Metaphysics - ?!

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   Leptirelaposted 13 years ago

   Is it just me, or is anyone else having trouble to get deeper understaing of Metaphysics?! I have read some pieces of writing where this was applied and have been told I write in this form, yet I didn't know this myself! Any views?!

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      (Q)posted 13 years agoin reply to this

      If you have been told you write in this form, it may be such that those critiques were suggesting you write in regards to trying to understand the world around us in a philosophical nature as opposed from a physical position.

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      qwarkposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      ...get busy and study the metaphysical treatises of Aristotle.
      It isn't easy reading but he coined the phrase 'First Philosophy."

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         Leptirelaposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         

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            Jean Bakulaposted 12 years agoin reply to this

            Meta means to go beyond. So the study of Metaphysics is when you attempt to find out the true meaning that lies behind a certain way of thinking, such as a philosophy. Or what are religious texts REALLY trying to say? There is an esoteric meaning, the one you take at face value. Then there is the exoteric one, the more complex meaning hidden in an allegory or which you will understand after meditation.

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   Website Examinerposted 13 years ago

   Metaphysics is a philosophical concept, rooted in ancient Greece. It has to do with phenomena that lay outside the realm of physics.

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   Hauntyposted 13 years ago

   The writing of René Guénon may shed some light on metaphysics for you. But don't expect an easy read.

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      Leptirelaposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Thanks y'all, Ok... thing is i still dont understand the depth of it... knowing its philosophycal hits me harder...I'm going to do more research on this actually... hmm...
      
      @ Haunty , your absolutely right... it is not an easy read  at all....  this is what am trying to say,,,,is it purposelly difficult....?!

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         Leptirelaposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         I think its simple for us to say WHAT METAPHYSICS IS ...But the truly understand the underlaying ......thats what I'm really after...

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            psycheskinnerposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            That is a bit like saying "I don't understand psychology" or "I don't understand biology".  There is no one basis or underlying theory.  It is an area of study, with a lot of different componants.  If you think there is more to the world than science can explain, this is the study of what that "more" might be.  That is really all there is to it.

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   raisingmeposted 13 years ago

   meta:  later, behind; beyond, transcending, encompassing; change, transformation; higher, more developed
   
   comes from Greek/Indo European - after/beyond
   
   physics: the scientific study of matter, energy, force and motion and the way they relate to each other
   
   the physical processes, interactions, qualities, properties or behaviour of something
   
   comes from Latin/Greek - of nature
   
   metaphysics - the branch of philosophy concerned with the study of nature,of being and beings; existence, time, space and causality.
   
   Spirit is non physical, mind is non physical and yet both influence the physical universe.  It is a simple concept which many have devoted life times to complicating

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   luvpassionposted 13 years ago

   When contemplating the metaphysical world, You must be willing to let anything and everything dissolve and go into a state of flux.
   
   Any attachments to beliefs, desires or fears will subtly dissolve and reform as the subtle understanding and awareness grows within your mind.
   
   Beliefs such as "I am a person and I am living my life in the world" are particularly prevalent and confining, so too are attachments to possessions, pleasures and motives. Any attachment leads to rigidity in the mind because certain ideas become fixed, and these rigid concepts reinforce each other and collectively resist change.
   
   This can lock you into a particular paradigm or world-view and prevent you from experiences others. If followed with earnestness and perseverance studying the metaphysical world can gradually soften these rigid conceptual structures and make your mind more flexible.

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   liberposted 13 years ago

   Metaphysics means above or before physics.  So it's supposed to be a study of truths that proceed the truths of the sciences.
   
   An example might be the study of existence.  What exists?  Things with mass exist.  What about ideas?  Concepts like "evil" or "just".  Do they exist?
   
   This is a question that cannot be answered using the scientific method, in a sense it proceeds science.

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      luvpassionposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Science, I believe, is the search for explaining new mysteries rather than the cataloguing of old facts and concepts.
      
      The first philosophy (Metaphysics) is universal and is exclusively concerned with primary substance. ... And here we will have the science to study that which is just as that which is, both in its essence and in the properties which, just as a thing that is, it has. (Aristotle, 340BC)
      
      Thus at the heart of Metaphysics is Substance and its Properties, which exists and causes all things, and is therefore the necessary foundation for all human knowledge. Most importantly, Aristotle was correct to realize that One Substance must have Properties that account for matter's interconnected activity and Motion.

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         Leptirelaposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Thank you all for going deeper into this, see this is much better to understand , I have read each and every one of your insights into this and to be honest your all much easier to understand than the likes of others who actually stand for Metaphysics!! ..... thank you!!
         
         It is still something that's just neverending!

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         (Q)posted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Science is a method for understanding the physical world around us. Physics is the area of study in this regard.
         
         
         
         What does "Substance and its Properties" mean? I have no idea what you're talking about here.

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            Leptirelaposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            I have no idea what am trying to say either when question of Metaphysics, am still very confused about it .... truthfully.!
            
            if you know better.... write a sentence of fiction.... where you use an example of metaphysics...

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               (Q)posted 13 years agoin reply to this

               Physics: Gravity is indistinguishable from acceleration.
               
               Metaphysics: God made gravity to keep things on earth.

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   alternate poetposted 13 years ago

   I don't know if the person who said this to you meant metaphysical - your writing can't be simply that, you can be writing about metaphysical things. 
   
   The metaphysical poets wrote about things that are not concrete - abstract things - they were also Romantic era, meaning that they saw what they wanted to see and ignored the reality that was before their eyes.

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   Website Examinerposted 13 years ago

   Just for your information, the thread was moved from "help" to "philosophy," which made some of the deep thinkers come on board.

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   Shadesbreathposted 13 years ago

   Metaphysics is ontological (that's actually redundant); it's the investigation of what "is" or "is not."  Evaluating metaphysics is done through epistemology.  Sometimes the two get confused.  The former attempts to determine what we know.  The latter examines how we know it. Exploring both helps refine either.

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      Leptirelaposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Hmm,,,,, thank you ALL for sharing your views on this with me.
      
      @alternate poet I think what you say makes sense, I may have been writing about metaphysical things, I believe I would have known if I intentionally did this, hmm....
      
      I understand much  better now, though I thought it was completely something different I guess I dint understand it all... But I thought metaphysics was beyond what you see, in simple words it is...but as for my writing or my poetry Its just the way I write and I had no considerations when I began to write... maybe they dont make sense to anyone else, my poems and pieces ...maybe this is where confusin began lol...

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    2befreeposted 13 years ago

    Very interesting and thought-provoking topic.  The first thing I thought of was the term "metaphysical" as used in Mary Baker Eddy's writing, "Science and Health with Key to the Scriptures."  She deeply explores this topic as related to God and man.  I wouldn't call myself religious, as much as spiritual because I don't have any rituals, but try and think of myself as not just a physical being, but a spiritual one with no bounds or limits.

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       Leptirelaposted 13 years agoin reply to this

       2befree - thank you

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    rebekahELLEposted 13 years ago

    a few metaphysical writers are Henry David Thoreau, Ralph Waldo Emerson, Rilke, Walt Whitman. have you read Walden? these are some of the best.

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       Leptirelaposted 13 years agoin reply to this

       Thank you I will keep this list for my research

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          rebekahELLEposted 13 years agoin reply to this

          here is a decent article about Rilke's style. The sample poem is a perfect example.
          http://harpers.org/archive/2009/08/hbc-90005586

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             Leptirelaposted 13 years agoin reply to this

             thank you

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             Leptirelaposted 12 years agoin reply to this

             rebekahELLE thank you the poem is perfect for an example
             some of my work is similar and it is exactly this I want TO USE IN ANY OF MY WRITING PARTS..
             
             Something to think about rather than a siple few lines anyone would know
             I have no particular reason for this I guess its just me.

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    liberposted 13 years ago

    I thought of another good example for you.  A question like "are we in a computer simulation right now?" would be metaphysical.  It's not a scientific question since it's not falsifiable.  You can't run experiments to determine if it's true.
    
    A lot of metaphysics is a pointless waste of time, as above: maybe we are living in a computer simulation, of course maybe we're just the dream of a unicorn living on Venus, it could be anything.  There's no real reason to believe it or even think it's important.

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       Leptirelaposted 13 years agoin reply to this

       Ok... I see your point liber,..In fact I understand it a whole lot better now!!...
       But, why do you think a lot of Metahphysics is pointless ?!(you don't have to answer , but I'd be interested)

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          liberposted 13 years agoin reply to this

          There are metaphysical questions I am dying to know.  I always say, if I somehow find myself face to face with God in this life or the next, the first thing I'll ask him (or her) is "why is there something rather than nothing?"  It's something I ponder every once and a while, the more you think about it, the more you would expect there to be nothing rather than something.  That seems...more natural.  More probable.
          
          Anyways that's probably the ultimate metaphysical question, it's something I'm dying to know, but it's unanswerable.  And not even because I'm not smart enough to discover the answer (well that's certainly true), but because there is literally no techniques available to figure it out.  There's no experiments you could run or sequence of logic you could run.  It's like trying to solve a math problem when math doesn't exist.
          
          So metaphysical questions, while interesting, are usually unanswerable.  In Karl Popper's language they are unfalsifiable.  When you have positivist leanings like me (ie, belief in science as the most viable way to the truth) this is sort of a no-no to begin with.
          
          In the western tradition of philosophy metaphysics has been a dismal failure for exactly that reason.  No metaphysician has any better way to demonstrate his claim than any other, so it's a dance without an end -- and after a while it seems like a dance without a point.
          
          In the beginning of the twentieth century a lot of philosophers began coming to the conclusion that metaphysics wasn't only impossible, it was literally nonsensical.  To these philosophers (like Wittgenstein) the questions asked by metaphysics are neither right nor wrong, in fact they have no truth value, they are literal nonsense, or gibberish.  I'm not sure I would go that far, but they kind of had a point.
          
          Metaphysics is a project that began some two thousand years ago in Greece, since that time it hasn't gained an inch in any direction, I doubt it ever will.
          
          Anyways, hope I didn't talk your ear off.  Don't worry about not understanding metaphysics, it's very understandable, I don't think anyone really understands what it's supposed to be.

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             Leptirelaposted 13 years agoin reply to this

             Well, thank you!! (I have big ears)
             
             Going back to  your point 'at the begin. of thwentieth century...' Just because 'a lot of' philosophers believed meataphysics was impossible or non sensical doesn't rule out its existence and certainly till this day I'm certain there are those who understand it and believe in it whether having proof of 'anything' or not....
             
             I think Metaphysics is similar to religion (in a way- this is my personal view) as far as I think I understand, Its a matter of belief.... faith....and the spirit of it... its whats beyond....believing its there without needing proof...and just because majority of us (hardly mention it never mind practice it) its possible its ruled out and 'nonsensical' because only a few follow.... !!!! I don't know . But I feel I have a much better of understanding---The person (who is now a friend ) said to me.... your poem is metaphysical... ,,, This is what confused me, because at the time of writing it I did not have metaphysics in mind, however months back I did some research on it for antother 'assignment' ... and maybe I picked up unaware0ly (if that's a word)...bit of it... it is rather difficult to put it all together to gain a better understanding but maybe its that as such for us to individually have our own understanding.... I dont know...Im trailing off and doubt much that am making sense....I need to look into this!!! AGAIN! its neverending...

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                liberposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                I've been burn't too many times by leaps of faith and I've become weary of them.
                
                Ordinarily I object to the idea of people taking things on faith --  it's folly in my opinion -- but you seem like an honest and inquisitive sort, I'm sure you can sort things out for yourself on your own path.
                
                Good luck to you then.

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                   Leptirelaposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                   heh , sounds like you know me already
                   
                   No, I understand a lot of people don't depend or believe faith to be a good thing in our lives but each one is different and what would we be like if we were all the same??! ... so I respect you on that especially if as you say you have been burnt , usually (at this point) I would say something like 'have faith' 'dont lose hope' ... but what you said about working things out for myself on my own path... you are most probably right there

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       Leptirelaposted 13 years agoin reply to this

       But , overall .... I do believe it is important --- metaphysics I have not figured how or why, but I WILL!!

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    Chasukposted 12 years ago

    This question is almost impossible to answer.
    
    Your metaphysics might be my hokum. Many of us try to gain knowledge concerning the fundamentals of being and knowing, but separating the snake oil from the omega-3 eludes us for a lifetime.
    
    I'm not saying give up, but I am saying proceed with caution.
    
    Learn to recognize logical fallacies.
    
    A popular lie is still a lie.

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       Leptirelaposted 12 years agoin reply to this

       Thank you Chasuk
       I have done enough research and now recognize the differences or .. . know what is needed to carry on with the writing style am always writing in.
       
       It was never a choice it was merely a few comments made on style of my writing I guess am happy with it now. Though I may find it difficult to portray anything to my first readers.

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