How long does it take to make any money with hubpages?

1. 57

   Doctor Jposted 16 years ago

   How long does it take to make money with hubpages?  After 160 views on 10 hubs they tell me I have 0 clicks.  Is something wrong?

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   1. 38

      kashifmahmoodposted 16 years agoin reply to this

      Do not expect more than 10 clicks per 1000 page views . There is no hard and fast rule .A reader will click on those ads , if they find it interesting. Sometimes lesser amount of clicks can earn you more and sometimes for the same number of clicks , your earnings are lesser .

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      1. 82

         Whitney05posted 16 years agoin reply to this

         That's actually not a good thing to go by. As a beginner, maybe, but  like I said, the longer you're here, the more you'll make, meaning the more clickes and the more page views.
         
         Don't expect to become a millionaire through HubPages, at least not yet. But, you can expect to make a couple of bucks a day, maybe 10 or more, once you really start earning.

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   2. 59

      darksideposted 16 years agoin reply to this

      160 views isn't much to go off.
      
      Traffic is important. And you need thousands and thousands to find any noticeable trends.
      
      And it also depends on the quality of the traffic.
      
      Obviously visitors who click on ads are quality traffic, but where to find those people?
      
      Fellow hub authors are terrible traffic. On a whole, we are less inclined to click on ads.
      
      Traffic from search engines is gold. From my experience they are more likely to click on ads.

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      1. 60

         Greg from Maineposted 16 years agoin reply to this

         I couldn't agree more. That is why it is so important to do the things that search engines want to see, like link building.

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   3. 61

      College politicoposted 16 years agoin reply to this

      Well you need FAR more impressions if you want to make money from adsense. My suggestion is that you try using amazon or ebay until you get a strong steady flow of page views. I managed to make about 30 dollars in my first 6 weeks. I explain how I personally went about it in this hub. Check it out if you wanna see my exact strategy.

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   4. 57

      KFitzgeralsposted 16 years agoin reply to this

      Do any of you guys have any step by step how to advice for new guys trying to get everything set-up to "possibly" make adsense revenues?

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      1. 66

         relacheposted 16 years agoin reply to this

         1) Make hubs full of original and useful content on subjects which you are passionate about and have some personal experience.
         
         2) Repeat step 1

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      2. 59

         Mark Knowlesposted 16 years agoin reply to this

         Well, I suggest you stop posting this sort of thing and calling it a hub:
         
         "Search Giant to provide technology for personal healthcare records
         Google, the search engine giant has finally come up with a way to penetrate the healthcare information industry. Seems that google is offering some interesting technology.
         Check out the article below:
         Google Health Begins Its Preseason at Cleveland Clinic"
         
         And that's the entire hub folks.
         
         And yes, I flagged it as being low quality

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      3. 70

         Maddie Ruudposted 16 years agoin reply to this

         I see you're approaching hubbing like blogging.  That's not going to do anything for you.  Each hub needs to be clear, concise, and full of content, and STAND ALONE.  Of course you want people to click on your other hubs or go to your profile and browse, but you can't approach hubbing assuming people will be "following" you.  Most revenue comes from search engine traffic--people searching for information on a certain subject--not from fans or other hubbers.

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         1. 86

            quotationsposted 16 years agoin reply to this

            That's a very good point Maddie. I agree that most traffic comes from search engines. Also quite a lot of traffic comes internally from other hubbers.

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            1. 66

               relacheposted 16 years agoin reply to this

               On my most popular hubs, the internal traffic only accounts for about 5% of the visits.

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   5. 63

      highwaystarposted 16 years agoin reply to this

      Respectfully, hubpages get indexed extremely fast, adsense if you know exactly what to do can bring in the cash but you do need a moutain of traffic...more clicks is what you need!
      
      If making money is your goal...the only thing wrong is your business mind-set is out of shape... firstly, may I be so bold as to suggest you need a ton of traffic to get results.
      
      10 hubs is a great start, keep up the motivation so you can leverage your results. The best way is to plan your business in the early stages, you need a product and distribution channel.
      
      thename of the game is targetd traffic with conversion, if you've got the bucks to do PPC advertising, learn the success ropes and get to it, or you can go the root of social networking.
      
      If you're new and want help there's no shortage of resources, if you'd like a kick start learning how to get more targeted traffic feel free to go here: <snip> no promotional links - admin</snip>

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2. 60

   Greg from Maineposted 16 years ago

   Unfortunately, if you are expecting to make a lot of money from Adsense, you are likely to be disappointed. Only about 1 person in 100,000 can develop an income large enough from Adsense to live on. I did write a hub about it if you'd like more info.

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3. 82

   Whitney05posted 16 years ago

   Keep making original hubs that interest people. It's going to take a while. I made my first dollar within a month at hubpages, but I tend to have hubs on animals and videos games, which for me un me a godo bit of traffic.
   
   The longer you're here and the long you write, the more you'll make. You've only been here 3 weeks, so remember that HubPages isn't a get rich quick scheme or get rich quick period. It's something you have to work for.
   
   Just stick with it. Write about things you enjoy and are knowledgeable about; it'll make writing hubs a more enjoyable process.
   
   Don't post specifics about your clicks and earnings. Against the Adsense rules I think.

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   1. 71

      Peter M. Lopezposted 16 years agoin reply to this

      That's the truth.  But it is a great hobby that does actually pay something.  Just think, I could take up golf and spend $300 per month, or I can hub and make a little.  The answer seems simple to me.

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      1. 86

         stephhicks68posted 16 years agoin reply to this

         Right Peter!  I actually am doing something useful, instead of wasting my time (and likely my money) in other ways.  I'll tell this one to my hubby. 

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         1. 71

            Peter M. Lopezposted 16 years agoin reply to this

            Well, "wasting" is too strong a word, but it's certainly less expensive and somewhat profitable.  Does he listen, by the way?
            
            This is a hard sell for my wife...

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            1. 86

               stephhicks68posted 16 years agoin reply to this

               Maybe we'll have to start our own thread on this topic... but the answer to the question is "sometimes."  It depends on what else is going on.  If the dogs are going nuts and the kids want dinner and I'm hubbing, it usually doesn't sit too well. 

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      2. 36

         makemoneyonlineposted 16 years agoin reply to this

         I don't like Golf as for me but my brother does and he wins some money doing competition so I guess he won't agree with you

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4. 62

   Jaken Sprawlerposted 16 years ago

   It is pretty difficult to earn via Google Adsense, especially if your new to publishing, and don't have a strong understanding of how advertisers bid via google adwords. In other words, which topics/articles target high paying keywords resulting in high paying ads being shown on your hubpages, and which don't. I will be explaining this topic in the near future. ( Just recently joined a few days ago). 
   But as to your main issue, which is low click-thru rate, the solution is "Examination of traffic sources". If you are sourcing your traffic via forums, blogs, linking, or through visits from other hub users, you are likely to have a very low click-thru rate. The reason being that the traffic generated from these sources are not targetted,low in number, and slow to come. They pull in few visitors that are looking for entertainment and time passing, rather than actual buyers and serious researchers that are looking for info and want to buy.
   So, where should you source traffic from? "Pay Per Click advertising". I will be writing on this soon for those that are not well versed on this ad model.
   The traffic that comes in from PPC advertising, is "instant", "cheap", and"highly Targeted".
   Also, learn SEO techniques that will list your hubpages high on search engine directories for relevant keyword phrases. In other words, search engine traffic is pretty good as well.
   Lastly, understand that if you really want to monetize on your hubpages, you have to constantly source a decent amount of well targeted traffic to your hubpages daily (PPC and search engine traffic) Don't only bank on forums and social networks. Let them supplement PPC and organic search engine traffic.
   I will be writing more on all of this soon..so if your lost, feel free to keep in touch.

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   1. 72

      Inspirepubposted 16 years agoin reply to this

      This is dangerous advice to a new Hubber!
      
      A Hub is not monetised terribly well, and PPC is tricky to master at the best of times.
      
      Think about it:
      
      Google is taking money from person A (advertiser) for a PPC ad, then paying money to person B (site owner, in this case Hubber) for the click on that ad.
      
      Google is making a profit, ie keeping some of the money that passes through. (Just like banks do when they pay you 6% in a "high interest" cash deposit account, and the turn around and lend that money out to a credit card holder at 17%.)
      
      You are proposing that someone goes and PAYS the higher price in order to bring people in who might click, allowing them to then EARN the lower price?
      
      What's more, you're advocating that they use PPC, which means they will pay for EVERY visitor, but they will get revenue for at most 10% of them, and more likely 1%, and split that revenue 60/40 with Hubpages to boot?
      
      That's like telling people to get a cash advance on their credit card at 17% interest and put it in a term deposit at 6%!
      
      PPC is only a viable traffic strategy if you can make more on average from a visitor than it costs you to bring them in.
      
      Hubbers need to be looking for free traffic.
      
      Search engine traffic if you can get it - think keywords, and learn where to put them on the page.
      
      Otherwise, articles, social bookmarking - and the things you disparaged, like leaving comments on blogs and forums.
      
      Done badly, sure, those things bring a small amount of untargeted traffic, and spammers do them unbelievably badly.
      
      Done well, they bring a larger amount of better targeted traffic.
      
      And it's FREE traffic (well, money free, it takes time, but no more time than setting up, monitoring and tweaking a PPC campaign until it delivers for you!)
      
      Free traffic means your clicks are 100% profit.
      
      Paying for traffic creates the possibility of losing money, and if it's a Hub you're taking about sending the PPC traffic to, it's more than just a possibility - it's a probability!
      
      Jenny

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      1. 60

         Greg from Maineposted 16 years agoin reply to this

         I couldn't agree with Jenny more. While PPC can be very profitable, I do not recommend using PPC to generate traffic to your hubs. It is very, very unlikely that you will make a profit doing this.

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         1. 65

            Mishaposted 16 years agoin reply to this

            I third this opinion. Just don't do it, such method requires skills and knowledge you don't have yet. It is an advanced strategy, very difficult to implement properly, and the fact that you get only 60% of total revenue on Hubpages, makes success almost impossible...

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   2. 59

      Mark Knowlesposted 16 years agoin reply to this

      Awesome - Another expert with 1 hub.

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      1. 60

         Greg from Maineposted 16 years agoin reply to this

         Do I detect any sarcasm in your comment Mark?

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5. 59

   Mark Knowlesposted 16 years ago

   Oops, forgot the smilie
   
   

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6. 58

   Hazel Crawnerposted 16 years ago

   It's easy to be funny by being sarcastic.

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7. 59

   Mark Knowlesposted 16 years ago

   Be my guest.....

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8. 62

   Jaken Sprawlerposted 16 years ago

   I feel like i should emphasize a little more, i do apologize for not being a little bit more specific. PPC is pretty advanced, but not beyond the reach of those that are willing to truely master the system. I understand the revenue spit that hubpages offers its users. I also see where Jenny is coming from.
   But to suggest that the cost per click would inevitably be more expensive than the revenue generated from a click on a hubpage, is to show a lack of understanding PPC mechanisms.
   I feel like im at fault, however, for not elaborating. If you bid on keywords the standard way, you will end up paying more and infact losing money on your hub, rather than earning. "The key here is optimizing your page for high paying Keywords, by writing on certain profitable niche topics that pull in high paying adsense ads, and then buying those exact same keywords for dirt cheap on 2nd tier and 3rd tier search engines like goclick.com. The Concept is called Adsense Arbitrage, and its proved profitable for a very long time. Infact Google is build on an arbitrage concept, and so is shopping.com and ebay. They sell you traffic for much higher than they are getting it for. You have to understand this system Jenny before you conclude that the price differential is against your favor. You bid/buy cheap traffic and then sell high on your website/hubs. Infact, you can actually use Adwords itself to bid real low (0.05-0.25) on high paying keywords shown on your site. The idea is to tap into these inefficiences. If your not sure how, let me know...
   I must add, however, that if your sole purpose is adsense arbitrage, meaning that you only want adsense ads on your hub (also called MFA -made for adsense sites)and little to no content, giving bad user experience, google will shut you down. They want to see quality content.
   In response to Mark, like i said, i joined only a few days ago. I think 1 hub in 3 days is decent, don't you think?

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9. 59

   vrecccposted 16 years ago

   I wouldn't hang around hubpages if  your sole motivation is making money. Why? Because it just isn't a good business plan. From what I understand through a report from hubpages, the highest earner on hubpages is only earning about $1000 a month. There are some pretty awesome hubbers here that make some excellent hubs, but it still isn't enough to make a living.
   
   If you want to make money using adsense then PM me and I will introduce you to some methods. Don't worry, they are whitehat methods, but certainly not something that everyone would be interested in.
   
   Cheers,
   
   Jonathan

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   1. 70

      Maddie Ruudposted 16 years agoin reply to this

      Actually, if I'm not mistaken, Paul and Jason have both stated that some hubbers are making several thousand a month.
      
      To OP: Give it more time.  3 weeks in, I had next to nothing.  By 5 months I was making $10 a day on Adsense.  I now make about $20 a day, and expect it to continue to grow.

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      1. 0

         hayden_meposted 16 years agoin reply to this

         hi there im very new to this. im not sure if its safe or anything or whether or not i should sign up to adsense. i am interested in posting articles and more. can you please give me advice. thanks in advance

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10. 72

    Inspirepubposted 16 years ago

    Jaken,
    
    I think you should learn a little about how Hubs work before offering your advice.
    
    I am sure you have some useful knowledge, but you need to put it in context for it to have any value to your readers.
    
    There is no such thing as a "MFA" Hub with only Adsense ads on it.
    
    Hubs are supposed to contain original, quality content.
    
    Hubpages places the Adsense ads, and the Hubber can't control where the ads are placed.
    
    Hubpages also takes 40% of the revenue.
    
    I don't care WHERE you are getting your clicks, you won't be able to reliably get them cheap enough to overcome the fact that you pay for every person who comes in, and only a small percentage click on anything.
    
    Assuming you're doing well, with a CTR of 4-5% on your Hubs, that means you have to be able to get something like 40 times the price for a click as what you are paying per click.
    
    Without cost-per-action advertising, that's a big ask.
    
    Most click arbitragers are using PPC to CPA arbitrage. That's easier, but not allowed on this platform.
    
    Jenny

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    1. 66

       relacheposted 16 years agoin reply to this

       Actually the way Paul Deeds clarified this, the HubPages codes (AdSense/Amazon/eBay) are inserted in the pages 40% of the time.  If the only clicks came when their codes were on the page, they'd get all the revenue.  If the only clicks came when your codes were active, you'd get all the revenue.
       
       That's not the same as them getting 40% of the revenue.

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       1. 60

          etetirengposted 16 years agoin reply to this

          My Amazon and adsense are active, but how about ebay. further more there is no photo shown on ebay capsul
          
          thanks

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          1. 59

             Mark Knowlesposted 16 years agoin reply to this

             LOL - You might want to stop hiding your Amazon affiliate links in the text so that hubpages don't get a share of the impressions
             
             And as your last hubs states that you are writing "because there is lot of successful people on the Internet Business, and make some money." - I feel sure you will be able to work it out.

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             1. 60

                etetirengposted 16 years agoin reply to this

                Thank for your support,
                As I mentioned on my 1st hub that writing article is not easy for me, can I use the same article on my BLOG? which there is Adsense link as well?

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                1. 59

                   Mark Knowlesposted 16 years agoin reply to this

                   LOL - The sarcasm smilie is mine.
                   
                   First of all, stop hijacking someone else's thread - if you you have a question, start another.
                   
                   Second of all, the idea is to use amazon capsules and share the revenue with hubpages - you are hiding text-based amazon  affiliate links in your hub which cuts out hubpages share - this will not go down well.
                   
                   Third of all,........ that's all I can be bothered with. If you don't understand good advice when you hear it that's your problem.

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                   1. 70

                      tom zposted 16 years agoin reply to this

                      hello mark, i'm new to the hub world, what do you mean when you say "hiding amazon affiliate links"...how does that lower the impressions you get on hubpages? 
                      
                      thanks for any tips you have.  i just wrote my first 2 hub pages and want to learn as much as i can about this cool new technology.
                      
                      thanks
                      tom z
                      
                      

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11. 72

    Inspirepubposted 16 years ago

    You're right, Relache, I was assuming you had enough traffic that it evened out to the expected average.
    
    It IS possible that you make nothing at all, or 100% of the revenue, across a small number of Hubs and clicks.
    
    Jenny

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12. 62

    Jaken Sprawlerposted 16 years ago

    Your right Jenny. After doing a little more research in the "hubs" platform, i realized your options are a whole lot more limited, for adsense arbitrage, as it would be for actually owning your website and the game is a lot different here. You can't place your ads where you want, and can't format it all the way.
    This arbitrage model does work very well for owned websites though, its been generating a decent income for me and a lot of friends that i know, and you definetly can pay 0.02 and 0.03 cents for clicks on keywords worth $2 and $3. So getting clicks cheap enough is not as issue. Also the average conversion rate for good adsense arbitragers is 15-21% not 4-5%. It would be very sad to have it that low.
    But for hubpages, like you said, this doesn't work due to control issues like ad placement, format, and largely because, ( learnt this tonight), your adsense ads don't display 100% of the time. Im sorry for the confusion. Your right, in the context of hubpages, it doesn't work as well. I unncessarily assumed, what works for "owned websites", would work here.

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13. 57

    Doctor Jposted 16 years ago

    Thanks guys.  This helps.

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14. 59

    darksideposted 16 years ago

    Hubbers get 60% of the pageviews.
    
    The other 40% is divided between HubPages and possibly one or two other ID's.
    
    But what Relache is saying is correct. It's not a revenue split, it's a pageview split.

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15. 0

    terrygposted 16 years ago

    You will find Hubbers are just like bloggers.
    
    Their ad blind.
    
    If you want to make money from adsense then your efforts are better concentrated elsewhere.
    
    Ask yourself one question, while your looking at other hubs do you click an ad? Therein lies your answer why you won't make money with hubs or blogs.

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    1. 79

       embitcaposted 16 years agoin reply to this

       Actually, that's not true. You won't make money from Hubbers clicking on your ads because we don't click on them, but as Relache mentioned, most of the traffic for your top hubs will come from the search engines, not from internal traffic. I make more adsense income from Hubpages than I do from any other site on which I have Adsense. 
       
       Assuming that search engine visitors act the same way that you, as a publisher, act is a mistake.

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       1. 0

          terrygposted 16 years agoin reply to this

          Well I will go out on a limb here. I have noticed a lot of different ad serves on my hubs from different sources. If I arrive at my hub from another source such as a search engine I see the usual set of ad components. If I arrive to my hub from my own sources I see a different set and colour scheme of ad components.
          
          If someone would like to convince me that when a visitor arrives at my hub from a search engine IS it equally distributed my pub code or hubs.
          
          Why do I ask this? Because my analytics program tells me. If I count in one day how many times I access my hub my analytics corresponds. When I check my statistics under My Account the statistics and sources is quite a lot more. 
          
          So what am I saying to make it clear. The search engine traffic does not arrive when it is my turn to have my pub id on the ad component. 527 views on Google analytics and 1247 "ever" on Hub traffic sources. Correct me if I'm wrong but in my part of the world that is not a 40 to 60 split.
          
          Now to take this one step further if you arrive at your hub then right click mouse for the page source or go to view and select page source. You will then see the publisher id in the source code. When I did this guess what I saw. Not my id. Try it yourself. The google_adclient id was not mine and on most occasions won't be your own.

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16. 59

    Mark Knowlesposted 16 years ago

    Are you looking at "for all time" on google analytics ? - it usually just shows the last 30 days - that might explain the difference. I have found the 60/40 split to be consistent between hubpages stats and google analytics.
    
    The other question you raise about hubpages picking the search engine traffic for their own impressions and giving internal traffic your impressions - if that's what you are suggesting?
    
    That's an interesting question, but I don't see how you can check that - perhaps Jason or Paul will answer that one?

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17. STAFF

    pauldeedsposted 16 years ago

    The split is done at random with each page view, without regard for referrer or any other factor.   It's pretty easy for anyone to test this, just use wget to request 100, 1000, or 10000 copies of a hub using whatever referrer you like. For instance you could run these commands on a unix system (unfortunately, not all have the repeat command), in two separate directories:
    
    Google Referrer: repeat 1000 wget -referer http://www.google.com/search?q=Subvert+ … ite+review  http://hubpages.com/hub/Subvert-and-Pro … ite-review
    
    HubPages Referrer: repeat 1000 wget -referer http://hubpages.com/ http://hubpages.com/hub/Subvert-and-Pro … ite-review
    
    And then use grep and wc to count the number of times the HubPages adsense token appears:
    
    grep -l pub-6958755572607374 * | wc
    
    Because it is done entirely at random, statistically speaking impression sharing will follow a binomial distribution.  This means if you grab 100 copies of the page you should find the HubPages token appearing on between 30 and 50 of them 95% of the time.  If you grab 1000 copies you should find the HubPages token appearing on between 370 and 430 of them 95% of the time.  If you grab 10000 copies you should find the HubPages token appearing on between 3904 and 4097 of them 95% of the time.
    
    All that said, if you think we are screwing you somehow there are many other places to publish online.  Feel free to use them.

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       terrygposted 16 years agoin reply to this

       Well bearing that in mind what I did was to go to the google link above. I pressed it ten times. I read the page source on each open link that came up to my hub. Out of the ten times I saw one id, this one - google_adclient: "pub-6958755572607374
       
       That is not mine. So out of ten clicks from Google search engine for the chosen keyword my id came up not once.  I also tried the same thing on Live and received the same result.
       
       I do not think you are screwing me but the facts speak for themselves.

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       HubbaHubbaposted 16 years agoin reply to this

       -----------------------------------------------------------------
       
       Hey Paul,
       I don't know you, I just joined but I'm guessing you're something to do with the Hub Pages Setup (or maybe ARE the Hub Pages Setup). I was just thumbing my way through some posts and came across your answer.
       Thank you for a good belly laugh. Your borrowed usage of engineering terminology  was spot on and I thought encapsulated the post message perfectly.

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18. 72

    Inspirepubposted 16 years ago

    Highwaystar,
    
    You just presented yourself like a cobbler with no shoes, or a make-up artist whose lipstick is bleeding.
    
    Posts like this on forums like this on sites like this is exactly the way NOT to do social networking.
    
    If everyone else will excuse me for a moment - you'll find more detail about why this is so on this Hub:
    
    http://hubpages.com/hub/Web-20-Marketin … Or-Fiction
    
    Sigh.
    
    If you had even bothered to read the rest of this thread before you posted, you would have discovered that mentioning driving traffic to Hubs by PPC was a baaaaaaad move, credibility-wise.
    
    Jenny

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19. 60

    Originplusposted 16 years ago

    I suggest focus on content...because the quality of the hub is whats going to generate traffic, and the traffic will eventually click on the ads that they are interested in.

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20. 61

    Betty Jo Pettyposted 16 years ago

    Sad, to say, this is all above my head.  I do wish I knew more about computers.
    
    That's one thing I like about Hub Pages.  There are lots and lots of knowledgeable people here, willing to help people like me.
    
    Also sad is the fact I had three kids in college this year, too busy to help an old (57) lady like me do this stuff.  They say something like, just do it.
    
    I do have an opinion:  write, and research and write, and have some friends or relatives critique for you.  Read it aloud to yourself. 
    
    Make your articles look as good as possible. 
    
    Write and write and write.  After months and years, think of the money adding up, even if it's only pennies per day.
    
    I, myself, don't write for the money.  I write because I have found places where I can write, and I absolutely love trying.
    
    I graduated High School, (this is unbelievable, I know, because I only feel seventeen!) Forty years ago this May.  So writing and trying to keep up with educated people of today, is very hard for me. 
    
    Keep writing, and submitting it.  Or not.  Betty Jo

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21. 72

    Inspirepubposted 16 years ago

    We just did an experiment - looked at over 86,000 ad impressions on one of my Hubs.
    
    HubPages ID came up 37.8% of the time, instead of the expected 40%.
    
    So, if anything, they are giving us some of their share
    
    Jenny

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22. 43

    boycottchapter27posted 16 years ago

    I don't know what all the complaining is about (and over analysis), we have access to this incredible, FREE tool, generating income from day 1. Concentrate on content and the money will follow, why would the guys at hubpages look to screw someone out of a few clicks, they have a killer business model, assume positive intent and enjoy. or post to your personal blog and get lost in cyber-space.
    
    Great Job Guys!!!
    
    Peace

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23. 61

    About-The-Homeposted 16 years ago

    I agree boycottchapter27 (that's a mouthful!).
    
    If someone's not too trusting of this system, there's really no reason for others to go out of their way to justify it.
    
    Most of us take it on trust, maybe we're too trusting but I think that just looking at how long it's been operating and how long people have been posting hubs means that trust is not misplaced.
    
    Namaste
    
    GerryM

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24. 59

    Mark Knowlesposted 16 years ago

    There are ready made amazon capsules that are part of the hubpages software. If you add these, hubpages get a 40% share of the impressions.
    
    You can also add a text link with an affiliate id embedded in it. This circumvents hubpages share for the impression. Not a good idea
    
    Take a look at darkside's hubs on using capsules - he's excellent.
    
    Welcome

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