that it's on track to repay the government everything. Plus interest.
            
            Isn't calling that "theft," then, incredibly misleading of you?

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               Padrinoposted 14 years agoin reply to this

               No! The American people didn't want the bailout to happen, its the American peoples money, so theft is accurate!

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                  livelongerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                  So everything is up for referendum? Let's look at...the Iraq War, then. Were the American people convinced to support the Iraq War? Were the justifications for it true? How much have we spent, in dollars and lives, in this war? When are we going to be paid back for it? (And will it come with interest?)

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                     Padrinoposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                     Sorry, that's not the topic of this thread, maybe you should start one on that topic.
                     
                     Nice try at deflection though.

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                        livelongerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                        Reminds me of a story I had read about Harvard President A. Lawrence Lowell’s attempt to start a debate at Harvard in the 1920s about whether the number of Jews should be restricted because Jews cheat. When a distinguished alumnus pointed out that non-Jews also cheat, Lowell replied that the alumnus was trying to change the subject, because Lowell wanted to talk about Jews.

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                           Padrinoposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                           Ok, are you attempting to hijack this thread?

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                              livelongerposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                              I'm pointing out that your definition of government theft is clearly inaccurate, and if you needed an example of government theft to illustrate that for you, I provided you one. The fact that you have nothing to say about that itself speaks volumes.

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                                 Padrinoposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                                 Ok then.

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                     Jeff Berndtposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                     "So everything is up for referendum? " No, only the stuff the wingnuts disagree with. If it benefits corporations, or it goes boom, it's not subject to referendum. If it benefits someone other than the right wing, it is.
                     
                     You should know that by now.

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         2. 69

            wyanjenposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            money was loaned.
            money was returned.
            
            It's not only accurate, it's pretty damn simple.
            
            Of course, if it is made out to be more complicated than it is, there is more room to bitch...

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               Padrinoposted 14 years agoin reply to this

               You said
               "Rest easy. Your money has been returned."
               
               No it has not been returned! That is accurate, have a nice day!

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                  wyanjenposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                  hmm.
                  If it wasn't returned, where did it go?
                  Maybe GM left it on the bar and somebody walked off with it.

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                     Mark Knowlesposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                     But where did they borrow it from to pay it back?   GM posted a $4.3 billion loss after emerging from bankruptcy.

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                        William R. Wilsonposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                        Not sure how they accounted for the loan repayment but if they paid back 6.7 billion and only showed a 4.3 billion loss, they did ok.  If they did indeed borrow from Peter to pay Paul at least someone thought they were a good enough investment to loan them the cash.

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                           Mark Knowlesposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                           No - The loss was a trading loss. So they lost $4.3 billion and found $6.7 billion from "somewhere".
                           
                           Where was the somewhere? Because it was not a private investor.

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                              William R. Wilsonposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                              Well, you're getting into something that's over my head.  I'd like to learn more about it. If you come across something that answers your question, or even asks it/analyzes it in an understandable way, I'd like to read it.

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                                 Mark Knowlesposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                                 http://blogs.ajc.com/jamie-dupree-washi … on_insider
                                 
                                 Seriously - where else could this money have come from? They lost money after the bankruptcy. Their market shares have fallen around the world and they find the money to repay some of their loans?

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                                    Padrinoposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                                    It seems that "creative bookkeeping" is being used, imagine that.

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                     Padrinoposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                     The stories written on this "slight of hand" maneuver by GM with the Obama administration as a willing cohort is where the money came from and where it went.
                     
                     Posting out and out lies in order to make the Obama administration look as if they know what they are doing is ridiculous, the money has not been payed back and more than likely never will be payed back!
                     
                     Its down the black hole with more taxpayer money!

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      William R. Wilsonposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Wait, how do you see that?  The article says they paid everything in full, with interest. 
      
      Read instead of criticize, troll.

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         Jeff Berndtposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         Or link to a source.
         
         To Wyanjen, I think a lot of the animosity to Detroit comes from the perception that US manufacturers have been making substandard products for a long time and so deserve to fail. This is a false perception; in recent years US quality has gone way up. But the big three have done a terrible job convincing Americans that their cars are once again as good as or better than the foreign competition.
         
         This is understandable, since in the days of low quality, low reliability, and low fuel economy, US manufacturers tried to get along by invoking patriotism (or more accurately, xenophobia and nationalism) to get Americans to buy American cars that weren't as good as the competition. It's going to be hard to win back American consumers, especially after this bailout (and it was a bailout, even though the money is being repaid).
         
         On the other hand, I advised my mom to invest a small windfall in Ford last year, and she more than doubled her money.

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            wyanjenposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            Yeah, Ford has been doing some good things.
            
            regarding fuel economy: there was so much criticism about SUVs dominating the lots...
            but they weren't going unsold now, were they?
            
            Remember the Geo Metro? 40 MPG.
            People wouldn't buy it though, they stampeded to the SUVs.

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         Padrinoposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         I did read, http://www.businessweek.com/news/2010-0 … ments.html
         
         
         Sock-puppet!

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            William R. Wilsonposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            Meany Pants!
            
            Actually I thought I read "loan money" instead of "bailout money" in your post.  The loans have been paid ahead of schedule and with interest. The remainder of the bailout should turn a profit as well, when GM stock goes up the Government can sell it to the public. 
            
            And then there is the question of what would have happened to the economy if thousands of well paid autoworkers had suddenly lost their jobs....
            
            This bailout is looking like a good deal for the American people, so far.

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         Padrinoposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         (((crickets)))

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7. 60

   Ron Montgomeryposted 14 years ago

   TK is wrong again (what's new?) The American people, much to the chagrin of the wingnuts, put Democrats in charge to fix the mess left behind by Republicans.  They're doing a great job of it; all of your whining won't change that.
   
   I'll check back in to review the daily pummeling you are once again going to receive.  Thank God for Right-wing masochists.  They make the forums fun.

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   Padrinoposted 14 years ago

   "The American people, much to the chagrin of the wingnuts, put Democrats in charge to fix the mess left behind by Republicans.  They're doing a great job of it; all of your whining won't change that."
   
   If putting the US in deeper debt is fixing the mess then the Democrats are doing a wonderful job!
   
   Still not TK

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   manlypoetrymanposted 14 years ago

   I could use a "Bail-out" next...I promise to repay it with interest!

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    Mark Knowlesposted 14 years ago

    Oh and here is some more on the repayment:
    
    http://www.denverpost.com/opinion/ci_14957343
    
    If you just remember - your government thinks you are stupid - it all makes sense. Sorry Jen.

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       Padrinoposted 14 years agoin reply to this

       Our government loves us!

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    LegendaryHeroposted 14 years ago

    http://reason.com/archives/2010/04/27/g … ut-payback

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