IDEA: Reward / Penalty model for hub flagging?

1. 86

   kschangposted 14 years ago

   Right now flagging is a purely voluntary activity that relies on the altruism of members.
   
   What if we make it reward / penalty based instead?
   
   If you flag properly (i.e. HP staff agrees), you are allowed to flag more, and get a temporary hubscore boost
   
   If you did NOT flag properly (i.e. HP staff disagrees), you are allowed to flag LESS, and you take a temporary hubscore hit
   
   Your flagging history is only visible to you (and HP staff) so you can adjust your flagging patterns.
   
   Comments?
   
   (thanks to Yahoo! Answers and hubber pcunix for inspiration)

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   1. 59

      Pageliftposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      I kind of really like this idea; something similar passed through my head as well.
      
      Sometimes I ask myself if I'm flagging articles for the right reason, and based off of this system, I know what has been flagged as inappropriate in the past, so I can continue to help better the community.
      
      Great suggestion, keep pushing this. I'd like to see it become a reality in the future.

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2. 67

   simeonvisserposted 14 years ago

   If you did not flag properly, it could also be that HubPages TOS was not clear enough or that you misunderstood it, not necessarily out of ill will.
   
   Accolades could be introduced to reward people. I think that will prove to be a greater incentive than a small yes / no in your account settings.

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   1. 86

      kschangposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Ditto, but then without feedback from HP you wouldn't know whether the flag is right or wrong. So you're basically doing things at random. Eh?

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3. 67

   relacheposted 14 years ago

   There already exists an Accolade that is given for this,
   
   "Great HubPages Citizen: contributes to the community by helping our new users in the Forums, voting and/or flagging inappropriate content for our moderators."
   
   
   I think getting Hubscore boosts for flagging is one of the worst ideas I've ever heard, and would create all manner of abuses.

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   1. 86

      kschangposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      What else would you recommend as a reward? 
      
      Did I miss something? Is there some practical significance to hubscore other than the 75 / nofollow threshold? My idea was a temporary boost, maybe 5-10 points for 48-72 hours.

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4. 81

   MyWebsposted 14 years ago

   "Your flagging history is only visible to you (and HP staff) so you can adjust your flagging patterns."
   
   I think making your flagging history available is a great idea so we all know where we are getting it right, and wrong. Maybe a simple "Agree" or "Disagree" would show up beside each flagged item once staff makes their decision. Maybe an optional note they could also add to further communicate if they feel the need.
   
   Tying it directly to hub score is a bad idea. Maybe a separate Flag score possibly. Really I'd much rather know where I was doing good than have another score.

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   1. 77

      wildernessposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      I agree.  The only method we have now is to go back and check and I flag far too many for that to work.
      
      It would be nice to have feedback on how we're doing.

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5. 62

   Lisa HWposted 14 years ago

   I don't think too many Hubbers (most of whom already flag when they see fit), are all that interested in getting all into a "tattletale"/"brownie points"/"score" kind of mentality, especially on something like flagging (which, after all, isn't why most people come to a site like this, and is only part of what most think is "doing something a extra on the side".  Besides, most people (or at least a whole lot of them) will tell you they plain, old, don't care about HubScores.

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6. 67

   Adroit Alienposted 14 years ago

   Those who are looking to boost their hubscore will most likely consist of new users or spammers.
   
   I can see it now. The Hubpage staff gets hit with a mountain of flags that they have to sort through. Now have become human versions of akismet. I see it as a huge waste of manpower.
   
   Flagging is like a 9-1-1 call. Lets not turn in into babysitting for the staff.
   
   edit: shouldn't this be posted in the suggestion forum?

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   1. 86

      kschangposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      Want to see if any one else think about what should be reward / punishment model itself.
      
      Newbies would be limited in the amount of flags they can make. So the spam is self-limiting. And if they spam enough their quota would be reduced.
      
      (As an example, in Yahoo Answers, newbies start at level 1, can only post X questions and answers every 24 hours, and asking questions cost points, which they have limited amount of. Only when they participated and gotten some "best answers" will they get enough points to ask more questions)

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      1. 67

         Adroit Alienposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         I don't think there's a need for a new system.
         
         After getting above 75, there really isn't any incentives to go higher.
         
         
         As someone mentioned earlier, there's already a reward for this (accolade).
         
         Your system will create a higher demand for newbies and spammers to flag while hubbers with 75+ score see no real incentive.
         
         If anything, it will deter 75+ hubbers from flagging since they have everything to lose and nothing to gain. Example: an 80 hubber is practically the same as a 75 hubber. While a 70 hubber only needs 5 points to get dofollow backlinks.
         
         
         In the meantime, newbies and spammers will flag and likely false-flag until their quota is reached. Even if their quota is 1 per day. That may mean 100 false-flags the staff have to sort if 100 spammers want that 5 points.
         
         Your system can be easily gamed. This is not saying the current system is perfect. Just better.

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         1. 86

            kschangposted 14 years agoin reply to this

            You did not propose any new rewards / punishment, but then you argue that based on the EXISTING reward/punishment, the idea is not workable. Thus, you're not helping at all.

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            1. 67

               Adroit Alienposted 14 years agoin reply to this

               I'm not the only one...
               
               You asked for comments.
               
               
               
               Personally, if I were to introduce a change, I would just punish false-flaggers. The current system doesn't do that and that is a potential exploit. I would keep the reward the same(accolade).
               
               Punishing false-flaggers will reduce abuse. Example: Vendetta flagging.
               
               
               You are putting words in my mouth. I didn't say the current system is not "workable." I said it isn't "perfect." It is working fine.
               
               Please don't misquote me again.

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               1. 67

                  relacheposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                  You don't seem to understand how the flagging system works based on the comments you just made.  When site users flag a Hub it merely brings that Hub to the attention of the admin team.  A lot of flags makes it rise to the top of their action list faster.  If a Hub gets unpublished, it's because the moderators have found it in some way to be in violation of the site terms of use.  Vendetta flagging as an action can't exist because if there's nothing genuinely wrong with the Hub being flagged then no action is taken against it.

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                  1. 67

                     Adroit Alienposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                     I take back "vendetta flagging".
                     
                     No actions may be taken but mods still have to sort through the top flags wasting time for false-flags. It is possible to create multiple accounts, mask ip's and game the system. It may even be done from ignorance by people not familiar with the TOS.
                     
                     Based on the comment I made, the point was not to reward flagging.
                     
                     People still sort through spam even if no action is taken. It doesn't matter if hubpages use a "popular vote" style system. Each vote(flag) is still counted and if they decide no action is taken, then in my opinion, that's time is wasted.

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                     1. 86

                        kschangposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                        Your argument was basically NOT to reward flagging because... false-flagging (flagged hub deserved no action) is a waste of moderator's time.
                        
                        But flagging is NOT false-flagging. That would be a strawman. 
                        
                        And wouldn't a reward / punishment model punish those false-flagging the wrong hubs, while encouraging more people to flag the truly substandard hubs?

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                        1. 67

                           Adroit Alienposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                           1. If you bothered to read, I told Relache that I took it back.
                           2. I never said flagging is false-flagging. THAT is a strawman. Again, READ.
                           3. I've already explained why your system is inferior to the current system.
                           4. I was never for a reward/punishment system. Just punishment(unless you consider accolades rewards. I don't)
                           5. This is your thread. Not mine. Your idea stinks.

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                           1. 86

                              kschangposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                              1) You said you took back "vendetta flagging" argument. You didn't say about the rest.
                              
                              2) You wrote "No actions may be taken but mods still have to sort through the top flags wasting time for false-flags. "  So you are indeed arguing that flagging is false-flagging, unless you want to take that back too.
                              
                              3) You explained it with a strawman, see above.
                              
                              4) So you do agree that the present system (no accolade, no reward) needs change? (as for change to what is up to debate)
                              
                              5) Yet you agreed half-way. Hmmm... 

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                              1. 67

                                 Adroit Alienposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                                 1. Then why did you bring it up?
                                 2. so?
                                 3. no
                                 4. no
                                 5. no
                                 6. Your idea STILL stinks
                                 7. hmmmmm........

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                                 1. 67

                                    Adroit Alienposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                                    did I mention it still stinks? Yes, this is redundant but you don't seem to take feedback very well so I thought I'd mention it again.
                                    
                                    
                                    ps. your idea stinks.

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                                 2. 86

                                    kschangposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                                    Nope, you said part of it stinks.

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                                    1. 67

                                       Adroit Alienposted 14 years agoin reply to this

                                       Then I was foolishly mistaken. It stinks.

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7. 60

   Randy Godwinposted 14 years ago

   What's that smell? 

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   1. 67

      Mishaposted 14 years agoin reply to this

      burning flesh...

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      1. 86

         kschangposted 14 years agoin reply to this

         Sunburn, actually. AA and I are joshing each other.

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8. 66

   SandyMcCollumposted 14 years ago

   So what about ppl who never flag? Will their score go slowly down because they don't participate in that?
   
   I am not into a site that scores me on the basis of flagging the work of other writers. I participate but, I think it will cause argument and fire between the users and I do believe it can be gamed. As long as ppl stick to the rules the way they are, it should be good enough.

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9. 59

   Vala Fayeposted 14 years ago

   How about the most helpful people get extra media exposure on who they are as writers?

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