Why am I not eligible for Hubpages Ad Program?

1. 89

   Mrs. Menagerieposted 13 years ago

   Did I do something wrong?  Why do I get this message?
   
   "You are not currently elgible to enroll in the HubPages Ad Program."

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      ryankettposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      In answer to your question, the program is currently still in BETA stage, it is a brand new thing on Hubpages.
      
      But don't worry, everybody will be in by June

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   2. 61

      Randy Godwinposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Because like many of us longtime loyal users, you were not  somewhat randomly selected to participate in the program.  Most of those who consider the program introduced fairly were those who were admitted.  It was handled quite badly by HP staff in my opinion, but then, I'm not surprised by the goings on here any longer.  Especially after seeing some of the hubs allowed to remain on this site.
      
      I disagree about why some are removing some of their content from HP.  I intend to be as loyal to HP as they are to me.  I don't see how they could expect anything else from its members. 

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         ryankettposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         That isn't an answer to her question though is it? The one in which she asks why SHE isn't in the program?
         
         To which the answer, to an 11 day old member, is that the program won't be open to the entire community until June?
         
         Your own opinion about whether or not you should have been invited, or whether it was handled badly (an opinion which you are 100% entitled to and 100% entitled to voice publicly I must add) has very little relevance to somebody who joined the site 5 days after the first and last wave of invites were handed out.

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            Randy Godwinposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Yes, just my opinion, Ryan.  I suppose staff considered the way it would be introduced and thought it would be fine to promote some members over others and announce this to the members.  The fact they did so in such a manner lets me know they aren't very savvy about community harmony.
            
            They could have kept the program quiet until the testing was done as we had no need of knowing how good or bad the admitted members were doing with the new program.  Simply telling those selected they would lose the account if they made waves about it publicly would have kept most of them quiet.
            
            The results and data would be collected just the same and partisanship, unless you think there was none at all, would have been avoided.  I could have almost predicted which hubbers would be somewhat randomly selected.  And who would not, for that matter!  Sorry, it was handled badly! 

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            1. 70

               Vicki.Pierceposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               I hate to admit that I have been discouraged with hubpages and really have not been motivated to continue writing since I have heard about this. 
               
               I originally started writing so I would have a place for my customers to go on the internet to find good answers about parrots.  Not sure if I will continue writing here or not. 

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                  Randy Godwinposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  You aren't alone in feeling this way, Vicky.  Many members have been hurt by the way this was handled but are afraid to post their feelings here. 
                  
                  I volunteered to speak for some when we discussed the terrible way the program was introduced.  We knew those "selected" would see no impartiality to the program and this has been clearly evidenced here on the forums.
                  
                  But I am immune to the "sour grapes," "green with envy,"  "childish attitude," "for your own good," etc, posts expected by anyone protesting the way the program was implemented.  I've seen this same type of thing on other sites and it's always the same result.  Disharmony among the members and distrust of the site staff is always the ultimate outcome. 

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      2. 87

         Marisa Wrightposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         I wasn't one of the first and I considered it fair. As Ryan said, the Beta users had to endure the bugs as well as the benefits.
         
         And if you read some of the threads, you'll see some people din't even get any benefit. Some people found they just lost an equivalent amount of Adsense income, so they were no better off. 
         
         That's why you do testing.  I'm guessing also that there's a certain amount of administration in setting up new members of the ad program, and that's another reason to do people in blocks.

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            Randy Godwinposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            I would have considered it fair if those chosen were not identified, Marisa.  As you stated, the results are mixed.  So what benefit is this to those not chosen?  Being told it may or may not make a difference is no big advantage for us, is it?
            
            What difference would it make if we didn't know the pros and cons before being allowed to participate?  We still have no idea whether it will benefit us or not, do we? 

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            1. 63

               WoodsmensPostposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               They can fill the whole hub with ads It doesn't exclude the fact that hubbers are pulling their hubs whether excepted to the new ad program or not, the core of the problem is a much bigger picture.

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                  Randy Godwinposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  Some are too blind to see or simply do not want to!  Ye gods! 

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                  ryankettposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  Everybody can see why people are pulling their hubs. I know why, the question is do you?
                  
                  Why are they pulling their hubs?

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                  1. 63

                     WoodsmensPostposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                     ryan you are to funny... read the forums once in awhile will you lol its surely not because of not being added to a new advertising concept on their pages.
                     
                     Peace Hubber Peace

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                        ryankettposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                        I do read the forums, as you are well aware.
                        
                        Hubbers are removing content because of the Google algorithm change, which affected content farms, they now see it as potentially more valuable on their own domains.
                        
                        That is all, no big conspiracy, the sales pages have tanked, they think that they can win more traffic on a domain which is not damaged by association.
                        
                        My personal belief is that this is a rash decision, less than 4 weeks since the slap, and as such I am keeping most of mine precisely where it is.
                        
                        If you see any other reason then feel free to let me know.

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   3. 81

      ngurecoposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Perhaps you would have liked it if it stated something like this:
      
      "You are not currently eligible to enroll in BETA TESTING HubPages Ad Program."

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   4. 64

      2uesdayposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      You are getting the standard message that people like me and others who were not in the test group or first batch get. I know because they put it in the position of the Amazon link and did not notice the first time after the 'roll out'.
      
      BTW. If I am due to be in the next batch then I am happy to give up my place to someone in a desperate hurry to board the HubPages Ad Program express. Anyway if someone uses this site for their income and has been here longer than me I am happy to wait until June.
      
      As a gardener I am use to things taking time to grow, nothing decent grows over night and gardening is about trial and error with a sprinkling of patience.

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         Randy Godwinposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         I'm a farmer, which is just a gardener on a much larger scale.  Imagine my patience and you will perhaps understand why this isn't about waiting for the program at all.  Gee, to be considered writers, some of you guys have a hard time reading and understanding posts on these forums.

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            ryankettposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            I'm a farmer too!*
            
            
            
            
            
            
            
            
            
            
            
            
            
            
            
            
            
            
            
            *on Facebook

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               Randy Godwinposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                 I have absolutely no doubt of that, Ryan!  "That you sow, you will also reap."  Not true of course, even if it is in the babble.  Any farmer worth his salt will tell you a drought will prohibit any "reaping" at the end of the growing season.  We have a drought now, even though some are provided with extra water rights. 
               
               But those who see their hard earned crops dry up, while those with plenty of water have abundant profits on their produce and find the system equitable, should just keep silent or be accused of "having a chip on their shoulder" or some other such nonsense as seen here on the forums.

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                  BRIAN SLATERposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  Farmers are either complaining there is too much rain or that there isn't enough. They just find something to moan about.

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                     Randy Godwinposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                     I'm sure you are well acquainted with most of us farmers here in the US.  We now have irrigated and scientifically drained fields which will handle either drought or floods.  We generally plow under much more food than is actually harvested in many cases.
                     
                     But the way the food supply is manipulated by those buying our food means the consumer pays much more for the food than they should and the farmer makes much less profit.  There may be a comparison to this situation after all.    How long have you farmed, Bryan? 

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            2. 74

               Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                
               
               I cant even do that right -my corn all withered ,farm hands buggared off.
               
               So I sold my farm to China everything appears to be made there now anyways!

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      2. 89

         Mrs. Menagerieposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         An excellent point about "things taking time to grow."  I like that.

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2. 70

   Cagsilposted 13 years ago

   I'm not eligible for the Hubpages Ad Program either. It is still presently being rolled out to members and it's on invitation only.

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3. 63

   WoodsmensPostposted 13 years ago

   It's to bad too. Many have started deleting hubs and taking content down. Much of the rubbing in of the income some hubbers claim to be making has left a bad taste in some hubbers pockets. Some were hurt more than others and some will leave for good.
   
   Invitation only? Thats a nice way of saying we don't need your work yet not even if you give us 40% of what you make. Some will never come back its a shame.
   
   March madness at its finest.

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      Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Hey Woodsmenspost, it's by invitation only, because Hubpages is still working out the kinks.
      
      Staff/Admin/Owners have already stated that all members will be in it eventually. They are striving for June to have all members enrolled in the program. However, if writers choose not to participate, then that is their choice.
      
      As for the 40%? Hubpages only displays the Hubpages Ad Program on their individual impressions. The ads are not on your hub during your 60% of impressions.

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         WoodsmensPostposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Exactly, Thanks for stating the obvious.  Anyone who doesn't have the invitation is free to take down their work. But when you see some long time hubbers bailing out much of their quality hubs ( I won't state names) then the core of the problem may be a little deeper than you would like to admit.

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            ryankettposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            They are not taking down Hubpages because they haven't had an invite.
            
            They are taking down sales pages because they no longer win much traffic.
            
            Many of the people taking down sales pages ARE members of the ad program. They don't necessarily subscribe to the same chain of thought as you.
            
            In fact, I have taken down 33, will be taking down another 20, I am a happy member of the ad program.

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            Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            That would premature and foolish.
            No it's not deeper than I would like to admit. I'm sorry if people feel left out of the program, however, as Ryankett already stated, it's still in testing. If people feel inclined to take down their work, because they feel that they have been neglected in some manner, then I would say to those people, to get a grip and get over themselves.
            
            Staff has already admitted that it would be rolled out to everyone, yet people are not paying attention to that and feeling self-absorbed and sorry for themselves, because they were not invited as of yet.
            
            So please.
            
            @EK, that statement is just down right demeaning to Staff. And, totally uncalled for.

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               ryankettposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               Don't think that was Sophie, unless she deleted the post?
               
               EDIT: OK, your edit crossed

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                  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  I know Ryan, I edited the post.

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                  Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  Cags, my opinion is mean ? lol  your funny.
                  
                  I just happen to think a few more staff would help.
                  
                  Ya just canthave it both ways. I also accept their decisions.
                  
                  Its not complaining by the way if people express a different opinion Cags.
                  
                  Guess its all a matter of perspective.
                  
                  Gimme a break guys ,its not like your family .

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         3. 87

            Marisa Wrightposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            WoodsmenPost, you're conflating two things.  Hubbers are not "bailing out their quality Hubs" because of the ad program. They're bailing out Hubs which, in their opinion, no longer suit Google's new algorithm.
            
            HP is rolling out a new program cautiously.  What part of that sentence don't you understand?  They're being totally open about that, not keeping it a secret. 
            
            I wasn't in the first group of invitees but I didn't get my knickers in a knot over it.  It wasn't a personal insult, just part of the process.  I've just signed up now.  Your turn will come.

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               WoodsmensPostposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               WHo said I was or wasn't part of the new program? LOL whatever Marisa read the posts. It was in response to something Cags had stated.

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                  Marisa Wrightposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  All 5 pages?  I did skim, must have missed something.
                  
                  Sounds like you're a real man of principle, being a member of an ad program you think is unfair.

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                     WoodsmensPostposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                     I never said the program was unfair deary

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      ryankettposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      It is still in BETA stage, every major website on the net runs BETA testing on major developments.
      
      Testing with 9 hubbers is not sufficient to then invite 200,000 people overnight. That could mean major problems. In fact, we have already seen a Trojan attack.
      
      Would you accept medication which had been tested on just 9 people? Or would you expect it to undergo numerous tests before being available to the wider market?
      
      That is an extreme example, but the first 9 to test a new medicine are brave. The next 500 to test that medicine are almost as brave. Invitation to the Ad Program came with no guarentee of increased earnings, if I were seeing a $1 CPM like some members then I would have seen a big decrease in earnings; I accepted the invitation with excitement but with an open mind as to the results. It was 50/50 with me, it would either increase my earnings or decrease my earnings. And, in fact, some users are saying that the program isn't really benefiting them.
      
      I have been one of those to make public my happiness with my HubAd earning levels. If people are considering leaving as a result of decreased earnings, do you think that they would be more likely or less likely to leave if they knew that in two and a half months they could see their earnings rise again?
      
      If members were to tell everybody that the program is rubbish, would people be feeling left out? In my opinion there are three emotions that non-members can be feeling:
      
      1) Excitement about the ad program
      2) Jealousy of the HubAd members
      3) No feelings whatsoever towards it, because they don't care about the money
      
      Ultimately, they can choose which one they subscribe to, those who choose number 2 could easily choose number 1 like many others.

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         Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         I choose #1, and don't subscribe to #2.

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         ryankettposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Despite running AVG, one of those Trojans actually penetrated my computer too. I lost about a thousand photos, many of which are hopefully saved on an external drive somewhere.
         
         So whilst some of you moan about having to wait a couple of months for Hubpages to pay you a few more dollars, it may be worth considering that I haven't yet once moaned about the loss of memories which have arisen through this ad program.
         
         Change what you can change and don't worry about things that you can't, that is my motto. I can't change the fact that I lost some memories, but I can change the number of external drives that I own.
         
         You can play a bitter blame game, or you can chill the f*ck out, the second will see you become happier.

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            Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Hey Ryan, I am also running AVG and my virus shield held up. Hmmm...a little strange.

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               ryankettposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               It caught the first 29
               
               Must have been a new one or something, which they hadn't added to an update.

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                  Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  

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                     ThomasEposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                     I'd run your AVG again, I have just updated it, and 2 of the dratted things have penetrated.

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                        ryankettposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                        My was found retrospectively too. I hadn't perused any adult sites or used any torrents between by last AVG search and the virus playing tricks, hence the reason that I know it was a Hubpages virus

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                           ThomasEposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                           I have a very boring life... no adult sites or torrents used at all in the last six months.
                           
                           Woe, woe is me

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                              ryankettposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                              I actually recently felt a small degree of guilt at the use of torrents and banned myself from using them.
                              
                              Now that a virus has made my music collection somehow dissapear, I have changed my mind
                              
                              As for the adult content, that is just an addiction

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                              Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                              I use my torrent everyday and have no problems.

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                        Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                        Hey Thomas, my AVG is updated automatically and scans every morning. Sorry to report, nothing happened or got through my virus shield.

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      3. 60

         lyndreposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         I am a #3.
         But for other hubbers I would be a #1
         
         To still have a platform like hubpages, I hope the new ad program is a success for all the hubbers trying it out. As without the commercial side hubpages would cease to be here.It is afterall first and foremost a business.

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         KCC Big Countryposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         What a great response!

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   3. 74

      Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      You gotta point.
      
      And for all the people who feel sorry for HP staff who are small in number ,yet boast a membership of over 2,000 seems crazy or greedy.
      Just my opinion.

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         ryankettposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Hubpages had only just reached "profitability" before the algorithm change, so I doubt that they could afford too many more staff, or are you saying something different? Apparently Squidoo only have 6 staff!

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            Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Ok but doesnt a company (offline) naturaly increase staff as numbers (production) increases.
            
            I wasnt being personal ,just a logical observation in general.

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               Randy Godwinposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               Not necessarily, EK!  The profit margin is higher with less employees to pay if a company can get by with it.  Getting non-paid volunteers to glean the chaff from the wheat costs them nothing.  Even though known chaff is allowed to remain if it earns the site a significant amount of money. 
               
               What a conundrum to face by HP staff.  And still unaddressed by a staff spokesperson at this point despite many mentions of the articles in the forums.  Yes, we should trust their judgment implicitly. 

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               ryankettposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               It may have just been an observation, but it wasn't a very accurate one, I have perhaps been observing a little more closely. When I started publishing 20 months ago they had 7 members of staff, when I visited Hubpages HQ at the beginning of February they had 25.
               
               That is 19 more than Squidoo, who are near them in the Alexa rankings and have more pages of content. That is an increase of 357% in 20 months (far larger than the growth of the site).
               
               Now, if you said that they "need another Maddie" then I would agree 100%. But, Maddie herself has already said that they need more 'Maddies' and more 'Norahs'.
               
               I suspect that this site saw a huge fall in revenue on 24th February, like we all did. Would could hazard a guess that their recent "profitability" became "non-profitability" or "slight-profitability". I would further hazard a guess that many of the newer members of staff are slightly concerned as to whether or not they will have a job in the near future if things don't improve.
               
               That is why I am slightly dissapointed to see people moaning about irrelevant things constantly, not you but others, and a new found tendancy for the staff to be criticised for almost everything that they do. They were the best thing since sliced bread until the 24th February, now they can't do anything right.
               
               I am subscribing to the idea that the staff have absolutely everything to gain, and that many of them have plenty to lose, should this site not seek to successfully adapt and change over the next few months.
               
               I wish that more would spare a thought for the pressure that they all must be under to get things moving, from hubbers and investors, and with their own livelyhoods at stake.
               
               Personally I am not going to jump the ship in a panic because it has a slight leak, I will stay and try and help the team fix the leak. I will be doing so by anchoring my backlinks, sorry - poor pun. I further hope that those who are jumping ship live to regret it, but only because it would mean that my decision to stay will have been proven as justified.
               
               Best,
               
               Ryan

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      Len Cannonposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      It isn't a way of saying they don't need your work, it is a way of saying they need to know if their system works at all. There's a lot of things that need to be worked out before a sitewide rollout.
      
      1. It is still having significant reporting issues.
      2. Some of the ads were triggering virus warnings.
      3. Making sure mass, direct payments work.
      4. Finding out what ad partners are working.
      5. Making sure there's enough documentation for the program.
      6. Seeing if their system is able to handle mass signups.
      
      and a million other strictly technical things I don't even understand.
      
      It is a beta! That is what happens.  Every year, Windows provides beta versions of their latest products months in advance for lots of users. That isn't because they don't think the people who won't use it until it is released commercially  aren't worth their time.
      
      The purpose of a beta is to open up access to software to a group of real-world users and see how it runs.  This is taking out of in-house testing and slowly building up the number of users to see how the system is able to handle increased volume.
      
      I can almost ASSURE you that before HubPages started allowing regular sign-ups, they had a growing number of beta users.  That is just how this type of business works.

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         ryankettposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Yes they did, they had 'BETA' at the top of the page for months! At least a year in fact!
         
         The waybackmachine confirms that

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      paradigmsearchposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      I've lost 4 followers (closed accounts) as a result of this.

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         ryankettposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         I've just followed you, for currently having the most applicable username on the site.

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            paradigmsearchposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            

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         Cagsilposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Hey Para, I've lost 3 followers in that last day or two, but it does happen from time to time. Especially, because spammers who fan/follow bunches of people and then their accounts get deleted.

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4. 0

   Sophia Angeliqueposted 13 years ago

   Actually, they are rolling it out 500 at a time. They are testing it to see if there are any kinks in the program. As they find the kinks, they are fixing them, then inviting another 500. Then if there are more kinks, they are fixing them, and inviting another 500. When the program is perfect, then everybody will be allowed to join.
   
   It's nothing personal.

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5. 94

   wildernessposted 13 years ago

   To those of you that think the first wave using the ad program are "rubbing it in" with their vastly increased income:
   
   I am one of that first wave (and have no idea why) and I have reported that I believe I'm seeing increased income as a result.  It is, by my best estimation, about $.25 to $.30 per day increase with some 100 hubs.
   
   If that additional quarter makes you so green with envy that you pull all of your hubs, I'm sorry for you but probably won't miss you. 
   
   I report these things to the general membership simply as an information update, thinking that many will be interested.  I'm certainly not rubbing in that my greatly increased income amounts to a quarter a day!
   
   Far more important and interesting to me is the possibility of increased traffic down the road.  At that point the increased income might even amount to something that will buy more than a gumball at the vending machine.

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      Randy Godwinposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      I think it might be a bit different for those of us who have hundreds of thousands of views, Wilderness.  But it isn't being "green with envy" at all, despite the many inferences to the contrary. 
      
      Intentionally or not, it obviously favors some members more than others.  The whole "I think those selected were somewhat randomly chosen" statement caused more trouble than anything else.  If you think all those selected were were chosen without favorites in mind, then fine.  As I stated earlier, I will be as loyal to HP as they have been to me.  Probably more so, if the truth be known! 

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         Sophia Angeliqueposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Looking at those who were chosen, I noticed that they all seemed to put in somewhere about 4 or 5 each and every day. Maybe that had something to do with it?
         
         Or not so?

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            Randy Godwinposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            The truth of how it was done is unknown, SA!  It is probably even worse than we think.  So we won't hear about it from staff, that's a no-brainer! 

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      CASE1WORKERposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      wilderness...... you are making that much extra! seriouslly it is cents at the moment. I find it extemly impressive that an organisation is rolling out a programme to make sure it works. When you think about it how often is this site closed for maintenance? ( in one year of hubbing i have never seen that) , how many times are there technical difficulties ?- well sometimes the stats get stuck for a few hours- that's it really. I think they have done a jolly good job at keeping the technical side afloat and now they are trying to deal with the changes in a fair and competent way.
      Perhaps we were chosen because we dont gripe and would provide a fair and honest of assessment of how its been for us.?

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         ryankettposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         The maintanence thing happened a fair few times in the 2009 Xmas period, the affiliate marketers were - naturally - in uproar. They learnt from that I think
         
         A few hours of downtime on any day in December will cost a lot of money to the heavyweights.

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            Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Ryan its true Im not as intense perhaps as you are with respect to your researching numbers ,stats and everyting else.
            
            
            
            Accurate hmm..C'mon with so much info flying here and there the past couple of weeks ,not to mention blogs and notifications, then add on hubbers experiences good and bad.
            
            
            Confusing (IMO).
            
            I understand your critism was not directed at anyone in partcular, but I just get tired of the 'them' and 'us' or we' syndrome at Hubpages.
            If get loyalty I return it 10 fold. Same with respect
            
            Cheers.

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               ryankettposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               Well you haven't lost any of my respect Kiwi, I'm just a habitual number cruncher

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         Randy Godwinposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         "Perhaps we were chosen because we dont gripe and would provide a fair and honest of assessment of how its been for us.?"
         
         
         I'm sure that's it, CW!  I would have been untrustworthy and griped constantly about being given the chance to earn more money while others were skipped over.  This makes things much more clear! 
         
         
         Actually, I'm quite glad HP did this the way they did.  It motivated me to look elsewhere for places to publish my work. They did me a huge favor by directly, or indirectly, opening my eyes to the way things are handled here.  I've seen it all before on other sites and do not like it.  Sorry, but that's just my experience. 

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            WoodsmensPostposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            Assessments of the new ad program are to be in as many threads as possible Randy, that way everyone has a chance to read about how well or poor they are doing in every other thread you read.
            
            No sense in having an assessment thread for "beta testers" to report. Why would something like that have a effect on traffic anyway?
            
            Plus it gives Ryankett a chance to give his total history of his editing process in more than topic.
            
            Oh sorry don't subscribe to anything I say.
            
            Beta-Testers Reporting Thread Never heard of such a thing in forums lol
            
            Happy trails!!

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               ryankettposted 13 years agoin reply to this

               If it makes you feel any better, the HubAd program would probably be crap for you anyway, it tends to work for people who achieve a decent amount of traffic.
               
               The problem may lie in your insistance that a title should be less than 70 characters in length, as per your advice in the 'SEO Best Title Search Engine Placement Length 4 Search Engine Company' hub.
               
               This contrary to Google's own suggestion that an optimum title length is a maximum 60 characters, a total which includes spaces. The title of your "SEO Best Title Search Engine Placement Length 4 Search Engine Company" hub is, somewhat ironically, 68 characters in length with spaces. Whoops!

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                  WoodsmensPostposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                  I didn't ask for assessment of my hubs ryan is this a personal attack now? wow I want to be like you

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                     ryankettposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                     If you want to dish it out then you need to learn how to take it back, it was no more personal than your dig at me a few minutes prior.
                     
                     Your right, you do want to be like me, and the few hundred other people in the ad program. Your green face becomes transparent each time you spout your bitterness.

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      BRIAN SLATERposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Glad to hear of your experience wilderness. I do not think the people on the first wave are rubbing it in, on the contrary, I wasn't in the first wave but are looking forward to when I do get accepted.
      Myself and everyone else needs to hear about how the program is running and I don't consider those in the program are some type of favorites or were chosen specifically or in deed underhandedly as suggested.
      I am quite happy for the Beta testing to continue and to let hp's iron out any errors before rolling it out.

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      Sophia Angeliqueposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      @wilderness. And I am definitely interested in hearing it. It means I have something to look forward to.

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   CASE1WORKERposted 13 years ago

   exactly- 2009!
   
   compare that to institutional systems and they are so superior. When they introduced a new government computer system several years ago, our day used to be punctuated by system on and sytem off announcements. Even now I have been locked out of a government system for 10 days- yet HP keeps on rolling with lots of data - like you say if its down you aint making  $$$$$

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   wildernessposted 13 years ago

   You know, I keep thinking about that virus attack.  It apparently came from the new ads on a couple thousand hubs from that first 500 hubbers.
   
   Would it have been worse if they somehow managed to get everyone enrolled at once, with hundreds of thousands of hubs?  I don't know, but DO think that HP made the right decision to extend their "beta" testing to only 500 people.  I'm sure I'll be flamed for it, but would go so far as to say that it would be wise to go at least a month or even a payout period before extending it.  The payout is something HP hasn't done at all, is completely new to them and untested.

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8. 41

   Ritsosposted 13 years ago

   Errrr what an impatient lot ... we're talking June here ... that's just over 2 months away ... surely not long to wait is it ? Or would you rather the mechanic fix your car brakes in 1 minute flat!

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      Randy Godwinposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      Not at all!  But what if your mechanic said "Hey, I know you are a loyal customer but this new guy is going ahead of you even though you've been waiting for hours."?  I'm sure you would say "No problem, his time is more valuable than mine."  Yeah right!

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9. 61

   saleheensblogposted 13 years ago

   I will never be able to participate in the HP ads program as I can't get PayPal account from Bangladesh.

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      ryankettposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      I suspect that at some stage in the future they will offer additional payment methods, most programs tend to, maybe alternative payment processors such as AlertPay?

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         saleheensblogposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         LOL, I can't get Alertpay as well. It would be better if they could visit my home and pay me.

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            BRIAN SLATERposted 13 years agoin reply to this

            That's a pity Saleheensblog, you had better listen to Nellie's advice and start your own site's and earn through that method. More strings to your bow and all that.

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      Nelle Hoxieposted 13 years agoin reply to this

      You are in good company. I will never be able to get a Paypal account either - and it's not because of where I live. I'm just not acceptable to them! Don't worry, there's a lot of ways to make money online. And hey, you have adsense now.

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         saleheensblogposted 13 years agoin reply to this

         Yes, I know. indeed you people taught me that. I am getting some clicks in adsesnse but very cheap clicks. I have to be a little more careful about choosing the right kind of topics. And the recent Google things have been encouraging me to open my own website more then ever. I have to learn it well and quickly, also have to search for someone with a credit card. LOL. I am a man of problem.

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    skyfireposted 13 years ago

    "In year 2011, beta males and females will come together to kick alphas out of content farm, lucyfurrr, mind it - Kitteh Krist [300BC]

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    Uninvited Writerposted 13 years ago

    When did everyone become so sensitive to everything all of a sudden?
    
    I am in ad program and I do not post 3 hubs a day and I don't make huge amounts of money. Many people who have been here less time than I have are in the program. Honestly, if I was not in the program it would not bother me as I know I could join eventually.

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       Randy Godwinposted 13 years agoin reply to this

       I do understand your viewpoint, Susan.  This isn't about having to wait for the program at all.  I can only assume those not understanding my point of view have not been involved with this type of controversy on writing sites before.
       
       I don't care if I am chosen or not, at this point.  In fact, if it would make you guys believe I am only trying to help HP avoid problems of community dissension in the future, I will gladly not ever enable the program.  I cannot make myself be any plainer than that. 

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          ThomasEposted 13 years agoin reply to this

          But it is sensible not to roll out a program like this for everyone all at the same time. It is part of the testing process.
          
          Basically, all they are asking is that you continue on hubpages on exactly the same terms you signed up for,

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             Randy Godwinposted 13 years agoin reply to this

             I've never stated they should not have tested the program in any manner they chose to do so, Thomas!  If they don't care about alienating some here by the manner the program was introduced, then they can, and did, do it in this manner. 
             
             It does say loads about the forethought given for the members feelings though.  If nothing else, they cannot say they didn't intend to insult loyal members if this happens again.  Or perhaps they can, what do I know?  Many seem to buy it just fine! 

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                wildernessposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                Well, [b]I[/i] think they chose accounts by reverse alphabetical order with between 50 and 250 hubs and less than 500 views per day average.  They won't divulge this because it discriminates against accounts beginning with a letter higher than Q and those account holders will feel hurt.
                
                Then they threw in a handful of accounts with more than 500 hubs, high traffic and averaging more than 1500 words per hub as a different test.  They won't divulge this either because...because...I don't know.  Maybe because there were only 26 of them.
                
                Could even be true for all I know!

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    Nelle Hoxieposted 13 years ago

    SahleensBlog, Yes you should find that credit card quickly. My adsense clicks on HP are about 10% of the value of the adsense on other sites. It's never been this low.
    
    You may be a man of problems, but at least you overcome them.
    
    And I agree that Alertpay isn't acceptable either. A grown up affiliate plan has Direct Deposit these days. I really don't trust one that doesn't.

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       ThomasEposted 13 years agoin reply to this

       I won't be on the HP affiliate plan. I simply don't want to use paypal. Not since the time they suspended my account for no reason. I eventually got the money back, but once bitten twice shy.

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       ryankettposted 13 years agoin reply to this

       SahleensBlog, if you can't get a credit card, then what about a pre-paid Visa? In fact, Redgage pay by sending you a pre-paid Visa, you could try earning money on there and then using the card to pay for a domain and hosting?

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          saleheensblogposted 13 years agoin reply to this

          WOW!! I will be very serious with redgage from now on. I never thought of that. Thanks a lot.

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    skyfireposted 13 years ago

    Shifa, if you're not acceptable in paypal then chances are there that some of the US affiliate networks will deny you for legal reasons (for example, affiliate.com/blueverse and few others). Only those who pay checks are likely to accept you in their network. Any network with direct deposit/western union is also going to be hard for you to join. (Note- This is just my observation based on asian affiliate activity) Try joining clickbank/moreniche/solo affiliate offers.
    
    
    __________________________
    
    Xoom is one good option for hubpages to pay international writers. But i'm not sure how this will work out on monthly basis because there are many legal issues attached with it.

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       saleheensblogposted 13 years agoin reply to this

       Thank you very much for the advices. I am learning everyday.

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14. 74

    Laura du Toitposted 13 years ago

    All the negativity surrounding the “chosen few” hubbers on the hub ad program may well act as a deterrent for people on the as program to report their experiences with the Ad program.
    
    If you really feel a need to tantrum and throw your toys out of the cot just make sure it is for something worth making such a fuss about.
    
    I am one of the “chosen few” and because the launch of the Hub Ad Program coincided with Google’s slap it is impossible to say what the exact cause is but my overall earnings have dropped drastically over the past ten days. I am earning less than $1 per day on Hub Ads and my Adsense has sizzled down to a few cents a day.  As I said it is impossible to determine whether the Hub Ad program plays a role in the decrease in Adsense revenue or whether this is purely as a result of the new Google algorithm. Either way I think we should rather encourage Hubbers on the program to report their experiences instead of making them feel guilty for being chosen.

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       Randy Godwinposted 13 years agoin reply to this

       "If you really feel a need to tantrum and throw your toys out of the cot just make sure it is for something worth making such a fuss about."
       
       Is keeping community harmony and confidence in HubPages worth "throwing a tantrum about" as you so eloquently put it?  And what are you referring to as the "toys" in your post?  A writer's work, or something else? 

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          Laura du Toitposted 13 years agoin reply to this

          You still only hear what you want to hear.

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             Randy Godwinposted 13 years agoin reply to this

             And apparently, you only answer questions you want to answer!    The "toys" you mentioned, what are they?

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                Laura du Toitposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                As far as I know they are things small children play with and when they get really angry they throw them out of their cots to get attention! 

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                   Randy Godwinposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                   So what are the metaphorical "toys" in this scenario? 

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    paradigmsearchposted 13 years ago

    I’m amazed this thread generated over 80 posts.

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16. 69

    cindyvineposted 13 years ago

    I concur

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17. 74

    Laura du Toitposted 13 years ago

    Just part of the whole tantrum scenario The entire purpose of the post was to point out that at this stage the inclusion or exclusion to the Hub Ad program is not worth throwing your "toys out of your cot" about.
    
    I would think that from a farming perspective it would be more prudent to gather sufficient information on which to base an informed business decision than to complain because you were not part of the experiment which will more than likely have its fair share of teething problems ( as we have seen with the Trojan virus reported.)

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       Randy Godwinposted 13 years agoin reply to this

       Still refusing to identify the "toys" and I don't blame you for doing so.  Your description of my posts as being a "tantrum" merely indicates you have no idea as to the reasoning behind my posts concerning the new program. 
       
       There is actually no purpose in having the "chosen" report their earnings or lack thereof to the rest of us unchosen unless everyone's results are similar.     I would wager it works for some and not for others, just like the Adsense and Amazon programs do.  We won't find out until we try them out personally.
       
       It was handled badly, but make excuses for HP if it makes you feel better.  I hope you don't have the same experiences with this site as I have had with similar content farms. 

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          Laura du Toitposted 13 years agoin reply to this

          In defence of HP I honestly think it would have been worse if they had secretly chosen 500 Hubbers to launch the program (as you suggested). People would really have reason to feel betrayed if and when it leaked out - as I am sure it would have.
          
          At least HP were open about the fact that they were only selecting 500 Hubbers to launch the project so that they could handle any teething problems as and when they occurred.
          
          Keeping in mind that the Ad Program is not the only problem that they have to contend with I feel one should give them credit where its due - at least they are constantly trying to improve the quality of the site.

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             Randy Godwinposted 13 years agoin reply to this

             Why would they feel betrayed unless the majority of those chosen broke their silence and boasted to the rest?  This has been mentioned several times before and it makes no sense at all to me.
             
             Your loyalty to HP is commendable considering they are in large part responsible for the recent Google slap.  Those who endeavored to publish well researched written content were slapped right along with those who did not from no fault of their own other than trusting HP to keep the site free from such trash.
             
             Now those same writers are asked to clean up the mess allowed here by HP.  I'm sorry, but such betrayal of trust doesn't engender even more trust in the site for me or others.  My "toys" are my work, not HP's.  My "toys" are suffering because I depended on HP to make sure there were no broken toys making mine look equally bad to Google.  But I suppose you don't blame HP for any of this by your defending their policies. 
             
             Yes they have lots on their mind at the moment.  But so do I.  I will continue to deal with HP as honestly as I can, but not unless they deal honestly with me.  Is that too much to ask for?

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                WoodsmensPostposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                Marisa picked me to pick on and I wasn't even complaining lol Twisted I was stating a fact that hubbers are bailing out some hubs. Jeez this used to be a nice community of hubbers funny how change brings out the true side of people.

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                   Randy Godwinposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                   Especially if the change is badly handled!  This type of controversy is the direct result of that.  Exactly what I was referring to.  Community harmony is very delicate as human nature is always a factor.  Good luck with the program, I won't be participating until everyone else is admitted. 

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                Eaglekiwiposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                I hear that Randy. You said it better than I did.
                
                I agreed to the T.O.S and they agreed to support my incredible writing skills

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                   Randy Godwinposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                   No one from HP appears anxious to address the concerns about the garbage intentionally allowed to remain on the site.  This, in itself, says loads about the transparency of the site.  Any of the proponents of the new ad program want to give their take on it?  Might get you a few brownose..er.. brownie points! 

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                      ryankettposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                      They will soon be putting in a system which identifies all copied content, even internal copied content, which will be removed. That is a good start.
                      
                      1.16 million pages of content is a lot of content, they have to use software, and before they can use software they have to write the software.

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                      1. 61

                         Randy Godwinposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                         Actually, it wasn't the copied or duplicate content I was referring to, Ryan.  It was the Yahoo article and others which drew millions of views because people thought it was related to Yahoo email or something of the sort. 
                         
                         Some people even left their email or contact information in the comments (some 1000's of them) thinking the hub was a legitimate article from the company.  It remained on the site for 4 years and apparently brought in millions of views.
                         
                         Having this issue resolved would possibly gain credibility to HP in a time it is sorely needed.  But I doubt there is any explanation other than it brought in quite a bit of money during the previous 4 years, despite the questionable content.  But even this would be preferable to HP totally ignoring the issue.  Your take on it? 

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                         1. 0

                            ryankettposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                            The removal of that Yahoo article lost me 400 page views per day, so I probably shouldn't have said anything

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                               Randy Godwinposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                               You probably shouldn't have said anything?  Yes, perhaps you are right.  I am indeed foolish for speaking out about things merely because they are wrong.  The money's the thing!  What was I thinking anyway?  :LOL:  Principles?  Who needs em! 

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                                  ryankettposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                                  It was me who brought that to your attention, I wasn't talking about you.

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                         2. 87

                            IzzyMposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                            I didn't know that hub had been pulled and went looking for it. Found instead pages and pages of copycat style hubs with www.yahoomail or www.googlemail or a host of others in their titles and urls.
                            
                            If Hubpages pulled that first one for being misleading, then it is only fair for them to pull the rest.
                            
                            http://hubpages.com/search/yahoomail

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                               ryankettposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                               One of which is mine, but I think you will find that mine is at least a little better quality.
                               
                               By the way, I believe that Hubpages now pulls NEW hubs which are exclusively wwwDotCom in the title.

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                               1. 87

                                  IzzyMposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                                  Yes somehow saying 'about' in front of the url is less misleading, but I do believe you also had comments on one of your hub suggesting the public thought it was the real deal.

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                                     ryankettposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                                     Yes I had one, not my fault they are completely retarded, I believe that I even link to the correct site in mine.
                                     
                                     Xomba have banned wwwDOTcom titles too. That is probably the way forward, I would be happy to stick 'About' in front of all of them.

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                                        ryankettposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                                        I will probably ban them on Excerptz too, a couple have been allowed, but I can't see the problem with adding 'About' or 'Information' at the end.

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                            2. 0

                               EmpressFelicityposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                               A sample from one of these, er, delights, published by a hubber named Motorcycle Helmets:
                               
                               "Break?
                               
                               Dependable. This is the conclusive Extraordinary fair shake to get a compose isolated grade in www. Yahoomail.com! Or at elementary some uttermost 10 rankings. From what I’ve empirical most markets are fanatical for the selection.
                               
                               That’s because some of the notable guns excursion enduring in Google have protected up an allied opener listings in www. Yahoomail.com."
                               
                               To be fair, he actually says in the first paragraph that he was doing the hub to prove a point, namely that you didn't have to publish good content in order to get massive numbers of hits a day.
                               
                               But somehow I don't think that Google would see the joke.

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                                  IzzyMposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                                  I went and read that hub and thought it quite clever till I read his other yahoomail hub - it was the same nonsensical spun rubbish with no disclaimer this time to say it was a trial.

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                                     IzzyMposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                                     In fact I have just flagged the profile - all his work is spun and badly at that!

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                                        ryankettposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                                        I have been envisaging the way that Hubpages will deal with this stuff from now on, and spun content is probably the only one that they can't automate.
                                        
                                        They could detect all duplicate content, in fact they already do. They can use a keyword density filter to detect keyword spamming, and they can already identify short hubs. It would be possible to identify non-English hubs, and it is already possible to identify hubs with excessive links. It is also possible for them to detect words most commonly associated with spamming, such as that asbestos disease.
                                        
                                        I just don't know whether they would be able to identify spun content, I can't think of a precedent which has been set for it, so that is the one which will require us to continue hub hopping.

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                                           IzzyMposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                                           They maybe don't have software for it per se, but have you ever noticed that every spinner seems to end with a really low user profile score?
                                           
                                           Maybe they should go through everyone's work that has a low authorscore and check it, with an exemption for newbies of course.

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                                              WoodsmensPostposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                                              Kind of a good idea Izzy but heres one for ya, most I say most of the flagged profiles and hubs I have flagged for duplicate content have no profile picture. This throws me a flag right away to check the hub out. Some of the bot generated hubs don't add a pic. To require a pic could slow these junkies down. What do ya think?

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                                              ryankettposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                                              Sounds viable, everybody with more than 10 hubs, for over 6 months, who haven't acheived... say.... 65 hubberscore?

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             3. 68

                lrohnerposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                Huh? Broke what silence? I don't remember doing the super-duper uber iron-clad pinkie swear when I signed up for the program. And maybe I've been living under a rock, but I don't remember any boasting either.

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                   Randy Godwinposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                   Check your goat, Ironer!    This was not in reference to the present ad program.  It was my answer to a statement claiming someone would have broken silence if the 500 chosen had been told to keep silent about the program or lose their account. 
                   
                   You'll have to read the posts before you can understand mine. 

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                      ThomasEposted 13 years agoin reply to this

                      It wouldn't have been possible to keep silent anyway. The ad program has a different layout to the classical hubpages advertising layout. People would have noticed.

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18. 74

    Laura du Toitposted 13 years ago

    So glad to hear that some people can see the bigger picture.
    
    You have just said what I was trying to say - hope you are able to get the message through.

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19. 77

    shoganposted 13 years ago

    All right, you all better quiet down, or I'm pulling this car over!!! 
    
    In all seriousness, it seems to me that there are potentially plenty of mistakes on all sides.  It also seems to me that nothing great has ever been accomplished by pointing fingers.  We adapt, we grow, and that goes for everyone.
    
    Many of you who have been here for a long time speak of a former HP community, one in which members were considerate and responsive to each other.  Well, any great community starts with one member.  If you miss a warm, accepting yesterday, then start today with a fresh attitude.  Go outside, live life, and check in back here with the knowledge that our interactions with others always reflect our own perspective.

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       EmpressFelicityposted 13 years agoin reply to this

       I think people still are considerate and responsive, but the trouble is that the site has become the victim of its own success, and a large number of spammers have jumped on board and tried to game the system.
       
       You have to show them the door, or they will pull the rest of us down.  Arguably they already have pulled the rest of us down.
       
       This is a subject that trips one of my hot buttons (I have several of these )  Several people have come on here and said things along the lines of "we should be warm and welcoming towards everyone, and anyway what right do we have to judge others?"  Well I say nuts to that!  Sometimes a judgment call is the only way to go.

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          shoganposted 13 years agoin reply to this

          It's a double-edge sword, EmpressFelicity.  I hear what you're saying, but at the same time, a judgmental person is never only sorta judgmental.  It's hard to be ruthless about spammers, but then not be ruthless toward each other.  I think several recent threads are evidence of this.
          
          I'm not advocating passivity, either.  I simply think that we should do what we ought to do and leave the tension at the door.  If we're not sure what to do, that's ok, too.  Uncertainty doesn't have to equal suspicion.

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    thesailorposted 13 years ago

    HubPages Ad Program is on BETA Test. I am a patient person. What I'm doing right now is editing my hubs to avoid warnings of having too much Amazon ads and the like.
    Its full implementation will be on June, so, I'll just wait and see.
    In the meantime, I'll continue writing about my being a sailor.
    
    P.S. I just celebrated my 1st year anniversary on HP and I'm waiting for my 2nd Google AdSense payout on April.

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       Randy Godwinposted 13 years agoin reply to this

       Kudos to you for your 1 year anniversary, Sailor!  Just made 2 years myself! Sometimes patience is a virtue, others a forced period of suspense. 

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