Saving HubPages

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   promisemposted 5 years ago

   If you think Hubpages is in great shape, you are wrong.
   
   You only need to look at the Maven stock price to see the company has serious issues going forward.
   
   https://www.cnbc.com/quotes/?symbol=MVE … earchterm=
   
   A severely declining stock price means company executives, employees and investors have doubt about its future. If they thought otherwise, they would be buying the stock and boosting its price.
   
   If the company doesn't produce a reliable profit soon, its future is doubtful. So is your income. When the next recession comes, probably in 2020, ad revenue will take a dive and wipe out weak sites. We don't want HP to be one of them.
   
   If you want to help the company and help yourself, please don't post trivial forum comments like "yawn" as well as low-quality Hubs.
   
   Please post forum comments with substance that have search engine friendly keywords. Even more importantly, follow the HP guidelines about quality Hubs:
   
   1. More than 1,000 words.
   2. Original images
   3. Keywords that appeal to search engines
   4. Authoritative conent
   
   If you take HP for granted, you are risking the future of the site as well as your own income.

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      Will Apseposted 5 years agoin reply to this

      The Facebook thing seems to have been a big deal.
      
      Our continuing traffic losses seem to be linked somehow. I suspect aggressive SEO in search of a buck after the Facebook hit, which has not worked out well.
      
      Sad for staff as well as a dose of self pity, lol.

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      greenmindposted 5 years agoin reply to this

      Maybe, but the entire stock market has been in the tank lately -- this week was the worst since 2011. And for what it's worth, my December Amazon sales are 5 times what they were a year ago.

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         Wesman Todd Shawposted 5 years agoin reply to this

         True. Trade wars and increases in interest rates have done a number on it. It's not a big deal though, as the quarterly data shows a GDP increase of over 3 %

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         promisemposted 5 years agoin reply to this

         The stock price was plunging before the market started going down.

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      samanthacubbisonposted 5 years agoin reply to this

      Hey guys, I'm glad everyone is putting so much thought into keeping things in tip-top shape. Just a few things to put the collective mind at ease:
      
      - HubPages is doing just fine, and as far as I know, we're not going anywhere!
      
      - In regards to the acquisition, there are bound to be some fluctuations during this adjustment period. We're talking about a multi-company merger here! It's complicated stuff.
      
      - Playing "nice" on the Forums was not stressed for any particular reason aside from it being a topic in the FAQ. The whole point of the Pro-Tips section of the newsletter is to introduce new and helpful sections to our users that may not want to read through the whole FAQ.
      
      - That being said, it should be a given that we should be kind and courteous when writing in the forums. Just because there is a screen between us doesn't mean we should act any differently than we do in public.
      
      - Forums DO get indexed by search engines, but if the content is rich, informative and useful, it will do everyone a lot of good.
      
      - Connected to the index thing, we do a great job of weeding out the spam and naughty things that could damage anyone's reputation.
      
      So please enjoy the forums and continue connecting with your community through the various topics available. I hope this has been helpful!

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         letstalkabouteducposted 5 years agoin reply to this

         Thanks, Samantha. It's always helpful (and reassuring) to hear from HP leadership. Otherwise, it's a little nerve-racking to just hear everyone's theories. Happy holidays!

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            samanthacubbisonposted 5 years agoin reply to this

            Of course! Happy Holidays!

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      poppyrposted 5 years agoin reply to this

      Thank you for this. Might save backups of all my articles, just in case.

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   Wesman Todd Shawposted 5 years ago

   I'm uncertain how forum posts could have anything to do with anything. They aren't monetized. The HP community forums, the business end of it, like right here, are the only thing worth consideration at all. But if the quality of forum posts is important, then the political ones would need to be removed completely.
   
   The least intelligent users, the lowest of all possible quality material, the worst the network has to offer is found in the politics forums. Daily.
   
   ....but I still can't figure how that could hurt the website, except for a few persons who could give prospective authors the jitters, for being so low in quality and character.
   
   Hey, thanks for giving me something to worry about. I was almost getting into the whole Christmas spirit thing. You cured me right up, Doc.

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      promisemposted 5 years agoin reply to this

      Forum posts get indexed by search engines. High quality posts attract better rankings than low quality posts.
      
      You're welcome. This is reality.

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   theraggededgeposted 5 years ago

   And a Merry Christmas to all
   
   I've never seen a HubPages forum post appear in search results, by the way.
   
   Edit: Okay, I put "I'd like feedback on my article" into Google search and one did appear in the results, so I take back my previous observation.

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      Bedbugabscondposted 5 years agoin reply to this

      This is the reason that there has been major emphasis on respecting one another on the forums. They are indexed, and if you want to argue about it, just remember that things that aren't meant to get indexed can get indexed by accident anyway. So let's not argue about that point.
      
      Our expertise and authority are showcased in our articles and on the forums. If you write content on the forums that might fall into the category of user generated spam, then you could also be taking a hit to your reputation as a writer. We are a collective, so we all take that hit together when we post substandard content in articles or on forums.
      
      As for stocks, I have been watching them for a long while too. Tech companies often strive on other kinds of funding that you don't hear talked about too much. The Maven coalition brings something brand new to the table, and wise investors have and will invest. Of course, there will have to be profit, so we should all be giving it our best.
      
      Honestly though, why do so many people resist the idea of acting professional and with civility on the forum. It's 2018, not 1999. It is about to be 2019, and 2020 is around the corner. The world is very different, so why shouldn't this forum evolve right along with tech? Listen, we got a flying car, Elon Musk has one flying through space right now. It's OK to join the present, which is always becoming the future. And really, in the industry we are working in, tommorow is already yesterday.

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         Will Apseposted 5 years agoin reply to this

         I would like to imagine that stuff happening in these forums reverberates across the world, but somehow I can't, lol.

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            Bedbugabscondposted 5 years agoin reply to this

            I am just sharing my opinion, but thanks for making light of it. You go ahead and joke, and think me to sensitive.

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               theraggededgeposted 5 years agoin reply to this

               And that's the way things go on forums... and that's the way it should be. Will wasn't making jokes about your sensitivity. You go ahead and share your opinions and let others make jokes. It's all fine.

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                  Bedbugabscondposted 5 years agoin reply to this

                  Can we not be serious about this matter for a moment? Do we allwasy have to tease one another? Ahh, its like a soap opera. Perhaps every now and again we can have a serious thread? Or is that asking too much, no really you get the last word this time.

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                     theraggededgeposted 5 years agoin reply to this

                     Go back through the thread. You were the one who responded to my comment and telling me not to argue the point. I wasn't arguing but you seemed to have decided to escalate it and make it personal. Maybe you should take your own advice and try to be pleasant to other forum members?

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            NateB11posted 5 years agoin reply to this

            lol. I was just going to write lol and then realized it might mess up the whole site, so let me add that I just went to the kitchen and learned HOW TO BOIL AN EGG and then went to my bedroom and figured out HOW TO TIE A TIE. Meantime, I saw a neighbor teach her daughter HOW TO TIE A PONYTAIL.

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         theraggededgeposted 5 years agoin reply to this

         Because it's a forum. For chatting and interaction. Where professionals can relax a little perhaps? Otherwise there's no point in having them. And why are you telling us off for spam comments? WE, the writers, don't leave spam. Most of us are wary of posting any links here at all.
         
         All HP needs to do is have a regular clean out. Get rid of old, obsolete threads. And act immediately as soon as spam is reported.
         
         I really think you are directing your concerns at the wrong people. Why not contact those in charge?
         
         Edit: For example, some idiot has blanket spammed the topical forum - FIVE hours ago. How is it still there? It wouldn't be difficult to ask for some volunteer mods from different time zones to clean it up as soon as it appears.

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            Bedbugabscondposted 5 years agoin reply to this

            This kind of response is why I almost always ignore the form now. Why in the first paragraph do you have to belittle me. I won't be offended, it is just too bad you have nothing positive to say about the simple suggestion we be kind to one another. I don't think sharing my opinion where it seemed appropriate for the thread is something you need to react offended to, just my opinion. How does it hurt to repeat it to each other and ourselves to have appropriate comments. I was not attacking anyone, but your telling my my post is "talking to the wrong people". How is taling about positive change so bothersome? I have a right to add my opinion, please respect that. I know you both enjoy the last word, so I will retreat into my recess and keep my mouth shut like a good girl then.

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               theraggededgeposted 5 years agoin reply to this

               I'm not belittling you. It's called conversation. I'm explaining what I see the forum as being. How is that belittling you? We don't have to share the same perspective, do we?
               
               I'm not acting 'offended' either. Where did you get that from?
               
               And my suggesting you contact the staff about your concerns (seeing as they're the only ones who can take action regarding old threads and spam) is just that - a suggestion.
               
               And of course you are entitled to your opinion, as am I.

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                  Bedbugabscondposted 5 years agoin reply to this

                  This is not about weather either of us is offended. Really, it is about an algorithm and AI looking for quality, which is based off current social norms to some degree. But I guess quality is in the eve of the beholder. Still, keeping up with Google standards doesn't hurt. We all need to be paying attention to how search engines and forums are interacting, if you haven't noticed the gradual change, I suggest you look into it. It is good information to know for how to make the best forum possible.
                  
                  Me, I am switching to pinterest traffic, but still want to live up to Googles standards.

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            Wesman Todd Shawposted 5 years agoin reply to this

            That's how I feel about it. I've never considered those forums to be any more in value than Facebook chatter, which is worthless except as an example of humans need to communicate with other humans.
            
            There is one person in the politics forums who I report every time I see anything at all to complain about. The person seems to only be on this website in order to make it look like a place for 5th graders to congregate.

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            promisemposted 5 years agoin reply to this

            We can chat with some substance and improve the reputation of the site or post junk and heap abuse on each other, which brings our reputation down.

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               theraggededgeposted 5 years agoin reply to this

               'We' do on this forum. However, the 'other forum', nah, not so much. I said years ago that HP should disconnect it from hp.com and give it its own url.
               
               Do you remember that awful heated discussion we had here last year because I suggested that the quotes and games should go over to 'the other side', while the writing and HP stuff stayed here? To be fair, the team did act on that and most of the trivial stuff gets moved over.
               
               When I looked last night, that spam had been there for 14 hours. Not good.

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                  promisemposted 5 years agoin reply to this

                  I do remember that battle and agree the quotes shouldn't show up here.
                  
                  I also agree the behavior isn't the same here as the topicals.

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         DrMark1961posted 5 years agoin reply to this

         If HP really considers these forums that seriously, they would just eliminate them and take out those frivilous posts on politics and religion.
         As far as user generated spam, it happens almost every day. Almost every spammer that comes on here registers and is considered a user.
         I think there is a lot to disagree about on this subject.

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            TIMETRAVELER2posted 5 years agoin reply to this

            Maybe HP should reconsider a few things for the New Year.  For example, why not drop all of the topics forums and just have one forum dedicated to writing issues?  Why not discuss spam and inappropriate ads with Maven to see if they can remove them?  Why not ban people from forums who don't stick to the topic of writing issues?  While these things may put limits on what writers can do, would they not be worth doing if they could increase the site's rankings?  Just suggestions that may or may not work, but if "bad behavior" is the problem, this would be one way to put a stop to most of it.

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4. 87

   Will Apseposted 5 years ago

   Just to get this thread back to something sensible...
   
   This is the Maven share price over the last 12 months.
   
   
   
   That is more than a 75 per cent decline.

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      jansharesposted 5 years agoin reply to this

      

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      promisemposted 5 years agoin reply to this

      Thanks for the graphic. It does a good job of illustrating the point.
      
      If we all focus more on improving the quality of our articles AND forum posts, we can turn that trend around.

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      PaulGoodman67posted 5 years agoin reply to this

      Thanks for the graph, that has to be a matter for concern, Will. Overall, I was feeling optimistic, despite a couple of months of decline. I guess we will see how things develop... I have been writing a lot of hubs recently. I don't get that involved with the forums...

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   hard sunposted 5 years ago

   Getting the huge number of spam posts dropped onto the political forums in the last hours may be a good start. However, people expect a certain amount of argument and debate in forums. If they are looking up political topics, they may even be looking for that. I do think it turns people off though when the debate is just unproductive name calling.

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      Bedbugabscondposted 5 years agoin reply to this

      A political section of the forum would theoretically be treated like other similar forums. So what ever the norm is for that type of forum is probably where the limit should be set if your trying to please both the algorithm/ai and the people.

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   FatFreddysCatposted 5 years ago

   Keep in mind that HubPages is just one of many sites in the Maven "network."
   
   If their entire operation is truly in such dire shape, then playing nicey-nice in the HP forums will have no effect whatsoever.

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      Bedbugabscondposted 5 years agoin reply to this

      I don't think it is just about playing nice nice on the forum. It is about lively conversation that computes well. Your right, every part of the Maven network has to increase it's reputation. I think it is more about getting in the habit of remembering to keep your behavior alighned with our goals. And really, its true that most the people who need to hear this probably don't even check the forum. They just post and run.

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         promisemposted 5 years agoin reply to this

         Well said!

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      promisemposted 5 years agoin reply to this

      I'm talking about HP the company and not the website.
      
      I also am encourging forum posts with more substance that appeal to search engines. They don't have to be nicey dicey.

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   jansharesposted 5 years ago

   Thanks, promisem, for posting this forum. Enlightening and relevant information. Good to know. Fortunately, I don't count solely on my HP income but it would be missed. More importantly, having this amazing site to post articles would be greatly missed. My concern would be finding the time to start a new site just for articles, upgrading existing site to add my articles, moving my articles elsewhere, or a combo of all. Hopefully, HP will last a few more years and I can worry about it later. As for the forums . . . well . . .

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   hard sunposted 5 years ago

   Yes, honestly, I know little about how forums affect search engines and Maven as a company.
   
   I do know that if my first encounters with Hubpages is not a good one I'm less likely to click on a link when it's presented in the results.
   
   I've had decent success in the past-- going back to Associated Content--with SEO sites, and is why I'm here now. I'm not doing as well as I'd like, but that may be due to taking some time away from SEO articles.
   
   Part of what keeps me interested in the site, and may draw other writers though, is all of the forums.

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   Natalie Frankposted 5 years ago

   I wasn't aware that the forums affected our rankings on search engines.  There's so much about online publishing I just don't know.  I'm glad others in our community are knowledgeable about such things and can make those of us who aren't, aware.   It seems that if it does affect us to a significant extent then there would have been an effort to get rid of posts and threads that would bring us down.  I'm not suggesting censorship but things that are truly negative, insulting, illogical and inaccurate should be removed just as a matter of course.  I have noticed several threads that I know were heading down negative directions with someone being insulting have been removed (as evidenced by there being zero posts).  There is also the issue of really old threads as in years old - shouldn't these be archived?  Do we even have archives?  Do archived forums affect rankings with search engines also?  (See - I told you I'm clueless!) 
   
   I think this is an important issue to consider so thanks for posting it.

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      Bedbugabscondposted 5 years agoin reply to this

      You know it's really interesting to learn about the way user-generated spam impacts content. Like many others suggested, I went through all my articles on all accounts and deleted ALL comments that did not add value. For example, "Nice Article" wouldn't really add value to the piece. I also followed Z's suggested and got rid of the playful banter that was off topic. The result was better traffic. I was not aware that Google considered some of that user generated spam, because it looked fine to me.
      
      Here is some official information about the Google take on user generated spam. It does indicate that if there was a serious issue, then it may result in manual action against a whole site.
      
      https://support.google.com/webmasters/a … ic=6001971
      
      I have no idea if we have archives, but that is a good question. If you did have archives couldn't you noindex or nofollow it?

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      promisemposted 5 years agoin reply to this

      I should add that it's not just search engine response.
      
      It's also the reputation of the site and the image it projects to non members who visit.
      
      I assume we all want those visitors to be impressed with what they see and come back often.

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         wildernessposted 5 years agoin reply to this

         Disagree.  I'll watch the site location of information sometimes, such as wikipedia, the Mayo Clinic, etc., but when it comes to forum posts on those sites it means almost nothing except for posts from the writer providing the information I want.  Never do I check the social aspects, such as these forums, for anything and doubt that many people do.

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            promisemposted 5 years agoin reply to this

            Your personal behavior is not relevant  to search engine behavior and site reputation.

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         gerimcclymposted 5 years agoin reply to this

         Yes, we should all focus on improving the quality of our articles, but ultimately HP is responsible for publishing poor quality articles. Many of the good articles get moved to the niche sites and I don't doubt that there are many good ones that for one reason or another don't. My concern is that there are many poor quality articles that remain on the HP main site, and this impacts the reputation of the site because of the image it projects to non members who visit.
         
         Until and unless HP raises their standards, I have little doubt the site is going down. Some of us would be wise to start exploring our next steps--whether that be creating our own websites or something else.

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            promisemposted 5 years agoin reply to this

            Well said. As someone who publishes his own sites, I have to say that making money from them is getting more and more difficult.
            
            The number of websites and webpages competing for advertising continues to grow much faster than ad revenue.
            
            Google, which is the largest ad network partner, is holding onto an ever-higher percentage of that ad revenue for its own sites rather than sharing it with partners.
            
            The HP-Maven network so far is doing better with advertising RPMs but apparently worse with audience lately. Let's hope they get audience growth back on track.

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            Jean Bakulaposted 5 years agoin reply to this

            I think the quality of articles has gone way up since I began here eight years ago. I began fixing all my work and submitting them to niche sites. I had almost 175 articles when the niches began. If I thought they were well written and up to the new standards (which took about a year to do), they were moved, and it often resulted in thousands more views for certain articles in a year. I have written a little bit of new material, but have about 6 more left on HP. There's no reason to leave anything on there, it's a graveyard.

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    Lovelli Fuadposted 5 years ago

    Since we're on topic, I would like to add that over the past 3 months, I had only 1 count recorded in GA from the Maven Coalition. I'm not in the US, but is it possible for people in other countries to purchase Maven's shares? I keep thinking that maybe if more regions were exposed to the coalition then it could help with exposure.

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    psycheskinnerposted 5 years ago

    Hubpages is trying to survive, I wish them good fortune.

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    Will Apseposted 5 years ago

    I really thought Maven would be the reward that the two Pauls and Robyn deserved for so much work on HP. Hope it still works out.

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       PaulGoodman67posted 5 years agoin reply to this

       Advertising rates appears to have risen dramatically with Maven. But the increased investment hasn't managed to create a sustained increase in views so far. I am hoping the recent travails are temporary. I had some record breaking income in Autumn, certainly for Hub Ads (Amazon income continues to decline for a variety of reasons), before the rot set in. Still, the decline hasn't been as dramatic as some of the previous crashes, I just hope it doesn't continue. Paul E said that the recent "fixes" would take until the new year to take effect, so fingers crossed.
       
       That graph you posted was troubling though.
       
       As we both know, HP have made massive strides in reducing spam and thin content. It's now virtually a conventional publishing site, with editors and rejection notices for writers, rather than the free for all of seven or eight years ago. Yet still, I feel that Google is reluctant to give HP more viewers.

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          TIMETRAVELER2posted 5 years agoin reply to this

          This is why HP started the niche sites.  HP hubs that don't get moved to the niches will never get good views again.  Unless Google is still associating the niches with the HP site, we should be in good shape once the glitch from a few months back gets corrected.  Unfortunately, that one mistake may have caught Google's attention and harmed the whole deal.  I sure hope not because I know many writers here are hurting as a result of what happened.

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             PaulGoodman67posted 5 years agoin reply to this

             You are right that hubs that don't make it to niches are pretty much a waste of time for writers. But niche sites can be punished by Google just like the old HP site or any other website for that matter. We will see in due course whether HP team can rectify the issue(s).

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          Will Apseposted 5 years agoin reply to this

          That fix better work, or I will end up loving in a tree, lol. I'm in no shape to start a new career.

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             PaulGoodman67posted 5 years agoin reply to this

             There are worse places to end up than "loving in a tree", Will - though I'm sure that the twigs get in the way at times!

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    Natalie Frankposted 5 years ago

    That graph is worrisome.  If you read Maven's investor news they keep saying they're on track to reach financial goals by years end.  If that's really the case why has their stock plummeted over the past 12 months?
    
    They also posted this the end of October:  "This week Maven announced its combined advertisers now reach 110 million monthly users, up from Maven’s 6.1 million in May. The growth is due in part to operational integration with HubPages and Say Media, which transformed the enterprise from a start-up to a top 20 U.S. digital media property." So in five months starting with 6.1 million viewers they added about 104 million additional users, which seem to be largely accounted for by us and Say Media.  That seems to suggest that HP and Say Media are the heavy hitters with the Maven sites not adding much to the mix.
    
    They also state in their investor info that the number of Maven channels grew from 197 in June to 259 in September, and are expected to reach over 300 by the end of December.  While some sites like Rachel Ray may be quality sites a lot of the ones I've looked at are low quality.  The likelihood of them become lower quality with the daily posting requirement also seems pretty high. It seems possible they've just tried to add as many sites that have a high viewership regardless of quality.
    
    I guess it's still too early to tell what these mergers will mean for HP.  But it's understandable that we are noticing the differences on a day to day basis while the board and people running Maven are looking at it based on a longer term perspective.

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    Erudite Scholarposted 5 years ago

    I have noticed a nose-dive in traffic after the merger. I am trying my best to produce high quality content. This is a wait and see situation for me right now. In the meantime, I will continue to publish more and more articles.
    I still believe in HP.

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       TIMETRAVELER2posted 5 years agoin reply to this

       It's a wait and see for all of us right now, but I strongly believe that in another month or so we'll see the numbers start to rise.  You're doing the best thing you can do right now, and it will pay off in the long run.

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