Hey, just wanted to let you know that a company called ProspectMX is sending a doll of Matt Cutts into space (actually like 2000 feet, but still.)
For all you SEO/Internet Marketing Gurus, I'm sure you know he's a big deal, so here is the problem they are having. They need a name for the rocket. I'm not sure whats allowed here as far as links go, but here is the link to the voting page, I personally thought Black Hat Express was pretty cool.
<no self-promoting links>
That's hilarious! There have been times where I'd like to blast the entire team of theirs into space....
I'm hoping that the many reports of the death of SEO will one day prove to be true. Then writers and website designers can emerge from their little underground burrows and rule the web.
And what would replace it? How would people interested in the subject or subjects you write about find your articles? Through social media perhaps? But arent most social media sites in themselves mini search engines of a kind that can be optimised in some way to give those writers with a little marketing savy a real advantage. What about bookmarking sites? How would new content found so that it could be bookmarked in the first place?
Every other day the death of SEO is pronounced yet the market seems to grow anually in net worth. SEO is no longer about simply getting to the top of google its about many many other things. SEO wont die although it will evolve.
Writers who fail to grasp the benefits of SEO and act upon it are missing out on recognition and potential earnings. There are definitely a few writers who could build a much more satisfying writing career if they were to emerge from their underground burrows and along with art for arts sake think about money for survivals sake!
Lol,let's play that way by thinking there is death of SEO. World population is 6,811,800,000 as of march 2010(rough estimate) & internet users are 1,733,993,741 and growing. How on earth good writers expect to get found out with organic linking in this crowd? So either flock at place where other respectable writers are writing or start your own campaign to get known in this huge crowd. In any case with organic linking there is no way one can establish his popularity in 2010, there needs to be promotion to get yourself known on the internet. Search engine needs to know why they should rank you higher, they don't read how good you write so only way they find that out with help of links to your hub/site. You do the SE promotion and so you're in SEO. Where SEO is dying ?
Anyway back on topic, amusing video and Black Hat Express would be my choice also.
Paul Hoggan said concerning SEO
'And what would replace it? How would people interested in the subject or subjects you write about find your articles? Through social media perhaps? But arent most social media sites in themselves mini search engines of a kind that can be optimised in some way to give those writers with a little marketing savy a real advantage. What about bookmarking sites? How would new content found so that it could be bookmarked in the first place?'
Off page SEO is an attempt to manipulate the search engines. In a perfect online world a page that delivered the best experience for visitors would rise to the top of the SERPs.
Google tries to pick out the best pages using its algorithms but of course SEO 'experts" often manage to get second and third rate pages in their place by mimicking what Google is looking for- mostly using manufactured, back links.
SEO isn't in the interest of good content creators. As long as SEO 'experts' exist though. we are all obliged to waste our time playing the off page SEO game.
Which is another way of saying that SEO experts are merely the newest form of Political Lobbyists. They manipulate the system (lobby) for their own publications to be (sometimes unfairly) placed in the public eye.
Nicely Said Will... Err Paul...
Will, Ok, some people write crap and like their underground burrows! However if you are writing quality articles and want to make a career out of writing what is wrong with promoting your skills. If staying bunkered down in your underground burrows and letting the average and the ordinary lobby for the attention of your intended readers, and ultimately rule the roost, is your idea of a solution you are welcome to it.
If you think you are worthy of attention stand up and be counted. But that’s only my opinion and I appreciate some people write simply for the love of writing. However, if recompense for the hard work, research and penmanship needed to produce a truly useful and meaningful article is important, then a little help isn’t necessarily a bad thing on every occasion.
By the way my name is Peter, great eye for detail!
Sorry about the name detail, Peter but it doesn't change the facts.
SEO probably generates 90 per cent of the webs content. Billions of articles in article directories that are only written for the link they offer. Billions of blog posts written for the same reason. Billions of social media pages Maholo, Xomba etc etc written for no reason except the damn link!
No one would ever read that stuff. No one enjoyed producing it. It is just cyber pollution. And all for the link.
Anyway. I reckon the day of the SEO dinosaurs is over and it is time for the clever little mammals.
Will, my problem with all of this is the fact that you publish articles on HubPages. You obviously don’t have a problem with commerciality because your articles have Adsense switched on. This would also mean, if you are a man of conscience, you have no problems with the search engines themselves, or the fact someone is paying money to you for clicks on those ads in order to promote their content. So why is it ok for you to promote someones content but wrong for me or any other SEO.
Many of those ad accounts will be controlled by SEO's just like me. So on one hand you paint SEO as a plague while the other is stuck out to pick up a few cents for clicks... Sounds like hypocrisy to me.
So I will ask the question again, what will replace SEO? I am more than prepared to discuss any aspect of online marketing but you need to put up realistic arguments based on fact rather than empty sound bites or the way you would personally like the web to be.
I can't believe you are seriously asking what will replace SEO. The real question is what value has offpage SEO ever been? No off page SEO would mean search engines working as they are meant to work. They would find the best page without interference. You need to get out of those trees so that you can see the wood.
I'm interested, How SE's will find good content without SEM/off-page?
What value has SEO ever been? I work for a couple of worthy causes and we have just been appointed as the SEO for a new government backed website to raise awareness of Sudden Unexpected Deaths in Infancy. As well as public and private sector clients we also have partnerships with SME´s and even small mom and pop businesses. The net value to them has been sustained growth through troubled financial times while many of their competitors went under.
I appreciate that you see no value in SEO but there are others who wish to future proof their business and grow. I guess you can’t come up with an answer to my question about what would replace SEO because at the end of the day it was a hollow wish that’s more aligned to your rather insular view of the web rather than reality.
As for the trees, just keep swinging from branch to branch, with luck you might eventually evolve.
The whole role of search engines is to find good content. Offpage SEO is a deliberate attempt to make a page look more valuable to a search engine than it intrinsically is. Offpage SEO is all about undermining search quality.
Google cannot decide if a page is good by reading it. It's a robot it can't understand content. It measures responses that human beings make to a site instead. So if people spend a lot of time on a site that is a tick. If someone links to the site that is a tick. There are about 27 things that Google measures.
Ideally, Google measures what real people do. That way it can find good content.
What SEO 'experts' do is interfere in the process to make it look as if real people are making a lot more positive responses to a site than they really are. Mainly SEO focuses on creating back links. These are entirely fake and try to cheat the search engines and, thus, everyone else who uses the web.
I'm in same line of reasoning like Mikel here. Everyone makes lobby, be it preachy Islamics/Christians, politicians or some another cult. Why leave SEO people alone in this case ? We all make lobby and sell something. We all manipulate each other to stand out. We all manipulate something to show what it's not in order to sell. Manipulation is part of survival. Form a tribe and sell something. Lobbying sells as of now that's why we're here on Hubpages or squidoo.
If you want to kill SEO, you've to kill thinking of lobbying first. Google can't kill it cause it is forming lobby of it's own with opensoical/and many other projects. If they were to kill SEO/SEM why they even bothered to post Google Webmasters SEO Report card ? They're improving search engines to get more human content out of scrapper content and they'll do just that without our help & opinion on "made-for-search engine content".
Google measures only 27 signals??? You are so far off base your not even in this Galaxy anymore! LOL
Google's algorithm relies on links to a web page to locate content. Links from more important pages count for more. But links are only one part of hundreds of signals Google uses.
You are in dying industry, Peter. Why not use your obvious ability to create quality content, instead of just using it to fool search engines into thinking there is quality content?
The truth is Google is getting more and more sophisticated and soon all off page SEO will be valueless. I see very few keyword searches dominated by SEO engineered sites, nowadays.
Where SEO remains important is in site design and content. That kind of SEO should should be renamed 'Making a Worthwhile site".
What content am I promoting in an attempt to fool search engines about its quality? Do you even know who my clients are?
I am in a dying industry, really, have you any idea how much money gets spent on search every year, or whether that spend rising or falling? I would suggest do some research before you call SEO a dying industry.
On another note, there are hundreds of links generated every day to hubs by their authors, as the benefit of these links spread through the site your hubs will also benefit. If you truly see link building as an evil why post your articles here knowing you are benefiting from the link building activities of others? Why not post your articles on a site where no nefarious link building activity goes on. OK nobody will ever read a word that you write but at least you your conscience would be clear.
I've been keeping it simple here because lets face it, its a big subject. Google has its own agenda and off page SEO does not suit it at all. Google makes money from ads. It has driven out affiliate sites with some justification (too many sites and all the same) but it also happens to be great for Adsense.
It will drive out off page SEO for the same reason. Everything is about targeted traffic. Targeted traffic is traffic corralled by Google into the right channels. Second rate sites forced into the faces of information or product searchers by SEO 'experts' undermine the business plan big time. Google needs happy consumers at every step.
I can only direct you to 'Spammy Backlinks;
http://googlewebmastercentral.blogspot. … -spam.html
I did post this link one time before so I hope I don't get hit for spamming.
It is Google's take on back links. Google, unsurprisingly, likes real back links. You could also check out the endless discussions on digitalpoints forums.
The only questions are- is the present Google search engine good enough to sort out the wheat from the chaff? Will the new one (currently being tested) be a real scourge of manufactured back links? When will Google really get it right?
They're doing it very slowly. Especially autoblogs sites like swik or similar auto-content generating sites which offer no value are not getting slapped that fast by google. I just wish site that create subdomain on almost every keyword in niche should get slapped fast cause they appear sometimes in first 3-5 number in results and they offer nothing but affiliate links.
It's a war, skyfire. Google has the money and the motive to win and I reckon it will. I remember when black hat SEO dominated search that is gone now, more or less. Grey hat is next.
Anyway, thanks to you and Peter but it really is time to do some work. Good night.
Will, you have still to explain how the works of an author or the marketing message of a company are to be eyeballed without SEO. Sites like HubPages have been SEO’d from the ground up, from the initial concept throughout site development to the launch and beyond. Had it not, it is unlikely you would be posting your articles here or even know the site existed.
HubPages have created a fantastic platform that gives authors the chance to be read, to earn recognition and to be recompensed for their work. Part of this success lies in the original concept and how HubPages successfully differentiates itself from its online competitors. And I dare say they regularly look at their competitors to ensure they keep their edge. This is all part of the SEO process along with an understanding of analytics and key performance indicators, server technology, copywriting, information architecture etc.
Outside of HubPages where webmasters don’t have the knowledge to put together their own successful blueprint or when a company doesn’t have the required skill set in-house it is often necessary to outsource marketing and SEO requirements. The work professional SEO companies undertake on behalf of clients does not involve spamming blog or forum posts as you attempt to imply. In fact many SEO companies will refuse to work with clients who have used unethical tactics in the past. Similarly anyone thinking of using a SEO company that advocates using forum or blog comments as a link building strategy should drop them ASAP as they clearly don’t have a clue.
You should not confuse SEO with the activities of some marketers who push useless business opportunities or dodgy article spinning software for example. These are areas where no Search Engine Optimizer with any integrity will venture. SEO is a valuable service that can improve lead generation, sales, opt-ins and brand awareness, without it many companies in highly competitive sectors like real estate or finance would simply wither and die.
Thankfully the vast majority of business owners who want to be successful in the long term recognize the importance of SEO as part of a well rounded marketing plan. These are proactive business people who won’t to sit back and let their online competition dominate the biggest and most profitable marketing channel of all time. These are people who realize that by failing to market their products effectively online they would, by lack of action, be contributing to the success of their direct competitors.
SEO is just another form of marketing, you will see much more advertising costs over other overheads in any company, and it's so people find your company, not necessarily the best company.
Will, I am not trying to sell anything. First you hijacked a thread to spout of unrelated garbage (perhaps the question should be what are you trying to sell) then you follow up with even more garbage like SEO is a dying despite the fact that as an industry SEO has grown year on year for the last 10.
Then there was the ridiculous comment that SEO wasn’t in the interest of good content creators, yet in truth the only way to get even the best content found is often through SEO.
And so it goes on 'SEO probably generates 90 per cent of the webs content' where do you get this crap, want to share the toilet you used as a resource on that one!
'There are about 27 things that Google measures.' That really made me laugh, please, please please shares your resource on that one. The number is more likely to be in the hundreds and search engines tend to be very secretive about them. 27?
Then you let loose this gem of understanding 'Mainly SEO focuses on creating back links. These are entirely fake and try to cheat the search engines and, thus, everyone else who uses the web.' Actually no decisions to buy are ever made on a search engine nor is a top search engine ranking a guarantee that the page referred to is a writers masterpiece. It comes down to how well your content works once a visitor gets there, through split testing you can find out exactly what customers want/need and deliver it. I dont see that as fooling anyone, rather it’s delivering the best content to the most relevant readers.
You clearly understand little about the reasons why people would consider SEO, the mechanics of the SEO process or the benefits it can deliver. The ironic thing is, while you continually knock SEO you publish your hubs on a highly optimized site and enjoy the obvious benefits. Your fellow authors are building links that you ultimately benefit from and profit from. And you think It’s me that can’t see the woods for the tees!
If you still have a problem comprehending intent, then you really are dumber than a bag of nuts!
If Will is so set against SEO he can go and buy a domain name and I will host it for free for life. How can I do this you may ask.
Since SEO is so evil and he would never stoop so low as to engage in such a horrible practice I know he will be lucky to get 10 uniques per day, hell I doubt he will get 1 if we are not counting his IP. Thus it won't cost me a dime for monthly bandwidth expenses. He can stand on his soap box there and preach about how evil SEO is to the rare visitor who happens to find him in a sea of billions of web pages.
Please Will stop using HubPages immediately as it is a highly SEO optimized web site and your surely going to burn in AOHell for eternity for being such a hypocrite!
Now go and say 10 Hail Googles and repent my evil son.
I will gladly buy that domain! Drat, invisible man dot com is already taken.
Let's get back to topic guys,personal opinion will lead to nowhere. We all do what we have to do to survive so let's get back to business(whatever that is).
You need to read more carefully,Peter. I was pretty careful in distinguishing between off-site SEO and on-site SEO.
Onsite SEO is not rocket science. Making sure Google can crawl and index a site isn't hard. Learning to use headers properly and laying out content in a search engine friendly way is not tough. You read through Google's webmaster help and forums here: http://www.google.com/webmasters/ and all the information you need is available.
One thing you quickly learn is that the most important thing is to avoid the many techniques SEO experts have developed to cheat search engines. So no invisible text, keyword stuffing etc.
For backlinks half a dozen links from ezine articles, hubs etc to begin with will do the trick if you have chosen the right subject area. By the right subject area I mean something that hasn't already been colonized by big web presences. How do you find these? Read around. Find what will be big in six months or a year- the new technologies,games,fashions etc.
SEO won't help you find these and SEO won't help you break into an already popular area unless you have a lot of money and want to build a very big and high quality site. Even then SEO is only a small part of the process.
ps. I was glad to see you dropped the ad speak in your last post. Buzz words and empty marketing phrases give me a headache.
SEO experts don't use keyword stuffing or invisible text so I guess that leaves only 25 things for Google to measure.
Be honest, you publish articles on HubPages, 114 of them, because they get indexed quickly, rank well and put some money in your pocket - and there’s absolutely nothing wrong with that. But whether you are prepared to admit it or not off page SEO factors, specifically back links, play a major role in making it all possible.
Will, its time to drop the charade and show some moral fiber. Try to regain some credibility man, because up until now you have treated everyone who has read this thread like complete idiots. Nothing you have said about SEO so far has been fair or true yet you have managed to paint a startlingly clear picture for everyone to see of your double standards and hypocrisy.
Ever thought about a career in politics?
Hubpages is a great place for writers. It is the easiest platform to use by a very long way. It has decent quality control of content via hubscores etc and that gives it pull with Google.
The link juice flows freely and a lot of the inlinks will be natural (and therefore valuable) because there are professional, quality writers here.
I'm sure Hubpages have done their SEO work well but I am equally sure it is secondary to the quality of the platform and its ability to attract good content as far as Hubpages success is concerned.
You are right that back links are important but I see no evidence that you are aware of the huge changes in Google's ability to discriminate between spam back links and genuine, natural back links.
Its also worth mentioning that natural back links would be a lot more common and a far more reliable way of gauging the value of a site if SEO 'experts' hadn't convinced huge numbers of people that linking to other sites will harm there site in Google rankings.
The plume of pollution from the lower reaches of the SEO industry spreads far and wide.
I am not suggesting you are one of the lower reaches but I am wondering what you are looking for on Hubpages. Perhaps you should come right out and make your pitch. If it is a good one, I might even be interested myself.
There are cowboys in every industry, SEO is no different. However up until now you have been talking in generalizations and seemed to be painting a picture that all SEO was bad. It is this type of crap that angers me especially when you are directly benefiting from it.
Yes HubPages have done their SEO work well, and along with Hubbers linking to their own hubs you are literally cashing in on this work. Sure there are organic links but I have to tell you and any Hubber who is interested, unless you are writing truly extraordinary hubs organic links take a long time to build.
There are signals that search engines can use to determine the quality of links but there is a lot of link spam that goes undetected. Luckily most of the stuff that goes undetected is low quality and won’t help much anyway.
When you discover obvious spam report it, that’s what I do. Sometimes It’s the only way to get rid of it.
There is no pitch, sorry to disappoint you.
I just wanted to update everyone, we sent the rocket up, Matt Cutts was beheaded, bummer lol the video is up on the ProspectMx website, so for everyone who wants to see Matt Cutt's head rolling around the inside of a rocket, which was named "Spam Blaster" watch the newest video, comment if you will, its worth a lot of words, took 200+ hours of manpower, thousands of dollers regarding rocketry equipment, and all in all, it's hilarious!
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